so...I have been working on a restaurant in Los Angeles for the past 3 years as designer and now project architect.
My office isnt doing well financially at all.
I am planning to move to Seattle in the near future.
The office is planning to go to 4 day weeks in June, basically giving me a $10,000 pay cut. I cant afford to live in LA on a 4 day a week salary but I would like to stay and see the restaurant through completion in September (it would be a great piece for my portfolio as I want to continue restaurant design in the future).
I do...its just that the restaurant is a 4000sq ft outdoor dining establishment and is gonna be nice...I may just fly back to LA after it is done and take pics
i personally think it would be great to work 4 day weeks and do what dml suggested... get a bar tending job at a local corner place... do they have corner bars in LA? i dunno... but if they do... one of them must need some help...
if you know it's only going to be 3 months at reduced salary before you move, then find a part-time gig like others have said and just stick to your timetable. should be able to pick up some work that'll make up the $800/m difference shouldn't you?
plus it'll give you time to do a proper search for the right job in seattle. that's always been a big thing for me - finding the right employer whenever i switch jobs, and not just taking what's available. use that extra day to work, but basically as your own recruiter.
Mdler, stay. This project seems pretty important, and it's only a few more months.
Get a second job, whatever it is.
I waited tables for three years between school and my first architecture job, and it was great. (It took several years before my professional salary would match what I made working 20 hours a week at a swanky place just up the street from the Ivy. Actually, I worked at the Ivy for six of the longest weeks of my life, but that's another story....)
Those jobs are plum and highly sought-after, though, so don't set your sights unreasonably, unless you have experience. How about Barnes and Noble, Coffee Bean, whichever? Stay and get that restaurant under your belt, then head for Raintown.
if you want to stay in restaurant design it sounds like bar/restaurant experience would be both fun AND educational/useful, unless you have already reached your tolerance for that kind of work. in which case it would be hell.
it'll reflect really well when job hunting in seattle that you:
a) stuck it out through construction not leaving your office and client when they needed you.
b) you won't have to deal with the possible impression that you bailed to avoid the inevitable construction problems.
c) you'll have a complete project to take with you when looking for a new job.
Interesting, I was in a very similar situation last year. Office was having trouble making payroll, I desperately wanted to stay and see my years of work pay off in good pictures... I stayed as long as I could on one project (till punchlist time) and took off in the middle of the rest. I couldn't afford to wait around, and it wasn't going to get better. I have gone back and gotten pretty good pictures of most everything however, and maintained a good enough relationship with the firm to ask for some photos here and there. I'm glad I got out. For you, in this market, you have to consider that if you wait until September there may not *be* any jobs in Seattle for you. Personally, I would leave.
On the other hand, if this is your ONE AND ONLY restaurant project that can go into your portfolio, then perhaps it's worth staying for. I had a couple other similar projects to help pad out the portfolio in the direction I wanted to get a job in, so that helped quite a bit.
I had a guy in front of me at the gas pumps yesterday driving a chevy suburaban, he told me it had a 40 gallon gas tank. So he was looking at $152.00 fill up. Now that is scarry!
maybe you could talk them into letting your work five days a week
instood of four and just come in later and leave earlier. Then you
could walk or bike to work and save all that gas money.
dude. if the place is going to be cool, you'd be wise to stay and finish it if possible.
i can't second the above comment enough that said working in a restaurant will help you along the way in designing them.
it goes without saying, obviously right?
but the truth is: most architects think they can design a restaurant simply because they eat in them.
unfortunately, most architects are wrong on that one. i know you've got some hospitality experience, but you could have some fun and learn some more by picking up a job as a food-runner, busboy or potwasher.
you're not really in the busy season though, and a job for a short-timer might not be as easy as it sounds unless you stick to some low-key places.
better yet - work as a barback. the money's great!
mdler, everyone has their own circumstances and prioritiesm but if it were me, i'd find temp work and see the restaurant through before abandoning ship...
if you still like L.A. and want to stay, just to be clear, going to the four day work week in June is just officially one month right? it'd only be like a $10,000 pay cut if the four day work week extends to the rest of the 12 month year, right? (I'm assuming that you don't make $50,000 in the month of June...)
it might not be a bad move to try a change, but if you can stick it out, find a part time job outside of that 4 day week, it might be worth it... not sure if the math is right, but sticking it out til September sound like it's only really at most a $833 a month x 4 months = $3333 bullet total assuming that they keep the 4 day work week from June through September (when the project will be finished)... If you can make that sum of money doing a side job over 4 months, you'll be no worse off...
and you can always start applying, build a portfolio while working, but I wouldn't move without having a job lined up before you relocate... Seattle is expensive too, definitely if you are having trouble finding work here...
But if your reason to move is really more that you just want a change, and don't want to live in L.A. anymore because of the livability and affordability issue generally, that's a different story...
I have no desire to live in LA any more. Also, we are now thinking that the restaurant wont be opening until December. There are no decisions being made by the client (he wont let us make design decisions any more and is completely micro-managing the project)
I have basically become a mediator/shrink for all parties involved. I basically spend an hour on the phone with the construction manager telling me how he hates the operator and then an afternoon with the operator telling me how he is pissed off that the owner didnt ask for his imput and how he is either going to kill himself or move out of the country. The owner then refuses to make any decisions...I then have to come back to my office and have my boss bitch to me that I spend too much time dealing with these people (some of whom he doesnt like)
Anyways, I am planning on leaving and letting them figure it out.
I would take the opportunity of the four-day weeks to use the extra day for portfolio updating, resume sending, calling offices in Seattle, and at some point heading up for interviewing and/or apartment hunting. Use the time to get your shit together for the move.
well woohoo. Then your extra day off each of the next few weeks should be no problem: planning a move can get out of hand, time-wise. I highly recommend the north ravenna/roosevelt area, there's a nice little community being assembled here lately.
mdler.....if it can't be done in a month bail. We had a new restaurant project walk into our office about three weeks ago.
It is almost a total gut and redo. Fortunately for us we have
some good energy with the Clients. It is funny because we
did the existing restaurant 3 years ago and as you know all things
change in this business. The former owner gave us a sparkling reccomendation. The new owners were eager to have someone on board before the closing and we seemed to be the most logical. We
gave them a price for the architectural aspect of the job they didn't bat and eye. Before you know it my Mrs....is doing the Logo for the place, and the Exterior Signage, and the Menus. She is in Fat Heaven!
This is where she really shines. Mighty Might can only appreciate the conversations which take place about food and menus. The amazing thing is they will be up and running in less than three weeks from today. So we made money on the Architectural Part of the Job and the Graphics income was a bonus. There are lots of reasons to work with bad clients, but I can't find one for you. Go get your flying wings wet in the Northwest.
One of the clients (who is FUCKING CRAZY) wants me to now work for free on the project. He feels that if I really want my design opinion felt I should provide them with free drawings (even though I know that he is going to design it the way that he wants to anyways). I actually feel unconfortable around this guy (to the point that I wish that I had a gun when meeting with him - no joke)
Anyways, my name aint on the door of the office....
Get the fuck out of there, ASAP. If Seattle is where your heart is (I can't blame you there -- the Pacific Northwest is fucking beautiful), then don't waste any more time trying to get there. This is what awaits you:
This time last year I had just decided to move from Chicago back to NYC, even though the "sensible" thing to do would have been to stay in Chicago for another year and finish my BA degree and save up some more money. But NYC had been calling me for over a year, and I couldn't put it off any longer... And I haven't regretted it for a second. Don't burn any bridges, mind you, but follow your heart, and make no apologies for it.
Do you already have a job in Seattle lined up, or a place to live?
I have a place to stay for a while and have a couple of interviewish-like-meetings lined up for this weekend
I just found out that a well respected architect walked off of a job for the same restaurant clients that I am now working for (on thier previous restaurant)
my dilema...
so...I have been working on a restaurant in Los Angeles for the past 3 years as designer and now project architect.
My office isnt doing well financially at all.
I am planning to move to Seattle in the near future.
The office is planning to go to 4 day weeks in June, basically giving me a $10,000 pay cut. I cant afford to live in LA on a 4 day a week salary but I would like to stay and see the restaurant through completion in September (it would be a great piece for my portfolio as I want to continue restaurant design in the future).
what should I do?
man-whore
If the restaurant can fill a 5-day week, why not ask to stay 5-day. But tell them your whole story first.
garpike
it really cant, which is the problem
Leave. after 3 years you should have enough to put a portfolio page together
TD
I do...its just that the restaurant is a 4000sq ft outdoor dining establishment and is gonna be nice...I may just fly back to LA after it is done and take pics
go freelance on the side.
Get a part time gig as a barista, bartender, or waiter (free food) on the weekends...
Valet at the Ivy.
Oh, if that's an option, take off.
i personally think it would be great to work 4 day weeks and do what dml suggested... get a bar tending job at a local corner place... do they have corner bars in LA? i dunno... but if they do... one of them must need some help...
if you know it's only going to be 3 months at reduced salary before you move, then find a part-time gig like others have said and just stick to your timetable. should be able to pick up some work that'll make up the $800/m difference shouldn't you?
plus it'll give you time to do a proper search for the right job in seattle. that's always been a big thing for me - finding the right employer whenever i switch jobs, and not just taking what's available. use that extra day to work, but basically as your own recruiter.
Mdler, stay. This project seems pretty important, and it's only a few more months.
Get a second job, whatever it is.
I waited tables for three years between school and my first architecture job, and it was great. (It took several years before my professional salary would match what I made working 20 hours a week at a swanky place just up the street from the Ivy. Actually, I worked at the Ivy for six of the longest weeks of my life, but that's another story....)
Those jobs are plum and highly sought-after, though, so don't set your sights unreasonably, unless you have experience. How about Barnes and Noble, Coffee Bean, whichever? Stay and get that restaurant under your belt, then head for Raintown.
Good luck!
Do you still have any good working organs left, mdler?
i have one, ether....
if you want to stay in restaurant design it sounds like bar/restaurant experience would be both fun AND educational/useful, unless you have already reached your tolerance for that kind of work. in which case it would be hell.
definitely stay and get a second job if need be.
it'll reflect really well when job hunting in seattle that you:
a) stuck it out through construction not leaving your office and client when they needed you.
b) you won't have to deal with the possible impression that you bailed to avoid the inevitable construction problems.
c) you'll have a complete project to take with you when looking for a new job.
do you know why your office isn't doing well?
working for friends and not charging clients for work = no $$$
ouch.
sorry.
then put it to good use. outside the box, mdler (or in it if you must)...
I do have a recently divorced former client worth about $250,000,000...
if i were you i would move into tumbles place and be her manservant/dogwalker/whateverelsesheneedsgiver...
i met with a potential client going through a divorce that i wish was worth that.
any red flags there?
vado
I did...she told me to move out...single again!!!!!!!!!!
What does your sister charge you to sleep on her couch?
not much...$350 a month
So what the heck is so expensive about living in LA....if your paying $350 a month for housing? That price is even better than Rust Belt
Living.
snook
it is that combined with everything else...and $4 gas
Ya have to quit drinking those expensive bottles of wine for the next three months...and take the bus to work or car pool.
Get a job at Boston Market - that oughta hold ya for a while
Interesting, I was in a very similar situation last year. Office was having trouble making payroll, I desperately wanted to stay and see my years of work pay off in good pictures... I stayed as long as I could on one project (till punchlist time) and took off in the middle of the rest. I couldn't afford to wait around, and it wasn't going to get better. I have gone back and gotten pretty good pictures of most everything however, and maintained a good enough relationship with the firm to ask for some photos here and there. I'm glad I got out. For you, in this market, you have to consider that if you wait until September there may not *be* any jobs in Seattle for you. Personally, I would leave.
On the other hand, if this is your ONE AND ONLY restaurant project that can go into your portfolio, then perhaps it's worth staying for. I had a couple other similar projects to help pad out the portfolio in the direction I wanted to get a job in, so that helped quite a bit.
newsflash...gas is pushing 4 bucks everywhere. i paid 3.80 on friday...
I had a guy in front of me at the gas pumps yesterday driving a chevy suburaban, he told me it had a 40 gallon gas tank. So he was looking at $152.00 fill up. Now that is scarry!
moonlight more than just your design skills.
maybe you could talk them into letting your work five days a week
instood of four and just come in later and leave earlier. Then you
could walk or bike to work and save all that gas money.
snook_dude
I cant walk or bike to work ;(
Sorry Dude.....I walk out of the bedroom to my office everyday. It is about a total of twenty steps.
dude. if the place is going to be cool, you'd be wise to stay and finish it if possible.
i can't second the above comment enough that said working in a restaurant will help you along the way in designing them.
it goes without saying, obviously right?
but the truth is: most architects think they can design a restaurant simply because they eat in them.
unfortunately, most architects are wrong on that one. i know you've got some hospitality experience, but you could have some fun and learn some more by picking up a job as a food-runner, busboy or potwasher.
you're not really in the busy season though, and a job for a short-timer might not be as easy as it sounds unless you stick to some low-key places.
better yet - work as a barback. the money's great!
"Hello my name is MDLER, can I take your order?"
mdler, everyone has their own circumstances and prioritiesm but if it were me, i'd find temp work and see the restaurant through before abandoning ship...
if you still like L.A. and want to stay, just to be clear, going to the four day work week in June is just officially one month right? it'd only be like a $10,000 pay cut if the four day work week extends to the rest of the 12 month year, right? (I'm assuming that you don't make $50,000 in the month of June...)
it might not be a bad move to try a change, but if you can stick it out, find a part time job outside of that 4 day week, it might be worth it... not sure if the math is right, but sticking it out til September sound like it's only really at most a $833 a month x 4 months = $3333 bullet total assuming that they keep the 4 day work week from June through September (when the project will be finished)... If you can make that sum of money doing a side job over 4 months, you'll be no worse off...
and you can always start applying, build a portfolio while working, but I wouldn't move without having a job lined up before you relocate... Seattle is expensive too, definitely if you are having trouble finding work here...
But if your reason to move is really more that you just want a change, and don't want to live in L.A. anymore because of the livability and affordability issue generally, that's a different story...
bRink
I have no desire to live in LA any more. Also, we are now thinking that the restaurant wont be opening until December. There are no decisions being made by the client (he wont let us make design decisions any more and is completely micro-managing the project)
I have basically become a mediator/shrink for all parties involved. I basically spend an hour on the phone with the construction manager telling me how he hates the operator and then an afternoon with the operator telling me how he is pissed off that the owner didnt ask for his imput and how he is either going to kill himself or move out of the country. The owner then refuses to make any decisions...I then have to come back to my office and have my boss bitch to me that I spend too much time dealing with these people (some of whom he doesnt like)
Anyways, I am planning on leaving and letting them figure it out.
Seattle is calling!!!!!
btw
LA is too fucking hot now, anyways
I would take the opportunity of the four-day weeks to use the extra day for portfolio updating, resume sending, calling offices in Seattle, and at some point heading up for interviewing and/or apartment hunting. Use the time to get your shit together for the move.
rationalist
I plan to be in seattle in a month
well woohoo. Then your extra day off each of the next few weeks should be no problem: planning a move can get out of hand, time-wise. I highly recommend the north ravenna/roosevelt area, there's a nice little community being assembled here lately.
get out .... the fact that it is a 3 year restaurant project pretty much explains it all
mdler.....if it can't be done in a month bail. We had a new restaurant project walk into our office about three weeks ago.
It is almost a total gut and redo. Fortunately for us we have
some good energy with the Clients. It is funny because we
did the existing restaurant 3 years ago and as you know all things
change in this business. The former owner gave us a sparkling reccomendation. The new owners were eager to have someone on board before the closing and we seemed to be the most logical. We
gave them a price for the architectural aspect of the job they didn't bat and eye. Before you know it my Mrs....is doing the Logo for the place, and the Exterior Signage, and the Menus. She is in Fat Heaven!
This is where she really shines. Mighty Might can only appreciate the conversations which take place about food and menus. The amazing thing is they will be up and running in less than three weeks from today. So we made money on the Architectural Part of the Job and the Graphics income was a bonus. There are lots of reasons to work with bad clients, but I can't find one for you. Go get your flying wings wet in the Northwest.
snook_dude
One of the clients (who is FUCKING CRAZY) wants me to now work for free on the project. He feels that if I really want my design opinion felt I should provide them with free drawings (even though I know that he is going to design it the way that he wants to anyways). I actually feel unconfortable around this guy (to the point that I wish that I had a gun when meeting with him - no joke)
Anyways, my name aint on the door of the office....
run away. fast. do it now.
mdler:
Get the fuck out of there, ASAP. If Seattle is where your heart is (I can't blame you there -- the Pacific Northwest is fucking beautiful), then don't waste any more time trying to get there. This is what awaits you:
This time last year I had just decided to move from Chicago back to NYC, even though the "sensible" thing to do would have been to stay in Chicago for another year and finish my BA degree and save up some more money. But NYC had been calling me for over a year, and I couldn't put it off any longer... And I haven't regretted it for a second. Don't burn any bridges, mind you, but follow your heart, and make no apologies for it.
Do you already have a job in Seattle lined up, or a place to live?
LIG
I have a place to stay for a while and have a couple of interviewish-like-meetings lined up for this weekend
I just found out that a well respected architect walked off of a job for the same restaurant clients that I am now working for (on thier previous restaurant)
Sounds like you know what to do, then.... Best of luck in Seattle.
LIG
I do know what to do...my problem is that I always worry too much about the other parties involved
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