Donna, I didn't mean to threaten you, I'm sorry, it was just an observation. And I have 8 years of experience working for architecture firms. I've also worked for engineers, subcontractors and manufacturers which I did to round out my experiences in architecture. I was a member of AIAS. The firms I worked at were all AIA members although I was not as an individual. I was the lead designer of a project that won one of the firms an AIA award though and I've been at their banquets and meetings and conventions and con eds many, many times.
I have been out in the woods all weekend, this thread really blew up while I was out.
And how recently, tintt? You've said yourself you haven't been an AIA member, and we know you haven't worked in a firm in, what, 5 years at least? Really, how much of an authority are you on what architectural culture is like these days?
And you're not threatening me, you're threatening the ability of this website to provide helpful information for serious questions without completely inundating the questioner with cynical attitude.
Yes, 5 years out of traditional practice. And my opinion is as valid as yours. Here is a fact though... the AIA is not the profession. The AIA is a professional club. Donna just did a nice job of helping prove my point that the AIA and its menbers wants people to believe they are one and the same. They are not.
Aug 2, 15 6:38 pm ·
·
Hold on!
Where did Donna actually say that?
Be careful with assumption of implied meaning because that is a slippery slope.
Richard, she said I wasn't familiar with the profession because I wasn't an AIA member.
Aug 2, 15 6:48 pm ·
·
"And how recently, tintt? You've said yourself you haven't been an AIA member, and we know you haven't worked in a firm in, what, 5 years at least? Really, how much of an authority are you on what architectural culture is like these days?
And you're not threatening me, you're threatening the ability of this website to provide helpful information for serious questions without completely inundating the questioner with cynical attitude."
tintt, this is what she said. She did not say you are not familiar with the profession because you were not an AIA member.
More precisely you referred that you haven't been an AIA member and that it known that you haven't worked in a firm in 5 years. Then goes on to the point of "How much of an authority are you on what architectural culture is like these days?"
First, you haven't been an AIA member so your authority on the subject of AIA is questionable.
Second, you haven't been employed by a firm in 5 years and her questioning your authority on the subject matter of 'architecture culture' is about your lack of recent employment.
HOWEVER, I think her argument is weak on that. The architecture culture hasn't change much in 5 years. The culture isn't magically going to change much today than it was 20 years ago.
I do not think the culture has changed much appreciably. It is a strong argument that your lack of AIA membership doesn't necessarily make you the strongest authority of AIA. However, I agree with you that you been to AIA events and activities because may have an idea what AIA is like in your area as an AIA member in your area would. What you wouldn't have is voting rights on matters requiring voting. This doesn't mean you have not had opportunity to observe.
I'm not against your point but you were starting to go on a misstep. Take a step back and rethink your argument points.
I said the contracts were useful, which was one of the nicer things said in this thread. Let's get back to saying good things about the AIA, please. Don't pay any attention to me, a non-member. Please, don't let me get in the way, I am not important enough to warrant so much attention.
As for whether or not I am in touch with the profession or not, I offer this: my best friend writes questions for the ARE and she will ask me questions and takes my thoughts and opinions seriously. She is not an AIA member either, BTW, but is of course a licensed architect. Who doesn't work in traditional practice I might add.
the club is not in touch with the profession, but its not a profession as FLW says......if i were to join i would only push to disolve the organization.........and yeah its annoying to tell people RA is registered and not AIA, wonder how the public got so misinformed?
Richard is just sad. You want to help him, or kick his ass into gear. But everyone who tries gets sucked up in his endless loops of excuses, until they concede that it's hopeless because he's his own biggest obstacle. This is why birds kick the babies out of the nest after a while, if they don't launch on their own. Richard's parents should have booted him out 15 years ago.
As for the AIA: maybe its usefulness varies by Chapter. I haven't found that ours does anything much of interest - and suggesting things of interest is invariably met with "there's no funding for that." I'm a member because my employer wants all licensed staff to be members and pays all the dues. If not for that I don't think I'd stay in it.
Actually, tintt, I take back everything I said about your authority: you are absolutely correct in your interpretation of things according to your own worldview. The fact that every single thing you look at is insufficient and lame and unchanging certainly has more to do with the true state of things than with your own bad attitude.
BTW did you know that AIA Colorado is leading the country in their RePositioning efforts, and all the other states are looking to you as a model? But never mind, they never change.
Everything that needed to be said on this thread really was said by David Cole, who I'll quote here:
The "unlicensed worker bees" already have an organization, and it's called being an Associate member of the AIA. They even have their own national committee, activities and meetings throughout the year, and a significant presence at the national conventions.
Funny how the people who complain the most about lack of representation at the AIA are usually the ones who can't be bothered to get involved.
As for membership dues, they're completely free for the first 18 months after graduation (including free admission to the national convention). After that, any employer worth their salt should be reimbursing you for AIA membership dues; this is a pretty standard benefit at most firms. If your firm is too cheap to offer that, then maybe it's time to consider a job change.
My world view? That the AIA is not the profession? There are plenty of people in this forum and the fact that you choose to single me out says a lot about you.
Colorado also has an alternative to the AIA.
I'm inclined to write a letter to your AIA chapter to inform them if your behavior on this thread. Aren't there ethical standards for AIA members? Like not attacking other professionals for their "worldview"? Which is what? That we can do better? That there is a big world outside of architecture?
"I'm inclined to write a letter to your AIA chapter to inform them if your behavior on this thread."
says the anonymously posting interweb surfer.
oh brother.
say what you will about the AIA, but Donna is making a great case to join.
The straight talk, reasoning, and lack of mincing of words is impressive.
Seems reasonable to conclude that tintt isn't licensed therefore can't join the AIA even if the desire was there?
Is this one of those penile envy situations?
Its one thing to be licensed and capable of joining yet decline for whatever reason. Its another to badmouth the AIA when membership isn't even in the realm of possibility.
No one need go any further for evidence that licensure is necessary in order to isolate and quarantine the dross than a certain poster's ceaseless inane babbling.
For one thing: smart, capable disciplined people as embodied in building owners, facility management, building officials, A/E/C professionals etc etc want to walk into a room and/or send written correspondence to discuss their building problems with architects and engineers as they work through problems of importance. Not the hordes of unlicensed/ unregistered wannabes who would inevitably clutter the air with their useless blather.
Ultimately, generally speaking, the process of education, experience and examination is more effective than not in culling the relatively undisciplined, uneducated, inexperienced and unintelligent from muddying up the process of problem solving.
After that, any employer worth their salt should be reimbursing you for AIA membership dues; this is a pretty standard benefit at most firms. If your firm is too cheap to offer that, then maybe it's time to consider a job change.
This is a ridiculous statement. Being a member of the AIA has nothing to do with being a good architect "worth their salt" or having a good practice.
I disagree Cis. I'd be willing to bet there is a high correlation between AIA membership and better architects (more profitable) and better practices (more profitable).
I'm sorry, GK, I don't find profitability to be the measure of a good architect. I suppose it could be one of many measures but not the first one I would look for. But if we are all going to pull random correlations out of our bottoms that are virtually impossible to prove or disprove, I would be willing to bet that there is a high correlation between AIA membership and Frank Gehry's infamous 98%.
I stopped reading the posts because Balkins hi-jacked yet another site! I have a couple of things to say about that:
First, Richard, if you put as much effort into obtaining your license as you do ranting on these message boards, you would have your license by now! Second, I have no use for people would make excuses as to why their lives aren't the way they should be. Your live is the way it is because of the choices that you made. If you want things to be different in the future, you have to change what you are doing now. Also, if you were such a good building designer with many clients, how do you get the time to post such long diatribes on message boards? I'm sure this is not the only message board that you are on. This must be a full time job for you! Stop making excuses, get off your duff and just do it.
(I'm sure he will post a long rebuttal to this post about how he can't become an architect...blah, blah, blah!)
Describing what's happening in NYC would probably take hours of writing. And the AIA is actually trying to respond to it. it's extremely evident in their event programming; they are trying to cater to a pretty diverse crowd.
Cisellicious, I don't *at all* dispute your last sentence, LOL, but I do think firms that care about mentoring younger members of the profession, and thus show a commitment to the betterment of the profession, encourage active participation in social culture, one aspect of which is AIA membership. Every firm I've worked in since licensure has paid for either all or part of AIA mbership.
Again, the AIA is not profession. They are not one and the same. Should I draw a picture? And I wasn't aware I was kicked out of the profession, did you have my degree rescinded? I am not in a traditional path, but I thought you liked people who are taking their design skills outside of buildings (referring to that great article you posted last week). I do that, that is me. I help kids and adults with learning disabilities. I work with kids with autism, I invent games for them and draw pictures for them. I am helping some students design and build a shed. But I accept your disdain for me, Donna. But it hurts.
For one thing: smart, capable disciplined people as embodied in building owners, facility management, building officials, A/E/C professionals etc etc want to walk into a room and/or send written correspondence to discuss their building problems with architects and engineers as they work through problems of importance. Not the hordes of unlicensed/ unregistered wannabes who would inevitably clutter the air with their useless blather.
Ultimately, generally speaking, the process of education, experience and examination is more effective than not in culling the relatively undisciplined, uneducated, inexperienced and unintelligent from muddying up the process of problem solving.
This is beyond foolish and arrogant. It demonstrates a very narrow perspective that I suspect translates into a limited ability to solve creative problems...
An architectural degree =/= a professional architect. You are even less part of the profession if you've not even been practicing within a firm composed of (licensed) architects for years.
Nice attempt at a stretch, though. Almost as convincing as Rick B's.
jla said, "This is beyond foolish and arrogant. It demonstrates a very narrow perspective that I suspect translates into a limited ability to solve creative problems..."
Would you elaborate, please?
I suppose a perspective that focuses exclusively on building design and construction is what you and your 'broad-minded' (undisciplined/ unfocused/ unlicensed/ unexperienced/ unexamined) cohorts who are against licensing because you can't hack it would define as a very narrow perspective.
Oh please. Pay the price to gain the education, experience, and examination and just become a bonafide architect already. If its not within the realm of possibility admit it and move on to something else.
...like 'doctor of design' pfffft. Puhlease. So pathetic.
Promotes design excellence and outstanding professional achievement through an awards program
While the AIA is not "the profession" it is the only meaningful voice and the predominant meaningful practice resource available to the profession.
If the AIA has weaknesses and flaws (and it does) those weaknesses and flaws can be fixed only if a sufficient number of Architects join, participate, make known what they want from the Institute, and support constructive efforts to make those goals achievable.
Carping about the AIA from the outside is, IMHO, a meaningless exercise.
GK, I do small freelance design jobs, basements, baths, stuff you won't do but need to be done. Why do I have to work in a firm? I don't want to work in a firm making plans on CAD. I like being self employed, I have worked really hard at it to make it work. This is absurd. Haters.
I've been thinking, maybe I should get licensed, join AIA. Is there need or want for small time entrepreneurs like me in AIA? I could use some more positive role models and mentors.
GK, I do small freelance design jobs, basements, baths, stuff you won't do but need to be done. Why do I have to work in a firm? I don't want to work in a firm making plans on CAD. I like being self employed, I have worked really hard at it to make it work. This is absurd. Haters.
tintt, for one thing buildings embody mountains of potential energy stored in roofs, ceilings and floors suspended in some cases a thousand + feet above the heads of buildings' occupants. There is this thing called life safety. Architects require a license to practice for the same reasons surgeons go through the education, experience, examination, and continuing education to earn a license to practice surgery. There are a host of other reasons of course.
I don't think the founder of archinect is a licensed architect. I suspect he isn't an AIA member either. Is he a poser wannabe loser too?
How is a license to practice architecture and AIA membership requisite to establishing a website? I doubt the founders of google are FAIA either but I fail to see the point here.
I've been thinking, maybe I should get licensed, join AIA. Is there need or want for small time entrepreneurs like me in AIA? I could use some more positive role models and mentors
Why not?
As a licensed, practicing architect I'm no fan of the AIA -far far from it- but Donna, among others, has gotten me thinking lately that perhaps if I make it worth the membership it just might be...
I think you are confused, GK. That is not an answer to why I should have to work in a firm. I understand life safety.
The founder of archinect is clearly engaged in the profession but by the definition given to me above, he would also not be considered in the profession nor knowledgeable about anything pertaining to the profession. Clearly that is not the case, or none of us would be here reading the news.
An architectural degree =/= a professional architect. You are even less part of the profession if you've not even been practicing within a firm composed of (licensed) architects for years.
Total disagreement there. I spent a little bit of time "out of the profession". Came back with what amounts to a huge cache of weapons and contacts. Why did I do that? Because architecture favors indentured servitude to a master architect. Any other path is seen as less legitimate (as exemplified with that comment). I got my professional validation from people outside of the profession, and came back to it with a nice big seal of approval which was the best way (that I could find) of leapfrogging the "council of elders".
tintt - not sure if your comment "Is there need or want for small time entrepreneurs like me in AIA?" is meant to be serious or not.
But, assuming it is serious, there is a very active and tight-knit Knowledge Community in AIA called the "Small Project Practitioners" that focuses entirely on issues related to practicing professionals engaged in the general scale of work you undertake.
Also, the last time I saw research figures related to membership, the vast majority of AIA members work in very small firms - i.e. < 5 people. That may not still be the case, but my experience with AIA suggests that it is.
tintt, your endless disdain for the profession that you couldn't hack, disdain that you trumpet here at every opportunity, is why I direct anger at you. I have huge respect for people who leave architecture to pursue alternate careers but manage to do so without hard feelings. Your career path seems lovely; it's filling a need, it gives you pleasure and satisfaction that you're doing good work in the world. Architecture does the same for me, but you take every opportunity here to tell anyone who feels that same that we're idiots.
The founder of archinect is clearly engaged in the profession but by the definition given to me above, he would also not be considered in the profession nor knowledgeable about anything pertaining to the profession. Clearly that is not the case, or none of us would be here reading the news.
How is establishing a website (as well as running it I suppose) engaging in the practice of architecture?
Broad strokes allow for very broad confusion. Your concept of the profession of architecture is whacked. Its probably okay if comfort is found in the herd. The confused herd is large indeed. Nothing special or unique about the confusion. These are indeed interesting times. A lot of folks speak but don't even know what they are saying...much less why.
Total disagreement there. I spent a little bit of time "out of the profession". Came back with what amounts to a huge cache of weapons and contacts. Why did I do that? Because architecture favors indentured servitude to a master architect. Any other path is seen as less legitimate (as exemplified with that comment). I got my professional validation from people outside of the profession, and came back to it with a nice big seal of approval which was the best way (that I could find) of leapfrogging the "council of elders".
Maybe you are right null pointer. Only if you were licensed before you left and after your return. (i.e. you have to be licensed to be in the profession in the first place prior to leaving as well as to come back).
'Indentured servitude' is different than gaining professional experience under a master architect.
Yes, any path other than the basic education, experience, and examination under the shepherd-ing of a master architect is definitively less legitimate.
Cutting corners is never advisable. If only for the single reason that you know you've cut them.
If you approach life like that...sooner or later...what did Mr. Miyagi in the Karate Kid say? *squish: just like grape*
I didn't realize I made you feel like an idiot, Donna, sorry. I will take more care in the future to curb my experiences and opinions so you won't be bothered. There are plenty of other people that have expressed disdain for the profession, don't put it all on me.
Choosing to leave and couldn't hack it are different. Why do you think I couldn't "hack" it? I think this is just what you want to believe. I "hacked" into another profession, which was really hard and frustrating but I did it. We are working hard, doing very well, we drove our corporate competitor out of town, that would be my partner's former employer who set up an office .25 miles away from us and operated there for 3 years before giving up. I have a lot of drive and ambition that I got from architecture and it helped us do that, to problem solve, visualize and be great, to be better than an international brand with a solid reputation because we had an edge. I give much of the credit to my success in my other work to the skills I built in architecture. I say stuff like that all the time on archinect too. I love architecture.
quizzical, It was a serious question. Thanks. I am really, really small time, more like a hobby. But maybe there is a place for me. There is definitely work there, I could do all the basements I want but do need support and guidance still.
AIA
Donna, I didn't mean to threaten you, I'm sorry, it was just an observation. And I have 8 years of experience working for architecture firms. I've also worked for engineers, subcontractors and manufacturers which I did to round out my experiences in architecture. I was a member of AIAS. The firms I worked at were all AIA members although I was not as an individual. I was the lead designer of a project that won one of the firms an AIA award though and I've been at their banquets and meetings and conventions and con eds many, many times.
I have been out in the woods all weekend, this thread really blew up while I was out.
null pointer,
Enroll with what money?
And how recently, tintt? You've said yourself you haven't been an AIA member, and we know you haven't worked in a firm in, what, 5 years at least? Really, how much of an authority are you on what architectural culture is like these days?
And you're not threatening me, you're threatening the ability of this website to provide helpful information for serious questions without completely inundating the questioner with cynical attitude.
Yes, 5 years out of traditional practice. And my opinion is as valid as yours. Here is a fact though... the AIA is not the profession. The AIA is a professional club. Donna just did a nice job of helping prove my point that the AIA and its menbers wants people to believe they are one and the same. They are not.
Hold on!
Where did Donna actually say that?
Be careful with assumption of implied meaning because that is a slippery slope.
Richard, she said I wasn't familiar with the profession because I wasn't an AIA member.
"And how recently, tintt? You've said yourself you haven't been an AIA member, and we know you haven't worked in a firm in, what, 5 years at least? Really, how much of an authority are you on what architectural culture is like these days?
And you're not threatening me, you're threatening the ability of this website to provide helpful information for serious questions without completely inundating the questioner with cynical attitude."
tintt, this is what she said. She did not say you are not familiar with the profession because you were not an AIA member.
More precisely you referred that you haven't been an AIA member and that it known that you haven't worked in a firm in 5 years. Then goes on to the point of "How much of an authority are you on what architectural culture is like these days?"
First, you haven't been an AIA member so your authority on the subject of AIA is questionable.
Second, you haven't been employed by a firm in 5 years and her questioning your authority on the subject matter of 'architecture culture' is about your lack of recent employment.
HOWEVER, I think her argument is weak on that. The architecture culture hasn't change much in 5 years. The culture isn't magically going to change much today than it was 20 years ago.
I do not think the culture has changed much appreciably. It is a strong argument that your lack of AIA membership doesn't necessarily make you the strongest authority of AIA. However, I agree with you that you been to AIA events and activities because may have an idea what AIA is like in your area as an AIA member in your area would. What you wouldn't have is voting rights on matters requiring voting. This doesn't mean you have not had opportunity to observe.
I'm not against your point but you were starting to go on a misstep. Take a step back and rethink your argument points.
Just an point.
I said the contracts were useful, which was one of the nicer things said in this thread. Let's get back to saying good things about the AIA, please. Don't pay any attention to me, a non-member. Please, don't let me get in the way, I am not important enough to warrant so much attention.
Dick: Take. out. loans.
If you don't believe that you're worth such an investment, consider a different career (seriously). Everyone has different aptitudes, right?
As for whether or not I am in touch with the profession or not, I offer this: my best friend writes questions for the ARE and she will ask me questions and takes my thoughts and opinions seriously. She is not an AIA member either, BTW, but is of course a licensed architect. Who doesn't work in traditional practice I might add.
why does anyone take Dick $o seriously.....ok carry on
the club is not in touch with the profession, but its not a profession as FLW says......if i were to join i would only push to disolve the organization.........and yeah its annoying to tell people RA is registered and not AIA, wonder how the public got so misinformed?
Richard is just sad. You want to help him, or kick his ass into gear. But everyone who tries gets sucked up in his endless loops of excuses, until they concede that it's hopeless because he's his own biggest obstacle. This is why birds kick the babies out of the nest after a while, if they don't launch on their own. Richard's parents should have booted him out 15 years ago.
As for the AIA: maybe its usefulness varies by Chapter. I haven't found that ours does anything much of interest - and suggesting things of interest is invariably met with "there's no funding for that." I'm a member because my employer wants all licensed staff to be members and pays all the dues. If not for that I don't think I'd stay in it.
Actually, tintt, I take back everything I said about your authority: you are absolutely correct in your interpretation of things according to your own worldview. The fact that every single thing you look at is insufficient and lame and unchanging certainly has more to do with the true state of things than with your own bad attitude.
BTW did you know that AIA Colorado is leading the country in their RePositioning efforts, and all the other states are looking to you as a model? But never mind, they never change.
Everything that needed to be said on this thread really was said by David Cole, who I'll quote here:
The "unlicensed worker bees" already have an organization, and it's called being an Associate member of the AIA. They even have their own national committee, activities and meetings throughout the year, and a significant presence at the national conventions.
Funny how the people who complain the most about lack of representation at the AIA are usually the ones who can't be bothered to get involved.
As for membership dues, they're completely free for the first 18 months after graduation (including free admission to the national convention). After that, any employer worth their salt should be reimbursing you for AIA membership dues; this is a pretty standard benefit at most firms. If your firm is too cheap to offer that, then maybe it's time to consider a job change.
My world view? That the AIA is not the profession? There are plenty of people in this forum and the fact that you choose to single me out says a lot about you. Colorado also has an alternative to the AIA.
I'm inclined to write a letter to your AIA chapter to inform them if your behavior on this thread. Aren't there ethical standards for AIA members? Like not attacking other professionals for their "worldview"? Which is what? That we can do better? That there is a big world outside of architecture?
Yes, it does say a lot about me: it says that I've listened to your crappy attitude here on Archinect for 15 years and am sick of it.
And every state has alternatives to the AIA. They're full of whiners who don't get it.
Oh, ok.
"I'm inclined to write a letter to your AIA chapter to inform them if your behavior on this thread."
says the anonymously posting interweb surfer.
oh brother.
say what you will about the AIA, but Donna is making a great case to join.
The straight talk, reasoning, and lack of mincing of words is impressive.
Seems reasonable to conclude that tintt isn't licensed therefore can't join the AIA even if the desire was there?
Is this one of those penile envy situations?
Its one thing to be licensed and capable of joining yet decline for whatever reason. Its another to badmouth the AIA when membership isn't even in the realm of possibility.
Please do write that letter, tintt. Go for it. It will be exceptionally well-received, I'm sure.
so much stupid.
No one need go any further for evidence that licensure is necessary in order to isolate and quarantine the dross than a certain poster's ceaseless inane babbling.
For one thing: smart, capable disciplined people as embodied in building owners, facility management, building officials, A/E/C professionals etc etc want to walk into a room and/or send written correspondence to discuss their building problems with architects and engineers as they work through problems of importance. Not the hordes of unlicensed/ unregistered wannabes who would inevitably clutter the air with their useless blather.
Ultimately, generally speaking, the process of education, experience and examination is more effective than not in culling the relatively undisciplined, uneducated, inexperienced and unintelligent from muddying up the process of problem solving.
Filtration is effective.
Ok.
So if the AIA is so amazing, why are they trying to change?
After that, any employer worth their salt should be reimbursing you for AIA membership dues; this is a pretty standard benefit at most firms. If your firm is too cheap to offer that, then maybe it's time to consider a job change.
This is a ridiculous statement. Being a member of the AIA has nothing to do with being a good architect "worth their salt" or having a good practice.
I disagree Cis. I'd be willing to bet there is a high correlation between AIA membership and better architects (more profitable) and better practices (more profitable).
I'm sorry, GK, I don't find profitability to be the measure of a good architect. I suppose it could be one of many measures but not the first one I would look for. But if we are all going to pull random correlations out of our bottoms that are virtually impossible to prove or disprove, I would be willing to bet that there is a high correlation between AIA membership and Frank Gehry's infamous 98%.
I stopped reading the posts because Balkins hi-jacked yet another site! I have a couple of things to say about that:
First, Richard, if you put as much effort into obtaining your license as you do ranting on these message boards, you would have your license by now! Second, I have no use for people would make excuses as to why their lives aren't the way they should be. Your live is the way it is because of the choices that you made. If you want things to be different in the future, you have to change what you are doing now. Also, if you were such a good building designer with many clients, how do you get the time to post such long diatribes on message boards? I'm sure this is not the only message board that you are on. This must be a full time job for you! Stop making excuses, get off your duff and just do it.
(I'm sure he will post a long rebuttal to this post about how he can't become an architect...blah, blah, blah!)
Yup, they really are trying.
Describing what's happening in NYC would probably take hours of writing. And the AIA is actually trying to respond to it. it's extremely evident in their event programming; they are trying to cater to a pretty diverse crowd.
Again, the AIA is not profession. They are not one and the same. Should I draw a picture? And I wasn't aware I was kicked out of the profession, did you have my degree rescinded? I am not in a traditional path, but I thought you liked people who are taking their design skills outside of buildings (referring to that great article you posted last week). I do that, that is me. I help kids and adults with learning disabilities. I work with kids with autism, I invent games for them and draw pictures for them. I am helping some students design and build a shed. But I accept your disdain for me, Donna. But it hurts.
For one thing: smart, capable disciplined people as embodied in building owners, facility management, building officials, A/E/C professionals etc etc want to walk into a room and/or send written correspondence to discuss their building problems with architects and engineers as they work through problems of importance. Not the hordes of unlicensed/ unregistered wannabes who would inevitably clutter the air with their useless blather.
Ultimately, generally speaking, the process of education, experience and examination is more effective than not in culling the relatively undisciplined, uneducated, inexperienced and unintelligent from muddying up the process of problem solving.
This is beyond foolish and arrogant. It demonstrates a very narrow perspective that I suspect translates into a limited ability to solve creative problems...
An architectural degree =/= a professional architect. You are even less part of the profession if you've not even been practicing within a firm composed of (licensed) architects for years.
Nice attempt at a stretch, though. Almost as convincing as Rick B's.
jla said, "This is beyond foolish and arrogant. It demonstrates a very narrow perspective that I suspect translates into a limited ability to solve creative problems..."
Would you elaborate, please?
I suppose a perspective that focuses exclusively on building design and construction is what you and your 'broad-minded' (undisciplined/ unfocused/ unlicensed/ unexperienced/ unexamined) cohorts who are against licensing because you can't hack it would define as a very narrow perspective.
Oh please. Pay the price to gain the education, experience, and examination and just become a bonafide architect already. If its not within the realm of possibility admit it and move on to something else.
...like 'doctor of design' pfffft. Puhlease. So pathetic.
The AIA serves as the voice of the architecture profession and the resource for our members in service to society.
We carry out our goal through advocacy, information, and community. Each year the AIA
While the AIA is not "the profession" it is the only meaningful voice and the predominant meaningful practice resource available to the profession.
If the AIA has weaknesses and flaws (and it does) those weaknesses and flaws can be fixed only if a sufficient number of Architects join, participate, make known what they want from the Institute, and support constructive efforts to make those goals achievable.
Carping about the AIA from the outside is, IMHO, a meaningless exercise.
GK, I do small freelance design jobs, basements, baths, stuff you won't do but need to be done. Why do I have to work in a firm? I don't want to work in a firm making plans on CAD. I like being self employed, I have worked really hard at it to make it work. This is absurd. Haters.
I don't think the founder of archinect is a licensed architect. I suspect he isn't an AIA member either. Is he a poser wannabe loser too?
I've been thinking, maybe I should get licensed, join AIA. Is there need or want for small time entrepreneurs like me in AIA? I could use some more positive role models and mentors.
mj, so what did you decide, are you joining?
GK, I do small freelance design jobs, basements, baths, stuff you won't do but need to be done. Why do I have to work in a firm? I don't want to work in a firm making plans on CAD. I like being self employed, I have worked really hard at it to make it work. This is absurd. Haters.
tintt, for one thing buildings embody mountains of potential energy stored in roofs, ceilings and floors suspended in some cases a thousand + feet above the heads of buildings' occupants. There is this thing called life safety. Architects require a license to practice for the same reasons surgeons go through the education, experience, examination, and continuing education to earn a license to practice surgery. There are a host of other reasons of course.
I don't think the founder of archinect is a licensed architect. I suspect he isn't an AIA member either. Is he a poser wannabe loser too?
How is a license to practice architecture and AIA membership requisite to establishing a website? I doubt the founders of google are FAIA either but I fail to see the point here.
I've been thinking, maybe I should get licensed, join AIA. Is there need or want for small time entrepreneurs like me in AIA? I could use some more positive role models and mentors
Why not?
As a licensed, practicing architect I'm no fan of the AIA -far far from it- but Donna, among others, has gotten me thinking lately that perhaps if I make it worth the membership it just might be...
I think you are confused, GK. That is not an answer to why I should have to work in a firm. I understand life safety.
The founder of archinect is clearly engaged in the profession but by the definition given to me above, he would also not be considered in the profession nor knowledgeable about anything pertaining to the profession. Clearly that is not the case, or none of us would be here reading the news.
Good Knight, you aren't a member? That's hilarious. I think you should join.
An architectural degree =/= a professional architect. You are even less part of the profession if you've not even been practicing within a firm composed of (licensed) architects for years.
Total disagreement there. I spent a little bit of time "out of the profession". Came back with what amounts to a huge cache of weapons and contacts. Why did I do that? Because architecture favors indentured servitude to a master architect. Any other path is seen as less legitimate (as exemplified with that comment). I got my professional validation from people outside of the profession, and came back to it with a nice big seal of approval which was the best way (that I could find) of leapfrogging the "council of elders".
tintt - not sure if your comment "Is there need or want for small time entrepreneurs like me in AIA?" is meant to be serious or not.
But, assuming it is serious, there is a very active and tight-knit Knowledge Community in AIA called the "Small Project Practitioners" that focuses entirely on issues related to practicing professionals engaged in the general scale of work you undertake.
see: http://network.aia.org/smallprojectpractitioners/home/
Also, the last time I saw research figures related to membership, the vast majority of AIA members work in very small firms - i.e. < 5 people. That may not still be the case, but my experience with AIA suggests that it is.
tintt, your endless disdain for the profession that you couldn't hack, disdain that you trumpet here at every opportunity, is why I direct anger at you. I have huge respect for people who leave architecture to pursue alternate careers but manage to do so without hard feelings. Your career path seems lovely; it's filling a need, it gives you pleasure and satisfaction that you're doing good work in the world. Architecture does the same for me, but you take every opportunity here to tell anyone who feels that same that we're idiots.
The founder of archinect is clearly engaged in the profession but by the definition given to me above, he would also not be considered in the profession nor knowledgeable about anything pertaining to the profession. Clearly that is not the case, or none of us would be here reading the news.
How is establishing a website (as well as running it I suppose) engaging in the practice of architecture?
Broad strokes allow for very broad confusion. Your concept of the profession of architecture is whacked. Its probably okay if comfort is found in the herd. The confused herd is large indeed. Nothing special or unique about the confusion. These are indeed interesting times. A lot of folks speak but don't even know what they are saying...much less why.
Total disagreement there. I spent a little bit of time "out of the profession". Came back with what amounts to a huge cache of weapons and contacts. Why did I do that? Because architecture favors indentured servitude to a master architect. Any other path is seen as less legitimate (as exemplified with that comment). I got my professional validation from people outside of the profession, and came back to it with a nice big seal of approval which was the best way (that I could find) of leapfrogging the "council of elders".
Maybe you are right null pointer. Only if you were licensed before you left and after your return. (i.e. you have to be licensed to be in the profession in the first place prior to leaving as well as to come back).
'Indentured servitude' is different than gaining professional experience under a master architect.
Yes, any path other than the basic education, experience, and examination under the shepherd-ing of a master architect is definitively less legitimate.
Cutting corners is never advisable. If only for the single reason that you know you've cut them.
If you approach life like that...sooner or later...what did Mr. Miyagi in the Karate Kid say? *squish: just like grape*
tintt: I found this data online: "As of 2013, 63 percent of all AIA member–owned architecture firms had fewer than five employees."
Source link: http://www.aia.org/practicing/AIAB104583
I didn't realize I made you feel like an idiot, Donna, sorry. I will take more care in the future to curb my experiences and opinions so you won't be bothered. There are plenty of other people that have expressed disdain for the profession, don't put it all on me.
Choosing to leave and couldn't hack it are different. Why do you think I couldn't "hack" it? I think this is just what you want to believe. I "hacked" into another profession, which was really hard and frustrating but I did it. We are working hard, doing very well, we drove our corporate competitor out of town, that would be my partner's former employer who set up an office .25 miles away from us and operated there for 3 years before giving up. I have a lot of drive and ambition that I got from architecture and it helped us do that, to problem solve, visualize and be great, to be better than an international brand with a solid reputation because we had an edge. I give much of the credit to my success in my other work to the skills I built in architecture. I say stuff like that all the time on archinect too. I love architecture.
quizzical, It was a serious question. Thanks. I am really, really small time, more like a hobby. But maybe there is a place for me. There is definitely work there, I could do all the basements I want but do need support and guidance still.
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