I just got overwhelmed. Have a proposal staring at me for my first LEED project, and I've started working on a project and I have another project starting at the end of the summer. OMG!!! Okay, first things first... coffee

honestly, i am glad pre-fab/modular housing is dying/dead. for me it lacks a personal narrative, and plays to an idealized clarity/simplicity that no human being can have or possibly embrace and still consider themselves, well, human.

melt, overwhelmed is exactly the right word for me through the next week. So I guess I need to get the hell of archinect and start drafting and assembling.

Have a great day all!

WK>>>You rock girl. New Job New Man in that order!!!

Melty>>> You rock girl. Doin projects w/o volatile orgasmic compounds is the way to go!!!

Beta>>>The prefab sprout demise has really killed the economy in northern Indianastan. I've always wanted to just get a preengineered metal building and stick it out in the country somewhere so I can have some peace and quiet to shoot off my rifles.

But vado, that's a totally different kind of pre-fab. Though I know northern Indiana is suffering, I think their version of pre-fab will continue eventually. It's cheap, quality enough for most people, and looks like "home". The hipster modern PREtty FABulous home trend is the one that is most likely disappearing and I have to say I'm not sad about it either.

OK, I have to work! You guys shut and lock the TC door today and don't let me in, please!!!!!

Ok, I wrote all this earlier, but my internet crashed. Luckily, I copied it before i had to restart.

Good luck melt!

And Good Luck WK!

For the article that manta posted... I know it sounds fuddy-duddy, but did it have to be so vulger? Did the writer really have to use SO much profanity? I also felt she was overly harsh towards Schulman. When did he write his peice? It does seem historically acurate. I also would say that its social constraints that kept teen pregnancy and STDs down, and so they served a purpose. As for my feelings about marriage, I DO feel like if you're going to use the "consenting adults" argument, then you need to allow ALL consinting adults to participate. So that includes polygamist, and even incest - though you might want a sterylization clause somewhere in there. I know that sounds radical, but I dont have a problem with polygamy, though its not a choice I would ever be able to choose. And I think incest is gross, and scientifically a bad choice, but again, not mine to make.

I think thats the most forthcoming Ive ever been with my opinions on here. Its kinda scary.

I dreamed last night that I was driving a tractor in rural scotland...but nobody had the cool accent. Strange. Wonder what that means.

Hi all,
Good luck melt and lb.

SH, thanks for sharing and i agree consenting adults means consenting adults..

SH, I guess I'm a fuddy duddy too, because I didn't even finish the article. Using every lewd term possible doesn't make one's argument stronger...it undermines. IMHO, modernity will be the end of us.

And best wishes to Melt and WK!

a-techno - either you use energy to turn the fan or you find a way for the air to turn the fan and generate energy. the later is not that simple as there needs to be a good laminar air flow (minimal turbulence) and fans do a great job of stirring up turbulence.... I researched using the stack effect in tall buildings to run some turbines a la solar chimneys last year. the engineering calculations weren't encouraging for the energy potential (even at 100 stories). it's a small turbines versus utility scale mega turbines issue - energy is generated at by the square of the are - so a 10 m radius is an order of magnitude less powerful then a 20m radius turbine- it takes about 50m radius turbine to start generating sufficient energy to offset the costs/efficiency of the gen-sets. Anything less then 10m is a waste of materials. Also vibrations become a big issue in sticking a turbine on/into a building as there is lots of turbulence near structures.

wK- job sounds great for you, no matter what the role is, get your foot in the door and earn some $$ for the summer. Colorado will be an interesting experience - there are a bunch of earthships and a strong environmental ethos from those outdoor loving folks. I have a few friends that I can introduce you to if this becomes real.

i just feel like i should write something on tc.
hi everbody!
it looks like everyone is getting busier around here. tc comes out of the recession first and economists take note! it has not translated to $ amount yet but i am as busy too.
i have been critical of the so called pre-fab euphoria in the past. even though i don't like to see people losing their jobs etc.., this was inevitable. pre-fab of this generation was created by real estate speculation in last few years, and it has really built itself outside of the reach of the people it should help, the low income and first time buyers. it didn't take advantage of the technology but just moved the construction site to an old airplane hangar. instead of talking to low income groups, it talked to higher income people who read dwell and make over 200k.
it did not innovate anything but stylized a lot of old ideas.
as far as i am concerned, the 21 st century pre-fab home is not invented yet. closest i saw one was in neil denari's office which i included in my interview with him a couple of years ago.
the real mass marketed prefabs, i maintain, will have to come from car or coach manufacturers and i don't really think the society who would really be the main clientele for them are ready for it. at least in this country. but lets say if they were sold with great amenities around the price of an suv, it would be a good incentive.

Hi Orhan...
Good to "see" you.

I actually really like a lot of the prefab design coming out of these firms, at least the kind we're talking about. After meeting Leo Marmol and Michelle Kaufmann, I have to appreciate the pragmatic approach that they took to their practices. And not only that, but they put their money where their mouths were - they actually took the steps of not only designing, but producing the pre-fab units and selling some. Not enough apparently, but here were people that understood that in order to practice the design they wanted, they also needed to be better business people, and straddle the worlds of pre-fab and unique architecture.

From an environmental standpoint, their practices and processes were less wasteful, and more sustainable: they produced these homes in a factory, thus maintaining high standards for the quality of the product. And they were able to incorporate many energy- and water-saving features, as well as solar panels, probably a lot more than any one here has, frankly. I think it's disingenuous to suggest that in the midst of them trying to refine their products and eventually bring down the prices that any one of us, or any one of them, for that matter, could currently produce a one-off unique house with high-quality detailing, that's extremely green, at the price point that we'd all like to see.

I'm not saying that no one here could do it at some point; I'm just saying that it's easy to throw stones, but at least they got out there and tried it.

orhan, i like the idea of re|tooling autoworkers to build pre-fab modular construction, it would be a great use of existing skill sets with limited need for retraining.

i am sorry, i am all for sustainability, but the lack of a real narrative, that's intrinsic to the real homeowner annoys me to no end. how do these rather inflexible - yes i know modular is flexible - models designed for "one" type of living style, effectively address that we are all individuals, with varying degrees of; afflictions, family types, lifestyles, personal stories, etc...a home that might be good for a writer might not be good for an artist or home for someone in their 50's and no kids might not be good for a single mother with an autistic child.

these narratives are important for me and afford me the opportunity to create something for the occupant, that is based around the occupant[s] life, and that they could ultimately find themself[ves] at home in.

now, i don't expect to dismiss sustainability or responsibility, i just refuse to apply a once size fits all approach to a rather intimate challenge.

how many of our houses reflect our personal narratives?! i live in a house built in 1910, a four-square craftsman not dissimilar from thousands of other four-square craftsman houses in our neighborhood. and they're considered charming, with lots of character.

beta, if you're arguing for a reflection of an individual, it sounds like you're arguing for one-off custom housing which is rare indeed. most people are perfectly happy to personalize (by themselves) what they find and can afford.

what prefab purports to offer is the opportunity to have a 1) modern house (many buyers can't touch one otherwise), an architect-designed house (ditto), some environmentally/socially responsible bonus points (reduced waste, better labor conditions, controlled environment, etc), and just as much ability to customize as with any house-builder house.

no, it's not exactly 'affordable' housing, but it IS a way for architects to break into the housing market at a not-too-exorbitant house cost. otherwise, we just don't get to participate.

i'm a fan, as you can probably tell.

you're right, and i wouldn't design the house i currently live in; it doesn't reflect my life, but what i am suggesting is that modular homes are no less speculative than any other type, because anyone could inhabit the home and simultaneously not "inhabit" it as well. i think that a modular home reflects the current zeitgeist, and does not reflect who we are, what we are and how we ultimately live. it's still very much a pre-package concept that is sold and bought.

i can't imagine a single parent with an autistic child would live the same as a nuclear family would. so is the market narrower? yes, but i think that i as an architect should take into account that dynamic and think about what the long term implications of having autistic child might be. what are the issues, does the parent expect that their child would be dependent on them; how dependent?? what is important in terms of space, texture, color, light, accessibility...etc.

i like the narrative space of architecture, something that modular or prefab does not seemingly provide.

i do appreciate your perspective though.

I know there is a pre-fab thread going on, but I'd rather post this in TC.

When we talk about pre-fab, why does it have to be all or nothing? I know in general, the usage of prefab is for mass-produced, modular buildings built off site and transported. But isn't the degree of mass-production, modularity, and assembly off site CHOICES based on logistics and parameters of the project?

As for customization, design and reflection of the occupants - the building doesn't have to be designed for them to reflect the occupants, for 95% of the population, it is by what house/condo/apt we buy/rent.

slart, you're it doesn't have to be designed for them, that's just the direction i am interested in moving. just questioning how do the lives we have get reflected in the things we live, could they, should they; that's for someone else to answer. i just choose to embrace the idea that we're all different, and have complexities that modular prefab doesn't always take into account - especially the things that are done today.

Gosh I'm just really tired...emotionally, physically, financially. Is it horrible to plan to stay in bed all day on Saturday? I need to rustle up a good book to read. Maybe I'll go to the library then go back to bed on Saturday. Not that it matters much, since Saturday begins my official period of unemployment. Humph.

Back from Denver already? That was a quick trip. Good luck with the prospective job there.

Speaking of designing for people with autism, I'm mildly autistic myself (high-functioning Asperger's if you want to be technical), and I've been giving thought to how I'd design my ideal office. I find the current trend toward open-plan layouts and maximum collaboration to be the exact opposite of my ideal, as personal space and privacy are very important to me, and I find it almost impossible to filter out background noise. At my current setup, I spend about 3/4 of a given day being forced to listen to long-winded project team meetings and phone conversations taking place about 36" behind me, and it makes me want to rip my hair out.

new best way to waste time on the internet, the aptly named explosionsandboobs.com

nice puddles, nice, and it's SFW to boot.

Hey great to see the prefab debate finding focus on TC. There are a couple great facts; prefab needed to align itself with both architects and the affluent this time around (seeing as it never left, but was disguised under layers of nasty vinyl cladding). Another option had to be presented and the truth is both Marmol and Kaufmann become the poster children for a design savvy generation. The failure, aside from the obvious (global economic fuck up) has to do with the opportunities missed - fearful of aligning oneself with the poor and disenfranchised (ie. non American in this case) left prefab with a single buyer, when infact entire sustainable and affordable communities could of been built using these systems (which is really the core of all of this). I've "designed" prefab communities using methods and systems that attempted to look like mom & pop houses that by-design created more problems than not simply because they trying to be something they weren't - I refer to it as the square piece in the round hole.


and the pedagogy continues - seems like I'm days away from a formal offer regarding teaching. So excited.

My good friend has an austic son. He just turned 15 yesterday and well he is a great kid. There are some things he really likes and one of them is mirrors. Mrs B and myself gave him a book of mirrors for his birthday a couple of years ago and he is always carrying it around.
He also likes to ride on lawn mowers or anything that moves, I think it was because his mom and dad hauled him around in one of those bike trailors when he was young. He also loves the musical score to
"Phantom of the Opera" Two weeks ago they took him to see a professional production of the play. They were a bit worried, cause you know how people can get if your not a cut of the expected mode.
Well anyhow they had a great time. I keep thinking it must have been so cool to be with him when the orcherstra started playing...he must have thought now that is a sound system I could get behind.

I have never thought about how it might be to design a space for someone with his needs. Now I guess I'm going to have to and take it up with his mom and see what she has to say.

good for you archi.

wk, frankly any home i make in japan is automatically 7 times more energy efficient than standard home in usa.

that is without trying.

japanese govt has supported energy efficiency since the 70's after the embargo fucked them right good. usa never bothered because, lets face it, america is a kind of lazy country (to quote friedman) and is quickly falling behind the times (China is going to have higher fuel standards than usa, and that is even including the big ol revisions by obama- what the fcuk is going on???!!!)

anyway, where we fall down is not on energy use, but on toxic materials. that is finally starting to change as the govt here begins to mandate limits on off-gassing. but i expect that usa free market is going to ensure that never really happens while the rest of the world becomes like germany. we are certainly on our way here. solar heating for water is standard for for decades. pvc energy, and heat pumps are also pretty normal. and in any case all rooms are heated/cooled individually here, while the machines that take care of that are super high efficient. add to that the culture that assumes laundry machines are silly and throw in standard space for hanging your clothes to dry and we are way ahead. again all of that is without trying at all.

my only complaint with all of this though is that so far all we are doing is being less bad. which is not green. it's like when an asshole acts slightly less rude. he's still an asshole. what we need is something massively different. if i knew what i would be pushing for it, but i am still not sure.

beta's complaints are not relevant to my mind (sorry dude). people live in spite of their homes not because of them. that has not ever been different. so while it is an interesting point it has nothing to do with pre-fab construction.


and just to be annoyingly repetitive. this is pre-fab in japan.
.

it is for regular folks. most homes here are prefab. the process is to go to home seller, pick a style (there are many from modern to rustic), customise according to your narrative (to make beta happy), so that your home may be designed to accommodate the grandparents upstairs (2nd kitchen = tax break as govt tries to encourage less use of nursing homes for parents), or have a larger garage, no garage, etc.

because of this stuff i am not convinced by pre-fab as it is happening in america so far. but i am still sorry for the lady that started this discussion. like wk said she was doing something personal for a good reason. when something like that goes under it is never a good thing.

I know what Jump is talking about.

When I was going to move to Japan for a long-term temporary job in Fussa City... I suddenly realized why the job paid 68k a year for a temporary job.

I learned that reason is because even though Fussa City is kind of a scummy place (ridden with Yakuza), it has 3 golf courses and two "four star" hotels. It's also in one of the nice outlying areas of Tokyo.

But where I'm going with this is that even with an absurd salary for an entry level job... the most I could actually afford was a 460 square foot ish apartment or (12 mats as they like to refer it as.)

I wouldn't really have any modern appliances and that the oven that came with the apartment was a induction cook top that could be stored behind the fridge! Imagine that! Putting away a range!

So odd.

hey guys by the time I came home I got a call regarding the formal interview for the teaching job, it's in two weeks. How cool is that. I'm curious how I will present the various online writing I do. Suggestions anyone?

archi - I'd suggest a printed page on nice paper of a bunch of links to all 306 pages of TC

Sorry folks, coming late to the game as today has been busy.

Congrats WK on an interview well done. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you. Even if it's not your dream job it will get you in the "green" door and will put a little money in your pocket. Sorry to hear about WonderMan. It sounds as though it is for the best. I am a firm believer that everything happens for a reason.

As for the Schulman article... I'm at a slight loss for words too manta. Wow, that guy's life must be a sorry one if he really feels the way he says he does about marriage. Is it really that horrible?

I too am also sorry to hear about the PreFab company and agree with what SW says. But alas my brain is turning to mush, so words are beginning to fail me.

Atechno - that's great to hear about the job interview. I'm sure you'll get some good advice here on what to do... again my brain is mush so I got nothin' for the moment.

And on that note. Nite all. Time to go read.

archi-
I ignore my comments, but do list my feature/contribution to features/school blog and my 'frequent contributor' status. congrats and good luck!

oh, some lame writer at treeehugger wrote about BiWTs that missed much of what I posted on my school blog last year.

Question before bed all.

Is it just me or has anyone else noticed that lately (the last few years) it seems like there are a lot of interesting (read, scaled, low cost, high design) affordable housing type projects going on in LA?

If so any thoughts as to why?

Sleep tight.

I'm very, very tired, so this won't be totally sensical, but my issue with all the PreFab is that it seems to always skirt the issue of affordability. When you factor in land costs and utility hookups I don't think ANY modern pre-fab has yet beat the cost of a traditional built house.

Yes, the environmental impact of building in a factory is probably better, but this doesn't matter whether it's a CapeCod style or a Modern.

I'm not happy that Kaufmann is going under; I think it's sad, because yes she was trying like hell to accomplish something potentially important.

I just don't have faith that Modern Pre Fab isn't mostly greenwashing, and not really filling any unmet needs. Which aligns it with a product like ipods: the thing nobody ever knew they needed until they were invented. So that's fine, in a way: architecture as consumer product. In that aspect, though, they've never really interested me as a building type.

Now quonset huts on the other hand.....

And on the gay marriage thing: yes, Sarah, I agree that if we stop defining marriage as "one man one woman" the question of polygamy - including one wife two husbands, naturally - becomes valid, and it's an issue we'll have to work out as a society. Incest doesn't fall into the same category, IMO, though I'm too exhausted to figure out why; I'm sure some cultural commenter much smarter than me has already done so.

treekiller, as always brilliant advice. Liberty is quite sassy when she's tired. I did have to search for what the hell a quonset hut is. And found out that we loads of them around typically as industrial buildings on bauxite mining sites and there were loads as temporary structures around the volcano in Montserrat. I feel so much wiser now.Probably good after watching a X-men origins... I'm not a comic buff so it's authenticity doesn't bother me - what did was the directing. I mean really... does he have to sound that much like a douche?

oh sorry forgot the image

techno to be honest, while watching X-Men Origins: Wolverine, i wasn't really paying attention to the directing. :o)

too bad the door of that quonset hut looks like arse...

i see lots of murcutt in that building.

yeah you are right LB. stick built is more than good enough for most needs.

i am convinced that for true green revolution we need to make changes through political rather than architectural decisions. not that it works any better. i still can't get over the fact that obama, the man who supports green things more than most in office lately, is fighting to get a change in your country that is still behind what china has in mind. that just makes no sense to me. since when is america lagging behind china in environmental sensibility? and how do us auto-makers plan to keep up if they are behind the standards of a third-world nation? no wonder gm is bankrupt. really, the car-makers should be pushing for the highest standards not the lowest.



gay marriage works for me. polygamy too. i'm not sure why either but incest is not something i can imagine ever being ok.


way cool archi! maybe direct them to your blog as part of your cv? somehow i still don't include articles written online as part of my publications list, but that is more out of fear of being marginalised by the academics than a belief it is any less valid. in my field peer-reviewed is the main count anyway, which is mildly annoying...

still alive

i do not think of prefab as affordable because it is still new construction and new construction is inherently unaffordable to most people. architects are pretty much just wasting their time trying to tackle the "affordability" issue...better off designing ultra-luxe, 8-star hotel & vacation properties.

techno, congrats on the interview and good luck. I don't know how to present the online writing, but certainly your blog is part of your CV, I imagine? I recall pixelwhore (years ago) listed hot rod architecture on his CV under "interests and it generated a little discussion during the interview.

ap handled his archin-editorship pretty well in his cv. posted 1-2 weeks ago. was that here in tc? anyway, if you find it, it looked pretty good.

I've done prefab - not the fancy stuff, but the modular box stuff. i've done a few multi-family projects and one "contemporary" single family. it doesn't make sense cost wise unless you're going with their crappy plastic finishes or reached a critical mass in number of boxes. the single-family only worked because the client was a plumber and had a bunch of stuff he "acquired" working on various jobs - and his property was close to the factory.

the modular people are willing to do almost anything as long as you use their structural box (they'll let you use any finish you want) - but since not enough people request higher-grade finishes, it ends up costing just as much as stick-built.

LB is right - the big hurdle with prefab is cost of land, site-work, foundation, and services...

puddles - I disagree - I think affordability is something architects should continue to grapple with - just not on our own.

anyway - what I find fascinating, though, is the catalog houses at the turn of the 20th century - you ordered a house in a catalog, and they shipped all the materials out to you - with "assembly instructions" - you had to hire your own labor - but I guess labor was really cheap back then and you didn't have to worry so much about building codes.

i guess for me it's a question of goals. if the goal is prefab for cheap housing: not likely to work better than what the manufactured housing industry already produces. if the goal is to get architects more involved in design of residential work (instead of being involved in < 2% of the residential market), and allow more people to be able to afford an architect-designed house, it can make sense.

the question of all or nothing is also a useful one. prefabrication CAN be off-the-shelf housing at one end of the spectrum, but it can also be panelized, 'chunks' (as described by kieran/timberlake), various scales of modular, etc. a certain amount of our residential construction industry already involves the manufacture of things that used to be made on site. architects may be able to find/create value in proposing larger, more sophisticated pre-site work. some manufacturers already are (e.g., unit kitchens by bulthaup and others, unit bathroom 'columns' and others).

the realty world is already selling houses as an inventory of the things in it and certain manufacturers are happy to supply the pieces to be installed in a vanilla box. we can either reject the value of this evolution or we have the opportunity to participate in it and influence it.

There are quite a few of those sears and roebuck houses still standing up in the chicago burbs. pole barn construction isn't to expensive.

the problem with KitHouses! Watch from about 3:45 on...

Regarding the pre-fab house --
I like that it gets architects involved in design, and I like that it gives an architect (theoretically) greater control over the construction process. However, I can't help thinking that ultimately, pre-fab architecture ends up treating houses as yet another remotely-produced commodity -- and I'm worried that the movement will end up simply contributing to America's culture of consumption. Pre-fab allows the homeowner to remain entirely removed from the construction of his home, which I think ultimately hurts us as a society, as I think it encourages a level of non-thinking and non-questioning on the part of the public regarding how things are built. I just keep thinking of steak cuts in perfect plastic packages, consumed by people who don't have any clue what part of the cow their meal came from, or any concept of what goes into that dinner. Sure, it reduces energy to stick a million steers on a dusty lot somewhere in Nebraska, but does it help society in the long run?

I'm uncomfortable with the over-commoditization of life around here. Ultimately, a pre-fab home saves energy, sure -- it saves a lot of man-power energy from on-site construction. But you still have to truck it to your site. And you still have to prepare the site. And ultimately, shouldn't you just be re-using / re-colonizing an existing building anyway, and fitting it up with local materials and allowing yourself to become an integral actor in the construction of your own home? Do we want to be saving man-power energy?

all real concerns if prefab ever WERE to take off, manta. so far, though, seems everyone purchasing a prefab has picked a lot, been involved in the outfitting/customization, and been present for the setting, etc. hell, a lot of them even start their own blogs about it!

so much of this is not either/or. sure, there will always be new houses by architects that reflect the owner/client narrative. likewise, there will also always be renovaters/restorers (like me) that reuse, recolonize.

neither of those is for everyone and prefab is not replacing those options.

i don't think saving manpower is as much an issue or a goal of prefab, manta. even manufactured housing as currently produced is seldom mechanized, i.e., it's still built by people, for the most part. better: those people can have an stable indoor job with regular hours, are not subject to weather issues, sun, bugs, etc. they work in a controlled environment where accidents are less likely, where the insulation and lumber is probably not getting wet. their tools can be fixed rather than portable, so tighter tolerances can be maintained, making construction tighter. and supervision is easier, meaning quality control can be at a higher level. because it's effectively an assembly job, chances are the employees are more dependable, not itinerant, more likely to stick around for benefits offered by a more institutionalized employer. (ask a contractor how often workers disappear for a week, show up drunk, show up late, etc.)

i think it's fine not to be interested in it, but i don't understand the hostility toward prefab from many architects. it's just an alternative to 'the way we've always done it'.

The issue with prefab in the context of this discussion is that there are simply not enough homeowners/consumers interested in living in a flat roofed diagrammatic quote unquote modernish house. Americans, whether they ever experienced it or not, have a collective memory of what home means. For the very few, ie those who went to design school, this may include the California casework house or a Jean Prouve inspired house made of aluminum. But for most it means gable roofs, wood ie hardiplank siding, columns and pediments ie fypon, and enough garage space to store all their crap.

personally, i have no hostility for prefab. of course, i show up drunk & late too.

the catalog houses allowed a certain level of on-site customization - you got the kit, but then you could still change stuff during construction - the owner was way more involved in the construction of their house.

prefab you're stuck - even with the panel system, you're kind of locked in to the original design once it's shipped.

There aren't enough people with the money to do one-off new-construction houses anymore - everything's mostly spec these days

- but most people are simply interested in pimping out their house - it's all a matter of the level of DIY people are willing to do on their own - which translates to the sophistication of the kits you buy (the difference between people who are willing to install their own kitchen cabinets from ikea, or the people who hire an architect/designer to design their custom kitchen).

hertzberger did a project where he provided the vanilla structural box and people would customize their own apartments - Noero/Wolff have done several projects since the 80s where they encourage people decorate their own facades - Teddy Cruz is proposing a couple housing projects that are very similar to hertzberger's except he's allowing for mixed use...

there's a lot of this kind of stuff out there, but we don't like it because it happens without architects and we think it's ugly.

to me the question is at what level do we get involved in this customization?