Graduated in May with a B.Arch. Lost my job in August (Had been working there during school for over a year). Interviewed with some firms who were looking to hire for January, only to recently discover that my contact with one of the firms was laid off.
I was wondering if any of the big architecture firms can match the Insurance giants in how they treat the employees when they lay them off. I read this in the paper this morning:
Employees were notified Wednesday. Each person will receive nine weeks of salary, and additional severance will be based on the employee's length of service with Aetna.
I understand SOM's long history of pulling this kind of act. But I still don't understand the rationale of them folding so quickly and so unscrupulously. Everyone I know there said that they were extremely busy and so was everyone else at the office -- having deadline after deadline, working well over 40hrs a week, etc.
Are they just jumping the gun early to cover their own asses or are they really out of work for 09?
Archmed - The SOMs, Smith Gill's, and other monster overseas players are watching their clients evaporate as credit dries up. Contrary to popular myth the UAE projects were not funded with cash, but rather credit.
So you guys that have been laid off, what are you doing? How are you financially surviving? Do you have savings, unemployment benefits? Whats going on?
As for the firms that lock computers of employees they lay-off, I have heard that later the employees can have limited access to their computers or can request specific files. For instance, contacts, PDF's, personal files. To be prepared, it may make sense to regularly back up information that will help you in future jobs. You've put in the time on the projects and your work is useful as a reference. Of course, check what your employer's policy is and even ask permission.
Best Buy is offering 7 months of pay in their buyouts? Crazy...that's a lot of money, and they are betting that they won't be needing those people again in 7 months. So, they're assuming the economy will be worse than this for longer than that. Probably true, but forboding nonetheless.
never was laid off by skids but when i started there chicago was 1300 people and within 3 years went to 200 - early 80's when mecca / jeda airports going strong -
ASGG and SOM know they are gambling with peoples livelihood if they dont diversify - to them both i would say:
--dont take every job that enters the door,
--invest in project types beyond speculative developers,
--build a portfolio of work that is not 'consumer driven - neo-liberialism driven [simple!]
of course you wont be in the mags instantly!
-- ASGG is no different than SOM in that regard - a bit of lipstick on a pig one might say!
those under the knife - remember, first round its probably you but after that so many get axed in masses that its not about you - its filling the numbers -
The last round at SOM Chicago cut into several people I knew. Their staff was a bit bloated, but they have now cut some long-time employees with mad skills.
our client has 100% financing... but they are having municipality infrastructure issues- ie. getting water and sewer to the site. so now our project is on hold until it gets sorted out.
merry f-in christmas.
oh yeah, and we were pretty much assured via a ceo email last week that there will be "reductions in force" after the new year. wtf kind of term is that "reduction in force". i'm considering working for the government on something boring instead of enjoying designing and constantly wondering everyday i go into work if "today will be the day" they decide to axe the whole office.
I think a lot of firms are suspending layoffs for the holidays, and we will probably see more waves of layoffs in January. Am I just being pessimistic here?
neither- the boss's money comes first. they aren't laying people off because there isn't enough work to keep people busy... they are laying people off because they can't make as much of a profit with the work there is if you are still there. it's cheaper and they make more profit if they let all but a few go- and then work those few to death. because those few will be grateful to keep their jobs- and if they aren't, and they leave, there will be ten people just like them knocking down the door to get their job.
do you really think huge international firms like som, rtkl, gensler, etc didn't have enough money or profits to make it through two quarters of a recession without layoffs??? of course they do. but they look towards their end of year earnings and profits and think - well, if we lay people off we can blame it on the economy and make more money.
"Staff adjustments" is my favorite term. Yes, we're adjusting our staff, as in some of them will not longer work here. Just be honest and call it what it is, a layoff.
I+: While you may be right about some corporate firms no giving a shit about their human capital, I think your analysis is off. The cost to a firm to have an employee is often twice what their salary is. Imagine this: 10 employees, earning an average of $45K each; 6 months of these employees not bringing in any income or working on real projects could cost the firm $250K in cash. There are very few firms that have that kind of capital laying around, and even if they do, in an economic downturn it is totally reasonable to try and hold onto it in case something goes seriously wrong.
To be a little bit charitable: sometimes layoffs happen so that the firm can remain open and employ those that are left. I'm just saying.
And now the bad news: I know one LA firm that is laying people off today, since it is the firm's last working day of 2008. Merry f---ing Xmas.
here I am working on xmass eve...not much, but I am in the office. I too feel another wave coming early in January. Not sure what will be done with the higher ups, but they are the rainmakers...they are the ones bringing in the work (even if it's slow, they have the contacts)
We have been asked to "retain cash" for the end of the year...which means consultants have to wait til january to get paid...not sure what it means, but those are the orders.
things still look bleak, with more projects going on hold and the few active finishing up within weeks.
We'll see!
happy holidays to all!
I+, Janosh, I think the common point we have is that the lay-offs really suck. But the lay-offs due to the over-reaction to the financial crisis are evil. I partly agree with I+. Some bosses are really serious about their profit and the way they protect themselves is laying off staffs. In some firms there is a mandatory policy that partners have to retire at the age of 65. For those who are closing to this age, this year is really bad because perhaps their 401k would have shrunk 30% at least. So the decision is, you younger generations suffer this crisis - I will keep my decent life until my death. This is the ugly side of human beings.
Others who want to be promoted to the leadership level treat this as a great opportunity - once they get a chance, they laid off people who are believed to be their potential rivals or harmful to their promotion. Especially in large corporations, this happens a lot.
Job cuts hit local architecture firms
From the Crain's Chicago Business Newsroom
December 24 08:30:00, 2008
By Eddie Baeb
-----
(Crain’s) — Local architecture firms, including heavyweights Solomon Cordwell Buenz, DeStefano & Partners and Skidmore Owings & Merrill LLP, have had major layoffs in recent months, as building projects have slowed locally and worldwide.
SCB laid off about 30 employees and cut 10 vacant positions in October and November, roughly one-fourth of the firm's Chicago office. DeStefano earlier this month laid off 15 people, 10% of its staff, and also instituted 10% pay cuts for all employees in 2009.
Sources say Chicago-based SOM, meanwhile, has recently fired upward of 100 people here to cut costs.
The layoffs come amid a steep U.S. recession but are also a result of a global economic slowdown, as fast-growing countries, particularly China and Middle East nations, began showing signs of strain from the worldwide financial crisis.
“They’re working with the same financial markets everybody else is,” says Scott Sarver, CEO and principal with DeStefano. “It was just overheated, and was all based speculation of property appreciation that might have been overly optimistic.”
DeStefano had been working on a planned residential tower in Dubai and was recently told the project has been put on hold, Mr. Sarver says.
Overseas work has become increasingly important for many big architecture firms over the past year as the pipeline of U.S. work slowed, particularly for high-rise condos, shopping malls and office buildings. Now concerns about a global downturn have slowed the pace of development worldwide, and the sharp drop in oil prices has stymied once sky-high development aspirations in the Middle East.
SOM, with offices in Hong Kong; Shanghai, China, and Brussels, Belgium, has been among the most active U.S. architecture firms in the Middle East and China. A local spokeswoman didn’t return calls and e-mails seeking comment.
SCB’s projects in the Middle East remain active; the firm’s two rounds of layoffs were primarily due to the falloff in local assignments, the firm says. SCB designed many of the condo high-rises built downtown in the last few years, including the Heritage at Millennium Park and 340 on the Park in the Lakeshore East development.
“The economic slowdown has hit the residential real estate market particularly hard,” John Lahey, SCB’s chairman and principal-in-charge of design, says in a statement.
Even small and mid-sized firms that do most of their work around Chicago haven’t been spared.
OKW Architects has let go about 25 workers in three rounds of layoffs since April, almost 30% of its staff. The firm has shrunk to 55 people from 85 people early this year, says Jon Talty, OKW’s chairman and CEO.
“Ninety percent of our business is development driven from the private sector,” Mr. Talty says. “The retail market, which we’re very strong in, came to a screeching halt. The multi-family sector (condos and apartments), which we’re very strong in, came to a screeching halt.”
Mr. Talty says OKW, like other firms, is working to further diversify and reassign people from retail and residential to other assignments.
Job cuts in recessions are common among architecture firms, but sources say the breadth and severity of cuts this year are unusual because of how fast work dissipated and how pessimistic most people are about when things will improve.
“We have never really had to do this in our history,” says Mr. Talty of OKW, which will celebrate its 50th anniversary next year.
I haven't checked the email address I used to register at this site in a few months.
When I did, I was pretty amazed at the amount of posts to this thread!
The early 90's was really severe, but I didn't really stop working through it. I just worked free lance, took all kinds of jobs and worked in different places.
A lot of it was forgettable, some of it was horrible, and some of it was just weird. These were firms that had trouble getting people when times were good, so when times were bad they were suddenly able to get staff -temporarily at least. But they didn't know how to manage or treat them.
One (famous architect) hellhole a friend worked at had three shifts working on projects in Asia. 8 AM to 4 PM, 4PM to 12 AM, and 12 AM to 8 AM. The firm was located in a big loft building that had toilets from 1883.
The elevators couldn't take the volume of people filtering through and kept breaking so people kept having to climb 10 floors to get to work, and the toilets kept backing up and overflowing.
People on the late-night shift were all recently laid off and were basically unsupervised and didn't care, so they would just show up, get stoned, make out on the stair well, and poke at their computers a bit to show like they had been there.
I wonder how many stairwell babies there were nine months later.
SOM was, is and will always be a horrible place to work. It is just gross there, and so are all the other large firms. Lots of firms get started during the worst recessions, because in truth the inefficiency of a firm increases proportionally to the size of its staff.
It's hard being in your 20's and experiencing this for the first time, it feels like the world is ending. Many architects don't hit their stride till their 50's and 60's, so you all have lots of time.
Go back to school, take jobs in related fields, downsize...
Just stay away from SOM...at least now they have sites like this where people can compare notes so places like that can be exposed for what they are - grim factories that chew people alive.
If you're still working, then go in ASAP during off hours and download/print out samples of your work, it's harder to do when you've just been laid off, and still shaken up. You forget things.
It's better to download too much, than to leave things behind. At least now you don't have to get hard copies of everything to sneak out, you can put everything on a little jump drive.
I work at a large architectural firm in Chicago (not SOM) We saw layoffs 2 weeks ago in addition to pay cuts. The layoffs were across the board (from interns to the senior guys) I was spared, but things are even worse for us now. We have to keep working and worrying everyday. It seems as if the bad news doesn't end.
Gensler SF has had two rounds...one in August/September...one in November..
Total cut amounted to about 30% of the Architecture Studio....
One more is expected sometime in this month.
No, we work as long as we did before... even more as there is quite a competition - who won't get fired first. Nobody's been fired...yet. There's a rumor though about so-called 'holidays without paying' for some stuff.
Maybe, but I'm sure the management would prefer to go back to the days of flush work and a fully paid staff. I think there's plenty of blame that should be rest upon the upper level staff at any struggling firm, but I think the vast majority are not using this economy as an excuse to squeeze more out of their staff.
Cutting salaries is much better than laying people off. layoffs should be an absolute last resort. I think people are more likely to accept a layoff after everyone at the firm has made a sacrifice - especially upper management. it shows the firm has made an investment in its people.
We are a small community, and firms can gain lasting reputations for how they treated their staff during this downturn. In the future it might not matter much for hiring recent grads, but will definitely matter in finding experienced talent who survived this period.
Salary reductions don't go very far. Since salary is only perhaps 60%-70% of total benefits, a lot of people would have to give up 10% of their salary to save one job. Unfortunately, layoffs are more effective for keeping a firm a float.
i'd rather not say- but the DC area is small, i'm sure you'll find out soon enough.
i wouldn't mind if they temporarily suspended 401k contributions. since i seem to lose 40% of every contribution now because of the markets anyways... doesn't seem to make much difference right now. but i would have to wonder about a 10% salary decrease. i would accept it and then start looking elsewhere ASAP... i need every penny i get.
i have no idea what it's like in other markets... but i'm in DC working on international projects and it seems really bad- people are on edge, depressed, chronically worried, etc. every time there is a VP walking around, you can see people watching them for a reaction.
i could care less about innauguration day anymore. i'm not in any mood to party. nor do i seem to have any dispensable income to take advantage of the bars being open 24/7. i hope i am lucky enough to keep my job - at least until i figure out plan B. and good luck to everyone else out here...
It's funny. About a year ago, the only issues on my mind were relationships and how to spend my weekend. Now I could care less about any of that.
I'm at a major firm in DC and we're pretty wary about things too. Our hope is that our decent dose of federal, military, and judicial work will be able to help us ride this thing out. But when you have more experienced people and seasoned veterens in the already flooded job market more than likely willing to take pay cuts to ... well MY lowly salary level, it makes you nervous.
Every week seems like a new mountain to climb. Inauguration? That seems like two gigantic mountains from now. These days I've had to put travel plans with friends (which would be four months later) on hold since I have no idea if I'd be in a job by that time.
I was talking with a friend of mine yesterday and he was telling me how sick he was of this. We bust our asses, stay until midnight to meet nearly impossible deadlines, we get paid shit in the fist place ... And what's the payback? ZERO job security.
Layoff Update – A month or so ago I posted here about being poised for a layoff after 12+ years at the same firm. Well before it occurred I was able to line up an interim job with a big general contractor I have worked with several times. It’s a win-win for everyone.
I’m committed to work as an assistant project manager on a fast-tracked, schedule accelerated project for the GC through February helping to meet a challenging deadline. My architectural construction contract administration experience allowed me to step right into the fray of the construction as well as work as a conduit between the job site and architect since I “speak the language” and can interpret the design intension in the context of constructability. After February, I’m week to week at the GC’s so if things pick up at the architecture firm I can transition back there.
For the architecture firm their investment in me is protected since I’m not on the open job market and will return. My projects there are temporarily with another PM who still has a job because of my move. I keep up to date with everything through email and being able to log into the office network remotely and it takes about an hour a day to stay involved and direct work and schedules. When I get back to the firm I’ll be pretty much up to speed on all my projects there.
For me, I’m still employed making the same pay, there is no more uncertainty (stress) about being potentially unemployed and I’m learning quite a bit about architecture from a new perspective as well as gaining new project management, estimating, bidding, ordering and sub-contracting skills that will benefit me in the long run. I have an interim job as long as I need it and can return to the architectural firm with a week’s notice come March. We developed terms for the transition period where I’ll be tying up loose ends for the GC for a few weeks while back at the architecture firm as I’m currently “on call” while at the GC’s for architectural project management issues.
Layoffs....layoffs......
Graduated in May with a B.Arch. Lost my job in August (Had been working there during school for over a year). Interviewed with some firms who were looking to hire for January, only to recently discover that my contact with one of the firms was laid off.
please make it end.
I was wondering if any of the big architecture firms can match the Insurance giants in how they treat the employees when they lay them off. I read this in the paper this morning:
Employees were notified Wednesday. Each person will receive nine weeks of salary, and additional severance will be based on the employee's length of service with Aetna.
No.
2 weeks
Back in 2000 after the tech bubble bust I got 4 weeks...but that was a-typical.
9 weeks? Best Buy is offereing 4,000 employees "buy outs" that include 7 months of pay + a full year of health insurance benefits.
We are in the wrong field for sure.
I understand SOM's long history of pulling this kind of act. But I still don't understand the rationale of them folding so quickly and so unscrupulously. Everyone I know there said that they were extremely busy and so was everyone else at the office -- having deadline after deadline, working well over 40hrs a week, etc.
Are they just jumping the gun early to cover their own asses or are they really out of work for 09?
Archmed - The SOMs, Smith Gill's, and other monster overseas players are watching their clients evaporate as credit dries up. Contrary to popular myth the UAE projects were not funded with cash, but rather credit.
So you guys that have been laid off, what are you doing? How are you financially surviving? Do you have savings, unemployment benefits? Whats going on?
Archmed, I don't think Smith Gill rumor is true.
As for the firms that lock computers of employees they lay-off, I have heard that later the employees can have limited access to their computers or can request specific files. For instance, contacts, PDF's, personal files. To be prepared, it may make sense to regularly back up information that will help you in future jobs. You've put in the time on the projects and your work is useful as a reference. Of course, check what your employer's policy is and even ask permission.
Best Buy is offering 7 months of pay in their buyouts? Crazy...that's a lot of money, and they are betting that they won't be needing those people again in 7 months. So, they're assuming the economy will be worse than this for longer than that. Probably true, but forboding nonetheless.
never was laid off by skids but when i started there chicago was 1300 people and within 3 years went to 200 - early 80's when mecca / jeda airports going strong -
ASGG and SOM know they are gambling with peoples livelihood if they dont diversify - to them both i would say:
--dont take every job that enters the door,
--invest in project types beyond speculative developers,
--build a portfolio of work that is not 'consumer driven - neo-liberialism driven [simple!]
of course you wont be in the mags instantly!
-- ASGG is no different than SOM in that regard - a bit of lipstick on a pig one might say!
those under the knife - remember, first round its probably you but after that so many get axed in masses that its not about you - its filling the numbers -
The last round at SOM Chicago cut into several people I knew. Their staff was a bit bloated, but they have now cut some long-time employees with mad skills.
SOM has an ad in today's NY Times (Sun 12/21/08) for architects.
I'm confused.
I'm confused.
They are looking for entry level help? Did they just rid of staff before they were fully vested?
our client has 100% financing... but they are having municipality infrastructure issues- ie. getting water and sewer to the site. so now our project is on hold until it gets sorted out.
merry f-in christmas.
oh yeah, and we were pretty much assured via a ceo email last week that there will be "reductions in force" after the new year. wtf kind of term is that "reduction in force". i'm considering working for the government on something boring instead of enjoying designing and constantly wondering everyday i go into work if "today will be the day" they decide to axe the whole office.
I think a lot of firms are suspending layoffs for the holidays, and we will probably see more waves of layoffs in January. Am I just being pessimistic here?
who comes first the boss of the worker
neither- the boss's money comes first. they aren't laying people off because there isn't enough work to keep people busy... they are laying people off because they can't make as much of a profit with the work there is if you are still there. it's cheaper and they make more profit if they let all but a few go- and then work those few to death. because those few will be grateful to keep their jobs- and if they aren't, and they leave, there will be ten people just like them knocking down the door to get their job.
do you really think huge international firms like som, rtkl, gensler, etc didn't have enough money or profits to make it through two quarters of a recession without layoffs??? of course they do. but they look towards their end of year earnings and profits and think - well, if we lay people off we can blame it on the economy and make more money.
did you actually think they cared about you?!
"Staff adjustments" is my favorite term. Yes, we're adjusting our staff, as in some of them will not longer work here. Just be honest and call it what it is, a layoff.
I+: While you may be right about some corporate firms no giving a shit about their human capital, I think your analysis is off. The cost to a firm to have an employee is often twice what their salary is. Imagine this: 10 employees, earning an average of $45K each; 6 months of these employees not bringing in any income or working on real projects could cost the firm $250K in cash. There are very few firms that have that kind of capital laying around, and even if they do, in an economic downturn it is totally reasonable to try and hold onto it in case something goes seriously wrong.
To be a little bit charitable: sometimes layoffs happen so that the firm can remain open and employ those that are left. I'm just saying.
And now the bad news: I know one LA firm that is laying people off today, since it is the firm's last working day of 2008. Merry f---ing Xmas.
This year I'm not complaining about working on Christmas Eve, while the rest of the world has the day off.
here I am working on xmass eve...not much, but I am in the office. I too feel another wave coming early in January. Not sure what will be done with the higher ups, but they are the rainmakers...they are the ones bringing in the work (even if it's slow, they have the contacts)
We have been asked to "retain cash" for the end of the year...which means consultants have to wait til january to get paid...not sure what it means, but those are the orders.
things still look bleak, with more projects going on hold and the few active finishing up within weeks.
We'll see!
happy holidays to all!
I+, Janosh, I think the common point we have is that the lay-offs really suck. But the lay-offs due to the over-reaction to the financial crisis are evil. I partly agree with I+. Some bosses are really serious about their profit and the way they protect themselves is laying off staffs. In some firms there is a mandatory policy that partners have to retire at the age of 65. For those who are closing to this age, this year is really bad because perhaps their 401k would have shrunk 30% at least. So the decision is, you younger generations suffer this crisis - I will keep my decent life until my death. This is the ugly side of human beings.
Others who want to be promoted to the leadership level treat this as a great opportunity - once they get a chance, they laid off people who are believed to be their potential rivals or harmful to their promotion. Especially in large corporations, this happens a lot.
Although I've seen plenty of villainy in this profession, I've never heard of anything like that. Lucky me I guess.
Yes I never heard a firm who would let interns go. But it did happen at a Chicago based firm.
from yesterday's Crain's...
Job cuts hit local architecture firms
From the Crain's Chicago Business Newsroom
December 24 08:30:00, 2008
By Eddie Baeb
-----
(Crain’s) — Local architecture firms, including heavyweights Solomon Cordwell Buenz, DeStefano & Partners and Skidmore Owings & Merrill LLP, have had major layoffs in recent months, as building projects have slowed locally and worldwide.
SCB laid off about 30 employees and cut 10 vacant positions in October and November, roughly one-fourth of the firm's Chicago office. DeStefano earlier this month laid off 15 people, 10% of its staff, and also instituted 10% pay cuts for all employees in 2009.
Sources say Chicago-based SOM, meanwhile, has recently fired upward of 100 people here to cut costs.
The layoffs come amid a steep U.S. recession but are also a result of a global economic slowdown, as fast-growing countries, particularly China and Middle East nations, began showing signs of strain from the worldwide financial crisis.
“They’re working with the same financial markets everybody else is,” says Scott Sarver, CEO and principal with DeStefano. “It was just overheated, and was all based speculation of property appreciation that might have been overly optimistic.”
DeStefano had been working on a planned residential tower in Dubai and was recently told the project has been put on hold, Mr. Sarver says.
Overseas work has become increasingly important for many big architecture firms over the past year as the pipeline of U.S. work slowed, particularly for high-rise condos, shopping malls and office buildings. Now concerns about a global downturn have slowed the pace of development worldwide, and the sharp drop in oil prices has stymied once sky-high development aspirations in the Middle East.
SOM, with offices in Hong Kong; Shanghai, China, and Brussels, Belgium, has been among the most active U.S. architecture firms in the Middle East and China. A local spokeswoman didn’t return calls and e-mails seeking comment.
SCB’s projects in the Middle East remain active; the firm’s two rounds of layoffs were primarily due to the falloff in local assignments, the firm says. SCB designed many of the condo high-rises built downtown in the last few years, including the Heritage at Millennium Park and 340 on the Park in the Lakeshore East development.
“The economic slowdown has hit the residential real estate market particularly hard,” John Lahey, SCB’s chairman and principal-in-charge of design, says in a statement.
Even small and mid-sized firms that do most of their work around Chicago haven’t been spared.
OKW Architects has let go about 25 workers in three rounds of layoffs since April, almost 30% of its staff. The firm has shrunk to 55 people from 85 people early this year, says Jon Talty, OKW’s chairman and CEO.
“Ninety percent of our business is development driven from the private sector,” Mr. Talty says. “The retail market, which we’re very strong in, came to a screeching halt. The multi-family sector (condos and apartments), which we’re very strong in, came to a screeching halt.”
Mr. Talty says OKW, like other firms, is working to further diversify and reassign people from retail and residential to other assignments.
Job cuts in recessions are common among architecture firms, but sources say the breadth and severity of cuts this year are unusual because of how fast work dissipated and how pessimistic most people are about when things will improve.
“We have never really had to do this in our history,” says Mr. Talty of OKW, which will celebrate its 50th anniversary next year.
I haven't checked the email address I used to register at this site in a few months.
When I did, I was pretty amazed at the amount of posts to this thread!
The early 90's was really severe, but I didn't really stop working through it. I just worked free lance, took all kinds of jobs and worked in different places.
A lot of it was forgettable, some of it was horrible, and some of it was just weird. These were firms that had trouble getting people when times were good, so when times were bad they were suddenly able to get staff -temporarily at least. But they didn't know how to manage or treat them.
One (famous architect) hellhole a friend worked at had three shifts working on projects in Asia. 8 AM to 4 PM, 4PM to 12 AM, and 12 AM to 8 AM. The firm was located in a big loft building that had toilets from 1883.
The elevators couldn't take the volume of people filtering through and kept breaking so people kept having to climb 10 floors to get to work, and the toilets kept backing up and overflowing.
People on the late-night shift were all recently laid off and were basically unsupervised and didn't care, so they would just show up, get stoned, make out on the stair well, and poke at their computers a bit to show like they had been there.
I wonder how many stairwell babies there were nine months later.
SOM was, is and will always be a horrible place to work. It is just gross there, and so are all the other large firms. Lots of firms get started during the worst recessions, because in truth the inefficiency of a firm increases proportionally to the size of its staff.
It's hard being in your 20's and experiencing this for the first time, it feels like the world is ending. Many architects don't hit their stride till their 50's and 60's, so you all have lots of time.
Go back to school, take jobs in related fields, downsize...
Just stay away from SOM...at least now they have sites like this where people can compare notes so places like that can be exposed for what they are - grim factories that chew people alive.
If you're still working, then go in ASAP during off hours and download/print out samples of your work, it's harder to do when you've just been laid off, and still shaken up. You forget things.
It's better to download too much, than to leave things behind. At least now you don't have to get hard copies of everything to sneak out, you can put everything on a little jump drive.
Grab n' go!!
say it again...stay away from SOM
I work at a large architectural firm in Chicago (not SOM) We saw layoffs 2 weeks ago in addition to pay cuts. The layoffs were across the board (from interns to the senior guys) I was spared, but things are even worse for us now. We have to keep working and worrying everyday. It seems as if the bad news doesn't end.
I hope the New Year is better.
They cut the salary of the whole office by 33 percent - nice New Year Eve present.
But paid end of the year bonus though.
That's quite a big office..
Wow, a 33% reduction in pay? So, a person making like $60,000 makes $45,000 now? People put up with that??
Also, wanted to bring this thread back to life. It's been a good source of news for months.
Gensler SF has had two rounds...one in August/September...one in November..
Total cut amounted to about 30% of the Architecture Studio....
One more is expected sometime in this month.
a 33% reduction from 60,000 is 40,200
yeah, but the % cut probably comes with reduced hours too...
betadineligatures
No, we work as long as we did before... even more as there is quite a competition - who won't get fired first. Nobody's been fired...yet. There's a rumor though about so-called 'holidays without paying' for some stuff.
Rather profitable situation for the employers.
sorry, staff
Maybe, but I'm sure the management would prefer to go back to the days of flush work and a fully paid staff. I think there's plenty of blame that should be rest upon the upper level staff at any struggling firm, but I think the vast majority are not using this economy as an excuse to squeeze more out of their staff.
archiwhat,
Which place cut their salaries?
Cutting salaries is much better than laying people off. layoffs should be an absolute last resort. I think people are more likely to accept a layoff after everyone at the firm has made a sacrifice - especially upper management. it shows the firm has made an investment in its people.
We are a small community, and firms can gain lasting reputations for how they treated their staff during this downturn. In the future it might not matter much for hiring recent grads, but will definitely matter in finding experienced talent who survived this period.
make,
well, that's quite far away from the USA - Moscow, Russia.
I guess that was done in order not to fire 33% of the staff.
more layoffs in DC today at a large firm... happy friday drinking
+i, are you at liberty to say which one and how many?
I was just at Smithgroup today meeting up with some poeple for lunch....
eastman perkins?
Salary reductions don't go very far. Since salary is only perhaps 60%-70% of total benefits, a lot of people would have to give up 10% of their salary to save one job. Unfortunately, layoffs are more effective for keeping a firm a float.
i'd rather not say- but the DC area is small, i'm sure you'll find out soon enough.
i wouldn't mind if they temporarily suspended 401k contributions. since i seem to lose 40% of every contribution now because of the markets anyways... doesn't seem to make much difference right now. but i would have to wonder about a 10% salary decrease. i would accept it and then start looking elsewhere ASAP... i need every penny i get.
i have no idea what it's like in other markets... but i'm in DC working on international projects and it seems really bad- people are on edge, depressed, chronically worried, etc. every time there is a VP walking around, you can see people watching them for a reaction.
i could care less about innauguration day anymore. i'm not in any mood to party. nor do i seem to have any dispensable income to take advantage of the bars being open 24/7. i hope i am lucky enough to keep my job - at least until i figure out plan B. and good luck to everyone else out here...
another big layoff this week in St. Paul, nearly 20% cut. of course the ones that got cut are the ones that create documentation.
it's weird everytime i see the thread title, all i can think of is Jim Mora's famous rant; "Playoffs, PLAYOFFS?!"
+i, I know exactly how you feel.
It's funny. About a year ago, the only issues on my mind were relationships and how to spend my weekend. Now I could care less about any of that.
I'm at a major firm in DC and we're pretty wary about things too. Our hope is that our decent dose of federal, military, and judicial work will be able to help us ride this thing out. But when you have more experienced people and seasoned veterens in the already flooded job market more than likely willing to take pay cuts to ... well MY lowly salary level, it makes you nervous.
Every week seems like a new mountain to climb. Inauguration? That seems like two gigantic mountains from now. These days I've had to put travel plans with friends (which would be four months later) on hold since I have no idea if I'd be in a job by that time.
I was talking with a friend of mine yesterday and he was telling me how sick he was of this. We bust our asses, stay until midnight to meet nearly impossible deadlines, we get paid shit in the fist place ... And what's the payback? ZERO job security.
Layoff Update – A month or so ago I posted here about being poised for a layoff after 12+ years at the same firm. Well before it occurred I was able to line up an interim job with a big general contractor I have worked with several times. It’s a win-win for everyone.
I’m committed to work as an assistant project manager on a fast-tracked, schedule accelerated project for the GC through February helping to meet a challenging deadline. My architectural construction contract administration experience allowed me to step right into the fray of the construction as well as work as a conduit between the job site and architect since I “speak the language” and can interpret the design intension in the context of constructability. After February, I’m week to week at the GC’s so if things pick up at the architecture firm I can transition back there.
For the architecture firm their investment in me is protected since I’m not on the open job market and will return. My projects there are temporarily with another PM who still has a job because of my move. I keep up to date with everything through email and being able to log into the office network remotely and it takes about an hour a day to stay involved and direct work and schedules. When I get back to the firm I’ll be pretty much up to speed on all my projects there.
For me, I’m still employed making the same pay, there is no more uncertainty (stress) about being potentially unemployed and I’m learning quite a bit about architecture from a new perspective as well as gaining new project management, estimating, bidding, ordering and sub-contracting skills that will benefit me in the long run. I have an interim job as long as I need it and can return to the architectural firm with a week’s notice come March. We developed terms for the transition period where I’ll be tying up loose ends for the GC for a few weeks while back at the architecture firm as I’m currently “on call” while at the GC’s for architectural project management issues.
If you think you’re on the bubble, be proactive.
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