"Architects as a general rule set themselves up for failure".
This is the reason I emphasized project management earlier. You do that portion right, your daily design issues are pure gravy, period!
It is important for all of us if we want to succeed financially in this profession, and grow as an industry as a whole, to change the current state of mind amongst architects.
Basically, if a client says, "your effort for my 5,000 SF house is only worth $1,500", we need to all collectively say, "go blow a squirrel’s butt-hole", stand up, and walk away. (And that means your comrade next door should not suddenly perk up and say, "Oh! – I’ll do it for less than $1,000, sir!â€...)
Like in any industry, Supply & Demand does not necessarily equate to cheap and cheaper. The sooner this point is made, and we infinitely echo this as a group, the sooner you will all be working from, let's say, 40-60k to 80-100k per year for your many years experience and ongoing 60 hour+ weeks, etc. (Of course I cannot speak on behalf of large corporations, but then again, over time supply & demand is gold if everyone walked out from an interview when an insulting salary was proposed!).
And just to be clear, the reason I said it is important for all of us to succeed financially in this profession, is to allow sustainability in devoting our time to truly deliver high design, and not carry the daily burden of how will I keep this practice without next month’s rent.
Basically, it's all Supply & Demand, and I began repeating to myself day by day, Don't Grow, Change!
(… at least we can begin to artificially inflate our fees collectively!)
For the record, I share only some thoughts on changing the process - I am a competitor, but believe as a group change must happen now.
""Pseudophilosophy is, as I have said, intellectual wankery. It might feel good, but it doesn't really do anyone ELSE any good. Great, someone can manipulate fancy words. Fabulous, I hope it was enjoyable.
If architectural theory spent more time thinking about construction techniques and funding basic research, THEN it might have something to contribute. Providing phrases for critics to sling around isn't much of a contribution." - MrBaboon a few pages back
Amen. This is what I've been saying for 8 years, dammit.
John E X - this discussion always goes round and round. One big problem, and one that the AIA has done a good job of avoiding, is that there are good architects and there are bad architects. I would never blindly recommend to someone to go hire and architect (without knowing what their work was like) as I've seen developer driven projects look much better than many/most architects.
We cannot blindly promote higher fees for architecture in general, we need to promote good architecture, and then those that can provide those skills will get more compensation. This is how the business world works, in general. Those that are good, have good marketing, are paid more. Those that suck, don't get paid as well.
I think people miss that all too often. Most architects don't know anything about contemporary design, about theory, or about Archinect!
"It might feel good, but it doesn't really do anyone ELSE any good. Great, someone can manipulate fancy words. Fabulous, I hope it was enjoyable." <= oozing humdrum bitterness
the Bel Society are now recruiting conservation architects for the Preserving the Seat of Life project. They shall deck themselves in vine and will be treading on attached dactyla hoofs. The US army has already clashed with them a few times when they tried carry on with Saddam's plans to lay bricks on the Nebuchadnezzar ruins. One young stud from the 1st infantry division in Taza whose neck had turned red under the glaring eye of Shamash was overheard asking permission from his commanding lieutenant (who is ricardo sanchez's cousin-twice-removed..he did leave his mark then) to shoot those "monkey-like obsessive brick-laying islamic fundamentalists". Permission was not granted..though they were given permission to shoot if any of the protesters enunciated A-l-l-a-h even in anagrammatic fashion.
Overall, i think this has been a very good discussion, and one we should all try to carry over into our own firms...change starts at you, afterall. Thanks to all that contributed...i think we can all get some intriguing discussions going with co-workers on this topic.
Regarding the AIA...i think their attempts to 'sell' architecture go largely ignored, but oh do they try. i have hanging on my desk a little pamphlet they put out a few years back, entitled;
'Architects Bite; This is one of the strange ideas people have about architects. Here are some others'.
Did anyone else see this? it was copyrighted in 1995.
actually architectural theory is doing just that currently. pushing technologies such as cnc milling, systems integrations, and the development of smart materials. see decoi, kennedy violich, kieran timberlake, peter testa, etc...
this is the use of theory as expansion of the current architectural dialogue.
How can we, as a profession, market ourselves to the general public???
parker, do you ever work?
itg2 - dead on...
"Architects as a general rule set themselves up for failure".
This is the reason I emphasized project management earlier. You do that portion right, your daily design issues are pure gravy, period!
It is important for all of us if we want to succeed financially in this profession, and grow as an industry as a whole, to change the current state of mind amongst architects.
Basically, if a client says, "your effort for my 5,000 SF house is only worth $1,500", we need to all collectively say, "go blow a squirrel’s butt-hole", stand up, and walk away. (And that means your comrade next door should not suddenly perk up and say, "Oh! – I’ll do it for less than $1,000, sir!â€...)
Like in any industry, Supply & Demand does not necessarily equate to cheap and cheaper. The sooner this point is made, and we infinitely echo this as a group, the sooner you will all be working from, let's say, 40-60k to 80-100k per year for your many years experience and ongoing 60 hour+ weeks, etc. (Of course I cannot speak on behalf of large corporations, but then again, over time supply & demand is gold if everyone walked out from an interview when an insulting salary was proposed!).
And just to be clear, the reason I said it is important for all of us to succeed financially in this profession, is to allow sustainability in devoting our time to truly deliver high design, and not carry the daily burden of how will I keep this practice without next month’s rent.
Basically, it's all Supply & Demand, and I began repeating to myself day by day, Don't Grow, Change!
(… at least we can begin to artificially inflate our fees collectively!)
For the record, I share only some thoughts on changing the process - I am a competitor, but believe as a group change must happen now.
""Pseudophilosophy is, as I have said, intellectual wankery. It might feel good, but it doesn't really do anyone ELSE any good. Great, someone can manipulate fancy words. Fabulous, I hope it was enjoyable.
If architectural theory spent more time thinking about construction techniques and funding basic research, THEN it might have something to contribute. Providing phrases for critics to sling around isn't much of a contribution." - MrBaboon a few pages back
Amen. This is what I've been saying for 8 years, dammit.
John E X - this discussion always goes round and round. One big problem, and one that the AIA has done a good job of avoiding, is that there are good architects and there are bad architects. I would never blindly recommend to someone to go hire and architect (without knowing what their work was like) as I've seen developer driven projects look much better than many/most architects.
We cannot blindly promote higher fees for architecture in general, we need to promote good architecture, and then those that can provide those skills will get more compensation. This is how the business world works, in general. Those that are good, have good marketing, are paid more. Those that suck, don't get paid as well.
I think people miss that all too often. Most architects don't know anything about contemporary design, about theory, or about Archinect!
"It might feel good, but it doesn't really do anyone ELSE any good. Great, someone can manipulate fancy words. Fabulous, I hope it was enjoyable." <= oozing humdrum bitterness
the Bel Society are now recruiting conservation architects for the Preserving the Seat of Life project. They shall deck themselves in vine and will be treading on attached dactyla hoofs. The US army has already clashed with them a few times when they tried carry on with Saddam's plans to lay bricks on the Nebuchadnezzar ruins. One young stud from the 1st infantry division in Taza whose neck had turned red under the glaring eye of Shamash was overheard asking permission from his commanding lieutenant (who is ricardo sanchez's cousin-twice-removed..he did leave his mark then) to shoot those "monkey-like obsessive brick-laying islamic fundamentalists". Permission was not granted..though they were given permission to shoot if any of the protesters enunciated A-l-l-a-h even in anagrammatic fashion.
Overall, i think this has been a very good discussion, and one we should all try to carry over into our own firms...change starts at you, afterall. Thanks to all that contributed...i think we can all get some intriguing discussions going with co-workers on this topic.
Regarding the AIA...i think their attempts to 'sell' architecture go largely ignored, but oh do they try. i have hanging on my desk a little pamphlet they put out a few years back, entitled;
'Architects Bite; This is one of the strange ideas people have about architects. Here are some others'.
Did anyone else see this? it was copyrighted in 1995.
actually architectural theory is doing just that currently. pushing technologies such as cnc milling, systems integrations, and the development of smart materials. see decoi, kennedy violich, kieran timberlake, peter testa, etc...
this is the use of theory as expansion of the current architectural dialogue.
Block this user
Are you sure you want to block this user and hide all related comments throughout the site?
Archinect
This is your first comment on Archinect. Your comment will be visible once approved.