I must've sounded angry this afternoon when Mr. Strawbeary called. I heard him take a deep breath and sigh, then in a flat, sad tone, he breathed, "Did you get laid off today?" No, I didn't, thank goodness. Poor guy, he is stressing too as he is not working.
I have gotten 20% and 30% raises in the past. Unfortunately, when you start so low, it doesn't matter much. Now I'm bracing for a 20% cut, which I just realized when you CUT 20%, it is a lot bigger number # than adding 20%. Poo!
one last thing to add about why we don't get paid as much anymore (since this affects, in part, why we're seeing the layoffs we have right now)...
the other big creep in the last 30 years, and one which has accelerated in the last 10, is the sheer complexity of buildings and the increasing specialization of many parts of buildings. for example, if you look at the original 'team' that did the meier high museum here in atlanta, the number of players (arch, mepfp, struct., etc.) was less than 10. the new high museum? something like 20. why does that matter? we've now ceded (primarily by not doing, but also by not incorporating into our practices) tons of ground to various 'specialties', all of whom command a portion of the overall fee. the problem is, the total percentages a fee is relative to construction hasn't gone up much (and is pressured to come down more, especially in commercial projects). so, if we're all paying 2-3 extra consultants fees, even if they're a small percentage overall, it starts adding up.
we've got to start bringing those folks (LEED specialty consultants, planning, code, whatever) into the firms - they can provide some fee diversification as well as help expand our perceived value to clients. all that translates down the line and firms which are doing this are prospering more right now than many others...
I have gotten 20% and 30% raises in the past. Unfortunately, when you start so low, it doesn't matter much.
Ain't that the truth. Say an intern starts at a below average rate around $30,000. Well, 20% of 30k is only 6,000. 30% is just 3,000 more. While 30% sounds huge, $9,000 isn't exactly going to change your lifestyle. Can't imagine what going backwards would be like.
Speaking of the AIA, I just got an email about a quality control checklist they were giving us to help us produce quality work! What a joke!! The quarter page long checklist has useful info like telling us that dimensions should be correct!! DUH. Oh- and draftsmen should be skilled enough to be able to draft!!
Regarding the Fee table the AIA used to publish and was subsequently ruled anti trust ro price fixing; Thats exactly the kind of thing the AIA, a lobbying group should be working hard at making pass the test of anti-trust. Not praying.
I was at a firm for about two years. Business was moving rather well at first but things started to slow down significantly when projects started to slip out of our hands or just get dropped all together. If you remembered reading some of my early threads, I did not really like working at that firm and thought that culturally it was just not a good fit for me. I gave it chance after chance and after a long year of decision making, I finally realized that I need to end my services with that firm imediately.
By august it had become abundantly clear to me that this firm and firms like this were soon to fall victims of the economy as a whole. And sure enough layoffs started happening in large numbers and I witnessed a lot of very good people lose their jobs. I didn't wait one second -- I imediately redid my entire portfolio and resume, made PDFs of all my sample work, and just started firing out resumes nationally. I got a decent amount of responses -- Some were willing to talk further, other didn't respond, and a few others had recently implemented hiring freezes. However, I eventually was engaged in serious talks with a large EA firm that had a solid amount of diverse work both nationally and abroad. So without hesitating, I accepted the offer and never looked back.
But all goes back to the flooded market out there. We are all nervous because there are people with far more experience than me and some of my other colleagues who will take our pay at this stage. Basically, everyone is nervous -- there isn't a single architect out there right now that could honestly tell you that he or she will be employed next month or so... It's very uncertain and scary out there.
My next move is to try to go abroad -- maybe for work -- maybe just to take a breather and reflect back on my 30 years of existence.... It could be a good thing...really.
Archmed- I am beginning to think it's good to have more than one "plan b" kind of ironic!
... My new contingency plan...
My dad owns several businesses revolving around furniture, antique repairs, moving/installation, etc. When my family decided to build their own house last summer he started his own contracting business, too. I was already far away- in DC- and designing fancy resorts and other bullsh*t I thought was special... so now... I'm considering going back and running his contracting business and designing and building a home on a second site he owns (and subsequently turning it into an architecture firm). Mr. +i and myself are both architects- and the process of designing and building our first building ourselves is sounding like a really great prospect. Not to mention that over that time it will take to design and build it, about a year, perhaps the economy might improve somewhat and we can do more work. Sadly, this all requires leaving DC. Something neither of us really wants to do. We both like the city a lot. Plus, we signed a lease until July and would have to pay a crazy amount in concessions to back out of it. Of course in DC most places don't let you sublet either.
What I really hope is that we can make it until March in the firms we are in and perhaps by then we could maybe leave and make a go of it if we absolutely have to. At least this is happening BEFORE we bought a house. *sigh*
I'll second that toasteroven. I know several couples that are both architects or desginers. In this economy that's gotta hurt, even if just one of them is out of work.
Also know a few product reps that used to be architects. They both say the switched careers when starting a family because "I needed to provide for my family."
30+ years ago people did not leave this profession because they had an extra mouth to feed. Anyone who thinks our fees have kept pace with inflation is diluding themselves.
tumbleweed... babysitting is actually not a bad idea. in DC you can get $225 per child (under 4 yrs) per week. wouldn't match current income but would definitely help.
i was lucky enough yesterday to be placed on another HUGE project. but i am still talking with my father about myself and mr. + i running the contracting business, designing my family member's house, and then turning it into a residential firm. i hear that a lot of people turn on their own during times like these- that more people start their own firms in recessions. i am not sure why that is- except for the fear of being laid off. but i can totally understand that. i don't trust this new project i am on and i certainly don't trust the people in charge. so as for me... it's good for now and i feel blessed to be able to hold on for a few more months. but i wouldn't be shocked anymore if something else happens.
Cetra Ruddy in New York city has gone from 10+/- people to 100+/-. Then , it started to crash down in last July with several round of layoff. Last round of layoff was last week with about 15 people been let go. Now, they are down to 30+ employees.
i am originally from buffalo ny. what it seems is going on nation wide is the economic problems which have affected the the rust belt (Buffalo, Cleveland, Detroit, Pittsburgh ,etc....) for the past 30 years have finally spread to the rest of the country.
The problems you guys are having are the same problems that firms in the rust belt have been dealing with for years and years...
+i, can you share what your scary meeting was about? Was it the obvious?
I just had lunch with a bunch of AIA members. One firm who does project management (not design) for public school projects is booked solid for the next 3 years...so anyone interested in PM work might look into who manages your local public projects. As long as there is an architect working in the office you shouldn't have a problem getting your IDP requirements.
LB - once upon a time I worked on some public school projects. Talking to old co-workers, they are booked solid. Must be one of the few bright spots out there these days. And yes, if I were looking for work, I'm all over PM work in education/institutional work.
"what it seems is going on nation wide is the economic problems which have affected the the rust belt (Buffalo, Cleveland, Detroit, Pittsburgh ,etc....) for the past 30 years have finally spread to the rest of the country. "
Thank you. Many here in the Chicago area have been warning this for years. The move from production based to knoweledge based society is flawed because it assumes that the production society diodnt produce or didnt value knoweledge. Economists tout the FIRE sectors as the true growth engines and thats just wrong. The wealth of Nations argued that surplus production is the path to prosperity. The rust belt was the production belt. By the 1950s and 60s, the golden age of American production, the rust belt was joined by Los Angeles Long Beach. Both major contributing regions to the subprime crisis and growing liquidity crisi as small businesses and 30 yr mortgage holders, blue collar, are being slashed.
My fear is that the bickering in Washington has only begun. Our best course might just be to refuse payment this April. best stimulous we could give ourselves.
By my estimate we need about 3,000 people to leave the profession this year to be economically viable. I suggest at the next AIA convention we hold a rock paper scissors tournament to decide who will be in or out. Since the AIA seems like it is not doing much to help. Or maybe I am misinformed as to what if anything they are doing.
People are signing up in droves for the AIA....so many they can't process the applications in a timely manner or their understaffed and need to hire a few unemployed architects to help out.
My brother is doing a condo rehab - interiors - and I just got back from various furniture stores and lighting galleries in Chicago. I spoke to about 10 different reps and sales people on the showroom floors. All but one is an actual architect but working in product sales. I found that very sad.
"People are signing up in droves for the AIA....so many they can't process the applications in a timely manner or their understaffed and need to hire a few unemployed architects to help out."
If the AIA is indeed having a large membership increase, it might be due to the fact that people are seeing more value in network building right now... That's my hypothesis.
Make this is a response I recieved from the AIA National Office this week.
Due to a very high call and e-mail volume that are associated with membership renewal and Convention registration, your wait time may be longer than usual. We will do our best to respond to your e-mail within 48 business hours.
I'm seriously considering to switch to otherrelated field, that reward and investment are more balanced . You may all heard about new LEED exams and anual fee, plus continue education requirement. Now architects have one more organizations like AIA instead of helping architects to get more design fee, trying to squeeze more money out of poor architect. I'm glad I passed LEED several years ago before the first change, the exam fee was $200 and now $400. I don't think LEED help me to get more salary.
I think the problem with architecture is people don't treat it as job but as a passion, so they lost the judgement, and self deluted about the real situation. Architecture took most of the responsibilities during the design, lead the team, and doing all the coorindations. But all the consultants make more money than architects. It is a profession first affect by economy downturn and last recover from it. After years of education, IDP, and ARE exams, you still have very low salary and no job security. It's an old industry that doesn't have much future. Even the 10 best green jobs has no mention of architect. http://www.djc.com/blogs/BuildingGreen/2009/01/21/the-10-best-green-jobs/
What can architect do beside architecture that can rewarding and have a future? A green MBA?
Reason -- my sentiments recently couldn't agree more with your post. I don't know the answer to your question, but I have a sinking feeling that the profession is going to miss what I call the "green buoy"
I had faith that architecture would restablish its public signifigance in a big way with LEED and this shift toward sustainable thinking. Something easy to relate to, some simple cheesy mantra like "thoughtful design for a greener society" that your average non-architect could instantly wrap their arms around. I thought we would be the real power brokers of this shift.
While our profession scrambles to bail water out of our sinking firms a whole new profession of specialty engineers, consultants, and designers are being born. Sadly, I see architects turning over the reins of responsibility. Again.
LEED, while initially empowering, I fear is quickly becoming another AIA/IDP/NCARB like regulatory organization governing and extorting our profession.
I think the problem with architecture is people don't treat it as job but as a passion, so they lost the judgement, and self deluted about the real situation.
This is one of the major reasons we are paid like shit. Right from the git-go people are willing to work for free to get "experience." That snowballs into crappy entry wages right on up to accepting meager fees and architects undercutting one another for work.
Until we cut the bullshit and say architecture is a job first and passion second we are going to keep up this starving artist image.
That however is not the problem right now. We simply over built (all be it for not enough fees) and now there's little to no need for more buildings. Tight credit doesn't help things either.
Simply stated, we need to weed out a major % of the profession to match the demand for architecture. *If* there is going to be a "green revolution" we can be a part of it, but my fear is that will just build itself into another bubble and push out the demand destruction just a few more years.
it's a little sad that it takes a crisis to pull communities together, but I think there is an opportunity here for us to make our profession stronger and more cohesive. We are supposed to be resourceful by nature of our profession -- so I think after we collectively mope about our misfortune of getting laid off, we should start figuring out ways of making our profession viable again.
we can't wait for the AIA to do this - we have to do this.
I still have a job but have no delusions that at any minuete our projects could evaporate and company tank. This sounds bad but us younger licensed architects, working as a team, have a much lower standard and cost of living, by a factor of 5 or greater, than our bosses. Its time to churn the proffesion and let a new generation get started making businesses and that means lower prices, better attention and service. maybe the contractual knoweledge from yerars of experiance wont be there but hey - got to start somewhere and most of us sure arent learning it from our current situations. No more BMWs and Benzos for owners. No more owners' wives plastic tata's. No more 4 week Euro vacations every year. No more $12,000 AIA conventions aka golf spa outings. When demand drops, prices follow. Be in position to be that whore.
this thread has really gotten bizarre. bookending all the philosophizing, proclamations and manifestos, you get very stark real life posts like bowsers. it's humbling (or at least should be), and those of us who continue to be employed should be very grateful for what we have.
jafid - I am grateful, and we are working on an exciting project. However in this environment I dont see it happening nor the client following through on paying his bills. This decade has been a long string of unrealistic clients, over zealous billing and legal wrangling over payments - at least where Ive worked. I was simply stating the plan B long term outlook for young licensed individuals who may have a chance if the axe does fall.
no...62k!
Anyways, we are still moving forward...alot of anxiety. There is absolutely no hope of the "on hold, will start in early 2009" projects starting any time soon. Things are looking quite dismal right now, and although it seems that I have employment through may...I'm not sure what will be waiting for me then.
Haven't heard of any other lay-offs in Miami-DC-Baltimore, but I give it a couple of weeks...
Unfortunatly the Bad mis-mangement in Washington over the past 8 years has brought most of the world economy to it's knees.
As Kevin Phillips points out in his prophetic book, Bad Money, America's primary business became non-productive finance. Manufacturing fell to only 12% of GDP. Wall Street titans grew obscenely rich by simply passing around paper. Inflated or semi-worthless securities increased in bogus value at each stage of the trading process.
Wall Street was allowed to virtually print money and peddle toxic securities around the globe.
We now have to wait for Washington to throw some infrastructure $$$
around and hope it creates some employment for the A&E professions.
Layoffs....layoffs......
I must've sounded angry this afternoon when Mr. Strawbeary called. I heard him take a deep breath and sigh, then in a flat, sad tone, he breathed, "Did you get laid off today?" No, I didn't, thank goodness. Poor guy, he is stressing too as he is not working.
I have gotten 20% and 30% raises in the past. Unfortunately, when you start so low, it doesn't matter much. Now I'm bracing for a 20% cut, which I just realized when you CUT 20%, it is a lot bigger number # than adding 20%. Poo!
one last thing to add about why we don't get paid as much anymore (since this affects, in part, why we're seeing the layoffs we have right now)...
the other big creep in the last 30 years, and one which has accelerated in the last 10, is the sheer complexity of buildings and the increasing specialization of many parts of buildings. for example, if you look at the original 'team' that did the meier high museum here in atlanta, the number of players (arch, mepfp, struct., etc.) was less than 10. the new high museum? something like 20. why does that matter? we've now ceded (primarily by not doing, but also by not incorporating into our practices) tons of ground to various 'specialties', all of whom command a portion of the overall fee. the problem is, the total percentages a fee is relative to construction hasn't gone up much (and is pressured to come down more, especially in commercial projects). so, if we're all paying 2-3 extra consultants fees, even if they're a small percentage overall, it starts adding up.
we've got to start bringing those folks (LEED specialty consultants, planning, code, whatever) into the firms - they can provide some fee diversification as well as help expand our perceived value to clients. all that translates down the line and firms which are doing this are prospering more right now than many others...
Ain't that the truth. Say an intern starts at a below average rate around $30,000. Well, 20% of 30k is only 6,000. 30% is just 3,000 more. While 30% sounds huge, $9,000 isn't exactly going to change your lifestyle. Can't imagine what going backwards would be like.
Did anyone see Kermit Baker's quote the other day about the economy? "Theres nothing left to do but pray".
Great Work AIA.
Speaking of the AIA, I just got an email about a quality control checklist they were giving us to help us produce quality work! What a joke!! The quarter page long checklist has useful info like telling us that dimensions should be correct!! DUH. Oh- and draftsmen should be skilled enough to be able to draft!!
Regarding the Fee table the AIA used to publish and was subsequently ruled anti trust ro price fixing; Thats exactly the kind of thing the AIA, a lobbying group should be working hard at making pass the test of anti-trust. Not praying.
I made contingency plans back in August.
I was at a firm for about two years. Business was moving rather well at first but things started to slow down significantly when projects started to slip out of our hands or just get dropped all together. If you remembered reading some of my early threads, I did not really like working at that firm and thought that culturally it was just not a good fit for me. I gave it chance after chance and after a long year of decision making, I finally realized that I need to end my services with that firm imediately.
By august it had become abundantly clear to me that this firm and firms like this were soon to fall victims of the economy as a whole. And sure enough layoffs started happening in large numbers and I witnessed a lot of very good people lose their jobs. I didn't wait one second -- I imediately redid my entire portfolio and resume, made PDFs of all my sample work, and just started firing out resumes nationally. I got a decent amount of responses -- Some were willing to talk further, other didn't respond, and a few others had recently implemented hiring freezes. However, I eventually was engaged in serious talks with a large EA firm that had a solid amount of diverse work both nationally and abroad. So without hesitating, I accepted the offer and never looked back.
But all goes back to the flooded market out there. We are all nervous because there are people with far more experience than me and some of my other colleagues who will take our pay at this stage. Basically, everyone is nervous -- there isn't a single architect out there right now that could honestly tell you that he or she will be employed next month or so... It's very uncertain and scary out there.
My next move is to try to go abroad -- maybe for work -- maybe just to take a breather and reflect back on my 30 years of existence.... It could be a good thing...really.
"There's nothing left to do but pray"... YIKES!
Archmed- I am beginning to think it's good to have more than one "plan b" kind of ironic!
... My new contingency plan...
My dad owns several businesses revolving around furniture, antique repairs, moving/installation, etc. When my family decided to build their own house last summer he started his own contracting business, too. I was already far away- in DC- and designing fancy resorts and other bullsh*t I thought was special... so now... I'm considering going back and running his contracting business and designing and building a home on a second site he owns (and subsequently turning it into an architecture firm). Mr. +i and myself are both architects- and the process of designing and building our first building ourselves is sounding like a really great prospect. Not to mention that over that time it will take to design and build it, about a year, perhaps the economy might improve somewhat and we can do more work. Sadly, this all requires leaving DC. Something neither of us really wants to do. We both like the city a lot. Plus, we signed a lease until July and would have to pay a crazy amount in concessions to back out of it. Of course in DC most places don't let you sublet either.
What I really hope is that we can make it until March in the firms we are in and perhaps by then we could maybe leave and make a go of it if we absolutely have to. At least this is happening BEFORE we bought a house. *sigh*
+i - my plan B was to marry outside of the field... right now I am very thankful that my spouse isn't an architect.
I'll second that toasteroven. I know several couples that are both architects or desginers. In this economy that's gotta hurt, even if just one of them is out of work.
Also know a few product reps that used to be architects. They both say the switched careers when starting a family because "I needed to provide for my family."
30+ years ago people did not leave this profession because they had an extra mouth to feed. Anyone who thinks our fees have kept pace with inflation is diluding themselves.
tumbleweed... babysitting is actually not a bad idea. in DC you can get $225 per child (under 4 yrs) per week. wouldn't match current income but would definitely help.
i was lucky enough yesterday to be placed on another HUGE project. but i am still talking with my father about myself and mr. + i running the contracting business, designing my family member's house, and then turning it into a residential firm. i hear that a lot of people turn on their own during times like these- that more people start their own firms in recessions. i am not sure why that is- except for the fear of being laid off. but i can totally understand that. i don't trust this new project i am on and i certainly don't trust the people in charge. so as for me... it's good for now and i feel blessed to be able to hold on for a few more months. but i wouldn't be shocked anymore if something else happens.
Gensler SF had another HUGE round today...+/- 40 people axed across the board !!!
What?! Gensler didn't wait for those Obama "shovel ready" projects to get rolling?
Cetra Ruddy in New York city has gone from 10+/- people to 100+/-. Then , it started to crash down in last July with several round of layoff. Last round of layoff was last week with about 15 people been let go. Now, they are down to 30+ employees.
office-wide meeting tomorrow morning, first thing. just got it in our email boxes. yikes.
i am originally from buffalo ny. what it seems is going on nation wide is the economic problems which have affected the the rust belt (Buffalo, Cleveland, Detroit, Pittsburgh ,etc....) for the past 30 years have finally spread to the rest of the country.
The problems you guys are having are the same problems that firms in the rust belt have been dealing with for years and years...
welcome to our club! have fun!
+i, can you share what your scary meeting was about? Was it the obvious?
I just had lunch with a bunch of AIA members. One firm who does project management (not design) for public school projects is booked solid for the next 3 years...so anyone interested in PM work might look into who manages your local public projects. As long as there is an architect working in the office you shouldn't have a problem getting your IDP requirements.
LB - once upon a time I worked on some public school projects. Talking to old co-workers, they are booked solid. Must be one of the few bright spots out there these days. And yes, if I were looking for work, I'm all over PM work in education/institutional work.
You can just add me to the list of those lay off...
Aw, hell Cuervo - sorry to hear it.
when you are told by management to fudge your time sheet, you know a riff is coming and they want to keep you...
"what it seems is going on nation wide is the economic problems which have affected the the rust belt (Buffalo, Cleveland, Detroit, Pittsburgh ,etc....) for the past 30 years have finally spread to the rest of the country. "
Thank you. Many here in the Chicago area have been warning this for years. The move from production based to knoweledge based society is flawed because it assumes that the production society diodnt produce or didnt value knoweledge. Economists tout the FIRE sectors as the true growth engines and thats just wrong. The wealth of Nations argued that surplus production is the path to prosperity. The rust belt was the production belt. By the 1950s and 60s, the golden age of American production, the rust belt was joined by Los Angeles Long Beach. Both major contributing regions to the subprime crisis and growing liquidity crisi as small businesses and 30 yr mortgage holders, blue collar, are being slashed.
My fear is that the bickering in Washington has only begun. Our best course might just be to refuse payment this April. best stimulous we could give ourselves.
I heard Sharlom baranes layed off 30-35 workers recently
By my estimate we need about 3,000 people to leave the profession this year to be economically viable. I suggest at the next AIA convention we hold a rock paper scissors tournament to decide who will be in or out. Since the AIA seems like it is not doing much to help. Or maybe I am misinformed as to what if anything they are doing.
People are signing up in droves for the AIA....so many they can't process the applications in a timely manner or their understaffed and need to hire a few unemployed architects to help out.
My brother is doing a condo rehab - interiors - and I just got back from various furniture stores and lighting galleries in Chicago. I spoke to about 10 different reps and sales people on the showroom floors. All but one is an actual architect but working in product sales. I found that very sad.
"People are signing up in droves for the AIA....so many they can't process the applications in a timely manner or their understaffed and need to hire a few unemployed architects to help out."
Where did you here this?
What do you think the logic behind this is?
If the AIA is indeed having a large membership increase, it might be due to the fact that people are seeing more value in network building right now... That's my hypothesis.
EDAW NY, about 15% including some architects working as urban designers. Arup London rumored to be laying off something less than 10%.
oh to clarify, EDAW was right before Christmas. Arup is still a rumor.
Make this is a response I recieved from the AIA National Office this week.
Due to a very high call and e-mail volume that are associated with membership renewal and Convention registration, your wait time may be longer than usual. We will do our best to respond to your e-mail within 48 business hours.
Arup, rumour no more...
http://www.worldarchitecturenews.com/index.php?fuseaction=wanappln.showbriefdetail&newsid=107
snook, AIA dues were due, I think on the 15th. I'm late this year, oops!
I'm seriously considering to switch to otherrelated field, that reward and investment are more balanced . You may all heard about new LEED exams and anual fee, plus continue education requirement. Now architects have one more organizations like AIA instead of helping architects to get more design fee, trying to squeeze more money out of poor architect. I'm glad I passed LEED several years ago before the first change, the exam fee was $200 and now $400. I don't think LEED help me to get more salary.
I think the problem with architecture is people don't treat it as job but as a passion, so they lost the judgement, and self deluted about the real situation. Architecture took most of the responsibilities during the design, lead the team, and doing all the coorindations. But all the consultants make more money than architects. It is a profession first affect by economy downturn and last recover from it. After years of education, IDP, and ARE exams, you still have very low salary and no job security. It's an old industry that doesn't have much future. Even the 10 best green jobs has no mention of architect.
http://www.djc.com/blogs/BuildingGreen/2009/01/21/the-10-best-green-jobs/
What can architect do beside architecture that can rewarding and have a future? A green MBA?
Reason -- my sentiments recently couldn't agree more with your post. I don't know the answer to your question, but I have a sinking feeling that the profession is going to miss what I call the "green buoy"
I had faith that architecture would restablish its public signifigance in a big way with LEED and this shift toward sustainable thinking. Something easy to relate to, some simple cheesy mantra like "thoughtful design for a greener society" that your average non-architect could instantly wrap their arms around. I thought we would be the real power brokers of this shift.
While our profession scrambles to bail water out of our sinking firms a whole new profession of specialty engineers, consultants, and designers are being born. Sadly, I see architects turning over the reins of responsibility. Again.
LEED, while initially empowering, I fear is quickly becoming another AIA/IDP/NCARB like regulatory organization governing and extorting our profession.
This is one of the major reasons we are paid like shit. Right from the git-go people are willing to work for free to get "experience." That snowballs into crappy entry wages right on up to accepting meager fees and architects undercutting one another for work.
Until we cut the bullshit and say architecture is a job first and passion second we are going to keep up this starving artist image.
That however is not the problem right now. We simply over built (all be it for not enough fees) and now there's little to no need for more buildings. Tight credit doesn't help things either.
Simply stated, we need to weed out a major % of the profession to match the demand for architecture. *If* there is going to be a "green revolution" we can be a part of it, but my fear is that will just build itself into another bubble and push out the demand destruction just a few more years.
you can now add me to the list of laid-off architects....
I don't know what I am going to do. I'm freaking out.
it's a little sad that it takes a crisis to pull communities together, but I think there is an opportunity here for us to make our profession stronger and more cohesive. We are supposed to be resourceful by nature of our profession -- so I think after we collectively mope about our misfortune of getting laid off, we should start figuring out ways of making our profession viable again.
we can't wait for the AIA to do this - we have to do this.
I still have a job but have no delusions that at any minuete our projects could evaporate and company tank. This sounds bad but us younger licensed architects, working as a team, have a much lower standard and cost of living, by a factor of 5 or greater, than our bosses. Its time to churn the proffesion and let a new generation get started making businesses and that means lower prices, better attention and service. maybe the contractual knoweledge from yerars of experiance wont be there but hey - got to start somewhere and most of us sure arent learning it from our current situations. No more BMWs and Benzos for owners. No more owners' wives plastic tata's. No more 4 week Euro vacations every year. No more $12,000 AIA conventions aka golf spa outings. When demand drops, prices follow. Be in position to be that whore.
? What?
Evil, you've gone too far!!!!!
;-)
this thread has really gotten bizarre. bookending all the philosophizing, proclamations and manifestos, you get very stark real life posts like bowsers. it's humbling (or at least should be), and those of us who continue to be employed should be very grateful for what we have.
jafid - I am grateful, and we are working on an exciting project. However in this environment I dont see it happening nor the client following through on paying his bills. This decade has been a long string of unrealistic clients, over zealous billing and legal wrangling over payments - at least where Ive worked. I was simply stating the plan B long term outlook for young licensed individuals who may have a chance if the axe does fall.
Hearing rumors of another round at SOM. Any news?
so, should we point out that this is a kind of 'black monday' for the economy as a whole? 62,000 us job cuts announced in one day???
nothing about that number is good...
I thought that it was closer to 70,000.
But, the number that isn't good is 20,000 at CAT.
no...62k!
Anyways, we are still moving forward...alot of anxiety. There is absolutely no hope of the "on hold, will start in early 2009" projects starting any time soon. Things are looking quite dismal right now, and although it seems that I have employment through may...I'm not sure what will be waiting for me then.
Haven't heard of any other lay-offs in Miami-DC-Baltimore, but I give it a couple of weeks...
Unfortunatly the Bad mis-mangement in Washington over the past 8 years has brought most of the world economy to it's knees.
As Kevin Phillips points out in his prophetic book, Bad Money, America's primary business became non-productive finance. Manufacturing fell to only 12% of GDP. Wall Street titans grew obscenely rich by simply passing around paper. Inflated or semi-worthless securities increased in bogus value at each stage of the trading process.
Wall Street was allowed to virtually print money and peddle toxic securities around the globe.
We now have to wait for Washington to throw some infrastructure $$$
around and hope it creates some employment for the A&E professions.
Right on, jafidler.
Every day I'm not canned is a good one.
the fact that this thread keeps growing depresses me.
Also the Netherlands get their share:
OMA lets 50 people go
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