fisk,
I have it on good authority from someone in HR that firms will always let visa holders go if possible, since the definition of the visa itself is "temporary worker with special skills" and is issued on the precondition that no local is available to fill the position. That is why most H1 visa holders move very quickly into the Immigration process to rid themselves of this liability.
hope you don't have to pack up and go home, and can find something that lets you stay on in the US.
oh i think i got myself on a safety net here, i was married to a US citizen back in August and i m currently undergoing an adjustment of status right now. The interview is coming up in 2 weeks, if everything goes smoothly i will be able to get my green card soon....
but my 2 other friends in NY were less fortunate... they are single so right now they have to change their visa status to F-1 student visas and pay a few grand to enroll in language schools for a few months...
so I am still safe here, trying to claim unemployment as well, and seriously thinking of a change in profession.
But one funny thing, the reason that the firm said me when they let go of me was "You are not a right fit to our firm, you better find a 1 or 2 person firm to work for".... and yes, this firm spent 6K on my visa back in 2007 and I worked for them for over 2 years.... seriously I have no clue they are thinking about....
All of the staff at my last firm who were H1 Visa holders were laid off. There were about 10 of them. I was very good friends with a lot of them. It was really sad.
I really believe that H-1 are the first to go because of less liability and H-1 cannot claim unemployment benefits... that's a good chunk of money right there....
Yeah, you talk about diversity getting pitched into the rubbish bin in one day. The even sadder part is that these people who were laid off were nicer than any of the remaining people.
I think I was one of the nicer people... in fact when there were things that blew up, some refer me as the "squat team".... yes I mean staying behind till like 3 or 4 in the morning with constant project deadlines...
and sometimes this nice little LA fell into the cracks of poor management.... I had to once file 2 big boxes of a principal's papers.... like personal correspondence, invoices, e-mails.... totally inappropriate...
I wish we were a little more than a line item in an excel spreadsheet with a $-figure at the end of it, and were considered for skills, personality, potential, talent etc...but reality bites...
if the only personnel let go were those from overseas a lawsuit charging discrimination might be in order. a friend at another firm remarked that those his firm let go included those who did not follow the firm cad standards, those consistently late or those who intentionally worked irregular hours, the non-team players. would it be in a firms best interest to let those with limited english skills go as well?
one economist noted there will be companies that will use the recession as an excuse to unload or close down under-performing divisions they could not when the economy was more robust. architectural firms are shedding those that hinder optimal performance.
find out who is doing prisons. prisons are highly complex and involve numerous firms.
despite starbucks shutting down stores they are planning several hundred more.
firms that specialize in restaurants always seem to need good design talent. people still need to eat during a recession. several new going in around here.
most of the package will not go for construction. how much and how soon will public sector projects trickle down to architects and engineers. as always, it will require renewed confidence of the private sector to invest in new construction. unless money can be made available in a less riskier environment, it will take some time.
$900,000,000,000 stimulus ÷ 300,000,000 persons (illegals included) = $3,000 per person. throw in what was already wasted on wall street and detroit, its bumped to close to $6,000 per person. that's stimulating!
bailout money being spent on new offices and furnishing. some architect, engineer, decorator, and contractor got paid!
even zillion dollar bonuses go somewhere. the money does not just sit. it works.
question is whether federally funded programs will do a better job of invigorating the economy than giving each person a $9,000 tax rebate.
as commercial properties begin to be sold off this summer expect some facelifting and new dealmaking to attract/keep tenants. good likelihood of ti work ahead. somebody has to do it.
fisk, sorry to hear about your situation but immigrants are typically the first to go in countries all over the world. My relatives in Alberta Canada say that plane loads of immigrants are flying home these days because work has slowed...construction labor, architecture, engineering, oil field, etc. This is nothing unique to the USA.
It's just a fact of business, you are on a visa in the first place because the demand for your skills couldn't be met by a citizen. Since the downturn that has all changed, aka visa holders are first to go. The comment about joining a small firm sounds a little inappropriate. Not sure why they would've even need to make that editoral.
Since it sounds like you'll get your conditional permanent residency soon you'll be good...but just joining an already flooded market. It's not good times out there, and sadly sounds like it's even worse for you. Doubly worse for your friends. Can't imagine they will be able to stay int he country too long. Best of luck to you.
Honestly, if Obama wanted to help the economy get solid he would initiate a government sponsored relocation program. When you find work, you apply to government for assistance and when they approve it they release up to 75% of the cost for your relocation to that job. Family included, if you have it. I say this is available to a single person with no dependants twice a year, a single worker with dependents twice a year, and married/(separate but not equal)civil unioned spouses with dependents once a year.
That security during uncertainty would SURELY help people relax and deal with having to go where work is.
See it really sucks for me because I have a first and last name that sounds very exotic and practically spells out "F-0-R-E-I-G-N-E-R" to just about any firm reviewing my resume.
The reality however is that I'm American and an American citizen born and raised who just happens to have an "exotic" name. I know that when it comes time for me to start looking my resume will be among the first to hit the wastebasket because of that. Oh well. C'est la vie. Wouldn't miss it for the world! :)
periodotbritches - the only problem with the moving assistance is what of those that have a house to sell? Many people are upside down in their mortgage, even if not it's near impossible to sell a house right now. Since 50% +/- of all people being laid off are home owners locked into a mortgage a simple moving allowance isn't going to make a big difference.
Regardless, I don't think the current "stimulus" aka pork bill will do much for architects. It's great to move to where the arch jobs are, but it's also great to get the economy moving again so there are arch jobs all over.
True. I would hope that the people who are 'in charge' of all this can figure out a way to balance the systems need for power with the peoples need for income. My suggestion is far from experienced, but it is an idea.
And ya know, maybe we can't all be "architects" all the time.
And ya know, maybe we can't all be "architects" all the time.
I've been saying this for a while. Might be a good time to cull the herd. Sadly, anyone posting on archinect probably cares more about their career of choice than most others, but obviously we're getting hit.
Feel for the "class of '09" They probably have it worst of all.
actually archmed, my ex firm mistaken my name and thought I was locally born and raised.... and when i first joined the firm fresh out of graduate school, they didn't process the H-1 visa because they thought i am american... so when I brought that up, they mumbled, and said, sure, the firm can do that for you. But the HR at that time wasn't too much of a help, and in the end I missed the H-1 quota for FY 2007.
then the second part, this HR was fired and along came another HR, she just changed everything in the office manual, so April came along and it's time for another year of H-1 quota lottery in 2008. This second HR demanded to have me pay for all visa expenses as per her office manual, where in fact the version of the office manual i have says the company will pay forth all visa expenses.... yes 2 versions mysteriously! She demanded me to pay $6,000 for the visa and lawyer fees. I have to fight for it because I should be grandfathered with the old rule... so I have the office paid, but still because the visas didn't overlap, I have to leave the country for 3 months.
so one year later, they have spend 6K, had 4 different HR, and I am out.
Hopefully this is a time when people will end up being able to tell a story that ends up something like "...never would've found out how much I enjoyed doing this work if I hadn't been laid off".
Bean a bit optimistic for my fellows and fellowettes, of course.
I heard 40 were let go from Gensler LA. I for one am optimistic. There is new work trickling in, all be it very slowly. Go Obama! Go the Stimulus Package! Death to environmental-insenstive building!
In response to minimal animals comment...
Unfortunatelly (as you all know) this is a business and each employee has a $$ value. Unfortunatelly if there is no work $$ there will have to be job cuts. Smart/good employers (of large firms) WILL look past the $$ and take into account all those qualities you've listed and find a place for you in the big picture. This is more difficult in single office operations...where there is no wiggle room.
Our first round was tough, but expected. Round 2 was very difficult for everyone...I had a conversation with my VP a few days later and she was still shaken to the point where she broke down. It's not easy...even for the persons making the decisions. Like I tell the junior people, if you are next it's not personal...it's just a business...we do care for each and everyone, but there are financial responsabilities...if we go bankrupt there may not be a place to come back to...
If person A stays over person B there is a reason...and you have to believe that it's all for the best interest of everyone. If and when things stabilize and slightly pick up, many of those laid off will be called back.
Things are in the sh!tter folks...let's hope the floor is near. There is HOPE in the new administration, and many of the folks I know who have been laid off have been able to find side work to make ends meet...additions, remodel, etc.
as for the obama administration, they need to forget the bipartisanship dance (because the Republicans won't plan) and spent on "smart" infrastructure, transit, construction, etc.
buildings freeway lanes to far-flung exurbs is not the answer.
I'm afraid that the chattering class inside the Beltway and in the news rooms in NYC do not realize how bad it is out there...
watch the GOP vote against the bill and loose even more support and totally kill themselves and show themselves be even more so hypocrites having voted for it partly in the first place and now trying to make a stand as obstructionists of progress, typical bigot closeted peeps ish.
Or the GOP may say let the Dems take all the credit for this bill. The GOP got sidetracked yes by embracing the radical right in an effort to thwrt the Clinton momentum.. But make no mistake - the core of smaller Gov republicans is still out there, even if many voted Obama, and they wont stand for this very long. This bill is a major dissappointment to moderate republicansas it it does no actual stimulating and wreaks of old school democratic program inflation. It doesnt help when Rahm says theres no better time than a crisis to get what we want. I say kill it. Its not a stimulus. The only stimulus is tax cuts. We got all the roads and trains we need this for this year. What we doent have is businesses transacting.
Two days ago, the House of Representatives passed an economic recovery bill that would make historic investments in our nation’s crumbling infrastructure. Thanks to the efforts of AIA members like you, the bill would support green schools, mass transit, affordable housing and other initiatives to help architects get to work designing 21st century communities.
But many of our hard-fought gains might be at risk. The bill is now before the Senate, where Senators from both parties have suggested they may try to drastically change the bill. There is the possibility that funding for green buildings and sustainable infrastructure might be reduced, or even eliminated.
Earlier this week, the civil engineers reported that it would take over $2 trillion to fix our infrastructure. Without infrastructure investments in the economic stimulus bill, our built environment will deteriorate even more, and the design and construction industries would be left out of the economic recovery.
The Senate will begin debating the bill on Monday.
either you say make it work for the people at a transparent sustainable level or have it not at all, none of this wack conservative borderline stuff that has been shown/known to be poison and lets corrupt privatization and deregulation to flourish.
basically the end of sideism and the embrace of the radical post left.
"Add the roughly $20 billion for business tax cuts, and by our estimate only $90 billion out of $825 billion, or about 12 cents of every $1, is for something that can plausibly be considered a growth stimulus"
Article also mentions about $6billion for green school renovations. Less than 1% of the bill. Nothing to get all creamy about.
The transit funding is for urban systems with heavily unionised workforces rather than new ones. Hmmm, I dont know about you but I smell payback.
I don't know a single right leaning architect. AIA advocates for green, jobs and it's members.
of course you smell pay check i think that is what it is about keeping people working. as far as unions i admire the IWW's achievements for workers rights but have no direct experience with anything other than low bid.
heard through the grapevine that Gensler DC had a nice healthy round today (in support of i+ comment above)...something like 20-25%
Ouch! anyone on here work (ed) there?
Archmed - In response to your 'foreign' sounding name, have you thought about putting a "CITIZENSHIP" section on your resume? I've seen this done before were the individual will list their American citizenship and, if any, dual citizenship. My friend has this section under his Awards/Achievements/Honors. He mentioned that some employers thanked him because it easily identified him regardless of his odd sounding name.
I had a freeing from Puerto Rico who at my suggestion added the following lines to his cover letter
“… and I would be happy to share with you my experiences practicing architecture in the United States Territory of Puerto Rico.”
After he added that line he started to get interviews
Many architecture firms are smallish and can not afford to take on a professional or experienced hr person. The society of human resources has not been able to get a title act, like architects or lawyers have, and as a result often unqualified people pose as HR professionals. Gentle nudging sometimes helps.
As a lefty liberal I have to admit that I've had way too much experience with unions to be entirely pro-union. Like most powerful things become, many unions are just plain corrupt. The idea of unionization is a fantastic one and I am extremely grateful for all the gains unions in general have made for the workers of this country. (Thank god for the 8 hour day, lunch breaks, and (somewhat equal) pay equity!) The sad thing is that now that the unions have become "status quo" many of the top brass seem to simply be fighting to sustain the quality of their own jobs and bank accounts rather than their workers'. Anyway, total digression here.
The Chicago Transit Authority is completely closed shop meaning you Must join the union to work there. This also applies to the capital projects not handled in house through the prevailing wages laws in Illinois check out the capital development board website. All state or federally funded projects need to adhere to the prevailing wage mandates.
Unions have to make a tough choice in protecting wages or protecting jobs, right now they can’t have both.
I suspect prefab and precast concrete will be popular for two reasons, one the speed of erection and two the ability to get out from under union wage mandates.
so J3, we should all be "ok" with being laid off...right ?
I don't know if its just me, but its an indignity that no one should have to face...at my former firm (large firm on the West Coast), recruiting was ramped up at an insane rate all through the last two years...and the hiring was totally indiscriminate, regardless of skill or talent...the studio balooned to a size of close to 80...and lo and behold, the inevitable economic downturn hit and severe attrition followed....4 rounds of layoffs have decimated the studio...where there are only titled staff and prinicipals left....this firm has huge reserves in cash, that could be used to sustain the staff through these hard economic times...but they have chosen to eliminate rather than reduce their profit margins. They even paid bonuses to the associates and partners....
Now, it does not take a degree in business administration for one to understand that slow, sustained growth through good practices is much better than meteoric uncontrolled growth...I guess it is typical of the whole economy...executives making rash decisions to make $$ quickly and indiscriminately....you can say very easily that "its just business, and its not personal" when you're not at the receiving end of the axe.
Call me crazy, but being laid off will never, ever be ok with me, knowing that I dedicate myself totally to the project, which makes these guys their big bucks.
M animal: Life if tough, no one figured we were being screwed for so long. Offices thought the run would continue cause they were looking at alot of indicators. So they were false indicators but who is to blame,
the Owners of Architectual Firms. I think not. We are basic followers,
we go where the money is. You know all the bases, and some are more stable than others. We are unfortunately in a very difficult time and I'm sure Layoffs to a boss are just as emotional as they are to the employee.
M animal....I have no one to layoff but myself.
Might we all survive this downturn of the economy.
My mother picked up cow pies off the high plains during the last big one in the 30"s. They were used to keep the fire going....and they did.
not saying that being laid off is ok, or that "ALL" firms are created equal...I've been laid off in the past...and know what it feels like... Just sharing some thoughts. Wether or not they have "huge" reserves or not a pot to piss on...it's still a business...how they lay people off is often the issue.
Having people sitting around doing nothing is not a model ANY industry follows (except GM...have you been to one of their factories?) we all know where that story ends...
Many (and I am only speaking of those who I have first had experience with) of the 30 or so former co-workers who have been let go in te past few months have gone on to do something productive, different...from going back to school, teaching, hell even back to flight attendant!
Back to my experience...but related to your "slow, sustained growth" comment. Our office is half the size it was a year ago, granted we lost quite a few on their own...but the powers that be held from the uncontrolled growth you speak of. Sure we turned away work, but only kept the long term "better"clients...some of which are keeping us going right now. Things are looking bleaker and bleaker but as I have said before, we are fortunate to be able to tap other offices for work and sustain enough talent in ours.
You are not crazy...there are plenty of greedy people out there that treat us like trash...another piece of advice is find a place you are happy with, and one that respects you.
GGA in DC just laid of 2 this past monday. Those that are higher up have had to take paycuts and as a result 1 has left due to the request of pay cuts. Also does anyone know of firms that are seriously coming close to folding? GGA recently had 2 law suits by DC Superior court that have come through. One is from a engineering firm and the other is from ABC the local/national rapido services. Law suits are for money that has yet to be paid for services. I am hearing that the total amount plus fees, etc could amount to 7 million. Trying to deal with that plus a recession!!!
snook,
I would agree that the owners of firms are not completely to blame, but they should take responsibility partially. I guess it is utopian to expect that people in this capitalist economy would have a conscience to not f%@k with the livelihoods of people who are only helping them get wealthier. On one hand, they're laying good, hardworking, honest people off, while they're paying themselves bonuses and spending $$$ on retreats and ski-trips and what not.
Granted that not all executives are cast in this mold, but most are.
There are some firms out there whose owners have taken pay-cuts, given up some of their benefits to keep the company solvent and sustain their staff numbers. I know of one executive who has invested his own personal retirement money in the company to sustain their people...so there are some, but these are few and far in between...and all power and success to them.
My experience has been quite to the contrary. The studio director, recently hired, at my last firm basically picked off all the people he did not like, like bottles in a shooting range...now the studio which may of us had worked our asses off to build into a collegial, fostering environment, is a total wasteland with no one left....and this is a "large" firm with billions in revenue and $$$ millions in cash reserves...this bloodbath was completely deliberate and maybe part of it was due to the economic downturn, but mostly it was personal...so forgive me for being bitter...
Layoffs....layoffs......
fisk,
I have it on good authority from someone in HR that firms will always let visa holders go if possible, since the definition of the visa itself is "temporary worker with special skills" and is issued on the precondition that no local is available to fill the position. That is why most H1 visa holders move very quickly into the Immigration process to rid themselves of this liability.
hope you don't have to pack up and go home, and can find something that lets you stay on in the US.
oh i think i got myself on a safety net here, i was married to a US citizen back in August and i m currently undergoing an adjustment of status right now. The interview is coming up in 2 weeks, if everything goes smoothly i will be able to get my green card soon....
but my 2 other friends in NY were less fortunate... they are single so right now they have to change their visa status to F-1 student visas and pay a few grand to enroll in language schools for a few months...
so I am still safe here, trying to claim unemployment as well, and seriously thinking of a change in profession.
But one funny thing, the reason that the firm said me when they let go of me was "You are not a right fit to our firm, you better find a 1 or 2 person firm to work for".... and yes, this firm spent 6K on my visa back in 2007 and I worked for them for over 2 years.... seriously I have no clue they are thinking about....
All of the staff at my last firm who were H1 Visa holders were laid off. There were about 10 of them. I was very good friends with a lot of them. It was really sad.
Archmed-
I really believe that H-1 are the first to go because of less liability and H-1 cannot claim unemployment benefits... that's a good chunk of money right there....
Yeah, you talk about diversity getting pitched into the rubbish bin in one day. The even sadder part is that these people who were laid off were nicer than any of the remaining people.
It was depressing.
heehee Archmed-
I think I was one of the nicer people... in fact when there were things that blew up, some refer me as the "squat team".... yes I mean staying behind till like 3 or 4 in the morning with constant project deadlines...
and sometimes this nice little LA fell into the cracks of poor management.... I had to once file 2 big boxes of a principal's papers.... like personal correspondence, invoices, e-mails.... totally inappropriate...
fisk, no offense, but it sounds like the folks you worked for weren't the greatest. Hope you get that job.
(not squat team)
sorry for the typo, yep, swat team is what i meant.... not squat.... lol!
apurimac- so i m glad i m no longer with them... no matter how people outside said they are a top notch LA firm...
I wish we were a little more than a line item in an excel spreadsheet with a $-figure at the end of it, and were considered for skills, personality, potential, talent etc...but reality bites...
if the only personnel let go were those from overseas a lawsuit charging discrimination might be in order. a friend at another firm remarked that those his firm let go included those who did not follow the firm cad standards, those consistently late or those who intentionally worked irregular hours, the non-team players. would it be in a firms best interest to let those with limited english skills go as well?
one economist noted there will be companies that will use the recession as an excuse to unload or close down under-performing divisions they could not when the economy was more robust. architectural firms are shedding those that hinder optimal performance.
find out who is doing prisons. prisons are highly complex and involve numerous firms.
despite starbucks shutting down stores they are planning several hundred more.
firms that specialize in restaurants always seem to need good design talent. people still need to eat during a recession. several new going in around here.
i was super excited when my bosses said they wouldn't go for any police/prison rfq's.
we've got enough of that sh*t as it is.
government waste: article today.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601109&sid=aYYHKPn4DOe8&refer=home
most of the package will not go for construction. how much and how soon will public sector projects trickle down to architects and engineers. as always, it will require renewed confidence of the private sector to invest in new construction. unless money can be made available in a less riskier environment, it will take some time.
$900,000,000,000 stimulus ÷ 300,000,000 persons (illegals included) = $3,000 per person. throw in what was already wasted on wall street and detroit, its bumped to close to $6,000 per person. that's stimulating!
bailout money being spent on new offices and furnishing. some architect, engineer, decorator, and contractor got paid!
even zillion dollar bonuses go somewhere. the money does not just sit. it works.
question is whether federally funded programs will do a better job of invigorating the economy than giving each person a $9,000 tax rebate.
as commercial properties begin to be sold off this summer expect some facelifting and new dealmaking to attract/keep tenants. good likelihood of ti work ahead. somebody has to do it.
fisk, sorry to hear about your situation but immigrants are typically the first to go in countries all over the world. My relatives in Alberta Canada say that plane loads of immigrants are flying home these days because work has slowed...construction labor, architecture, engineering, oil field, etc. This is nothing unique to the USA.
It's just a fact of business, you are on a visa in the first place because the demand for your skills couldn't be met by a citizen. Since the downturn that has all changed, aka visa holders are first to go. The comment about joining a small firm sounds a little inappropriate. Not sure why they would've even need to make that editoral.
Since it sounds like you'll get your conditional permanent residency soon you'll be good...but just joining an already flooded market. It's not good times out there, and sadly sounds like it's even worse for you. Doubly worse for your friends. Can't imagine they will be able to stay int he country too long. Best of luck to you.
got a note from someone yesterday that tvs in atlanta was doing a round of layoffs. not sure on the total.
Honestly, if Obama wanted to help the economy get solid he would initiate a government sponsored relocation program. When you find work, you apply to government for assistance and when they approve it they release up to 75% of the cost for your relocation to that job. Family included, if you have it. I say this is available to a single person with no dependants twice a year, a single worker with dependents twice a year, and married/(separate but not equal)civil unioned spouses with dependents once a year.
That security during uncertainty would SURELY help people relax and deal with having to go where work is.
See it really sucks for me because I have a first and last name that sounds very exotic and practically spells out "F-0-R-E-I-G-N-E-R" to just about any firm reviewing my resume.
The reality however is that I'm American and an American citizen born and raised who just happens to have an "exotic" name. I know that when it comes time for me to start looking my resume will be among the first to hit the wastebasket because of that. Oh well. C'est la vie. Wouldn't miss it for the world! :)
periodotbritches - the only problem with the moving assistance is what of those that have a house to sell? Many people are upside down in their mortgage, even if not it's near impossible to sell a house right now. Since 50% +/- of all people being laid off are home owners locked into a mortgage a simple moving allowance isn't going to make a big difference.
Regardless, I don't think the current "stimulus" aka pork bill will do much for architects. It's great to move to where the arch jobs are, but it's also great to get the economy moving again so there are arch jobs all over.
True. I would hope that the people who are 'in charge' of all this can figure out a way to balance the systems need for power with the peoples need for income. My suggestion is far from experienced, but it is an idea.
And ya know, maybe we can't all be "architects" all the time.
I've been saying this for a while. Might be a good time to cull the herd. Sadly, anyone posting on archinect probably cares more about their career of choice than most others, but obviously we're getting hit.
Feel for the "class of '09" They probably have it worst of all.
Gensler DC right this very second... pickin em off one by one
actually archmed, my ex firm mistaken my name and thought I was locally born and raised.... and when i first joined the firm fresh out of graduate school, they didn't process the H-1 visa because they thought i am american... so when I brought that up, they mumbled, and said, sure, the firm can do that for you. But the HR at that time wasn't too much of a help, and in the end I missed the H-1 quota for FY 2007.
then the second part, this HR was fired and along came another HR, she just changed everything in the office manual, so April came along and it's time for another year of H-1 quota lottery in 2008. This second HR demanded to have me pay for all visa expenses as per her office manual, where in fact the version of the office manual i have says the company will pay forth all visa expenses.... yes 2 versions mysteriously! She demanded me to pay $6,000 for the visa and lawyer fees. I have to fight for it because I should be grandfathered with the old rule... so I have the office paid, but still because the visas didn't overlap, I have to leave the country for 3 months.
so one year later, they have spend 6K, had 4 different HR, and I am out.
Hopefully this is a time when people will end up being able to tell a story that ends up something like "...never would've found out how much I enjoyed doing this work if I hadn't been laid off".
Bean a bit optimistic for my fellows and fellowettes, of course.
survived the 3rd wave...
I heard 40 were let go from Gensler LA. I for one am optimistic. There is new work trickling in, all be it very slowly. Go Obama! Go the Stimulus Package! Death to environmental-insenstive building!
In response to minimal animals comment...
Unfortunatelly (as you all know) this is a business and each employee has a $$ value. Unfortunatelly if there is no work $$ there will have to be job cuts. Smart/good employers (of large firms) WILL look past the $$ and take into account all those qualities you've listed and find a place for you in the big picture. This is more difficult in single office operations...where there is no wiggle room.
Our first round was tough, but expected. Round 2 was very difficult for everyone...I had a conversation with my VP a few days later and she was still shaken to the point where she broke down. It's not easy...even for the persons making the decisions. Like I tell the junior people, if you are next it's not personal...it's just a business...we do care for each and everyone, but there are financial responsabilities...if we go bankrupt there may not be a place to come back to...
If person A stays over person B there is a reason...and you have to believe that it's all for the best interest of everyone. If and when things stabilize and slightly pick up, many of those laid off will be called back.
Things are in the sh!tter folks...let's hope the floor is near. There is HOPE in the new administration, and many of the folks I know who have been laid off have been able to find side work to make ends meet...additions, remodel, etc.
+i I've heard that too
as for the obama administration, they need to forget the bipartisanship dance (because the Republicans won't plan) and spent on "smart" infrastructure, transit, construction, etc.
buildings freeway lanes to far-flung exurbs is not the answer.
I'm afraid that the chattering class inside the Beltway and in the news rooms in NYC do not realize how bad it is out there...
at my big E lil a, i just found out that we laid off 3
1 - mech
1 - LA
1 - Arch (registered + 5yr exp in our satellite office)
1 - construction estimator
... fwiw: times were good ~ the LA and construction estimator were "trials".
we do a lot of schools with a heavy "green" tint, so i'm hoping we can get in on the big spending of the legislation that just got passed.
...guess that adds up to 4 ;)
good thing you got all those E's around :)
watch the GOP vote against the bill and loose even more support and totally kill themselves and show themselves be even more so hypocrites having voted for it partly in the first place and now trying to make a stand as obstructionists of progress, typical bigot closeted peeps ish.
Or the GOP may say let the Dems take all the credit for this bill. The GOP got sidetracked yes by embracing the radical right in an effort to thwrt the Clinton momentum.. But make no mistake - the core of smaller Gov republicans is still out there, even if many voted Obama, and they wont stand for this very long. This bill is a major dissappointment to moderate republicansas it it does no actual stimulating and wreaks of old school democratic program inflation. It doesnt help when Rahm says theres no better time than a crisis to get what we want. I say kill it. Its not a stimulus. The only stimulus is tax cuts. We got all the roads and trains we need this for this year. What we doent have is businesses transacting.
AIA:
Two days ago, the House of Representatives passed an economic recovery bill that would make historic investments in our nation’s crumbling infrastructure. Thanks to the efforts of AIA members like you, the bill would support green schools, mass transit, affordable housing and other initiatives to help architects get to work designing 21st century communities.
But many of our hard-fought gains might be at risk. The bill is now before the Senate, where Senators from both parties have suggested they may try to drastically change the bill. There is the possibility that funding for green buildings and sustainable infrastructure might be reduced, or even eliminated.
Earlier this week, the civil engineers reported that it would take over $2 trillion to fix our infrastructure. Without infrastructure investments in the economic stimulus bill, our built environment will deteriorate even more, and the design and construction industries would be left out of the economic recovery.
The Senate will begin debating the bill on Monday.
either you say make it work for the people at a transparent sustainable level or have it not at all, none of this wack conservative borderline stuff that has been shown/known to be poison and lets corrupt privatization and deregulation to flourish.
basically the end of sideism and the embrace of the radical post left.
Ididnt know the AIA was somewhat partisan -
from the WSJ,
"Add the roughly $20 billion for business tax cuts, and by our estimate only $90 billion out of $825 billion, or about 12 cents of every $1, is for something that can plausibly be considered a growth stimulus"
Article also mentions about $6billion for green school renovations. Less than 1% of the bill. Nothing to get all creamy about.
The transit funding is for urban systems with heavily unionised workforces rather than new ones. Hmmm, I dont know about you but I smell payback.
I don't know a single right leaning architect. AIA advocates for green, jobs and it's members.
of course you smell pay check i think that is what it is about keeping people working. as far as unions i admire the IWW's achievements for workers rights but have no direct experience with anything other than low bid.
heard through the grapevine that Gensler DC had a nice healthy round today (in support of i+ comment above)...something like 20-25%
Ouch! anyone on here work (ed) there?
Archmed - In response to your 'foreign' sounding name, have you thought about putting a "CITIZENSHIP" section on your resume? I've seen this done before were the individual will list their American citizenship and, if any, dual citizenship. My friend has this section under his Awards/Achievements/Honors. He mentioned that some employers thanked him because it easily identified him regardless of his odd sounding name.
I had a freeing from Puerto Rico who at my suggestion added the following lines to his cover letter
“… and I would be happy to share with you my experiences practicing architecture in the United States Territory of Puerto Rico.”
After he added that line he started to get interviews
Many architecture firms are smallish and can not afford to take on a professional or experienced hr person. The society of human resources has not been able to get a title act, like architects or lawyers have, and as a result often unqualified people pose as HR professionals. Gentle nudging sometimes helps.
Freeing = friend
Sorry typo
As a lefty liberal I have to admit that I've had way too much experience with unions to be entirely pro-union. Like most powerful things become, many unions are just plain corrupt. The idea of unionization is a fantastic one and I am extremely grateful for all the gains unions in general have made for the workers of this country. (Thank god for the 8 hour day, lunch breaks, and (somewhat equal) pay equity!) The sad thing is that now that the unions have become "status quo" many of the top brass seem to simply be fighting to sustain the quality of their own jobs and bank accounts rather than their workers'. Anyway, total digression here.
Where is there still a heavily unionized workforce?
And what does that mean?
The Chicago Transit Authority is completely closed shop meaning you Must join the union to work there. This also applies to the capital projects not handled in house through the prevailing wages laws in Illinois check out the capital development board website. All state or federally funded projects need to adhere to the prevailing wage mandates.
Unions have to make a tough choice in protecting wages or protecting jobs, right now they can’t have both.
I suspect prefab and precast concrete will be popular for two reasons, one the speed of erection and two the ability to get out from under union wage mandates.
I'm holding on to my nipples...beg your pardon.
Now I understand what the union reference is to...
Yeah, there's gotta be some give on their side.
so J3, we should all be "ok" with being laid off...right ?
I don't know if its just me, but its an indignity that no one should have to face...at my former firm (large firm on the West Coast), recruiting was ramped up at an insane rate all through the last two years...and the hiring was totally indiscriminate, regardless of skill or talent...the studio balooned to a size of close to 80...and lo and behold, the inevitable economic downturn hit and severe attrition followed....4 rounds of layoffs have decimated the studio...where there are only titled staff and prinicipals left....this firm has huge reserves in cash, that could be used to sustain the staff through these hard economic times...but they have chosen to eliminate rather than reduce their profit margins. They even paid bonuses to the associates and partners....
Now, it does not take a degree in business administration for one to understand that slow, sustained growth through good practices is much better than meteoric uncontrolled growth...I guess it is typical of the whole economy...executives making rash decisions to make $$ quickly and indiscriminately....you can say very easily that "its just business, and its not personal" when you're not at the receiving end of the axe.
Call me crazy, but being laid off will never, ever be ok with me, knowing that I dedicate myself totally to the project, which makes these guys their big bucks.
M animal: Life if tough, no one figured we were being screwed for so long. Offices thought the run would continue cause they were looking at alot of indicators. So they were false indicators but who is to blame,
the Owners of Architectual Firms. I think not. We are basic followers,
we go where the money is. You know all the bases, and some are more stable than others. We are unfortunately in a very difficult time and I'm sure Layoffs to a boss are just as emotional as they are to the employee.
M animal....I have no one to layoff but myself.
Might we all survive this downturn of the economy.
My mother picked up cow pies off the high plains during the last big one in the 30"s. They were used to keep the fire going....and they did.
not saying that being laid off is ok, or that "ALL" firms are created equal...I've been laid off in the past...and know what it feels like... Just sharing some thoughts. Wether or not they have "huge" reserves or not a pot to piss on...it's still a business...how they lay people off is often the issue.
Having people sitting around doing nothing is not a model ANY industry follows (except GM...have you been to one of their factories?) we all know where that story ends...
Many (and I am only speaking of those who I have first had experience with) of the 30 or so former co-workers who have been let go in te past few months have gone on to do something productive, different...from going back to school, teaching, hell even back to flight attendant!
Back to my experience...but related to your "slow, sustained growth" comment. Our office is half the size it was a year ago, granted we lost quite a few on their own...but the powers that be held from the uncontrolled growth you speak of. Sure we turned away work, but only kept the long term "better"clients...some of which are keeping us going right now. Things are looking bleaker and bleaker but as I have said before, we are fortunate to be able to tap other offices for work and sustain enough talent in ours.
You are not crazy...there are plenty of greedy people out there that treat us like trash...another piece of advice is find a place you are happy with, and one that respects you.
GGA in DC just laid of 2 this past monday. Those that are higher up have had to take paycuts and as a result 1 has left due to the request of pay cuts. Also does anyone know of firms that are seriously coming close to folding? GGA recently had 2 law suits by DC Superior court that have come through. One is from a engineering firm and the other is from ABC the local/national rapido services. Law suits are for money that has yet to be paid for services. I am hearing that the total amount plus fees, etc could amount to 7 million. Trying to deal with that plus a recession!!!
snook,
I would agree that the owners of firms are not completely to blame, but they should take responsibility partially. I guess it is utopian to expect that people in this capitalist economy would have a conscience to not f%@k with the livelihoods of people who are only helping them get wealthier. On one hand, they're laying good, hardworking, honest people off, while they're paying themselves bonuses and spending $$$ on retreats and ski-trips and what not.
Granted that not all executives are cast in this mold, but most are.
There are some firms out there whose owners have taken pay-cuts, given up some of their benefits to keep the company solvent and sustain their staff numbers. I know of one executive who has invested his own personal retirement money in the company to sustain their people...so there are some, but these are few and far in between...and all power and success to them.
My experience has been quite to the contrary. The studio director, recently hired, at my last firm basically picked off all the people he did not like, like bottles in a shooting range...now the studio which may of us had worked our asses off to build into a collegial, fostering environment, is a total wasteland with no one left....and this is a "large" firm with billions in revenue and $$$ millions in cash reserves...this bloodbath was completely deliberate and maybe part of it was due to the economic downturn, but mostly it was personal...so forgive me for being bitter...
No need to ask for forgiveness for being bitter minimal animal grt it out of your system. Dont let it consume you.
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