I currently need to do a very small building( inhabitable) totally in brick. I hope the exterior brick wall could be self supported or only have minimal steel structure. Could this be done?
Is there any resources or website to help me to get this done?
Personally, I haven't seen any new buildings that use brick as load-bearing walls without the use of back-up. I've seen plenty of old buildings that do not use back-up and is made up of 2+ layers of brick. So its not that it can't be done, the proportion of cost of labor, material & importance of structural efficiency has changed over the years.
What is the purpose of having a purely brick wall?
Since the brick wall have openings like runing bond( one empty, one solid brick), so I don't want people see the backup structure system through the openings. Based on what you said, I guess 2+ layes of brick could be done? That's great.
jlxarchitect - those two wythes of brick need to be interlocked; it isn't enough to have them just running parallel. you'll need to figure out a pattern.
Openings? so its not an exterior wall in the sense that it will be an form the building envelope?
As el jeffe mentioned, something like a flemish bond where you're alternating between headers and stretchers will work better structurally. In fact, there are a lot of different traditional patterns to choose from, and of course there is the possibility of creating your own pattern.
As a side note I find it ironic that historic buildings (even back to Roman times) they used brick as the back-up structure and Marble (or other stones) as the veneer. And now? We use CMU for back-up and brick as the veneer.
And now that I think about it... there are plenty of buildings with CMU as the finish material. Whats next?
man my parents were all about colonial williamsburg when i was younger... i have so many pictures of me as a kid making doodie faces at the camera churning butter in 100 degree heat in a wood stable... ugh. how are you supposed to get excited for that when you're a kid and you can almost hear the roller coasters and people having fun at bush gardens five minutes away?
As to libertyBell mentioned "serpentine walls", I think it was built by the typical brick. I just curious if there are curved bricks existed today? I know it is not practical and ecomonical. But if you have info. please share with me.
no offense, but is it really a good idea to design using a wall system you have absolutely no idea how it works? if you're unsure if it can be load-bearing, how are you ever going to know how to insulate it, turn a corner, place control joints, etc. and curved bricks?! if you do intend to use a monolithic masonry system i would at least suggest some major research before you start. far more than posting a thread on archinect.
Hi, Jafidler, thanks for the input. I am suggesting a concept in my design because my senior is not in the office. And since it is not OK to expose what kind of structure it is, so You properly assume it is a reguar building for people to leave or stay. It is not. It is rather a simple structure. I AM doing my research. I guess it is part of my research to post my question here too, isn't it?
A bit of D-bar and some double skin construction and depending on the height of the walls and number of corners it'll hold itself up just fine. If you can source some nice aggregates/finihes on your blocks and play with the sizes and the mortar colour you can have some great looking walls.
Brick in and out might be a bit more tricky, as there's only the adhesion of the mortar to resist wind-loading, but it all depends on the size of the panels vs the number of corners. This could be negated with pillasters but then you lose that nice flat plane.
If it's 'habitable' then you'll need the double skin just to allow for your insulation and vapour barrier in between.
Don't forget your movement joints!
Mar 12, 08 1:08 pm ·
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anyone know brick structure
I currently need to do a very small building( inhabitable) totally in brick. I hope the exterior brick wall could be self supported or only have minimal steel structure. Could this be done?
Is there any resources or website to help me to get this done?
Do you mean without having to use back-up?
Personally, I haven't seen any new buildings that use brick as load-bearing walls without the use of back-up. I've seen plenty of old buildings that do not use back-up and is made up of 2+ layers of brick. So its not that it can't be done, the proportion of cost of labor, material & importance of structural efficiency has changed over the years.
What is the purpose of having a purely brick wall?
the kuenstlerhaus marktoberdorf by bearth + deplazes is brick through and through...
Thanks for the reply, philarch.
Since the brick wall have openings like runing bond( one empty, one solid brick), so I don't want people see the backup structure system through the openings. Based on what you said, I guess 2+ layes of brick could be done? That's great.
Look at the famous Jeffersonian serpentine walls for inspiration. Great blog post about them - and a lovely proposed design improvement - here.
jlxarchitect - those two wythes of brick need to be interlocked; it isn't enough to have them just running parallel. you'll need to figure out a pattern.
ever looked in graphic standards?
LB
you have a weekend job at Colonial Williamsburg?
the serpentine walls are in charlottesville.
but colonial williamsburg is awesome (and by awesome i mean boring as hell - i have no idea why it's so popular)
my parents used to live on the yorktown battlefield, so i've spent way too much time in all three places.
Openings? so its not an exterior wall in the sense that it will be an form the building envelope?
As el jeffe mentioned, something like a flemish bond where you're alternating between headers and stretchers will work better structurally. In fact, there are a lot of different traditional patterns to choose from, and of course there is the possibility of creating your own pattern.
As a side note I find it ironic that historic buildings (even back to Roman times) they used brick as the back-up structure and Marble (or other stones) as the veneer. And now? We use CMU for back-up and brick as the veneer.
And now that I think about it... there are plenty of buildings with CMU as the finish material. Whats next?
man my parents were all about colonial williamsburg when i was younger... i have so many pictures of me as a kid making doodie faces at the camera churning butter in 100 degree heat in a wood stable... ugh. how are you supposed to get excited for that when you're a kid and you can almost hear the roller coasters and people having fun at bush gardens five minutes away?
use bricks with holes and thread rebar through them - you can also get horizontal truss reinforcing @2 3/4" wide for a single wyth wall.
rent a brick saw or buy half length bricks for the openings.
As to libertyBell mentioned "serpentine walls", I think it was built by the typical brick. I just curious if there are curved bricks existed today? I know it is not practical and ecomonical. But if you have info. please share with me.
no offense, but is it really a good idea to design using a wall system you have absolutely no idea how it works? if you're unsure if it can be load-bearing, how are you ever going to know how to insulate it, turn a corner, place control joints, etc. and curved bricks?! if you do intend to use a monolithic masonry system i would at least suggest some major research before you start. far more than posting a thread on archinect.
Hi, Jafidler, thanks for the input. I am suggesting a concept in my design because my senior is not in the office. And since it is not OK to expose what kind of structure it is, so You properly assume it is a reguar building for people to leave or stay. It is not. It is rather a simple structure. I AM doing my research. I guess it is part of my research to post my question here too, isn't it?
I will take a look at the following link again for the structure issues:
http://agoraphilia.blogspot.com/2006/03/jeffersons-wall-take-two.html
ya mean like this?
He actually had to put columns in these walls if i'm not mistaken though and he used stone instead of brick.
not sure if it's along the lines or what you're doing jlxarchitect, but this thread showed some interesting brickwork.
Apurimac and phuyaka:
Thank you very much. Those examples are what I am looking for.
Have a good weekend.
did you look for the bia technical notes?
I use it all the time for brick detailing. it has tables for doubble wythe walls.
If you look closely, this is an openwork wall of standard brick:
This Guy Knows Bricks!
http://www.pushpullbar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2048
Yeah, that's wonderful stuff.
Here's another: http://www.scarp.ubc.ca/Havana_web/Necessary_ruins.htm
Apurimac:
That is what I want to do. Who designed this wall?
i rally like jensen + skodvin's drystack...
the photo is zumthor's kolumba museum in koeln
A bit of D-bar and some double skin construction and depending on the height of the walls and number of corners it'll hold itself up just fine. If you can source some nice aggregates/finihes on your blocks and play with the sizes and the mortar colour you can have some great looking walls.
Brick in and out might be a bit more tricky, as there's only the adhesion of the mortar to resist wind-loading, but it all depends on the size of the panels vs the number of corners. This could be negated with pillasters but then you lose that nice flat plane.
If it's 'habitable' then you'll need the double skin just to allow for your insulation and vapour barrier in between.
Don't forget your movement joints!
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