I have a contractor friend who wants to do design build for one of his clients. Obviously he wants to work with me not only because I am licensed but also because I use Revit to do all my projects. The contractor keeps calling himself the architect.
I havent done any work yet and I have not met with the client. I'm still trying to access the situation.
Who leads the design? What kind of problems will I run into?
Tell your friend to stop calling himself an architect, one, or he risks major sanctions, especially when the client finds out he isn't one and reports him to the state. B, don't work with friends that do unethical things, or you risk finding yourself in jail.
Hi... of course I would like say exactly as you put it to the contractor but I find that this is still a relationship they we all seem to run into continually. It's not so easily said and done, and working relationships are hard to come by. I'm looking for real negation strategies with difficult people. There must be a way.
I had this working acquaintance once, he got shit canned from the firm, but he fostered a relationship with one of our clients, not a major one, but one nonetheless. well, the client was a pain in the ass, and the firm dawdled, putting him off. All the while the client, and the acquaintance, were communicating back and forth. The client decided to go with this "friend" and the "friend" called me to come in on the project, with the one condition that I'd bring him the files, dwgs and existing drawings. At first, because I wanted to do outside work, I said yes, but when time came to deliver the drawings, and files, I thought about how this "friend" was putting me in a difficult spot; if the client screwed him, and went back to our firm, then that would almost certainly out me and cost me my job.
Following friends with zero integrity, is a zero sum gain; you're damned if you, damned if you don't. You just need to figure out if your integrity is worth losing, not by you, but by your friend.
The contractor relationship is supposed to be a two-way street. You introduce me to your client, I'll introduce you to mine. With positive working experience this becomes a recommendation rather than an introduction.
Option 1: Ask for an introduction to the client. If your "friend" won't agree, then adios.
Option 2: Propose a standard contract and fees with your "friend" as the client. If he doesn't agree, adios.
You could play both to see where your "friend" stands, but it's pretty obvious from here. The last thing you want is the kind of stink that this will more than likely leave on you: liability, reputation, compromised design, etc. Aside from the fact that you will get hosed on the fee.
Never forget Jaffe's Second Rule: If you need a lawyer, it's already too late.
why is a contractor claiming to be an architect? i find if people lie, they lie. if you know they're misleading other people, i think you should know they're going to mislead you. that means you need to treat them as someone you know is going to lie to you. get paid up front, don't sign or stamp anything you don't have to, and be prepared to walk the minute you're asked to take responsibility for something you aren't comfortable with.
a business relationship with someone who lies to you isn't a good relationship. communication is pretty important in our industry, and if you can't trust what's being communicated to you it tends to cause a lot of problems. the contractor is going to end up cutting some corner somewhere after they tell you they won't and even if it's something you've detailed different on your drawings, you're still going to get sucked in. insurance companies sue everyone.
i'm pretty sure i've worked on projects where the owner contracted with the contractor and the contractor hired us so our contract was with the contractor. we still have a responsibility to act as an owner's rep in those cases.
above post incorrect in design build mea culpa. i guess if you're gonna work with this guy you should in your agreement insist that he not call himself an architect since it is illegal for him to do so. i would also make sure there is money for you as the project progresses.
Option two was proposed as the way you would work with a speculative developer. If the "friend" agreed - which he never would - the logical argument is why not contract directly with the client. If it comes down money, it's quantifiable if not clean.
I undestand the desire to do business, especially in difficult times, but situations that are problematic before you start aren't going to magically improve. Odds are they will accelerate in the same direction.
Jun 4, 13 1:27 pm ·
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How to negotiate with a contractor in Design Build
I have a contractor friend who wants to do design build for one of his clients. Obviously he wants to work with me not only because I am licensed but also because I use Revit to do all my projects. The contractor keeps calling himself the architect.
I havent done any work yet and I have not met with the client. I'm still trying to access the situation.
Who leads the design? What kind of problems will I run into?
Tell your friend to stop calling himself an architect, one, or he risks major sanctions, especially when the client finds out he isn't one and reports him to the state. B, don't work with friends that do unethical things, or you risk finding yourself in jail.
Hi... of course I would like say exactly as you put it to the contractor but I find that this is still a relationship they we all seem to run into continually. It's not so easily said and done, and working relationships are hard to come by. I'm looking for real negation strategies with difficult people. There must be a way.
I had this working acquaintance once, he got shit canned from the firm, but he fostered a relationship with one of our clients, not a major one, but one nonetheless. well, the client was a pain in the ass, and the firm dawdled, putting him off. All the while the client, and the acquaintance, were communicating back and forth. The client decided to go with this "friend" and the "friend" called me to come in on the project, with the one condition that I'd bring him the files, dwgs and existing drawings. At first, because I wanted to do outside work, I said yes, but when time came to deliver the drawings, and files, I thought about how this "friend" was putting me in a difficult spot; if the client screwed him, and went back to our firm, then that would almost certainly out me and cost me my job.
Following friends with zero integrity, is a zero sum gain; you're damned if you, damned if you don't. You just need to figure out if your integrity is worth losing, not by you, but by your friend.
Smells bad.
The contractor relationship is supposed to be a two-way street. You introduce me to your client, I'll introduce you to mine. With positive working experience this becomes a recommendation rather than an introduction.
Option 1: Ask for an introduction to the client. If your "friend" won't agree, then adios.
Option 2: Propose a standard contract and fees with your "friend" as the client. If he doesn't agree, adios.
You could play both to see where your "friend" stands, but it's pretty obvious from here. The last thing you want is the kind of stink that this will more than likely leave on you: liability, reputation, compromised design, etc. Aside from the fact that you will get hosed on the fee.
Never forget Jaffe's Second Rule: If you need a lawyer, it's already too late.
why is a contractor claiming to be an architect? i find if people lie, they lie. if you know they're misleading other people, i think you should know they're going to mislead you. that means you need to treat them as someone you know is going to lie to you. get paid up front, don't sign or stamp anything you don't have to, and be prepared to walk the minute you're asked to take responsibility for something you aren't comfortable with.
a business relationship with someone who lies to you isn't a good relationship. communication is pretty important in our industry, and if you can't trust what's being communicated to you it tends to cause a lot of problems. the contractor is going to end up cutting some corner somewhere after they tell you they won't and even if it's something you've detailed different on your drawings, you're still going to get sucked in. insurance companies sue everyone.
architects don't have contracts with the contractor. architects have contracts with owner and contractor has contract with owner.
i'm pretty sure i've worked on projects where the owner contracted with the contractor and the contractor hired us so our contract was with the contractor. we still have a responsibility to act as an owner's rep in those cases.
above post incorrect in design build mea culpa. i guess if you're gonna work with this guy you should in your agreement insist that he not call himself an architect since it is illegal for him to do so. i would also make sure there is money for you as the project progresses.
Option two was proposed as the way you would work with a speculative developer. If the "friend" agreed - which he never would - the logical argument is why not contract directly with the client. If it comes down money, it's quantifiable if not clean.
I undestand the desire to do business, especially in difficult times, but situations that are problematic before you start aren't going to magically improve. Odds are they will accelerate in the same direction.
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