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x-jla

Rick, how much did you get paid for this project?

Apr 30, 16 5:05 pm  · 
 · 
JBeaumont

Rick I know you don't listen to other people ever, but take a true assessment of yourself here:  if you truly didn't know until yesterday that UL directories do in fact exist and that every tested assembly is in fact published, then doesn't that tell you yourself that your education is egregiously incomplete, and give you some serious doubts about your competence to design buildings?  Be honest with yourself.  There are human lives involved.

Apr 30, 16 5:21 pm  · 
 · 

eeayoeeayo,

Then cite the code section IN 2007 edition of the Oregon Structural Specialty Code that says what you are saying. Cite it or shut up?

When I look for UL listed assembly, I don't look for UL books. I look at what the code requires and I look at the proposed door assemblies and look to see if it has one of these:

or

and variants of it. 

For what you were referring to in the first place for fire resistant assembly, the only UL listed item required would be a fire rated door. The CMU wall meets the 1-hr rated wall assembly as well as the back stage concrete floor. The stage doesn't require to be fire rated. 

Look at fire barrier requirement. 

The building official probably called the CMU wall rating at 2-hrs. Going from memory, we were using 5/8" Type-X drywall throughout the interior remodel of the backstage throughout all the rooms and the egress/hallway. Add to that the sprinklers systems.

Apr 30, 16 5:48 pm  · 
 · 

jla-x: Rick, how much did you get paid for this project?

Pro bono. 

Apr 30, 16 5:51 pm  · 
 · 
eeayeeayo

This is at least the third time this has been mentioned in this thread:  for the whole backstage area to not be counted as part of the stage and put it over 1000 sf, the rated assembly would need to carry to the roofs, as well as to the exterior walls on both sides, for 5 feet in both directions.  The roof parapet is not high enough, so the assemblies need to continue in the ceilings and roofs on both sides of the parapet.  Unless those assemblies are specifically listed in IBC, they must be UL assemblies - wall, floor, ceiling, and roof.  It's clear form your own photos that the ceilings on either side of the CMU wall are not rated assemblies. The lighting/box office space are also open to the stage area so they're part of the IBC definition of the stage. You've got rooms in the backstage area that have the same issue of having to pass through more than one intermediate room in order to get to the egress. That's go nothing to do with sprinklers or the area of the stage or any of your other excuses.

Apr 30, 16 6:01 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

ricki you would be crushed in a lawsuit. your thinking is so obtuse and off track i am not certain you would even understand why you could be found guilty of malpractice, fraud, and negligence. what is the difference between a UL certified product and a UL assembly? eeayeayo is answering some of my questions for you actually.

Apr 30, 16 6:16 pm  · 
 · 

Rick I know you don't listen to other people ever, but take a true assessment of yourself here:  if you truly didn't know until yesterday that UL directories do in fact exist and that every tested assembly is in fact published, then doesn't that tell you yourself that your education is egregiously incomplete, and give you some serious doubts about your competence to design buildings? 

I knew there were books existed but finding them without having to spend $10,000+ to find every UL listed assembly for fire rating that has EVER been done so I can trace the pre-existing structural elements and their rating.

The last I check, CMUs don't have UL tags on it. 

Apr 30, 16 6:25 pm  · 
 · 
eeayeeayo

Rick IBC chapter 4, Stage Construction:  "In all types of construction openings through stage floors shall be equipped with tight-fitting, solid wood trap doors with approved safety locks."   In the photos it's clear the trap door in the stage is constructed of OSB with cabinet hinges, and is secured with velcro.

Also in that chapter:  "Dressing rooms, scene docks, property rooms, workshops, storerooms and compartments appurtenant to the stage shall be separated from each other by not less than 1-hour fire barriers".  What assembly did you use for the partitions between backstage storage and dressing rooms?  In the photos is appears they aren't smoke tight to the ceiling, and that some of them don't even have doors between rooms - just openings.  There's no exception there for having sprinklers.

This building has a truly unbelievable number of code problems per square foot.  In architecture school I had a structures class that was entirely based on case studies of terrible projects - this will be a fun one for him.

Apr 30, 16 6:29 pm  · 
 · 
eeayeeayo

Idiot.  It's not an issue of building materials bearing UL tags.  You have to open the books and find the assembly.  This is entry level intern work - if you're an experienced professional how did you not learn it?

Today you say "I knew there were books existed but finding them without having to spend $10,000+ to find every UL listed assembly for fire rating that has EVER been done so I can trace the pre-existing structural elements and their rating."   Yesterday you said "Olaf there is no such thing.  They don't publish any of those things."  Which is it?

Apr 30, 16 6:31 pm  · 
 · 

UL listed fire rated assemblies is a complete assembly using UL certified fire rated components with the rating with non-combustible components or other code qualified fire-rated components/assemblies meeting fire rating standards or all components being UL certified. UL listed fire rated door assembly requires the frame and the door components to be UL certified with fire rating. A hole wall assembly may consists of multiple components.

Apr 30, 16 6:32 pm  · 
 · 
eeayeeayo

Rick again:  UL directories prescribe ASSEMBLIES, made of common building materials, most of which do not have individual UL tags on them or certifications!  The types of materials and the detailing of the assemblies are prescribed for every single numbered ASSEMBLY.  You're confusing UL rated products with UL listed assemblies.

Apr 30, 16 6:35 pm  · 
 · 
shellarchitect

who is going on a field trip to Astoria, id love to hear about it

Apr 30, 16 6:36 pm  · 
 · 
eeayeeayo

This is so exasperating.  Every time somebody points out a problem with this project, your answer points out even more problems with this project.  This is a tiny building - I'm astounded by how much wrongness you were able to jam-pack in it!  It's like one of those kid puzzles "how many mistakes can you spot in this picture".

At this point the safest thing for the protection of the theater patrons, and most likely to keep you out of jail, would be a controlled burn of this building and starting it over - without any involvement from you!

Apr 30, 16 6:44 pm  · 
 · 

Shuellmi,

I'll meet whoever in person. Maybe, I can get in contact with ASOC to tour the building at an appropriate time.

Apr 30, 16 6:45 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

Idiot. It's not an issue of building materials bearing UL tags. You have to open the books and find the assembly.

Apr 30, 16 7:07 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

Idiot. It's not an issue of building materials bearing UL tags. You have to open the books and find the assembl

Apr 30, 16 7:07 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

Idiot. It's not an issue of building materials bearing UL tags. You have to open the books and find the assembl

Apr 30, 16 7:07 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

Idiot. It's not an issue of building materials bearing UL tags. You have to open the books and find the assembl

Apr 30, 16 7:07 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

Idiot. It's not an issue of building materials bearing UL tags. You have to open the books and find the assembly.

Apr 30, 16 7:08 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

Idiot. It's not an issue of building materials bearing UL tags. You have to open the books and find the assembly.

Apr 30, 16 7:08 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

Idiot. It's not an issue of building materials bearing UL tags. You have to open the books and find the assembly.

Apr 30, 16 7:08 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

Idiot. It's not an issue of building materials bearing UL tags. You have to open the books and find the assembly.

Apr 30, 16 7:08 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

Idiot. It's not an issue of building materials bearing UL tags. You have to open the books and find the assembly.

Apr 30, 16 7:09 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

Idiot. It's not an issue of building materials bearing UL tags. You have to open the books and find the assembly.

Apr 30, 16 7:09 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

Idiot. It's not an issue of building materials bearing UL tags. You have to open the books and find the assembly.

Apr 30, 16 7:09 pm  · 
 · 

eeayeeayo,

I had called for a fire rated door in part to compartmentalize. If I remembered correctly, we were using Section 3410 provision. You are applying every provision of NEW construction for an existing building.

You don't work with existing buildings. I advise you to stay away from designing projects involving existing buildings because you have to literally demolish any existing building in order to meet every damn requirement of new construction. You can't make an existing building over 25 years old comply with new construction because those requirements change. It is even more difficult to deal with buildings built prior to 1970s (in Oregon... 1973 is when Oregon enacted the state-wide building "Structural Specialty" codes for commercial buildings). 

You would be cost prohibitive at once. The client would terminate contract with you or not even select you because you would push something they can't afford. If you want all that, back it up with cash.

Do you realize that you just need to do is put a fire-rated door and maybe a little patch work. Then if you so much feel a need to add further fire rating, you can just put some furring strips horizontally and lay on another two layers of 5/8" type-X drywall drywall as well as two layers of  it on top of the deck stage adjacent to the CMU wall and at the top of the wall where the 8" CMU shifts to 6" CMU just under the rafters. That can't be that expensive. 

I can't imagine the building official letting the client get away with not putting a fire-rated door there. Doing so would be cheaper than installing two standpipes at the stage. Considering the implication that would have on the plumbing and water pressure.  

If he did, I'd be a little perturbed because the whole damn idea is to use that wall as a fire barrier. It was practically that to begin with. All it needed is a fire-rated door assembly.

While the building was a laundromat and had considerable water supply coming in, it can only go so far.

Apr 30, 16 7:16 pm  · 
 · 
Hey Ricky Balkins....the entirety of the UL books with assemblies are available online...for free.

We're all going to hear about a massacre in Oregon one day because of you. A massacre because of your ineptitude.
Apr 30, 16 7:36 pm  · 
 · 

This is at least the third time this has been mentioned in this thread:  for the whole backstage area to not be counted as part of the stage and put it over 1000 sf, the rated assembly would need to carry to the roofs, as well as to the exterior walls on both sides, for 5 feet in both directions.  The roof parapet is not high enough, so the assemblies need to continue in the ceilings and roofs on both sides of the parapet.  Unless those assemblies are specifically listed in IBC, they must be UL assemblies - wall, floor, ceiling, and roof.  It's clear form your own photos that the ceilings on either side of the CMU wall are not rated assemblies. The lighting/box office space are also open to the stage area so they're part of the IBC definition of the stage. You've got rooms in the backstage area that have the same issue of having to pass through more than one intermediate room in order to get to the egress. That's go nothing to do with sprinklers or the area of the stage or any of your other excuses.

Do you know how the egress from the backstage to its own exit? The backstage has its own exit.

Every room in the backstage exits to the hallway. The hallway does snake a little bit. The exit for the backstage is part of the hallway. 

Apr 30, 16 7:41 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

so rick, i couldnt figure out how to write the sentence that eeayeeyo eventually wrote so i backed off. a sentence gain illustrating your profound naivitiee......whats this would mean in a lawsuit is many experts would be smacking their foreheads when you talk and you would probably continue to ramble on like a moron.

Apr 30, 16 7:49 pm  · 
 · 
eeayeeayo

I do work with existing buildings - hundreds of them.  That's exactly why I'm qualified to call you an idiot.  

I can see that the backstage area has an exit to the exterior.  But all those spaces back there are required to have access to two means of egress - and by having them go through the unrated backstage circulation area (what you're calling the hallway) and then through the unrated theater house to get to the 2nd means of egress, you have too many intermediate spaces.  I don't understand why you're not getting that.  It's not a difficult concept.  You are only allowed to go from one room through one more room, before you either get to an enclosed egress route or directly to the exterior.  If I go from any room in your backstage area to the backstage "hallway" to the main theater, I've gone through TWO intermediate rooms to get to the outside, which is too many.

Also all of the backstage rooms are supposed to be fire separated from each other, which they are not.

The trap door on the stage is secured with velcro.

There are no standpipes and you proved that you don't know what one looks like.

Yesterday you claimed UL directories are not published and do not exist (wrong).  Today you claim that all UL assemblies are made up only of materials with UL certifications on them (wrong), and that they cost $10,000 (wrong).

This would all be hilarious except that hundreds of unsuspecting people visit that building every week.

Apr 30, 16 8:08 pm  · 
 · 

eeayeeayo would have to cite the code section because that is exactly what I would tell him to do even before court. 

Then we look at what the actual codes say. Even expert witnesses are wrong from time to time. 

The code book would be brought forward.

Section 706 says?

706.5 Continuity:

Fire barriers shall extend from the top of the floor/ceiling assembly below to the underside of the floor or roof slab or deck above and shall be securely attached thereto. Such fire barrier shall be continuous through concealed spaces, such as the space above a suspended ceiling. (other sentences snipped as they don't apply but you can read it for yourself online.)

The CMU wall isn't just continuous. It is continuous beyond the roof of the back stage. Remember the low side of the roof in the backstage (1980s era addition) is towards the CMU wall of the older CMU (1950s era) constructed building. 

The CMU wall line starts the footing level about 3 feet below the backstage floor level and extends continuously all the way. 

I'm using the provisions of fire barrier not "fire wall" so please tell me where the parapet height matters for the provisions of 'fire barrier' rules that's it continuous. What does Section 410.5.2 say? Go back and read 410.3.1.1 and then read again 410.5.2.

Lets say I have a 2-hr rated CMU wall going up. Aside from the CMU wall being 2-hr rated in and of itself. 

Do you know the difference in the requirements?

Apr 30, 16 9:00 pm  · 
 · 
eeayeeayo

For the thousandth time:  I understand the concrete wall, with the fire rated door in it.  But you do not have a fire separation between the two parts of the building because the parapet is not high enough, and the ceiling/roof deck on both sides is combustible.

Also, I keep asking you about the partitions BETWEEN THE BACKSTAGE ROOMS.  I'm not referring to the concrete wall between the theater house and the backstage area.  I'm referring to the new partitions that were constructed to create storage rooms and dressing rooms and a hallway in the backstage area.  Those rooms all require 1-hour separations (yes, even with sprinklers) from EACH OTHER.  I'm not talking about their separation from the stage. Example:  your backstage area has dressing rooms and storage areas.  Your own photos show that, as well as photos on the theater's various sites. Between any two of those little rooms the partitions are supposed to be UL-numbered assemblies.  It does not appear in the photos that they are. Some of them are not even continuous to the ceiling.  Do you understand yet?

Apr 30, 16 9:08 pm  · 
 · 
eeayeeayo

One other thing:  I have served as an expert witness a number of times, and a code book has never been produced in court in any case with which I've been involved.  The actual dialog has been along the lines of "In your expert opinion, does this [stair, wall, roof, whatever] meet applicable buildings codes?"  and then I answer that.  In this case I would answer "No, it does not", and then proceed to list why.   

Apr 30, 16 9:11 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

richard, having sat as expert witness in a case once and often involved in lawsuits, legalizations, and I work in  a city full of really old buildings where mainly Lawyers can afford to live, let me illustrate your behavior in court and the pitfalls you will have and why you should really heed E.I.E.I.O's advice:

 

"Richard Balkins please describe your education and professional licenses." - lawyer

"What I do is defensible as a member of an organization that deals with building designing. You are aware of what can and can not be done in Oregon and we did that here.  A ME engineer designed the sprinkler system and the building was old so we couldn't do new..."  Richard

lawyer cut's Richard off.

"Please describe your education and professional licenses." - lawyer

"I started in a community college and worked for such and such and I am registering to become a licensed building designer. I think the system is flawed and the education is incorrect.  What I do is defensible!" - Richard

"Let the record indicate Richard Balkins has not completed a professional degree in architecture nor liberal arts or science degree in any university, nor is he a registered Architect or Professional Engineer in the State Oregon."  - Lawyer

"I object! This is not defensible. I'm a Commodore C64 genius..." - Richard

Arbiter slaps forehead, Judge gets annoyed.

This is pretty much the end of the case for the person who died in a fire in a building Richard offered his NOT expert advice and drawings on, but let's assume it carries on.

"Are you familiar with UL certified products and UL directories of assemblies?" - Lawyer

"The only UL I look for is stamps on products. No architect or contractor has any books on UL assemblies.  This comes on a disk and costs $10,000 and is limited and really doesn't exist.  So I knew the concrete was 1980's so you know it's UL certified...." - Balkins

Lawyer submits four (4) $199 books, volumes, 1, 2A, 2B, 3 (notes this shit is free on the web) and then goes on to explain different types of code - descriptive and prescriptive and asks -

[totally fiction NOW]

"Mr. Balkins could you explain how you determined, as you state - 1980's concrete is UL certified in accordance with national and state standards?" - lawyer

This question would never happen, but in Richard's mind it would.

"See I read ACI 318 and some ASTM's and determined via my 4shared.com account where I jack this shit for free (incase you didn't know that) and determined  according to the standards in the 1980's the concrete could be certified.  See concrete is an aggregate, hold on I'm googling on my Commodore Android phone, it's like rocks, cementicous, Portland, see Oregon has the best cement because of Portland.  Anyway, I realized that in 1980, if you went to Home Depot (not sure there were any in Astoria, Oregon area) but you bought a bag of this shit - Certified, and a Bag of this shit - Ceriftied we'd be cool.  See i know my stuff and you do know this can all be googled on the internet and I'm an expert now!"

never apologizes for the death trap he designed pro-bono.

Apr 30, 16 9:14 pm  · 
 · 
eeayeeayo

Look Rick, experienced people are trying to tell you how to do the least damage to your future by shutting up now.  We're not kidding - the information you've put in this thread is enough to put you in prison if there ever is an accident in that theater.  Think about your own future - is it worth trading for the sake of arguing on an internet forum?  You're putting more and more evidence of your incompetence out there for posterity.  Why?

Apr 30, 16 9:15 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

Richard. Stop. Request to delete this thread. Report the bullshit you did in Astoria. Frankly I have to now as a Professional [not kidding].  Have a professional inspect and issue a report for corrections that are mandatory.

This isn't virtual reality man. 

Apr 30, 16 9:20 pm  · 
 · 

eeayeeayo,

I do work with existing buildings - hundreds of them.  That's exactly why I'm qualified to call you an idiot.  

I can see that the backstage area has an exit to the exterior.  But all those spaces back there are required to have access to two means of egress - and by having them go through the unrated backstage circulation area (what you're calling the hallway) and then through the unrated theater house to get to the 2nd means of egress, you have too many intermediate spaces.  I don't understand why you're not getting that.  It's not a difficult concept.  You are only allowed to go from one room through one more room, before you either get to an enclosed egress route or directly to the exterior.  If I go from any room in your backstage area to the backstage "hallway" to the main theater, I've gone through TWO intermediate rooms to get to the outside, which is too many.

Also all of the backstage rooms are supposed to be fire separated from each other, which they are not.

The trap door on the stage is secured with velcro.

There are no standpipes and you proved that you don't know what one looks like.

Yesterday you claimed UL directories are not published and do not exist (wrong).  Today you claim that all UL assemblies are made up only of materials with UL certifications on them (wrong), and that they cost $10,000 (wrong).

This would all be hilarious except that hundreds of unsuspecting people visit that building every week.

Unless you have the actual plans, you don't know what you are talking about. All the walls use 5/8" Type-X gypsum wall boards. Unless you measured them. I think you are full of shit. Looking from the photos provided, you wouldn't know. They been painted.

What does 1004.1 through 1004.1.1 say?

Apr 30, 16 9:24 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

What does 1004.1 through 1004.1.1 say?

Richard, do you know how the law works?

Apr 30, 16 9:29 pm  · 
 · 
eeayeeayo

I do have the actual plans - not the ones you drew but the ones that the architect who designed the as-yet unbuilt addition did of the now-existing theater.

1004.1 through 1004.1.1 are occupant count methods.  They have nothing to do with anything I've posted.  I already posted somewhere above the exact code language requiring 1-hour separations between all of those rooms, and you can see in photos that some of them don't go to the ceiling.  What on earth do you think "they been painted" has to do with that? 

Apr 30, 16 9:29 pm  · 
 · 
Rick, please report yourself. You've caused potential harm to these people. The only ethical thing to do at this point is to report the building, admit your wrongdoing, and face the punishment. You clearly do not have the experience and capability to look out of the public's health, safety, and welfare.
Apr 30, 16 9:30 pm  · 
 · 
awaiting_deletion

.


 

Apr 30, 16 9:40 pm  · 
 · 
Dangermouse

>Idiot. It's not an issue of building materials bearing UL tags. You have to open the books and find the assembly.

 

When balkans  calls someone an idiot, yet posts the same thing 12 times in a row

 

Apr 30, 16 9:55 pm  · 
 · 
eeayeeayo

I'm surprised one of those predator ADA lawyers hasn't been all over this place with a federal case yet.  There's no existing building exemption for ADA requirements, and this place is a doozy:  the ticket window is too high; the awning over it has brackets that project way into the blind person crash range; the stage isn't accessible; the snack bar isn't accessible; the lighting booth isn't accessible; the box office has no ADA turning radius or work surface with accessible width, depth, and height; there is an ADA portapotty but the route to it is not compliant; the door hardware clearances don't work and some of the hardware isn't accessible, and so forth.  Maybe setting a vulture lawyer loose on the place would put some attention on the firetrap issues at the same time.

Apr 30, 16 10:17 pm  · 
 · 
DeTwan

.

Apr 30, 16 11:47 pm  · 
 · 
no_form
Code violations can be reported to the people listed below.

Lisa Ferguson
Building Codes Permit Technician
1095 Duane Street, Astoria OR 97103
lferguson@astoria.or.us
503-325-1004

David Kloss
Interim Building Official
buildingofficial@astoria.or.us
503-325-1004 or 503-338-3697
Apr 30, 16 11:51 pm  · 
 · 
no_form
Lisa Ferguson
Building Codes Permit Technician
1095 Duane Street, Astoria OR 97103
lferguson@astoria.or.us
503-325-1004

David Kloss
Interim Building Official
buildingofficial@astoria.or.us
503-325-1004 or 503-338-3697
Apr 30, 16 11:51 pm  · 
 · 

eeayeeyo, 

I do have the actual plans (from) the architect who designed the as-yet unbuilt addition did of the now-existing theater?

Do you? Are you that architect? If so, lets meet up and talk about this over a cup of coffee or something?

 

I'm surprised one of those predator ADA lawyers hasn't been all over this place with a federal case yet.  There's no existing building exemption for ADA requirements, and this place is a doozy:  the ticket window is too high; the awning over it has brackets that project way into the blind person crash range; the stage isn't accessible; the snack bar isn't accessible; the lighting booth isn't accessible; the box office has no ADA turning radius or work surface with accessible width, depth, and height; there is an ADA portapotty but the route to it is not compliant; the door hardware clearances don't work and some of the hardware isn't accessible, and so forth.  Maybe setting a vulture lawyer loose on the place would put some attention on the firetrap issues at the same time.

I didn't specify any awning. It wasn't in the design. They added that later. It's a public right of way / sidewalk there where the "ticket window" is. As for the ticket window height. They altered and deviated from design when they came to that but I have no control over that. 

As for the Porta potties, I didn't specify the exact locations of them or even the canopy. 

As for the "box office", what work surface other than a table. The ticket booth would be at least 7-ft. deep and a table with clear height still provides and wide enough... say 6-ft. wide table... you still have a turn radius. As long as you have 4ft. plus 2-ft. under the table with clear height met. 

Lets not forget to include that ADA places limits on cost spent on ADA compliance. There is a 20% rule regarding disproportionality. The client didn't really tell me what the budget is for costs. How much did they spend on the project. 

In the east side, I told them they are to change that door to a proper ADA door. The on the east side is 42". The door is suppose to be changed out to a correct ADA door. The planter box that you see in one of the photos from before the remodel was removed. File name: DSC00026.JPG. There is suppose to be a clear path along that east side of the building from the sidewalk to the doors from the public sidewalk. Any deteriorated concrete work is suppose to be  patched or repaired as needed. It's concrete slab like the sidewalk. With the planter box removed, that's a 15-ft wide area. You can't tell me there isn't adequate room for clearance.

May 1, 16 12:07 am  · 
 · 
no_form

hey balkins, if this project was even permitted as you claim it was, provide us with the permit number and any drawings on file with the city for us to review.  hell, show us the drawings you did for this theater.  maybe we should call the theater company and ask them about their experience working with you as well.  

May 1, 16 12:22 am  · 
 · 
eeayeeayo

Rick I did not download your photos so I don't know what SDC00026 shows.  My virus protection doesn't open 4share. The box office has a built-in counter work surface approximately 2 feet deep and 42 inches high, with drawers below. I understand that they may have added this without your involvement,  but even without it your argument that there is enough width for this room to be ADA accessible and function as a box office is false. An accessible work surface has to be at least 30 inches from front to back, and the 60 inch diameter wheelchair clearance circle is only allowed to extend under a surface a maximum of 19 inches, and only allowed to extend under it at all if there is unobstructed horizontal clearance at least 3 feet wide.  This means you need 30" of work surface depth, plus a minimum of 41 inches of additional clearance, just to have adequate space to turn around.  But you also need a clear egress path at least 30 inches wide that fits behind the chair zone (because there is more than one person working in the room, and because it is the only way to get to the lighting booth) - so overall this room is too narrow to meet ADA unless all work surfaces are omitted entirely. 

May 1, 16 12:28 am  · 
 · 
eeayeeayo

And yes I do have the plans, but no I'm not that architect, and I'm thousands of miles away.

May 1, 16 12:53 am  · 
 · 

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