Yes, anyone in an ownership or management position really has to surround themselves with the best people they can find. In my organization, we have really woken up to that in the past couple of years.

Check section 1405.3 of the IBC for your climate zone. I’m a big fan of Certainteed’s MemBrain product for mixed climates. Sorry I can’t help with your makeover.

There should be no vapor barrier in wall assemblies in a mixed climate. I assume you mean vapor retarder? (One of my burning desires is to be less pedantic, but it's not going well...) I agree with EA that Membrain is a decent product, but I prefer Pro Clima Intello because it is much more robust, can be taped as an air barrier (Membrain rips if you look at it sideways), and it is slightly more vapor-closed when dry.

I learned something new today. Thanks Wood Guy

P.s. Being less pedantic isn't as fun. I like to watch people's eyes glaze over when I talk about the different classes of vapor retarders.

I started a group called BS* + Beer (*building science) so I could talk about this stuff at a local microbrewery with fellow nerds. The idea has caught on and other groups are starting all over the country. Building nerds unite!

I'd be into that. Any groups out West yet?

How far west? I know there's one in Kansas City, two in Minnesota, something similar in Golden CO, and I'm trying to get a friend in Oregon to start one there. It's not hard, you could start your own. I have a list of tips and topics, and no copyright on the name. (If you do start one, I would like to know about it so we can add it to the Pretty Good House website.)

Donna, sorry to hijack your thread.

If I drive an hour west I'll drown. :)

OMG BS+Beer sounds amazing! But I agree that in a mixed climate - which Indy very much is! - that a super tight VB isn't a good idea in a regular building (doesn't apply in PassivHaus, of course). I have a client insisting on a vapor barrier. So I'm really trying to figure out the best option to both serve their needs/wants and CMA.

Ooooooo. Vapour barrier pillow talk. My favorite. I have 2 clients right now where I’m installing one In their interior walls. We typically do vapour perméable air barriers when budget allows.

Wood Guy, you’ve mentioned your beer group before and it’s always fascinating. Don’t think we have enough interest up here for this.

Could always try the perfect wall from Lstiburek...

There is a pretty strong local chapter of the Building Enclosure Council (BEC) where I’m at. I’d like to see a BS+Beer meeting take hold here, but I think the BEC chapter meetings already fill that niche.

Donna, an advantage of Intello is that it is a class 2 vapor retarder when dry--at -.3 perms, it's very close to a class 1 vapor retarder, essentially blocking vapor movement. Then if the assembly accumulates moisture it becomes vapor-open, up to 13 perms. There's lots of info on it at foursevenfive.com.

A comparable product that is even tighter is Siga Majrex, from Sigatapes.com. It's a little tighter when dry, still not quite class 1 but close at 0.2 perms. It doesn't open up as much when wet (0.7 perms) but enough to allow some drying. It just isn't safe to try to block all vapor flow in a mixed climate unless it's with an insulating material, because the dewpoint location moves within the assembly as temperature and humidity changes. 

Non, I forget where you're located? I also forgot that I had brought up the discussion group idea before, sorry. I'm in a rural part of Maine, only about 30 people per square mile and one of the lowest per capita income counties in a low-income state, yet I still get 10-25 people each month. So I truly believe that if I can do it here, it should work pretty much anywhere.

WG, I'm in Ottawa (CAD)... so not a low-income place and certainly not rural (but definitively rural compared to montreal or toronto). The public here is almost 75% undeserving entitled government employee and they have a terrible habit of complaining and filling lawsuits on everything. I'd want to attend a Beer and BS thing here, but not with this crowd because it'll quickly turn to real BS.

This is more than I ever knew about vapor barriers, usually we just hire an envelope consultant and do what they say. Makes me wonder about the decline of the profession. Maybe starchitects just don't have the Burning Desire to keep the walls of their buildings water and mold free.

^We(I) spend a great deal of time picking the right product for my assemblies because I need solid ground to stand on when Mr. scummy contractor comes along and tries to sub parts of my clients walls because they have a "better" product.

Non, I understand. A couple of architect friends are starting a BS + Beer in Lake Placid, NY, which looks like is about 3 hours from you. I know that'a a haul but should be fun. There is an existing group in Burlington, VT. You can message me for contact info, michael at michaelmaines dot com. Or fast forward to the end of this presentation: https://www.finehomebuilding.com/2019/11/20/fhb-summit-pretty-good-house-insight-session.

Please don't keep your mouth shut, you have things to say that are worth hearing.

Kahn was 50 when he started his main body of work. You are still young!

But he died broke in a public toilet stall. Probably not the scenario you want for yourself.

I don't think that's necessary for the recipe of success to work out.

I think the problem starts with this sort of ranking. People put too much self worth into what other people think about their chosen method of living happily.

Costco actually pays their employees well and has good benefits relative to other retail.

As i said, its all about perspective

When I was a 22-year-old college dropout with no clue what I wanted to do with my life, becoming the best bagel-baker, then the best barista, were awesome goals to work toward.

I'm incapable of doing anything without wanting to be the best at it. Except domestic crap around the house.

I agree! My wife and I watched it a few weeks ago, with low expectations--while I enjoyed Eddie Murphy movies when I was young, they haven't aged well. We loved Dolemite Is My Name. Definitely inspirational for following your dreams.