Many of the folks that work at Gehry don't have time to, well, do anything but work there. What you'd get out if it depends on your level - you could make models all day if you are junior, or do nothing but staffing and profitability projections if you are more senior. The people who enjoy it the most seem to be around 5 years of experience, since they are engaged in work with wide scope and more project continuity.

well, i've got 3 years exp. also, i'm planning on going back for my master's in a year or 2. that said, having exp. at gehry's and also a rec from the office might be beneficial, imo.

fyi_gehry.builds.

I personally would never pass up the opportunity to work at Gehry's office. Make the most of it and absorb as much as you can. I am a strong believer of intuition and my instincts have never let me down. Yes, you might have many crap jobs initially, but you have the power to change that; actively seek out as many new opportunities as you can; prove your skill set and show interest in the new fabrications. The other jobs will be waiting for you once you decide to move on, if that is what you desire. I'm an optimist if you haven't figured that out yet :) I say go for it.

god, if you are weighing doing cabinetry designs in the small office with working for gehry, you need to start school asap and just concentrate on that.

for me this would be a no-brainer - go to gehry. (and i don't even LOVE his work), but to work in that environment would be fantatsic.

I took a sweatshop job at a big name and I never regretted it.
It gives you architectural street cred that is invaluable. You can pick your jobs after your tour of duty.

I had the same notions about going back but ditched it because I learned so much by going from one major player to another building my own personal vision, portfolio and confidence. I could do my own work by the time I was done.
What you gain is a certain amount of professional momentum by working on major work like a Gehry’s office would provide. The techniques and process that you can get from a small office is more common and easier to attain. I also suggest that you can build that experience yourself if you do your own thing.
Go West.
Think East

I got offered a job there. Passed it up. Kind of regret it now (though I'd worked for other big names at the time and was kind of tired of it but I think Gehry's office would have been quite different). I visited the office and have many friends there. I say go for it. I'm sure you can get a job detailing millwork at that firm if the Gehry action proves disasterous.

I'd reccomend finding housing close by. The commute blows. Venice, Westchester, Mar Vista ... Culver City wouldn't be bad.

I've had two friends that have worked there over the years - one guy was a recent March grad from Yale and was put to work in the model shop for modest pay. The other guy had 5 years of experience and is now doing some project architect/project manager type work, gets to travel, has a fair amount of direct contact with Gehry, makes pretty good cash etc.

Both guys work insane hours, but seem to really enjoy it.

i'm surprised noone posted this yet on this thread

okay, i know i mentioned the millwork stuff, but i didn't really mean that's what i wanted to do. just wanted to make the point that they do pretty much the full service.

so, when they made the job offer, they must have told you approximately what you'd be doing there...

i guess some people float back and forth between jobs, but there you're generally either a model guy or a computer guy or a management guy. let's assume with your level of experience that you won't be a management guy.

being a model guy is actually the best. because the model making is where the real design happens. so you won't just be building someone else's ideas, you'll be designing through model making. they don't have any fancy fabrication equipment but they do have a great wood shop with innumerable amounts of awesome, expensive materials at your disposal. you also get to socialize with your peers while making models with them (except for in the noisy wood shop) so it's a great way to make friends. the hours can, at times, be frustratingly long.

if you're a computer guy, i'm not exactly sure what you do. you take the fancy 3d scanner arm and scan in the models that other people made. you do plans and stuff. i dunno. it's probably really good too. at least you get your own desk that way.

in short i would say go for it. LA is just about the coolest place on the planet and you will be a better person for living there a few years.

work for the smaller firm and learn the craft..... if you want to be in a shop then take up a trade or work at an exhibit house...

b

word, cryzko

if you work in the model shop, stay late and steal study models. Also, steal any pieces of trace that Gehry has sketched on....sell that shit on ebay.

that's what i'm saying!

shit, then again i could sketch some BS drunk and sell it on ebay as Gehry's work

i'm waiting for frank to apply for a job working for me...he might get into the mill work drawings...or the model glue we use here [elmers].

Chase-

you're right. at my level, they said either models or computer, but not necessarily a floater. i got the impression that they hire to staff certain projects and will keep you on it through the duration.

Alcon, I think that even if you are working as a CAD jockey/monkey you will get a chance to work on software not used in typical offices so it will be a worthwhile experience. And having FOG on your resume won't hurt. If they have asked for you to join you must be doing something right/wrong or should I say wright (its all about Frank) - go for tell us how it goes.

i always hear people talk about how having frank gehry or so-and-so on your resume will look so great, but what does that mean? to me, it means if you want to keep working for starchitects your whole life (at no pay) then it will look great on your resume. most non-starchitect offices won't really care all that much and in some, it is a strike against you because of a lack of "real" office experience. if you want to start your own practice, banks won't really give a rip if you worked for frank gehry when applying for a loan. i just don't get the argument. anyone that can explain that rational, i'd be curious to hear the case for it.

they'll care about hearing the anecdotes. for about a week. then they'll tell ya " i don't give a damn how they do it at gehry's office. just put match to existing."

jafidler - I think having Gehry on your resume immediately lets people know that you have experience working on high profile, high stress, in many cases international, complex projects. What office would discount experience like that?

Even if you're spending most of your time in the model shop, as someone said, you've got your hands right there where the design happens and you often get to sit in on meetings with the clients, how valuable is that? If you're working in Catia and CAD all day, that's just a dress rehearsal for how the rest of professional world will be doing everything in five years: BIM.

Gehry's office is tough to generalize about because it's in a really unique position. The influence of their methods will be very wide reaching, regardless of any formal legacy. And they get paid.

this is what having gehry on your resume would say to me in no particular order:

a.) you went to a good school and are proficient in digital modelling and rendering (but i could have gathered that anyway from the rest of your resume and the portfolio you brought in to interview with).

b.) that you probably were using software that my office doesn't use.

c.) that if you only had a few years of experience before being hired at gehry, you probably a.) made a lof models there or b.) pumped a lot of cad, but have relatively little other office experience (i.e. ca, code search, shops, etc). i might be off base with that, and would be interested to here if gehry offers a more balanced work experience than is the general impression.

d.) you are a motivated individual that will work long hours for me, if i should need it.

e.) you aspire to being a designer more than an architect.

i guess my point is that taking a job at gehry shouldn't be about putting a name on a resume. it should be about the particular experience you are looking for in a firm. if you are into innovative process and working long hours with motivated people, gehry may be perfect for you, but i wouldn't go just because of the name, and i'm not sure it's the type of place that will necessarily teach you to be an architect.

Ah, yes jafidler, that is exactly the dilemma - to be both designer and architect, for i am very much interested in process. i want to be able to put together and build designs that result from such processes. I want to have my cake and eat it too. Surely it can't be mutually exclusive. I am at this point very much leaning towards accepting the offer.

Yes, in the immediate future, the name for grad school would be a plus, however, in the long term, that's not why i would work there - it would be to learn the methods and problem-solving skills that are utilized and practiced there, and then carry them on into my own future practice.

it seems like you have a pretty good sense of what you want to do and why you want take the offer with gehry. in which case, more power to you. it will likely be a great experience, particularly as a lead up to grad school. good luck and have fun with it.

IMO don't think in the long term. you will just drive yourself crazy. working at Gehry would be an great experience, and it doesnt set the tone of your career for the rest of life. we can always change.

in my past jobs (in the more well known offices) the thing that i got out of them the most was working with really great and motivated people. i am still in touch with many of them from all over the world.
for me that is priceless.

i'd do it.

jaf you need a new job. you are becoming cynical. i would take the gehry job - he's not predock, he actually builds. you will learn as much by osmosis as anything. and the lessons you learn there will be applicable to the future when you start your own practice and do the so-called "real" buildings. will it be difficult? well yeah, duh. but two years at gehry could be an incredible experience. and since you haven't been to grad school, not only will you be able to go wherever you want but you'll probably have a huge edge on other students who haven't come into contact with as many intelligent people as i assume work for gehry's office. and since you'll be in LA, your network will likely expand exponentially at a huge, highly respected office like gehry's than it will at a boutique, and that unto itself is completely priceless.

i just switched jobs actually. first office i worked in was small, boutique, academic - awesome. i had a ton fun, worked long hours, did good design, but found i couldn't get the mentorship in professional practice and construction that i needed. second place i worked for was completely corporate, decent, not great design, but many of my co-workers were experienced architects and good mentors. i learned a ton from them. the new office is big, but more design-oriented than the last. i needed more of a balance.

i wouldn't give up that second office experience for anything. to be an architect, you need to learn from real architects, not just putter away on the cnc router. i'm not saying that every office you work in should be all about architecture; i just think you have to be aware of where you are in your career, and what is best for you.

ah, predock builds a shitload of buildings.

build your resume! the small companies will always be there, but it'll make other firms that you may really want to work for down the road take a second look

yeah but he doesn't do his own cd's

who doesn't do his own c.d/'s, predock?

neither does holl

i haven't ever been in that situation. i wonder if you relinquish any control over how the documents get made? wouldn't it be wonderful to not have to do them but still get to watch over whether they get done right? and pitch in on a cool detail when you wanted to?

it is quite common in the netherlands that architects do not do their CD's.
and on the subject of Holl, our office is the local office for his Zuidas project, i am very curious how the relationship will develop.

having someone else do your cds is giving a lot of trust over to someone. maybe that's why holl's buildings look great from a distance but his details suck.

chase, yeah i know what you are saying but i now look at it as just another way of doing things. i holland it also explains why much dutch architecture is about the 'big idea', not the fine details.

a building can be successful even with one or two or ten botched details. particularly when considering the layman's knowledge of architecture. it's really all about instant icon stature found in the shininess, largeness and photo opportuniti-ness that the building provides its tourists.

You might get to meet Brad Pitt. I hear he's a nice guy.
Maybe even Robert Downey Jnr. will be the next to try his hand at shape creation with Frank.

As for learning the ropes at a 'real' architecture firm, who's to say you can't learn your own ropes all by yourself?

it isn't my intention to change the nature of the thread, but my $.02 is that the most quality construction and detailing comes from architects who create their own cd's. a lot of buildings that look beautiful and flashy on the glossy pages of a magazine can be quite disappointing up close. there's nothing worse that going to a building with a great design and seeing leaks, destroyed pieces of drywall, water stains, and poor details that stick out like a sore thumb.

Following along with the conversation on architects who do their own cds or not, does anyone know if Zumthor do his own? I think his buildings are all nicely done from the "big idea" down to the tiny parts.

i would guess he does. his sections and plans show a lot of construction. i'd doubt that they'd bother to consider such things in those drawings if they weren't going to follow through and detail everything.

water stains can be very beautiful in a phenomonologically speaking..

ah yes, the reveries of water stains.

my guess is that these offices farm out the cds, because they couldn't do them themselves. putting together buildings is harrrrrrrrd.

vado, don't forget the holes!

ok, back to gehry. since i'm probably going to take the position, i now have to think of places to live. anyone have anything to say about marina del rey and playa del rey?

so, im gonna tell a story (dont kill me tumbles)

anyways, tumbles used to be a server at a Gehry designed project. One night he was there and she was waiting on him. She saw him skectching on some napkins. After he left, she took the sketched upon napkin off the table...it is now in a frame on her wall

alcon - Marina del Rey looks like the one of the most boring places on earth. Try Culver City or even Venice, it's not as expensive as you might think.

www.westsiderentals.com is a good resource.

Really?? I figured since i'd be working all the time, it wouldn't really matter. plus, beachside sounds nice, but i'll look into culver city too. thanks.