What do you do when you can't find Internships or entry level positions? What do you do when employers constantly ask for experience when you yourself have never worked(fresh out of college with no real world experience) I've been actively looking for almost 2 years now and no luck. Do I call it unfair? I don't want to be negative about the situation because I understand there are many qualified people(better portfolio etc) out there seeking jobs.... BUT
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How does someone get around these obstacles...what have I been doing wrong? I really need some advice guys.
you've done nothing wrong. this job market is terrible, and you are not alone. i hear stories like this all of the time and it makes me sad for all of my peers and colleagues. try contacting the university you graduated from and see if they have a system in place that can help. have you thought of travelling abroad?
I'm sorry you're have a rough go of it archboy. Have you tried expanding your horizons to other related fields like construction or even graphic design? I'm sure that the job market in the other fields aren't much better, but they can't be worse than architecture.
And kaiden is right. Check with your university to make sure that you are taking advantage of all the services they offer getting alumni jobs.
Thank you guys for the kind words it really means a lot...It's very tough my college has tried to help but to no avail...I'm also trying to look into other related field as well but it seems that because I lack experience in the working world it's hard to come by...
I'm in the exact same boat as you my friend. Graduated in 2009 and have yet to land an arch job. I’ve done a few contract drafting jobs, that’s it. You could/should try that if you can. I have a full time job outside of job as an analyst. I’m trying to use the skills I’ve learned this job as new skill set I can offer arch firms, but I don’t think they really care. Really I think it comes down to luck. Knowing the right person or just someone at a firm deciding to give you a chance. The whole thing is a catch 22. They want people with experience but no one wants to give you experience. Crappy job market, and it’s not getting any better. I applied for my M.Arch, and will try to go the grad school route to pass time. I’ve talked to old professors and plenty of architects they are just like “it’s tough out here”. They don’t have any real advice. I’ve been to AIA networking events, and they don’t have any real advice either or jobs.
It sucks, we picked the absolute worst time like EVER to graduate. And it only gets worst b/c we been out of school longer and longer now and have nothing to show for it!
:-(
Quentin: You were soliciting any advice, but be careful of the temptation to sit out the recession in grad school. Unless it is part of some greater career plan, it could end up being a very expensive hiding place. That debt will just be one additional burden. You need to view education as you would any other investment. What does it cost, and what do I get in return.
The cost of architecture school, especially a master's degree does not make a lot of financial sense in this job market. Geezerarchitect is 100% right. Your returns on a very sizable investment would be very, very small.
Interesting, "The cost of architecture school, especially a master's degree does not make a lot of financial sense in this job market." I hear this a lot especially where there are different types of Architectural degree where are specific one is needed. Ultimately in the end you feel like you can make any of these degree work for the purpose of Architecture... yet they don't see it that way, I guess they see the situation as a principal (if it says you must have this certain degree you must) .
With a masters it gives you a slight edge since there are job offers which only requires a masters @Queintin, if you want to make your passion into a reality you should go for it, I wish you luck.
You'd bre surprised how many very highly ranked and highly acclaimed public schools there are where you can pay in-state tuition (i.e. Cincinnati, Virginia Tech, Michigan, UCLA, Washington, Georgia Tech, Florida, etc)....
Furthermore, you'd be surprised how many high-end designers who are principals at reputable firms there are.... Just saying.
You get a lot of douches on this board who think that their livelihood are completely over if they didn't get into GSD, Columbia, Yale, AA, RISD, Penn, and such... And these are the same people who frown and look down upon people who did not attend one of these programs - just a word of advise - if that's your mentality - you have a very short career.
just thought I'd check in here. same boat. my profs and instructors have done all they can to help me as in giving me referrals and recommendations but in the end no one will hire because I don't have enough experience. the only way to get experience it seems, is to have a hook up from the inside, i.e. your parent's friends or your friend's parents... or take something unpaid, which only reinforces the notion of architecture being a gentleman's pursuit: I got bills to pay, man!
I'm also beginning to think it doesn't matter what school you go to; all that matters is experience. And since it takes experience to get experience....
Hey there. I am there also. I graduated with my MArch in 2010, and am still looking after almost two years. After I graduated, I used my family to connect me, but they are all in Egypt. Side note, I grew up in the states, but all my family is in Egypt except for my mom and siblings. I felt very fortunate at the time, since I got to go live in a whole new place and was working in architecture. With the revolution, I had to leave after only being there several months. It has now been almost a year since I have been back and barely without any real interviews.
You are not alone. Everyone keeps telling me to be persistent and patient, which I have been. BUT, I am running out of hope with finding work in architecture. I am actually completely unemployed. I haven't had luck finding a job doing anything. I even started applying to grocery stores and other retailers, but nothing in that either. I am just wanting to be a part of society again! It has been a vicious cycle for me, I am either over qualified, or not qualified enough. BLAH. I am just remaining hopeful and going to keep trying! It is no ones fault. The economy sucks and the people who did find jobs, were just lucky. They were at the right place at the right time....
Times are very tough right now in architecture. You should be commended for your persistence.
But I caution you on developing the mentality that "it is the economy". Yes, the economy is very bad right now and architecture jobs are scare. But you should be able to find a job within the architecture field after two years. If you accept the condolences from others with stuff like "hang in there, the economy is awful. Don't give up. Be persistent" etc. --it can be dangerous. Sure it feels good to hear people's supportive thoughts.
But what you really need to be doing is finding out how you are representing yourself in portfolio, written and spoken word and get feedback on how you can improve. You need to be asking for feedback on how you can approach your job hunting more effectively.
Talk to your schools. Although I do think many schools have a huge gap of knowledge when it comes to making the transition from academic to professional. But talk to your schools as a starting point and get feedback on your portfolio, cover letter and resume from many, many different sources. It needs to be one package that reads clearly and cohesively. Get feedback from architecture professors who are also practicing architects. Get feedback from your peers who were able to successfully land positions. Get feedback from classmates several years ahead of you who have been in the job market for several years.
Ask if any professors need additional jury members for upcoming crits. A great way to network is sitting on a jury and allowing other professionals to see and hear how you speak and think and relate to others. It will also help keep your energy fresh and engaged when you are applying for jobs. Ask if there are any summer TA positions for recent grads to help out with the summer arch program that your school runs. Chase after those opportunities. Write a paper and try to get accepted at one of the many "sustainable architecture / technology" conferences held thru out the year. It is relatively easy to "get published" by these types of conferences if you can write well and have good research skills. This is a great way to network with professors and professionals, i.e. you are writing a paper about thermal bridging and would love to be able to speak with xyz architect about their building that was recently awarded LEED Unobtainium.....or whatever the topic might be.
So yes, hang in there. Keep your energy fresh and positive. But the biggest thing is that you are going to have to change before the economy does. The economy isn't going to change anytime soon, but the beauty of being human is that we can change and evolve on a dime.....
My dad always say "you have to get people to know you." goes back to what lance smith said about getting hooked up this is actually one of the realities...
Great advice sulidae12, networking seems to be one of the major step in all this, spread your name to get enough recognition. I'm glad you mention the steps to go about this.
Thank for your feedback. I have done everything you mentioned. Attended lectures, events, and so on. Networked my heart out. My school and the people there have been completely useless. Students and faculty. None of the professors are working in the profession. They are strictly academics. Anytime I asked someone to critique my portfolio, resume and letters, they just nod and say this is good, you'll find something right away. I know there must be something wrong with what I am doing. I also think it's crazy it's been two years and still searching... Would you be willing to rip my materials apart. This is what I need! Let me know if you have time to do this. Thanks!
I hate to sound overtly optimistic but hiring is going on in several regions.
My firm has been on a hiring spree since February 2011 (hired around 1000 people firmwide - no exaggeration!) I think that has subsided a little but other firms in my city also seem to be hiring. the job boards definitely look far more promising than they did in 2008/2009. I don't hear as much these days about mass layoffs.
I was laid off of my job last January and rebounded very quickly.
@med, I am in Chicago.... I am considering leaving and going somewhere that seems more promising to give a shot. What firm are you with and where? I can check it out.
I'm in Washington DC. Not saying this is the premier market or anything, but there is more construction here right now than many other cities. And consequently more firms are hiring.
The firm I'm with? Let's just say it's a global behemoth also known to tread water with the rise and fall of the economic tide. Our hiring spree wasn't because of an economic surge rather it was because we successfully competed within the marketshare. And that means competing on a lot of the work that other firms go after for even lower fees. It's worked pretty decently I must say and the firm has a reasonably nice shrewd business model.
Same boat unfortunatly! I have been looking for 8 months. My portfolio is very good, and I have great references, but none of that matters because employers want workers that they do not have to spend time and money training. They can do this because of good old supply and demand. The economy is a mess right now and no one wants to hire people with little experiance when people with lots of experiance are plentiful. The problem in this field is a lack of upward mobility and a reliance on others to pursue ones career. If like in Law, you could take a test and have a title that is valuable, then we would be in control of our own destiny and have the option of doing freelance work, but rather we must rely on our competition to "help" us get licenced and move ahead. It is bullshit. Not to say that If we all had a licence it would be easy, there is still little demand out there, but at least we would be in control of our own future and our careers would not be blocked by the inability of others to hire us. This is a frusturating position to be in. There is something fundamentally wrong with this profession when hard work and talent only get you to a road block that must be overcome by connections and luck inorder to go foward. Young talent is being stiffled by this ridgid system at a time when it is needed most in this profession.
@ntawancy if New York is one of your choices I'd say good luck because it's horrible here...Right now i'm applying for positions different from architecture and I actually just got back 1 hour prior from this msg from an interview in retail...its like my resume can't get me an architecture job at the same time it's denying me from getting other jobs outside architecture lol... the question always is "why aren't you looking for architectural position and you should try and stay on that path" it was the same question when i also interviewed for office assistant jobs long ago....no experience is such a burden
I just wanna touch on what @sulidae12 mentioned, because I think it's really important to not get too caught up in the "the economy sucks" mode and use it as a crutch... which is real easy to do. Even worse when all your friends around you are getting jobs via connections!
So far I haven't sent the same resume more than twice. I'm constantly revising it and thinking about how to make the experiences I do have more related and adaptable to what firms are looking for these days, and/or to specific jobs, that sometimes aren't even arch/design related.
I'd bet that outside of Arch departments, schools have some sort of career center... that would be willing to help alumni. At University of Washington, this service is free and they constantly offer work shops and all that stuff... even meet and greets.
There has *got* to be a way to make your past experiences, or even experiences in studio, employable... even if it's not an arch firm. I mean we didn't spend 36 hour school days doing nothing, right?
I guess I don't mean this as any formula for success, cause here I am still looking (ha) but I think for now... it is OK to look outside the box and be flexible on what kind of jobs are out there.
Visualization? Project Management?
In the end though, I think we'll come out on top. People who get hook ups can't develop job search skills... and those connections won't be around forever. They'll never learn how to sell themselves, or even put together a resume....
...which before now was just like 10 minutes in Word, OK, write a bunch of crap down.
But currently it's been an on going process, I've probably worked on it for a month, now. Maybe that's what it takes....
I'll walk my talk. Can you post your portoflio, resume and cover letter to issuu.com? You can do a private upload and just send me the link. I'll keep your identity confidential or you can just black out your name, contact info, etc.
I'd prefer to keep my email address confidential. Is there a way you can send me the link via archinect? Didn't architect allow that in the past?? Let me know via archinect if you send me something. I think my account is linked to an email that I don't check frequently.
No offence, quinten but I ha ve no idea what your situation is.
I had friends just move in from San Fran who got jobs within 1 week (both have about 4-6 years of experience.
I was laid off from my behemoth corporate firm in January 2011 and then started working (within 1 week) for a mid-size DC firm for about 3 months before I realized that it sucked donkey balls then annother sorporate behemoth that happened to be on a major hiring spree over the spring and summer hired me. I'm been there since.
Other firms also wanted me to join but I had already accepted my job so there was plenty of work. I mean look around DC, there is construction everywhere. I have no idea why you have had no luck.
For what it's worth I do staffing/recruiting. You can send me a private email to let me review what you have and what your approach has been.
Gensler was on a hiring spree from the spring to fall of 2011. Over 100 people hired in the office during that time period. I think that has ended for now.
Shalom Barnes is still hiring - a lot of projects have been awarded to them.
Check Smithgroup., RTKL, ZGF, HOK they have had some key project wins lately.
It's true - you really need to go on the "campaign trail" and get yourself elected - it is contact, contact and contact - and learn the latest social networking tools if you have not done already.
Yes - networking is also key! And I don't just mean having a linked in profile.
I have witnessed a lot of architects act like self-righteous assholes within the profession. Especially young people who think that being in asshole = looking like they have confidence. this is a critical error in judgement that many make both at the entry level and in school. Little do they realize that when the axe fall -= they will in most cases be victims and when it comes to looking for work they will be turned away.
I've seen people who were complete jerkoffs to me in other firms (for no reason other than arrogance) only get laid off later on down the stretch and then come to the firm I was work at. I always like the "oh fuck" expression when they notice that I'm there reviewing their work.
It's a very small profession. really hope none of you guys are like that.
It's ALL about being nice and professional professional professional!
I think having the 4-6 years of experience helps tons. I barely have one year within architecture and 2-3 within design, but most places want you to have 3 years of experience within an architecture firm. Landing work at the entry level is very tough right now...
@sulidae12 - I have a website you can visit that has everything.
Very nice work Ntawancy...There are so many people here with such beautiful work and I'm so amazed they are having a hard time landing work, at times I even get jealous because what chance do I have when there are so many more people who's qualified... lol I know I shouldn't be thinking that way but i can't help it... im not whining so please don't get mad at me.
Below is a link to my portfolio and only experience I basically have is college experience
One thing I really want to improve is my board presentations my work never usually shows visual impact... none of the work on my portfolio is set up as board presentations just to let you know.
I'm working late tonight but will try to provide feedback on your website later,
ntawancy ,
you must be getting many people trying to view your site because I can't get on to the site, even from my work computer. Will try later.
I echo med's comments. I work for one of the smaller 'corporate firms'. They have some office locations that are hurting but others are in hirng sprees. Many firms in my area are hiring as well. My firm's location brought on 10 interns with little to no experience in the last 2 months.
Thank you for sharing your lovely website. There is absolutely no reason why you should not be employed.
You express yourself very well in written word. Your resume displays a strong graphic sensibility and an ability to edit. This are important qualities to have as a growing architectural intern.
You come across as confident, smart and capable and quite frankly a solid candiate for a beginner intern position.
Things you can do to strengthen the way you are perceived:
1. It took forever to load your website. If you are using your website as an application tool, chances are many people are simply not considering you because the loading time is so slow. I only looked at two projects, your resume and the 'about' section. But it was painful to have to wait for the site to load. What are you using to create your website? Wix.com perhaps? Be careful. Load times that you experience are different than what others experience because you have cached information on your computer. Make sure you have downsized your images to the appropriate pixel size for your website viewing. Get rid of as much weight as you can to improve viewing performance. Ask friends and family who have never seen your website to view it and see what their load times are like. go to a local library and hop on a computer and see how others may be viewing your site.
2. Small graphic suggestions: Your graphic sensibility is strong enough that you can loose the color bar and rectangle line work around your name. Let your name be black or grey and perhaps kern the font out a bit and let your name express itself cleanly. You express yourself strongly in written text. Let your name be expressed clearly and strongly too. The color bar and black line rectangle is too "student like". It reads like an architecture student that is trying to be more graphically interesting when really, you want let the work read first. Let the work read first, let the white space support it. Nothing more.
3. While the perspectives show some graphic competence, they all become monotanous when viewing because they are all kind the same style and tone. In fact all the projects come across as kinda the same. What doesn't leap out is your design ability, your intellect, your process, your thinking, your instincts. What doesn't come across is that you have an understanding that in this one image, it says "this is what the project is about" and in that one image you have layers of the buildingscape, the landscape, the urbanscape, the peoplescape, etc. Perspectives don't have to have advanced graphic skills to be this immediate and informative.
4. Lack of process work and diagrams - sometimes in a quest to come off as accomplished or polished, we can edit out the very qualities that make our work unique and full of energy. You seem to possess such a strong art background. I believe you are smart enough and capable enough to choose wisely to show your handwork and other artistic abilities in a way that demonstrates you have mind, eye, hand coordination, i.e. you have the abilty to think and to express your ideas in sketch or other media forms. You must strive to show your process more. Your work is a void without it. You can do this without cluttering your clean aesthetic. Go to a bookstore in the arch section and look at architcture books from firms and architects you admire. Study how they lay out their books. Study how they use a full saturated bleed image against open white space. Study how a fully digital rendering or photograph is much more powerful when coupled with a small process sketch that shows evidence of the human hand.
5. Acknowledge the context of your work. I may not have seen it but I couldn't easily understand if I was looking at student work or professional work etc. The quality was low enough that I suspected it was all student projects but who knows since there was nothing online to help a viewer understand the context of the work shown.
6. Highlight your computer skills more. Firms wnt to hire people that have the full package of ACAD, Revit, Adobe Creative Suite, 3dmax, rhino, sketchup, yada, yada yada.
Highlight your computer skills and equally important, highlight that you have made the transition from student work to professional work with regards to computer experience. Often times students will say yes they know revit, but they have only used a very limited portion of revit for student projects and they have not worked with revit in a collaborative environment. Firms want to know applicants understand the difference between student computer experience and professional experience. There is a big different between "I know Revit" and " I provided Revit documentation support at the 50% and 100% DD deadlines on a 250K gsf university research facility."
7. I think you should enter some competitions to improve your overall portfolio. Student work is hard to develop fully under deadlines and time constraints. Take everything you have learned and enter a competition and use it to strenghten your communication skills via diagramming, processwork and more fully articulated perspectives that show evidence of design intent.
k,
excuse all my spelling errors, I was typing fast. sorry too for the length. That's my initial impression of looking at your website. Others?
I cruised thru your website. Thanks so much for sharing.
First off, there are many people out there with alot more experience and skills than you who have not done what you have done, i.e. gather up all your work, organize it and present it the best you can. For that, good job. Good indication of tenacity and follow thru.
But archboy, being blunt it might be hard for you to find a position in architecture or any field with the way you are presenting yourself. You definitely need to get career counseling advice on ways to strengthen your writing skills. If your school isn't up to par, research local organizations that might be able to give you some support. Friends with older brother and sisters who are in the working world could be a good resource too. It might be good to focus on just getting some foundational work experience that will allow you to grow and develop personally and professionally.
You seem like a very nice personable person. You seem to thrive in outreach environments, i.e. tutoring, helping your art instructor.
You could look into jobs or volunteer opportunities thru habitat for humanity or other construction related jobs that focus on youth and mentoring. This could be an area that you would excel at. There could be opportunities for you to take a leadership position via Americorps, etc., There could be high school programs that are looking for computer tutors, etc.
I would also encourage you to visit other schools in the NY area and see as much student work as you can. Pratt, Columbia, Parsons will all have final reviews in the Spring. It will be good to gain exposure to the breadth and range of other student work.
Don't put false pressure on yourself that you cannot find a job in the architecture field. You should feel great that you accomplished getting your Bachelor of Technology. I would focus on getting a job that will support you financially and that you can spend a couple years developing and maturing.
On your own time, you could enter competitions and continue to hone your graphic and communication skills if your passion for architecture is still driving you. But give yourself a couple years to just work and grow and be open to many career paths.
Again, thank you very much for sharing. One of the most important things to do to break out of a rut and grow and evolve etc. is to share and seek out feedback. So you are on the right track!
Archboy, here is the thing..... Not in anyway am I trying to sound incendiary but the way you present yourself must improve based on what I read from your website.
You can just do away with the whole "Arch-boy" thing on your blurb. You are a man and a professional so there is no reason to put that kind of front up. You will find that archtiects are reasonably professional and are always impressed when they see a candidate giving a great impression on them.
The tone of your cover letter sounds appologetic with a hint of "woe is me" mentality. This needs to go away - you should never appologize for something that is out of your hands. Everyone starts at the entry level and they can use your talents and abilities in other areas - (i.e. fast photoshop skills, renderings, digital models, etc). Meantime you will be trained on how to do the technical stuff. Anyone can learn how to do CDs. It's something where the more you do it, the better you will get. Do NOT appologize for the lack of experience and do NOT EVER EVER sound pessimistic, negative, or bitter in your cover letter. This instantly guarantees your resume a spot in the wastebasket.
Mechanically, your punctuation and grammar needs work in your cover letter. Two spaces after a period - this is cursory knowledge that people on archinect shouldn't have to tell you.
Your work is fine (the drawings are very clear and illustrate your knowledge of how to draw) and your renderings look great but you need to really show more of those in a sexy kind of way.
Oh I thought I edited above statement. Thanks again, you know a professor told me to write with a little sense of humor so I was going In that direction "employers likes to see the humor in people." this is what was said. I agree with my writing since I've heard this before and know that I need to improve on it so thanks for the in depth post Sulidae and Med. Going back to what sulidae said I know what your saying about developing more even if I can't get into architecture now I just want to find something where I can use my skills that way I can grow. Just got to get 1 foot in the door first lol
Hello...This is my first post ever because I have to share something with you guys.
I graduated from Parsons 2010 with a BFA in Architecture.
I have a year plus freelance experiences in professional practice and teaching.
I have a decent portfolio.
I'm Still looking for at least an internship position
Reality:
Architecture has the highest rate of unemployment in the US.
You need a Barch or March degree to compete for positions.
Firms frown on BFA graduates (with the exception of really small firms)
Solution:
Make sure you have a professional degree,
Make sure you have a superior skill set and is proven in your portfolio.
Advantage: LEED Certification.
I applied for grad school for fall 2012 and now I am enhancing my skills both technical and of course intellectual since I need to be visually and mentally ready for school again. 2 years is a darn long time. I was like a baby looking for job....crying for 4 hours and then sleep for 4 hours etc....
@sulidae I edited my about me section, should I go in that direction? Remember that I can't convey any real expertise(work experience) since I'm have not worked, And I will get rid of this archboy persona med mentioned to be more professional so the domain name will end up changing in the future...
Thanks for your feedback, it was very helpful and I will address those issues.
I have had similar feedback from others. Everyone keeps telling me my materials look good, so I don't know what the deal is. I think I just need to be a little aggressive and remain patient. I have a couple of possibilities that have been in limbo for a long time, one of them being almost a year, so I hope one of them works out. In the meantime, I have been working hard developing my portfolio and making new projects. Maybe you have some advice on how to approach and follow-up with people in an aggressive, yet professional way. I am always so hesitant about overly bugging people. I feel like it makes me look desperate and not professional.
@Archboy
I looked at your work also. I think your resume and letter need some work. I know you don't have any real work experience, but did you ever hold any responsiblities while in school, as in leading a project, organizing an event, or something related. As an advanced student in cermaics while in my undergrad, I had responsibilities in the studio. I had to make clay, glazes, assist beginning students, keep things clean, and load kilns. So, I listed this as an experience when I graduated and started looking for art jobs. And it helped! Even though it wasn't an acutual job, I did all those things on a regular basis for more than a year. So, be creative when writing your resume. Think of things like this you did in school and list it as an experience. Even if you worked at a sandwich shop, it could help. You have to have good communication skills, be able to multi-task, be organized. Right now, you don't have anything listed really. So this may be your trouble. Your cover letter also needs similar work. Talk about a project you worked on in school, why you enjoyed it so much and what you learned from it. If you traveled somewhere, talk about that. Make it more interesting and engaging. I hope this helps.
Your advice seems pretty good for those with little to no experience. If you have time, I'd appreciate any advice you might be able to offer regarding my portfolio/resume.
Ntawancy Archboy and others, congrats on having the courage to ask for help sometimes things get a little out of hand and brutal here.
On the issues of your portfolios you may want to go back and detail some things so that you can demonstrate you know or have an idea how the project might be built. The renderings are nice but can you demonstrate the knowledge to make it a reality? Try designing just a wall and all the stuff that needs to happen to make it safe durable and good to look at.
On experience I can say it is hard and unfair I have experience and I am under employed, but still doing design gigs some even architecture work with firms and professors. I am under employed but I am getting good at asking for work, don’t spend too much time on resume distribution and spend more time seeking out design problems.
Go and find work to do. Have a neighbor with a back yard build a patio, have a friend who has not arranged their furniture right go and do it for them, design competitions and the other thing I can suggest learn software at community college and then go to firms and offer to train part time the principal or staff. Your classmates might be your next boss.
Most firms don’t want employees they want solutions to their problems. My problem is I have grass to mow so I employ someone to mow it. Problem solution you have to become the solution. There are a lot of solutions out there and another huge tread can be started on that, but go out and ask for work ask for problems to solve, can I organize the archive, set up a meeting with a business that could use some renovation. This is how you get noticed and get in. Some small thing that you did to solve someone’s problem and repeat it a few times and they will want you because you are not a problem for them to solve you are a solution to their problems.
Let’s go back to your school for a moment. Did you leave on god terms? Are they building something on campus? Perhaps you can ask beg whatever to get invited to observe the construction as post graduate research, you meet contractors, architects and other powerful decision makers. Try it ask around get permission to sit in on a progress meeting or ask the superintendent or firm if you can tour the site when the architect makes their next field visit, just observe and take down names. Then call them or email and ask intelligent questions or make a suggestion if you think it would work. Some universities may have a program in place or they might want one after you bring it up. So ask get invited and show up. Solve problems with modesty and thought.
Directed to ntawancy, Archboy, Quentin, and others who have been searching for a long time:
I'm surprised that no one has suggested doing open competitions yet. There are lots of competitions for students and graduates who are not working in a professional environment :
If you graduated in 2009 / 2010 you *need* something fresh to show off. Participation in these competitions is pretty inexpensive and it gives you a chance to produce work quickly. It's also a great chance to learn a new set of skills (representation, layout, photoshop, rendering, whatever...)
I am wondering what those of you who say you have no experience mean... do you mean you have no relatable job experience whatsoever? Or just in architecture and design?
I looked at your website and resume, Nivine, and while your resume looks really good, I think your project images come across as a bit rough and they have a strong CG (computer generated) look to them. It's clear you have basic skills, as an entry level architect should have, but I would re-represent all my images (particularly the perspectives) to make them more eye catching, sensitive, and attractive. To me the perspectives all came across as quite dark in color and look a bit dull. Look at tutorials specifically on photoshop for visualisations like on http://www.vyonyx.com/index.php or http://www.alexhogrefe.com/...
Internships/entry level position
What do you do when you can't find Internships or entry level positions? What do you do when employers constantly ask for experience when you yourself have never worked(fresh out of college with no real world experience) I've been actively looking for almost 2 years now and no luck. Do I call it unfair? I don't want to be negative about the situation because I understand there are many qualified people(better portfolio etc) out there seeking jobs.... BUT
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How does someone get around these obstacles...what have I been doing wrong? I really need some advice guys.
you've done nothing wrong. this job market is terrible, and you are not alone. i hear stories like this all of the time and it makes me sad for all of my peers and colleagues. try contacting the university you graduated from and see if they have a system in place that can help. have you thought of travelling abroad?
I'm sorry you're have a rough go of it archboy. Have you tried expanding your horizons to other related fields like construction or even graphic design? I'm sure that the job market in the other fields aren't much better, but they can't be worse than architecture.
And kaiden is right. Check with your university to make sure that you are taking advantage of all the services they offer getting alumni jobs.
Thank you guys for the kind words it really means a lot...It's very tough my college has tried to help but to no avail...I'm also trying to look into other related field as well but it seems that because I lack experience in the working world it's hard to come by...
I'm in the exact same boat as you my friend. Graduated in 2009 and have yet to land an arch job. I’ve done a few contract drafting jobs, that’s it. You could/should try that if you can. I have a full time job outside of job as an analyst. I’m trying to use the skills I’ve learned this job as new skill set I can offer arch firms, but I don’t think they really care. Really I think it comes down to luck. Knowing the right person or just someone at a firm deciding to give you a chance. The whole thing is a catch 22. They want people with experience but no one wants to give you experience. Crappy job market, and it’s not getting any better. I applied for my M.Arch, and will try to go the grad school route to pass time. I’ve talked to old professors and plenty of architects they are just like “it’s tough out here”. They don’t have any real advice. I’ve been to AIA networking events, and they don’t have any real advice either or jobs.
It sucks, we picked the absolute worst time like EVER to graduate. And it only gets worst b/c we been out of school longer and longer now and have nothing to show for it!
:-(
Quentin: You were soliciting any advice, but be careful of the temptation to sit out the recession in grad school. Unless it is part of some greater career plan, it could end up being a very expensive hiding place. That debt will just be one additional burden. You need to view education as you would any other investment. What does it cost, and what do I get in return.
The cost of architecture school, especially a master's degree does not make a lot of financial sense in this job market. Geezerarchitect is 100% right. Your returns on a very sizable investment would be very, very small.
Interesting, "The cost of architecture school, especially a master's degree does not make a lot of financial sense in this job market." I hear this a lot especially where there are different types of Architectural degree where are specific one is needed. Ultimately in the end you feel like you can make any of these degree work for the purpose of Architecture... yet they don't see it that way, I guess they see the situation as a principal (if it says you must have this certain degree you must) .
With a masters it gives you a slight edge since there are job offers which only requires a masters @Queintin, if you want to make your passion into a reality you should go for it, I wish you luck.
I'm only going if I can get at least 50% financial aid. Also I only have a 4yr degree, so I'm at the bottom of the barell.
That's why I always tell people to go to a school they can afford to pay for.
Because it makes little difference in the profession.
You'd bre surprised how many very highly ranked and highly acclaimed public schools there are where you can pay in-state tuition (i.e. Cincinnati, Virginia Tech, Michigan, UCLA, Washington, Georgia Tech, Florida, etc)....
Furthermore, you'd be surprised how many high-end designers who are principals at reputable firms there are.... Just saying.
You get a lot of douches on this board who think that their livelihood are completely over if they didn't get into GSD, Columbia, Yale, AA, RISD, Penn, and such... And these are the same people who frown and look down upon people who did not attend one of these programs - just a word of advise - if that's your mentality - you have a very short career.
just thought I'd check in here. same boat. my profs and instructors have done all they can to help me as in giving me referrals and recommendations but in the end no one will hire because I don't have enough experience. the only way to get experience it seems, is to have a hook up from the inside, i.e. your parent's friends or your friend's parents... or take something unpaid, which only reinforces the notion of architecture being a gentleman's pursuit: I got bills to pay, man!
I'm also beginning to think it doesn't matter what school you go to; all that matters is experience. And since it takes experience to get experience....
Hey there. I am there also. I graduated with my MArch in 2010, and am still looking after almost two years. After I graduated, I used my family to connect me, but they are all in Egypt. Side note, I grew up in the states, but all my family is in Egypt except for my mom and siblings. I felt very fortunate at the time, since I got to go live in a whole new place and was working in architecture. With the revolution, I had to leave after only being there several months. It has now been almost a year since I have been back and barely without any real interviews.
You are not alone. Everyone keeps telling me to be persistent and patient, which I have been. BUT, I am running out of hope with finding work in architecture. I am actually completely unemployed. I haven't had luck finding a job doing anything. I even started applying to grocery stores and other retailers, but nothing in that either. I am just wanting to be a part of society again! It has been a vicious cycle for me, I am either over qualified, or not qualified enough. BLAH. I am just remaining hopeful and going to keep trying! It is no ones fault. The economy sucks and the people who did find jobs, were just lucky. They were at the right place at the right time....
ntawancy, archboy et al,
Times are very tough right now in architecture. You should be commended for your persistence.
But I caution you on developing the mentality that "it is the economy". Yes, the economy is very bad right now and architecture jobs are scare. But you should be able to find a job within the architecture field after two years. If you accept the condolences from others with stuff like "hang in there, the economy is awful. Don't give up. Be persistent" etc. --it can be dangerous. Sure it feels good to hear people's supportive thoughts.
But what you really need to be doing is finding out how you are representing yourself in portfolio, written and spoken word and get feedback on how you can improve. You need to be asking for feedback on how you can approach your job hunting more effectively.
Talk to your schools. Although I do think many schools have a huge gap of knowledge when it comes to making the transition from academic to professional. But talk to your schools as a starting point and get feedback on your portfolio, cover letter and resume from many, many different sources. It needs to be one package that reads clearly and cohesively. Get feedback from architecture professors who are also practicing architects. Get feedback from your peers who were able to successfully land positions. Get feedback from classmates several years ahead of you who have been in the job market for several years.
Ask if any professors need additional jury members for upcoming crits. A great way to network is sitting on a jury and allowing other professionals to see and hear how you speak and think and relate to others. It will also help keep your energy fresh and engaged when you are applying for jobs. Ask if there are any summer TA positions for recent grads to help out with the summer arch program that your school runs. Chase after those opportunities. Write a paper and try to get accepted at one of the many "sustainable architecture / technology" conferences held thru out the year. It is relatively easy to "get published" by these types of conferences if you can write well and have good research skills. This is a great way to network with professors and professionals, i.e. you are writing a paper about thermal bridging and would love to be able to speak with xyz architect about their building that was recently awarded LEED Unobtainium.....or whatever the topic might be.
So yes, hang in there. Keep your energy fresh and positive. But the biggest thing is that you are going to have to change before the economy does. The economy isn't going to change anytime soon, but the beauty of being human is that we can change and evolve on a dime.....
Hang tough and good luck!
My dad always say "you have to get people to know you." goes back to what lance smith said about getting hooked up this is actually one of the realities...
Great advice sulidae12, networking seems to be one of the major step in all this, spread your name to get enough recognition. I'm glad you mention the steps to go about this.
@ sulidae12
Thank for your feedback. I have done everything you mentioned. Attended lectures, events, and so on. Networked my heart out. My school and the people there have been completely useless. Students and faculty. None of the professors are working in the profession. They are strictly academics. Anytime I asked someone to critique my portfolio, resume and letters, they just nod and say this is good, you'll find something right away. I know there must be something wrong with what I am doing. I also think it's crazy it's been two years and still searching... Would you be willing to rip my materials apart. This is what I need! Let me know if you have time to do this. Thanks!
ntawancy, where do you live?
I hate to sound overtly optimistic but hiring is going on in several regions.
My firm has been on a hiring spree since February 2011 (hired around 1000 people firmwide - no exaggeration!) I think that has subsided a little but other firms in my city also seem to be hiring. the job boards definitely look far more promising than they did in 2008/2009. I don't hear as much these days about mass layoffs.
I was laid off of my job last January and rebounded very quickly.
@med, I am in Chicago.... I am considering leaving and going somewhere that seems more promising to give a shot. What firm are you with and where? I can check it out.
I'm in Washington DC. Not saying this is the premier market or anything, but there is more construction here right now than many other cities. And consequently more firms are hiring.
The firm I'm with? Let's just say it's a global behemoth also known to tread water with the rise and fall of the economic tide. Our hiring spree wasn't because of an economic surge rather it was because we successfully competed within the marketshare. And that means competing on a lot of the work that other firms go after for even lower fees. It's worked pretty decently I must say and the firm has a reasonably nice shrewd business model.
We have an office in your city.
Same boat unfortunatly! I have been looking for 8 months. My portfolio is very good, and I have great references, but none of that matters because employers want workers that they do not have to spend time and money training. They can do this because of good old supply and demand. The economy is a mess right now and no one wants to hire people with little experiance when people with lots of experiance are plentiful. The problem in this field is a lack of upward mobility and a reliance on others to pursue ones career. If like in Law, you could take a test and have a title that is valuable, then we would be in control of our own destiny and have the option of doing freelance work, but rather we must rely on our competition to "help" us get licenced and move ahead. It is bullshit. Not to say that If we all had a licence it would be easy, there is still little demand out there, but at least we would be in control of our own future and our careers would not be blocked by the inability of others to hire us. This is a frusturating position to be in. There is something fundamentally wrong with this profession when hard work and talent only get you to a road block that must be overcome by connections and luck inorder to go foward. Young talent is being stiffled by this ridgid system at a time when it is needed most in this profession.
@ntawancy if New York is one of your choices I'd say good luck because it's horrible here...Right now i'm applying for positions different from architecture and I actually just got back 1 hour prior from this msg from an interview in retail...its like my resume can't get me an architecture job at the same time it's denying me from getting other jobs outside architecture lol... the question always is "why aren't you looking for architectural position and you should try and stay on that path" it was the same question when i also interviewed for office assistant jobs long ago....no experience is such a burden
I just wanna touch on what @sulidae12 mentioned, because I think it's really important to not get too caught up in the "the economy sucks" mode and use it as a crutch... which is real easy to do. Even worse when all your friends around you are getting jobs via connections!
So far I haven't sent the same resume more than twice. I'm constantly revising it and thinking about how to make the experiences I do have more related and adaptable to what firms are looking for these days, and/or to specific jobs, that sometimes aren't even arch/design related.
I'd bet that outside of Arch departments, schools have some sort of career center... that would be willing to help alumni. At University of Washington, this service is free and they constantly offer work shops and all that stuff... even meet and greets.
There has *got* to be a way to make your past experiences, or even experiences in studio, employable... even if it's not an arch firm. I mean we didn't spend 36 hour school days doing nothing, right?
I guess I don't mean this as any formula for success, cause here I am still looking (ha) but I think for now... it is OK to look outside the box and be flexible on what kind of jobs are out there.
Visualization? Project Management?
In the end though, I think we'll come out on top. People who get hook ups can't develop job search skills... and those connections won't be around forever. They'll never learn how to sell themselves, or even put together a resume....
...which before now was just like 10 minutes in Word, OK, write a bunch of crap down.
But currently it's been an on going process, I've probably worked on it for a month, now. Maybe that's what it takes....
ntawancy,
I'll walk my talk. Can you post your portoflio, resume and cover letter to issuu.com? You can do a private upload and just send me the link. I'll keep your identity confidential or you can just black out your name, contact info, etc.
I'd prefer to keep my email address confidential. Is there a way you can send me the link via archinect? Didn't architect allow that in the past?? Let me know via archinect if you send me something. I think my account is linked to an email that I don't check frequently.
-Sulidae
@med, what DC firms are hiring like crazy? I live just outisdide of DC and have been looking for 2 years now. It's not that rosey.
No offence, quinten but I ha ve no idea what your situation is.
I had friends just move in from San Fran who got jobs within 1 week (both have about 4-6 years of experience.
I was laid off from my behemoth corporate firm in January 2011 and then started working (within 1 week) for a mid-size DC firm for about 3 months before I realized that it sucked donkey balls then annother sorporate behemoth that happened to be on a major hiring spree over the spring and summer hired me. I'm been there since.
Other firms also wanted me to join but I had already accepted my job so there was plenty of work. I mean look around DC, there is construction everywhere. I have no idea why you have had no luck.
For what it's worth I do staffing/recruiting. You can send me a private email to let me review what you have and what your approach has been.
Gensler was on a hiring spree from the spring to fall of 2011. Over 100 people hired in the office during that time period. I think that has ended for now.
Shalom Barnes is still hiring - a lot of projects have been awarded to them.
Check Smithgroup., RTKL, ZGF, HOK they have had some key project wins lately.
Stay away from AECOM. It's ugly there.
It's true - you really need to go on the "campaign trail" and get yourself elected - it is contact, contact and contact - and learn the latest social networking tools if you have not done already.
Yes - networking is also key! And I don't just mean having a linked in profile.
I have witnessed a lot of architects act like self-righteous assholes within the profession. Especially young people who think that being in asshole = looking like they have confidence. this is a critical error in judgement that many make both at the entry level and in school. Little do they realize that when the axe fall -= they will in most cases be victims and when it comes to looking for work they will be turned away.
I've seen people who were complete jerkoffs to me in other firms (for no reason other than arrogance) only get laid off later on down the stretch and then come to the firm I was work at. I always like the "oh fuck" expression when they notice that I'm there reviewing their work.
It's a very small profession. really hope none of you guys are like that.
It's ALL about being nice and professional professional professional!
" Little do they realize that when the axe fall -= they will in most cases be victims and when it comes to looking for work they will be turned away."
this is true - I have seen it - attitude will get you the folder when the project goes on hold
I think having the 4-6 years of experience helps tons. I barely have one year within architecture and 2-3 within design, but most places want you to have 3 years of experience within an architecture firm. Landing work at the entry level is very tough right now...
@sulidae12 - I have a website you can visit that has everything.
http://nivinetawancy.com
Very nice work Ntawancy...There are so many people here with such beautiful work and I'm so amazed they are having a hard time landing work, at times I even get jealous because what chance do I have when there are so many more people who's qualified... lol I know I shouldn't be thinking that way but i can't help it... im not whining so please don't get mad at me.
Below is a link to my portfolio and only experience I basically have is college experience
One thing I really want to improve is my board presentations my work never usually shows visual impact... none of the work on my portfolio is set up as board presentations just to let you know.
http://archboy.wordpress.com/about/
out of the 200 - 300 applicants, 2% will meet the technical requirements - then there is the office cultural aspect.
archboy,
I'm working late tonight but will try to provide feedback on your website later,
ntawancy ,
you must be getting many people trying to view your site because I can't get on to the site, even from my work computer. Will try later.
I echo med's comments. I work for one of the smaller 'corporate firms'. They have some office locations that are hurting but others are in hirng sprees. Many firms in my area are hiring as well. My firm's location brought on 10 interns with little to no experience in the last 2 months.
more soon,
Sulidae
ntawancy,
Thank you for sharing your lovely website. There is absolutely no reason why you should not be employed.
You express yourself very well in written word. Your resume displays a strong graphic sensibility and an ability to edit. This are important qualities to have as a growing architectural intern.
You come across as confident, smart and capable and quite frankly a solid candiate for a beginner intern position.
Things you can do to strengthen the way you are perceived:
1. It took forever to load your website. If you are using your website as an application tool, chances are many people are simply not considering you because the loading time is so slow. I only looked at two projects, your resume and the 'about' section. But it was painful to have to wait for the site to load. What are you using to create your website? Wix.com perhaps? Be careful. Load times that you experience are different than what others experience because you have cached information on your computer. Make sure you have downsized your images to the appropriate pixel size for your website viewing. Get rid of as much weight as you can to improve viewing performance. Ask friends and family who have never seen your website to view it and see what their load times are like. go to a local library and hop on a computer and see how others may be viewing your site.
2. Small graphic suggestions: Your graphic sensibility is strong enough that you can loose the color bar and rectangle line work around your name. Let your name be black or grey and perhaps kern the font out a bit and let your name express itself cleanly. You express yourself strongly in written text. Let your name be expressed clearly and strongly too. The color bar and black line rectangle is too "student like". It reads like an architecture student that is trying to be more graphically interesting when really, you want let the work read first. Let the work read first, let the white space support it. Nothing more.
3. While the perspectives show some graphic competence, they all become monotanous when viewing because they are all kind the same style and tone. In fact all the projects come across as kinda the same. What doesn't leap out is your design ability, your intellect, your process, your thinking, your instincts. What doesn't come across is that you have an understanding that in this one image, it says "this is what the project is about" and in that one image you have layers of the buildingscape, the landscape, the urbanscape, the peoplescape, etc. Perspectives don't have to have advanced graphic skills to be this immediate and informative.
4. Lack of process work and diagrams - sometimes in a quest to come off as accomplished or polished, we can edit out the very qualities that make our work unique and full of energy. You seem to possess such a strong art background. I believe you are smart enough and capable enough to choose wisely to show your handwork and other artistic abilities in a way that demonstrates you have mind, eye, hand coordination, i.e. you have the abilty to think and to express your ideas in sketch or other media forms. You must strive to show your process more. Your work is a void without it. You can do this without cluttering your clean aesthetic. Go to a bookstore in the arch section and look at architcture books from firms and architects you admire. Study how they lay out their books. Study how they use a full saturated bleed image against open white space. Study how a fully digital rendering or photograph is much more powerful when coupled with a small process sketch that shows evidence of the human hand.
5. Acknowledge the context of your work. I may not have seen it but I couldn't easily understand if I was looking at student work or professional work etc. The quality was low enough that I suspected it was all student projects but who knows since there was nothing online to help a viewer understand the context of the work shown.
6. Highlight your computer skills more. Firms wnt to hire people that have the full package of ACAD, Revit, Adobe Creative Suite, 3dmax, rhino, sketchup, yada, yada yada.
Highlight your computer skills and equally important, highlight that you have made the transition from student work to professional work with regards to computer experience. Often times students will say yes they know revit, but they have only used a very limited portion of revit for student projects and they have not worked with revit in a collaborative environment. Firms want to know applicants understand the difference between student computer experience and professional experience. There is a big different between "I know Revit" and " I provided Revit documentation support at the 50% and 100% DD deadlines on a 250K gsf university research facility."
7. I think you should enter some competitions to improve your overall portfolio. Student work is hard to develop fully under deadlines and time constraints. Take everything you have learned and enter a competition and use it to strenghten your communication skills via diagramming, processwork and more fully articulated perspectives that show evidence of design intent.
k,
excuse all my spelling errors, I was typing fast. sorry too for the length. That's my initial impression of looking at your website. Others?
-Sulidae
ntawancy,
I just looked at your website again on a home computer. Its loaded very quickly. It seems like the speed issue was just a fluke, just fYI,
Sulidae
alright archboy,
I cruised thru your website. Thanks so much for sharing.
First off, there are many people out there with alot more experience and skills than you who have not done what you have done, i.e. gather up all your work, organize it and present it the best you can. For that, good job. Good indication of tenacity and follow thru.
But archboy, being blunt it might be hard for you to find a position in architecture or any field with the way you are presenting yourself. You definitely need to get career counseling advice on ways to strengthen your writing skills. If your school isn't up to par, research local organizations that might be able to give you some support. Friends with older brother and sisters who are in the working world could be a good resource too. It might be good to focus on just getting some foundational work experience that will allow you to grow and develop personally and professionally.
You seem like a very nice personable person. You seem to thrive in outreach environments, i.e. tutoring, helping your art instructor.
You could look into jobs or volunteer opportunities thru habitat for humanity or other construction related jobs that focus on youth and mentoring. This could be an area that you would excel at. There could be opportunities for you to take a leadership position via Americorps, etc., There could be high school programs that are looking for computer tutors, etc.
I would also encourage you to visit other schools in the NY area and see as much student work as you can. Pratt, Columbia, Parsons will all have final reviews in the Spring. It will be good to gain exposure to the breadth and range of other student work.
Don't put false pressure on yourself that you cannot find a job in the architecture field. You should feel great that you accomplished getting your Bachelor of Technology. I would focus on getting a job that will support you financially and that you can spend a couple years developing and maturing.
On your own time, you could enter competitions and continue to hone your graphic and communication skills if your passion for architecture is still driving you. But give yourself a couple years to just work and grow and be open to many career paths.
Again, thank you very much for sharing. One of the most important things to do to break out of a rut and grow and evolve etc. is to share and seek out feedback. So you are on the right track!
Other thoughts from archinectors?
Sulidae.
Archboy, here is the thing..... Not in anyway am I trying to sound incendiary but the way you present yourself must improve based on what I read from your website.
You can just do away with the whole "Arch-boy" thing on your blurb. You are a man and a professional so there is no reason to put that kind of front up. You will find that archtiects are reasonably professional and are always impressed when they see a candidate giving a great impression on them.
The tone of your cover letter sounds appologetic with a hint of "woe is me" mentality. This needs to go away - you should never appologize for something that is out of your hands. Everyone starts at the entry level and they can use your talents and abilities in other areas - (i.e. fast photoshop skills, renderings, digital models, etc). Meantime you will be trained on how to do the technical stuff. Anyone can learn how to do CDs. It's something where the more you do it, the better you will get. Do NOT appologize for the lack of experience and do NOT EVER EVER sound pessimistic, negative, or bitter in your cover letter. This instantly guarantees your resume a spot in the wastebasket.
Mechanically, your punctuation and grammar needs work in your cover letter. Two spaces after a period - this is cursory knowledge that people on archinect shouldn't have to tell you.
Your work is fine (the drawings are very clear and illustrate your knowledge of how to draw) and your renderings look great but you need to really show more of those in a sexy kind of way.
I'm just going to jump in and offer the dissenting opinion on the two spaces after a period; one is enough.
I appreciate the feedback guys :D
Oh I thought I edited above statement. Thanks again, you know a professor told me to write with a little sense of humor so I was going In that direction "employers likes to see the humor in people." this is what was said. I agree with my writing since I've heard this before and know that I need to improve on it so thanks for the in depth post Sulidae and Med. Going back to what sulidae said I know what your saying about developing more even if I can't get into architecture now I just want to find something where I can use my skills that way I can grow. Just got to get 1 foot in the door first lol
Hello...This is my first post ever because I have to share something with you guys.
I graduated from Parsons 2010 with a BFA in Architecture.
I have a year plus freelance experiences in professional practice and teaching.
I have a decent portfolio.
I'm Still looking for at least an internship position
Reality:
Architecture has the highest rate of unemployment in the US.
You need a Barch or March degree to compete for positions.
Firms frown on BFA graduates (with the exception of really small firms)
Solution:
Make sure you have a professional degree,
Make sure you have a superior skill set and is proven in your portfolio.
Advantage: LEED Certification.
I applied for grad school for fall 2012 and now I am enhancing my skills both technical and of course intellectual since I need to be visually and mentally ready for school again. 2 years is a darn long time. I was like a baby looking for job....crying for 4 hours and then sleep for 4 hours etc....
@sulidae I edited my about me section, should I go in that direction? Remember that I can't convey any real expertise(work experience) since I'm have not worked, And I will get rid of this archboy persona med mentioned to be more professional so the domain name will end up changing in the future...
@sulidae
Thanks for your feedback, it was very helpful and I will address those issues.
I have had similar feedback from others. Everyone keeps telling me my materials look good, so I don't know what the deal is. I think I just need to be a little aggressive and remain patient. I have a couple of possibilities that have been in limbo for a long time, one of them being almost a year, so I hope one of them works out. In the meantime, I have been working hard developing my portfolio and making new projects. Maybe you have some advice on how to approach and follow-up with people in an aggressive, yet professional way. I am always so hesitant about overly bugging people. I feel like it makes me look desperate and not professional.
@Archboy
I looked at your work also. I think your resume and letter need some work. I know you don't have any real work experience, but did you ever hold any responsiblities while in school, as in leading a project, organizing an event, or something related. As an advanced student in cermaics while in my undergrad, I had responsibilities in the studio. I had to make clay, glazes, assist beginning students, keep things clean, and load kilns. So, I listed this as an experience when I graduated and started looking for art jobs. And it helped! Even though it wasn't an acutual job, I did all those things on a regular basis for more than a year. So, be creative when writing your resume. Think of things like this you did in school and list it as an experience. Even if you worked at a sandwich shop, it could help. You have to have good communication skills, be able to multi-task, be organized. Right now, you don't have anything listed really. So this may be your trouble. Your cover letter also needs similar work. Talk about a project you worked on in school, why you enjoyed it so much and what you learned from it. If you traveled somewhere, talk about that. Make it more interesting and engaging. I hope this helps.
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med. & all others,
Your advice seems pretty good for those with little to no experience. If you have time, I'd appreciate any advice you might be able to offer regarding my portfolio/resume.
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/michael-shuell/6/97b/167
Thanks
Ntawancy Archboy and others, congrats on having the courage to ask for help sometimes things get a little out of hand and brutal here.
On the issues of your portfolios you may want to go back and detail some things so that you can demonstrate you know or have an idea how the project might be built. The renderings are nice but can you demonstrate the knowledge to make it a reality? Try designing just a wall and all the stuff that needs to happen to make it safe durable and good to look at.
On experience I can say it is hard and unfair I have experience and I am under employed, but still doing design gigs some even architecture work with firms and professors. I am under employed but I am getting good at asking for work, don’t spend too much time on resume distribution and spend more time seeking out design problems.
Go and find work to do. Have a neighbor with a back yard build a patio, have a friend who has not arranged their furniture right go and do it for them, design competitions and the other thing I can suggest learn software at community college and then go to firms and offer to train part time the principal or staff. Your classmates might be your next boss.
Most firms don’t want employees they want solutions to their problems. My problem is I have grass to mow so I employ someone to mow it. Problem solution you have to become the solution. There are a lot of solutions out there and another huge tread can be started on that, but go out and ask for work ask for problems to solve, can I organize the archive, set up a meeting with a business that could use some renovation. This is how you get noticed and get in. Some small thing that you did to solve someone’s problem and repeat it a few times and they will want you because you are not a problem for them to solve you are a solution to their problems.
Let’s go back to your school for a moment. Did you leave on god terms? Are they building something on campus? Perhaps you can ask beg whatever to get invited to observe the construction as post graduate research, you meet contractors, architects and other powerful decision makers. Try it ask around get permission to sit in on a progress meeting or ask the superintendent or firm if you can tour the site when the architect makes their next field visit, just observe and take down names. Then call them or email and ask intelligent questions or make a suggestion if you think it would work. Some universities may have a program in place or they might want one after you bring it up. So ask get invited and show up. Solve problems with modesty and thought.
Directed to ntawancy, Archboy, Quentin, and others who have been searching for a long time:
I'm surprised that no one has suggested doing open competitions yet. There are lots of competitions for students and graduates who are not working in a professional environment :
www.bustler.net
http://www.ac-ca.org/en/home
http://www.anonymousd.com/
http://www.awrcompetitions.com/
If you graduated in 2009 / 2010 you *need* something fresh to show off. Participation in these competitions is pretty inexpensive and it gives you a chance to produce work quickly. It's also a great chance to learn a new set of skills (representation, layout, photoshop, rendering, whatever...)
I am wondering what those of you who say you have no experience mean... do you mean you have no relatable job experience whatsoever? Or just in architecture and design?
I looked at your website and resume, Nivine, and while your resume looks really good, I think your project images come across as a bit rough and they have a strong CG (computer generated) look to them. It's clear you have basic skills, as an entry level architect should have, but I would re-represent all my images (particularly the perspectives) to make them more eye catching, sensitive, and attractive. To me the perspectives all came across as quite dark in color and look a bit dull. Look at tutorials specifically on photoshop for visualisations like on http://www.vyonyx.com/index.php or http://www.alexhogrefe.com/...
I wish you all luck!
very interesting share Stephanie, especially the alexhogrefe website!
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