Women especially... anyone ever had an experience where you thought maybe your boss was a little TOO eccentric? My new boss of only a month keeps having very violent and scary outbursts that seem to go beyond just a passion for design. I just got this job, and otherwise it's a dream come true. Any advice?
i just spent last 2 weeks preparing a competition with a very well known and recognized architect (lets keep it secret just a few more posts) and the guy was an ass... i can say he doesn't seem to have the talent that ppl and his projects say he has...and its true, just by a simple fact, the one who did all the work at the office was his former partner who just quitted less than a year ago...the office is a mess, the equipment is obsolete (i still wonder how they produce such great presentations with such crappy equipment), and now i realize is a drag when u work for older people who dont understand that computers makes things easier, but they took time to process information and to produce stuff (renderings, images, etc)... the technology generation gap...
is too bad his partner has never been recognized cause he actually did all the design work, but his name has never been too "known" , lets see what happens from now on with that office...so far they just lost the competition i collaborated with them cause the guy got late to the presentation... (isn't he an ass??)
It's you're only option. Violence and verbal abuse is rampant in architecture firms. And I don't think it's directed towards women, per se, only the remarks are if you happen to be one. One of the main reasons I've been at my firm for almost 7 years is that my employers are the kindest, most "normal" people I've ever worked for.
One employer loved to stand behind me quietly when I was hand drafting something and as soon as he saw me make a mistake he would yell in my ear "Stop!" and give me heart failure. He also would have screaming arguments with his wife on the phone at the desk next to mine. I quit because I was becoming ill.
One employer treated us like we were his children, yelling at us for things he spilt on the carpet, not letting us make personal calls ever. He stood over my shoulder glaring at me once while I was talking to my son's math teacher about a conference. We had two single use toilets in the office and he would rap on the door if he thought you'd been in there too long. He would scream at us if he thought he had to redline a drawing too many times. We had a fight once and I had to leave, crying because I was so upset, and walk around the block. When I came back he berated me for leaving the phones because the other person in the office wasn't there that day to answer them. I came in one day to find my computer in pieces. He said he'd taken it home so his son could see if I had anything on it I shouldn't have. I had to reconnect everything while he yelled at me to "get a move on, there's work to be done". I can't believe I stayed there 2 years.
One employer would regularly bite the head off his other partners. We always wondered if we were next.
There's also a tolerance for this among empolyees. I've worked with one person who made other people so upset with his berating and violent actions (pounding tables, blowing up, punching things, racial comments and drunkenness). He made everyone so miserable. The guy eventually quit. He wasn't fired.
You just have to leave if it's intolerable. You can't change your employers.
I say "women especially' because I'm the only girl in a firm of 7 guys. All of the rest of the guys work on one project, and I'm overloaded with three (smaller) ones without real help.
This job was a big raise, big promotion, better design, etc. I dont want to quit.
Anyone had any experience with reconciling this kind of situation?
Unfortunately, kn825, the others are right. The only "reconciling this kind of situation" is to recognize that everything in life is a choice, a compromise of some sort. In order to stay on this (otherwise) great job, you must tolerate a boor for a boss. It's pretty much that simple. You won't change him, his wife won't change him, he is what he is.
You can stay and eventually try the litigation route (suing for mental distress), but that only means a new job somewhere else. As bad as he is, maybe some of these other stories put him in a slightly better light. Maybe you can tolerate him for the other good parts of the job...?
I would actually recommend you find some reason to leave, as soon as possible, on a good note. Preferably with another job already lined up (so it could take a few weeks). But dont burn any bridges, the boss may be an asshole, but as long as he or she doesnt know you think that, you can still use him for a reference, and he wont spread bad shit about you - as assholes are prone to do when you tell them off.
Swallow your ego and leave nicely, it will pay you back later.
Why are some architects so god damn frustrated?! I had a horrible experience when an ex-boss started to pound the shit out of a wall with a hammer. These people have absolutely no business in a professional position.
When they sign your paychecks, leaving is the only option. Would you try to change your behavior if some snot nosed grunt under your employ told you that you he felt uncomfortable around you? I think we'd all probably find a way to get rid of them rather than get into a touchy-feely-how-can-I-change position with them. Ideally we would, but most business owners didn't get where they are by trying to improve relationships in the office. That's a pretty new way to do business. Some are starting to - I heard one of the airlines was hiring consultants to do that - but architects are too egotistical.
if she (fem?) is valuable to him and the company, then theres a large chance that he'll respect her/him for their candor. they may even be looked up to for being so straightforward. once again- wording what one says is key to either two doors: the "youre fired" door or the "i see. lets work things out" door.
everyone is egotistical.
but we all know that theres always that intriguing factor in that person who comes straight in your face and says the truth be it good or bad.
True. Some people accept the truth very well, but "violent and scary outbursts" sounds like a place I wouldn't want to go. Maybe it's worth some conversation with fellow employees to see if this is a real Dr Jekyll or if others think the scary boss can be reasoned with.
Today he thought one of the PM's mumbled something about him, so he threw a pen at him as hard as he could. I think I might have back-up.
They just put up with him. They aren't on his project. Im basically his only direct employee. I'd be willing to bet he's never had one of those before (it's a very new company of 8 months).
I've never worked at an arch firm, but I have had nightmare bosses...
I paid my way through college, the first time around, working as an assitant manager at a video store. The store manager was egomaniacal (and why wouldn't he be? that's quite the prestigious position) and often flew into tyrannical rages. One night, I asked him if I could come in late for a shift the following week, because I had my final crit. He threw a video at my face. Fortunately, I have cat-like reflexes and I didn't lose any teeth. I was just a wee geek of 17 at the time.
It was at that point that I decided no one would treat me that way again. I threw the tape back at him along with my store keys (landed my throw) and quit. Now, this isn't the way to behave as an adult in a professional field. But, it is a metaphor for "throwing it back" at him. It's been my experience that people who act in such an abhorrent manner have never been kicked in the lip. Sometimes they have to be shocked into behaving humanely, because they are bullies, no different than the ones you find on playgrounds. I heard from friends who remained at the store that he acted out less and less after the incident.
SO, maybe, the next time he acts up, you should slam your hand down on the table and make it clear to him that you are not the one to tolerate his tantrums. He might fire you. He might not. But if he does, at least then you'll get unemployment in addition to the satisfaction of knowing you stood up for yourself.
Work hard to do a good job, but don't get bullied, or esle it will only get worse. Don't bend over, but don't let him walk over you. Show him you're confident and intelligent and there really no point in getting all worked up because you are responsive and will always get things done. Don't think to yourself that you really need this job 'no matter what', but keep in mind that you don't have to put up with this forever, that you are a professional, but you can quit if he ceases to be a professional.
did anyone find the pen projectile thing a little bit assault-ish?? maybe overboard?? howabout
lawsuit?
F that- i take my comments back (rare....very rare)
tell the pen assaultee to file a lawsuit for mental distress due to assault. abuse. whatever. and ask for a cut. blackmail. whatever you have to do to make this pathetic a hole of a boss realize how much of an anus he is...
i agree kyll...the 'pen projectile thing' is over the top. and if he really did throw it 'as hard as he could' it sounds like he was out for blood...so bite back
Yeah, the PM was genuinely furious. Part of the compounded problem here is that the rest of my coworkers seem to be able to ignore him, but they are visibly pissed when he goes off on one of them. Long story short, I doubt they will do anything about it ever, except be mad. Plus this boss is very well connected, ie he brings in ALL of the work in the office. It's basically his firm. So, if a lawsuit or something like that were to happen, the firm and all the good things it stands for (we do lots of affordable, sustainable housing projects and good design in a city reletively devoid of good design).
how is it possible to just "ignore" a man who's capable of throwing pointed (as pointed as a pen could be anyway) objects at another person? you dont just "ignore" people like that- you usually pound their face in- REGARDLESS who it is. i dont care how "connected" or famous he is- it could be friggin caesar himself- half the people in my firm woulda put your boss's head through a window.
and we're on the 16th floor
is the rest of the people in your firm that passive (chickenshit?)?
Stage a coup. If everyone feels the same way, why can't you all "go on strike." Even if he does bring in all the work, and even if he could hire all new employees, he'll be royally screwed when he loses valuable time because you all agreed to stop working until he "cools the f*ck out."
I think this in combination with j's recent comments woudl work well.
And if he's the only crappy pants around, you should all leave and start your own firm!
I staged a coup once. Things were going shitty in the office and the project we were all working on ( small office 5 people plus boss) was being pushed and we didn't have a lot of direction. Everyone was confused and frustrated with the direction at the time, plus the lack of work in the office made for a tough time. we were all cut back on hours for a few weeks. Which in itself was a wake up call to never work for anybody else again. Walking home at two in the afternoon was totally depressing, recently married it was tough emotionally.
We all wrote as letter to the boss which we wanted to present collectively and have a sit down discussion, when one of the guys went and had a meeting told the boss to fuck off and presented the letter in a totally violent manner.
Needless to say shit hit the fan and we were all fired on the spot, a day later I managed to get everyone to cool their jets and kept my job as did the others less one. but got the point across and made the boss aware that we need to be part of what's going on. Even if it is a lack of work.
Small offices often struggle and its part of the profession but its helpful to know and let staff know things can be a rollercoaster, personal issues are a whole different situation like divorces which I can only guess would be brutal on all staff.
Bottom line, don't put up with it, might be some issues outside the office that make for his attitude if not let him know that yelling won't motivate you, let him know your position it might help, but unless he's paying you way too much for the abuse I would leave.
I was getting crap from a contractor and in my frustration threw a pen against a wall (no damage) as I was forcefully telling my side of the issue. I was inside a conference room by myself. Admin person hears it (poor insulation) freaks out about how the environment was "threatening" and tells the big bosses. I get called in for a little meeting about my temper (until I had this job I had never had a problem). It was a wakeup call. Now I talk very quietly. Saying FU in a soft voice is a really powerful tool.
But to KN825's point: The sexism is rapant, but the violence is really universal. I wonder if that is the desperation we feel every day as our profession becomes more irrelevant. Sometimes social causes can create personal neurosis.
I had a very violent female supervisor at one point. She screamed at me in front of everyone in the office about talking to a client that only she should have spoken to...Control issues?? You bet. It was a poisoned athmosphere. She once broke out in hives during an offsite due to the pressure she was putting on herself. The stress was manifested in the hives and she had a nervous breakdown. She caused a great deal of her own problem, but upper management should have seen the trainwreck coming. Too much work with not enough time makes me desperate.
I think I've managed to develop an ego (in self defense). But I can't imagine ego will ever become an excuse or rational cause for being violent or verbally abusive.
This guy needs a sharp shot of pee in his eye. :-)
When we hear that someone has left 'surprisingly' during the middle of a project, we should consider that maybe that person simply escaped, because they couldn't take some insane sh1t any longer.
"No foul."
jeremy is right, there is no x cuse for psychotic behavior on the behalf of a stressed out boss/principal +/or co-worker. i never saw more of this trait then in architecture firms - it's really ugly.
so when it occurs - immediately! look for a new job. [it's abusive-get out of there]. When it occurs, make it pretty darn clear that, that is unprofessional and disrespectful. do it in an e mail if you can't say it face to face --
the reason you should say something is, you WILL leave and when you found a 'decent' environ - and you give notice, you're prior boss, the jerk - may actually know you're leaving because they're an a__.
i got some big apologies when i was in that situ., but it was just too late.
stick up for yourself - you'll be respected for it later -
yeah I was totally agreeing with you and thinking wow sterling hall speaks sense - then you say 'do it in an email if you can't say it face to face'. I think you are right about everything except that, if you can't say it to someone's face then don't say it. Thats what i reckon - even if it is harder, at least they won't be saying 'couldn't even say it to my face...' as you walk away from the job.
MADianito,
I don't have time to fully answer to your dilemma you had at Enrique Norten's office. Just to say I also worked there and I can understand what you went through. I can say it was a tough office to work at. But I will say this for Enrique, he recognizes all his employees (past, present and future) when he publishes his work. He is one of the few architects that will include you on this list, even if you just drew the bathrooms on a project. And he makes sure a list will be included when his work is published. It may be a difficult office but he helps you if you need it. I appreciate Enrique for this.
Good god. Fortunately I have had really great luck with actual employers When i was an intern, one sexually harassed me, and others were rude to me - but those were easy to leave as I was not financially dependent so I just quit.
My bosses right now are great. They are nice to sit down and talk to. They buy us lunch a couple times a week and make a coffee/pastry run for us on every day that isn't insanely busy. They know I am a recent graduate so they are happy to teach me what I need to know to do my job better, rather than screaming at me for messing up or not knowing. We leave the office when we're done with the work, which is anywhere between 4:30 and 5:30 normally. The latest i ever stayed was 8pm and that was the two days after I got back from taking a couple days off for a wedding - which they allowed me to attend without docking my pay or using up actual vacation days because I caught up my work when I came back. Everyone I work with is really nice to be around and overall I couldn't ask for a better environment.
My point is that there ARE amazing, nice employers in the design world. They are not all arrogant and rude. So work for the good ones, not the jerks you are unfortunately stuck with right now. Those awful people will either get sick of their high turnover rate and change their business practices (unlikely) or they will *always* be frustrated and they will *always* have tense environments and *never* have employees who are happy and therefore better workers. Their loss!
Those awful people will either get sick of their high turnover rate and change their business practices (unlikely) or they will *always* be frustrated and they will *always* have tense environments and *never* have employees who are happy and therefore better workers. Their loss!
if employees had better mobility (in context of this topic: if employees wouldn't suffer job-bounce stigma), then rotten employers would go bankrupt.
('you may say i'm a dreamer. but i'm not the only one' etc :-) )
I guess there's always a price to pay for a better job - higher salary - more responisibility, etc. He obviously finds it difficult to keep staff. Get some assertiveness training, get a life outside the office, then start looking around for an equally challenging job. It doesn't sound as though you've got fifteen children and a mortgate, so you're free as a bird.
you should have no trouble finding another job at a firm that respects you as both an employee and a person. i work for a small firm in southern california and we have been looking for a project manager for over a month; last week, we got a call from a firm a half hour away that was desperate for a project manager and was calling around to see if anyone had any tips on how to advertise! do not settle for less than you are worth in terms of either your salary or the respect that your employer offers you.
i am a 22 yr old woman at a firm whose gender composition has varied from 5:1 to 4:3 men vs. women over the time i have been employed there, and i have never had a problem with sexual politics. i think this is due to the attitude of the principal, which influences his decisions on who to hire. conscientious employers tend to hire only conscientious employees; conversely, abusive employers are surrounded by employees who are either subservient or abusive themselves. it sounds as though your fellow employees have become complacent so i doubt you will get much help from them. unless you feel like documenting everything and fighting a costly/time consuming court battle, i would say that the best course of action would be to find another job and then quit your current one, stating politely but firmly in a letter or in person to your current boss the reasons that you are leaving the job. maybe i am being pessimistic, but i am willing to bet that if you leave the door open to negotiation and your boss persuades you to stay, the situation won't improve enough to justify staying. even if the boss' attitude toward you changes some, you will probably never be fully comfortable either with the boss or the other pushover employees.
lastly, i do not think you should not take a job at a firm with "better design" over a job where you will be respected for your talents. i am sure there are those on this forum who would disagree and say that it's just one of the sacrifices you have to make in order to do good design. but any kind of sycophant can work for a big name architect and absorb the firm's style and process (not that i assume you are doing this, i am just trying to make a point). what kind of process is that, anyway, if it requires you to abuse the employees to get your projects done? and what kind of style can't be thoroughly absorbed from the books in the friendly local university library? why not evolve your own process by working for an ethical employer who appreciates the contributions of others and why not evolve your own style by using the freedom you will have to design things yourself rather than make the CDs for someone else's designs?
maybe i am either lucky in the jobs i have landed or young-and-wet-behind-the-ears (or both) but it seems to me like employers would not be able to pull these shenanigans if we didn't let them.
good luck with your job search!
Sep 15, 04 2:18 am ·
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violent boss
Women especially... anyone ever had an experience where you thought maybe your boss was a little TOO eccentric? My new boss of only a month keeps having very violent and scary outbursts that seem to go beyond just a passion for design. I just got this job, and otherwise it's a dream come true. Any advice?
hide the x-acto
what ways....why women?
i just spent last 2 weeks preparing a competition with a very well known and recognized architect (lets keep it secret just a few more posts) and the guy was an ass... i can say he doesn't seem to have the talent that ppl and his projects say he has...and its true, just by a simple fact, the one who did all the work at the office was his former partner who just quitted less than a year ago...the office is a mess, the equipment is obsolete (i still wonder how they produce such great presentations with such crappy equipment), and now i realize is a drag when u work for older people who dont understand that computers makes things easier, but they took time to process information and to produce stuff (renderings, images, etc)... the technology generation gap...
is too bad his partner has never been recognized cause he actually did all the design work, but his name has never been too "known" , lets see what happens from now on with that office...so far they just lost the competition i collaborated with them cause the guy got late to the presentation... (isn't he an ass??)
MADianito
Time to let the cat out of the bag. Who is he?
Quit.
It's you're only option. Violence and verbal abuse is rampant in architecture firms. And I don't think it's directed towards women, per se, only the remarks are if you happen to be one. One of the main reasons I've been at my firm for almost 7 years is that my employers are the kindest, most "normal" people I've ever worked for.
One employer loved to stand behind me quietly when I was hand drafting something and as soon as he saw me make a mistake he would yell in my ear "Stop!" and give me heart failure. He also would have screaming arguments with his wife on the phone at the desk next to mine. I quit because I was becoming ill.
One employer treated us like we were his children, yelling at us for things he spilt on the carpet, not letting us make personal calls ever. He stood over my shoulder glaring at me once while I was talking to my son's math teacher about a conference. We had two single use toilets in the office and he would rap on the door if he thought you'd been in there too long. He would scream at us if he thought he had to redline a drawing too many times. We had a fight once and I had to leave, crying because I was so upset, and walk around the block. When I came back he berated me for leaving the phones because the other person in the office wasn't there that day to answer them. I came in one day to find my computer in pieces. He said he'd taken it home so his son could see if I had anything on it I shouldn't have. I had to reconnect everything while he yelled at me to "get a move on, there's work to be done". I can't believe I stayed there 2 years.
One employer would regularly bite the head off his other partners. We always wondered if we were next.
There's also a tolerance for this among empolyees. I've worked with one person who made other people so upset with his berating and violent actions (pounding tables, blowing up, punching things, racial comments and drunkenness). He made everyone so miserable. The guy eventually quit. He wasn't fired.
You just have to leave if it's intolerable. You can't change your employers.
I say "women especially' because I'm the only girl in a firm of 7 guys. All of the rest of the guys work on one project, and I'm overloaded with three (smaller) ones without real help.
This job was a big raise, big promotion, better design, etc. I dont want to quit.
Anyone had any experience with reconciling this kind of situation?
Unfortunately, kn825, the others are right. The only "reconciling this kind of situation" is to recognize that everything in life is a choice, a compromise of some sort. In order to stay on this (otherwise) great job, you must tolerate a boor for a boss. It's pretty much that simple. You won't change him, his wife won't change him, he is what he is.
You can stay and eventually try the litigation route (suing for mental distress), but that only means a new job somewhere else. As bad as he is, maybe some of these other stories put him in a slightly better light. Maybe you can tolerate him for the other good parts of the job...?
Life is too damn short to waste it trying to change some dickhead boss.
You can either deal with him as he is, or quit. You won't be able to change him or his behavior.
But you should really let him have it before you go.
Embarass the hell out of him. Humiliate him. Do your worst.
Chances are good that other potential employers in your area know the situation, and will not hold it against you that you left the firm so quickly.
I would actually recommend you find some reason to leave, as soon as possible, on a good note. Preferably with another job already lined up (so it could take a few weeks). But dont burn any bridges, the boss may be an asshole, but as long as he or she doesnt know you think that, you can still use him for a reference, and he wont spread bad shit about you - as assholes are prone to do when you tell them off.
Swallow your ego and leave nicely, it will pay you back later.
Why are some architects so god damn frustrated?! I had a horrible experience when an ex-boss started to pound the shit out of a wall with a hammer. These people have absolutely no business in a professional position.
you cant ask him to the conference room one day and tell him on a non threatening level what the problem is? wording is key in that situation
is leaving or dealing with someone else's b.s. the only way? i doubt that those are the only two options
When they sign your paychecks, leaving is the only option. Would you try to change your behavior if some snot nosed grunt under your employ told you that you he felt uncomfortable around you? I think we'd all probably find a way to get rid of them rather than get into a touchy-feely-how-can-I-change position with them. Ideally we would, but most business owners didn't get where they are by trying to improve relationships in the office. That's a pretty new way to do business. Some are starting to - I heard one of the airlines was hiring consultants to do that - but architects are too egotistical.
Mum,
I think you are absolutely right egotistical is the correct word.
Doberman:
Enrique Norten
www.ten-arquitectos.com
*And imagine this guy was also named for running columbia's arch school....omg!
well- i see your point mum
however
if she (fem?) is valuable to him and the company, then theres a large chance that he'll respect her/him for their candor. they may even be looked up to for being so straightforward. once again- wording what one says is key to either two doors: the "youre fired" door or the "i see. lets work things out" door.
everyone is egotistical.
but we all know that theres always that intriguing factor in that person who comes straight in your face and says the truth be it good or bad.
especially when its about you.
True. Some people accept the truth very well, but "violent and scary outbursts" sounds like a place I wouldn't want to go. Maybe it's worth some conversation with fellow employees to see if this is a real Dr Jekyll or if others think the scary boss can be reasoned with.
Today he thought one of the PM's mumbled something about him, so he threw a pen at him as hard as he could. I think I might have back-up.
They just put up with him. They aren't on his project. Im basically his only direct employee. I'd be willing to bet he's never had one of those before (it's a very new company of 8 months).
I've never worked at an arch firm, but I have had nightmare bosses...
I paid my way through college, the first time around, working as an assitant manager at a video store. The store manager was egomaniacal (and why wouldn't he be? that's quite the prestigious position) and often flew into tyrannical rages. One night, I asked him if I could come in late for a shift the following week, because I had my final crit. He threw a video at my face. Fortunately, I have cat-like reflexes and I didn't lose any teeth. I was just a wee geek of 17 at the time.
It was at that point that I decided no one would treat me that way again. I threw the tape back at him along with my store keys (landed my throw) and quit. Now, this isn't the way to behave as an adult in a professional field. But, it is a metaphor for "throwing it back" at him. It's been my experience that people who act in such an abhorrent manner have never been kicked in the lip. Sometimes they have to be shocked into behaving humanely, because they are bullies, no different than the ones you find on playgrounds. I heard from friends who remained at the store that he acted out less and less after the incident.
SO, maybe, the next time he acts up, you should slam your hand down on the table and make it clear to him that you are not the one to tolerate his tantrums. He might fire you. He might not. But if he does, at least then you'll get unemployment in addition to the satisfaction of knowing you stood up for yourself.
Grow thick skin.
Work hard to do a good job, but don't get bullied, or esle it will only get worse. Don't bend over, but don't let him walk over you. Show him you're confident and intelligent and there really no point in getting all worked up because you are responsive and will always get things done. Don't think to yourself that you really need this job 'no matter what', but keep in mind that you don't have to put up with this forever, that you are a professional, but you can quit if he ceases to be a professional.
whoa-
did anyone find the pen projectile thing a little bit assault-ish?? maybe overboard?? howabout
lawsuit?
F that- i take my comments back (rare....very rare)
tell the pen assaultee to file a lawsuit for mental distress due to assault. abuse. whatever. and ask for a cut. blackmail. whatever you have to do to make this pathetic a hole of a boss realize how much of an anus he is...
and i second design geek girl- holla back at him (i mean that literally) and maybe wind up getting unemployment until u land a better spot
i agree kyll...the 'pen projectile thing' is over the top. and if he really did throw it 'as hard as he could' it sounds like he was out for blood...so bite back
Yeah, the PM was genuinely furious. Part of the compounded problem here is that the rest of my coworkers seem to be able to ignore him, but they are visibly pissed when he goes off on one of them. Long story short, I doubt they will do anything about it ever, except be mad. Plus this boss is very well connected, ie he brings in ALL of the work in the office. It's basically his firm. So, if a lawsuit or something like that were to happen, the firm and all the good things it stands for (we do lots of affordable, sustainable housing projects and good design in a city reletively devoid of good design).
wait- kn
how is it possible to just "ignore" a man who's capable of throwing pointed (as pointed as a pen could be anyway) objects at another person? you dont just "ignore" people like that- you usually pound their face in- REGARDLESS who it is. i dont care how "connected" or famous he is- it could be friggin caesar himself- half the people in my firm woulda put your boss's head through a window.
and we're on the 16th floor
is the rest of the people in your firm that passive (chickenshit?)?
Stage a coup. If everyone feels the same way, why can't you all "go on strike." Even if he does bring in all the work, and even if he could hire all new employees, he'll be royally screwed when he loses valuable time because you all agreed to stop working until he "cools the f*ck out."
I think this in combination with j's recent comments woudl work well.
And if he's the only crappy pants around, you should all leave and start your own firm!
I staged a coup once. Things were going shitty in the office and the project we were all working on ( small office 5 people plus boss) was being pushed and we didn't have a lot of direction. Everyone was confused and frustrated with the direction at the time, plus the lack of work in the office made for a tough time. we were all cut back on hours for a few weeks. Which in itself was a wake up call to never work for anybody else again. Walking home at two in the afternoon was totally depressing, recently married it was tough emotionally.
We all wrote as letter to the boss which we wanted to present collectively and have a sit down discussion, when one of the guys went and had a meeting told the boss to fuck off and presented the letter in a totally violent manner.
Needless to say shit hit the fan and we were all fired on the spot, a day later I managed to get everyone to cool their jets and kept my job as did the others less one. but got the point across and made the boss aware that we need to be part of what's going on. Even if it is a lack of work.
Small offices often struggle and its part of the profession but its helpful to know and let staff know things can be a rollercoaster, personal issues are a whole different situation like divorces which I can only guess would be brutal on all staff.
Bottom line, don't put up with it, might be some issues outside the office that make for his attitude if not let him know that yelling won't motivate you, let him know your position it might help, but unless he's paying you way too much for the abuse I would leave.
I was getting crap from a contractor and in my frustration threw a pen against a wall (no damage) as I was forcefully telling my side of the issue. I was inside a conference room by myself. Admin person hears it (poor insulation) freaks out about how the environment was "threatening" and tells the big bosses. I get called in for a little meeting about my temper (until I had this job I had never had a problem). It was a wakeup call. Now I talk very quietly. Saying FU in a soft voice is a really powerful tool.
But to KN825's point: The sexism is rapant, but the violence is really universal. I wonder if that is the desperation we feel every day as our profession becomes more irrelevant. Sometimes social causes can create personal neurosis.
I had a very violent female supervisor at one point. She screamed at me in front of everyone in the office about talking to a client that only she should have spoken to...Control issues?? You bet. It was a poisoned athmosphere. She once broke out in hives during an offsite due to the pressure she was putting on herself. The stress was manifested in the hives and she had a nervous breakdown. She caused a great deal of her own problem, but upper management should have seen the trainwreck coming. Too much work with not enough time makes me desperate.
'jeeeeezzz', another thread about insane people.
I think I've managed to develop an ego (in self defense). But I can't imagine ego will ever become an excuse or rational cause for being violent or verbally abusive.
This guy needs a sharp shot of pee in his eye. :-)
When we hear that someone has left 'surprisingly' during the middle of a project, we should consider that maybe that person simply escaped, because they couldn't take some insane sh1t any longer.
"No foul."
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MADianito, What's with "Enrique Norten"?
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As in the CNN story (link posted), Suddenly in the news in recent years:
http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&q=%22Workplace+Bullying%22
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To OP, my guess is that some kind of evidence collection will fortify your position, whenever you decide to make a move. If you're usually near the computer you (alone) use when you receive abuse, you should be able to hide a microphone amongst your paperwork and ornamental junk. Maybe a Stuffed Wabbit type of décor-toy, that might be built with a wire coming out of it anyway? But hopefully you won't have to hack or fab up something yourself. Hopefully you can buy something that's been tested and works.
jeremy is right, there is no x cuse for psychotic behavior on the behalf of a stressed out boss/principal +/or co-worker. i never saw more of this trait then in architecture firms - it's really ugly.
so when it occurs - immediately! look for a new job. [it's abusive-get out of there]. When it occurs, make it pretty darn clear that, that is unprofessional and disrespectful. do it in an e mail if you can't say it face to face --
the reason you should say something is, you WILL leave and when you found a 'decent' environ - and you give notice, you're prior boss, the jerk - may actually know you're leaving because they're an a__.
i got some big apologies when i was in that situ., but it was just too late.
stick up for yourself - you'll be respected for it later -
i promise.
sounds like you're with a person known as a wolf man.........
yeah I was totally agreeing with you and thinking wow sterling hall speaks sense - then you say 'do it in an email if you can't say it face to face'. I think you are right about everything except that, if you can't say it to someone's face then don't say it. Thats what i reckon - even if it is harder, at least they won't be saying 'couldn't even say it to my face...' as you walk away from the job.
MADianito,
I don't have time to fully answer to your dilemma you had at Enrique Norten's office. Just to say I also worked there and I can understand what you went through. I can say it was a tough office to work at. But I will say this for Enrique, he recognizes all his employees (past, present and future) when he publishes his work. He is one of the few architects that will include you on this list, even if you just drew the bathrooms on a project. And he makes sure a list will be included when his work is published. It may be a difficult office but he helps you if you need it. I appreciate Enrique for this.
if you are at a big enough firm to have an HR report him. you shouldnt have to experience that at work.
just a quick question MAD, would you go to an interview slamming Norten the way you have done here?
you know what MAD, i take that back, because seeing your blog and listing Norten as an architect you have worked for, you are an ass.
You must be stern when they are stern.
Good god. Fortunately I have had really great luck with actual employers When i was an intern, one sexually harassed me, and others were rude to me - but those were easy to leave as I was not financially dependent so I just quit.
My bosses right now are great. They are nice to sit down and talk to. They buy us lunch a couple times a week and make a coffee/pastry run for us on every day that isn't insanely busy. They know I am a recent graduate so they are happy to teach me what I need to know to do my job better, rather than screaming at me for messing up or not knowing. We leave the office when we're done with the work, which is anywhere between 4:30 and 5:30 normally. The latest i ever stayed was 8pm and that was the two days after I got back from taking a couple days off for a wedding - which they allowed me to attend without docking my pay or using up actual vacation days because I caught up my work when I came back. Everyone I work with is really nice to be around and overall I couldn't ask for a better environment.
My point is that there ARE amazing, nice employers in the design world. They are not all arrogant and rude. So work for the good ones, not the jerks you are unfortunately stuck with right now. Those awful people will either get sick of their high turnover rate and change their business practices (unlikely) or they will *always* be frustrated and they will *always* have tense environments and *never* have employees who are happy and therefore better workers. Their loss!
LaTorpilleRose !
where did you get that etch-a-sketch-ware? :-)
(javascript? java applet?)
'God didn't make little green apples', but maybe starbucks will soon sell little green applets.
if employees had better mobility (in context of this topic: if employees wouldn't suffer job-bounce stigma), then rotten employers would go bankrupt.
('you may say i'm a dreamer. but i'm not the only one' etc :-) )
I guess there's always a price to pay for a better job - higher salary - more responisibility, etc. He obviously finds it difficult to keep staff. Get some assertiveness training, get a life outside the office, then start looking around for an equally challenging job. It doesn't sound as though you've got fifteen children and a mortgate, so you're free as a bird.
you should have no trouble finding another job at a firm that respects you as both an employee and a person. i work for a small firm in southern california and we have been looking for a project manager for over a month; last week, we got a call from a firm a half hour away that was desperate for a project manager and was calling around to see if anyone had any tips on how to advertise! do not settle for less than you are worth in terms of either your salary or the respect that your employer offers you.
i am a 22 yr old woman at a firm whose gender composition has varied from 5:1 to 4:3 men vs. women over the time i have been employed there, and i have never had a problem with sexual politics. i think this is due to the attitude of the principal, which influences his decisions on who to hire. conscientious employers tend to hire only conscientious employees; conversely, abusive employers are surrounded by employees who are either subservient or abusive themselves. it sounds as though your fellow employees have become complacent so i doubt you will get much help from them. unless you feel like documenting everything and fighting a costly/time consuming court battle, i would say that the best course of action would be to find another job and then quit your current one, stating politely but firmly in a letter or in person to your current boss the reasons that you are leaving the job. maybe i am being pessimistic, but i am willing to bet that if you leave the door open to negotiation and your boss persuades you to stay, the situation won't improve enough to justify staying. even if the boss' attitude toward you changes some, you will probably never be fully comfortable either with the boss or the other pushover employees.
lastly, i do not think you should not take a job at a firm with "better design" over a job where you will be respected for your talents. i am sure there are those on this forum who would disagree and say that it's just one of the sacrifices you have to make in order to do good design. but any kind of sycophant can work for a big name architect and absorb the firm's style and process (not that i assume you are doing this, i am just trying to make a point). what kind of process is that, anyway, if it requires you to abuse the employees to get your projects done? and what kind of style can't be thoroughly absorbed from the books in the friendly local university library? why not evolve your own process by working for an ethical employer who appreciates the contributions of others and why not evolve your own style by using the freedom you will have to design things yourself rather than make the CDs for someone else's designs?
maybe i am either lucky in the jobs i have landed or young-and-wet-behind-the-ears (or both) but it seems to me like employers would not be able to pull these shenanigans if we didn't let them.
good luck with your job search!
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