I think that Cruijff also got a lot of recognition in Barcelona, not only because he was a great player and awesome coach, but simply for naming his son "jordi". I think there's always been a strong connection between Barca and Holland, be it Cruyff, Michels, Neeskens, Koeman, Rijkaard, Kluivert, De Boer, Overmars, Van Bronckhorst etcetera. The style of football always used to be similar since the seventies, I believe that Michels and Cruijff introduced the holland'74-style football to barcelona, and they based a typical style (similar to the ajax-style) on that.
And Messi is a wonderful player. However, wouldn't he be playing in a team with other brilliant midfield-players (like Xavi or Iniesta), he wouldn't nearly be as great with Barcelona, as the argentina national team shows...
Emilio, I know what Xavi thinks of Messi... those words you're quoting, he has been saying that all this past season.
And I know Messi is probably the best player in the world -or one of the top 3-, but without Xavi he can't show it so easily. Yes, Messi can assist goals -somehting, by the way, he has learned to do this season too, I don't remember him doin' so many assists during the 2009 Barça treble-, but it's not really his 'job' -or maybe it is in Argentina, but not in Barça-.
About the word nazi... I could have used the word Mussolini. In fact, I could use, simply, the word Franco. They are all the same. Guess how many Spanish flags with the fascist eagle -not the Constitutional Spanish flag, that only has the royal crown emblem-, I saw yesterday in some balconies -and even a couple of assholes in a bike and waving that shit-.. and this was Barcelona, I can't imagine how many there were in Madrid or other places in deep Spain. Of course, TV news reporters will never show them.. you know, it's not good publicity. I already said it was an extreme comparison...but that does not mean it can't be a valid one.
usernametaken,
yes Cruyff (or Cruijff?) brought that style in Barça in the first 1990s -we called it the Dream Team, after the 1992 Magic-Jordan-Bird team in the Barcelona Olympic Games-... and Rijkaard and Guardiola (even van Gaal in some way) have been perfecting it with time...
Probably the culmination of that style of playing was the 2009 treble. That was an amazing year.
As it is in Barca, I think Messi should be the one receiving the passes he was dishing out this World Cup.
For some reason, still a mystery to me, Veron did not play against most of Mexico and all of the Germany match. Was he injured ? This was the one player that would have allowed Messi to push up and be in positions where he is most effective. ( of course this should have been Riquelme or even Banega ..but that is another discussion).
veron was hurt initially...was able to play but sat in favor of maxi rodriguez...its easy in hindsight...but veron is old...id prefer maxi any day.
on messi, to me it seemed like he never got return balls...on runs he would start with the ball, leave off...then sprint ahead...hed never see the ball again. In barcelona...he always gets the ball back...and who better than xavi to get it to you.
i felt like higuain killed that option. He scored 3 goals in a game by tapping it into open nets from 3 feet and then gets locked in as a starter while milito grits his teeth. Finesse players need a similar quality around them...its not so interchangeable
well, on paper I'd say Spain wins, but Holland can just taste this one after losing in two others...the only way they're going down is by taking someone with them, if you get my meaning.
Who else was surprised by Germany's play against Spain? What happened to them? They were having an amazing tournament and then just gave up, it seemed.
I am glad that the Netherlands and Spain are in the final though. I think a new country to win will be nice. Don't know who I want to win. Hopefully it will be a fun game for the neutral watchers like me!
add 1,5 million catalans to those in the world who will support Holland tonight (well, the ones who like football)
(the APress is actually wrong cause we were marching for independence, not 'greater autonomy inside Sp', but well...)
I'm really ashamed of how the dutch played. There should have been two red cards in the first half (van bommel en de jong), which were both stupid attacks. I've always thought that the Netherlands would never become world champion, so I've taken pride in being known as the country that plays the most attractive football. And in this case, we had neither: crappy playing and still winning nothing. Today, Spain was better, quite simple. the Netherlands (robben) should've scored twice. And true, the referee wasn't really to our advantage, the spanish begging for cards was really annoying, but all in all we've lost because our team didn't want to play football, but was just aiming to destroy the spanish play. I'd rather lose with brilliant football, like in the last euro cup...
i think de jong didn't get the red because the ref realized he had given out too many effing cards at that point. spain was diving all over the place the whole game. the ref gave 2 yellows on plays he didn't even see.
the blatant miss on the deflection of sneijder's free kick set up the win.
i'm pretty convinced the ref was bought. the lack of subjectiveness in his calls was pretty obvious.
mueller takes the golden boot
forlan takes the golden ball
and that was a less interesting final than zizou's.
username, i don't think de jong's attack was blatant. he clearly had his eye on the ball the entire time. von bommel's challenge i don't think deserved a red either. don't forget spain had 5 yellows to the netherlands 9. at least two by the dutch were undeserved. in the end it was an evenly physical game. the ref influenced the game a bit, but the dutch should have been able to play through it. they were just outplayed by the spanish.
the only time robben should have fallen he didn't...go figure. puyol deserved a red card there..but didn't get one because robben stayed up for once...and then gets a dumb yellow for following the ref.
all you need to know about uneven officiating is that van bommel somehow only had two(...really?) yellows the entire tourney (out of 17 fouls). the guy was a hack the entire time and somehow didn't get carded for 88% of them...several of his offenses were straight reds if he played for many other teams...why he got so much respect i'll never know.
ah well.. good not great game..chances both ways...sad and glad that it didn't go to pks...no team deserves to lose in pks or in the 116th minute really.
blech......not the game anyone was expecting. Hacking aside, the game was there for Holland to steal even though Spain played better...Robben will be seeing that play in his nightmares for the rest of his life....
why [Van Bommel] he got so much respect i'll never know
because he's old. Veterans always get much more respect. It happened the same last year in the euro champions Barça-Bayern Munich, that guy is tough -and dirty-.... in fact, that's Van Bommel 'natural' style, he played for Barça 5 or 6 years ago, and all he did was foul after foul.. of course he only lasted 1 (maybe 2, I don't remember) years here in Barcelona.
ah, and Iniesta always falls... he's a small guy, he does what he can, not so physically strong -well, Messi, is small too and falls less, but he's faster-
I'm pretty sure someone told Xavi and Puyol, Barça's captains, what happened in Barcelona this last saturday -the biggest demonstration since 1977, biggest than the one against the war in Irak in 2003-, and it was nice to see them waving a catalan flag down there after the final -even if some people saw it as a kind of 'expiatory' act-...
it made the whole thing less painful for catalans (and lots of TV and radio commentators and 'aficionados' in Madrid got pretty angry yesterday, some were even insulting them for doing that... fuck them all, fascist spanish bastards.... one day, I hope, we'll see a Catalan team winning this thing).
thank you football, futbol, soccer, etc... thank you for another display of something all nations have in common. thank you for the beautiful game. thanks for the intelligent strategies, display of endurance, skill, mistakes of human kind, thanks for the joy. thanks for the nationalism of positive kind.
thank you the players for putting it all out there.
thank you south africa, africa altogether, europe, americas, asia, oceania and last but not least, the world...
thank you the fans, living room coaches, back seat referees, bad tv announcers, espn, architects who designed the stadiums and workers who built them.
finally, thank you the musical instrument called vuvuzela, the real buzz of this world cup!
yeah, thanks Africa for your first WC...!
we hope to see more international sports events in the black continent in the near future.
...now it's ... Brazil 2014!.. A World Cup in Brazil... I think it's going to be fun! soccer in the stadiums, soccer in the streets, soccer in the beach and soccer in the favelas (on the roofs)! :)
(and my apologies for hijacking a bit this thread and bringing in some politics... you know, in the end, they are all always related)
2010 world cup
I think that Cruijff also got a lot of recognition in Barcelona, not only because he was a great player and awesome coach, but simply for naming his son "jordi". I think there's always been a strong connection between Barca and Holland, be it Cruyff, Michels, Neeskens, Koeman, Rijkaard, Kluivert, De Boer, Overmars, Van Bronckhorst etcetera. The style of football always used to be similar since the seventies, I believe that Michels and Cruijff introduced the holland'74-style football to barcelona, and they based a typical style (similar to the ajax-style) on that.
And Messi is a wonderful player. However, wouldn't he be playing in a team with other brilliant midfield-players (like Xavi or Iniesta), he wouldn't nearly be as great with Barcelona, as the argentina national team shows...
Emilio, I know what Xavi thinks of Messi... those words you're quoting, he has been saying that all this past season.
And I know Messi is probably the best player in the world -or one of the top 3-, but without Xavi he can't show it so easily. Yes, Messi can assist goals -somehting, by the way, he has learned to do this season too, I don't remember him doin' so many assists during the 2009 Barça treble-, but it's not really his 'job' -or maybe it is in Argentina, but not in Barça-.
About the word nazi... I could have used the word Mussolini. In fact, I could use, simply, the word Franco. They are all the same. Guess how many Spanish flags with the fascist eagle -not the Constitutional Spanish flag, that only has the royal crown emblem-, I saw yesterday in some balconies -and even a couple of assholes in a bike and waving that shit-.. and this was Barcelona, I can't imagine how many there were in Madrid or other places in deep Spain. Of course, TV news reporters will never show them.. you know, it's not good publicity. I already said it was an extreme comparison...but that does not mean it can't be a valid one.
Anyway, back to soccer and the World Cup.
usernametaken,
yes Cruyff (or Cruijff?) brought that style in Barça in the first 1990s -we called it the Dream Team, after the 1992 Magic-Jordan-Bird team in the Barcelona Olympic Games-... and Rijkaard and Guardiola (even van Gaal in some way) have been perfecting it with time...
Probably the culmination of that style of playing was the 2009 treble. That was an amazing year.
Medit...Emilio..
As it is in Barca, I think Messi should be the one receiving the passes he was dishing out this World Cup.
For some reason, still a mystery to me, Veron did not play against most of Mexico and all of the Germany match. Was he injured ? This was the one player that would have allowed Messi to push up and be in positions where he is most effective. ( of course this should have been Riquelme or even Banega ..but that is another discussion).
Yes pshedahlk, I agree.
I think the main problem with Argentina is, basically, Maradona. Not Messi.
But I must confess I have not seen enough games of the 'albiceleste' to confirm that opinion.
The problem is that no one dares to contradict Maradona in Buenos Aires. He's some sort of god, with his own church.
veron was hurt initially...was able to play but sat in favor of maxi rodriguez...its easy in hindsight...but veron is old...id prefer maxi any day.
on messi, to me it seemed like he never got return balls...on runs he would start with the ball, leave off...then sprint ahead...hed never see the ball again. In barcelona...he always gets the ball back...and who better than xavi to get it to you.
i felt like higuain killed that option. He scored 3 goals in a game by tapping it into open nets from 3 feet and then gets locked in as a starter while milito grits his teeth. Finesse players need a similar quality around them...its not so interchangeable
oh well...
spain wins.
well, on paper I'd say Spain wins, but Holland can just taste this one after losing in two others...the only way they're going down is by taking someone with them, if you get my meaning.
Who else was surprised by Germany's play against Spain? What happened to them? They were having an amazing tournament and then just gave up, it seemed.
I am glad that the Netherlands and Spain are in the final though. I think a new country to win will be nice. Don't know who I want to win. Hopefully it will be a fun game for the neutral watchers like me!
usernametaken,
add 1,5 million catalans to those in the world who will support Holland tonight (well, the ones who like football)
(the APress is actually wrong cause we were marching for independence, not 'greater autonomy inside Sp', but well...)
wow. some blown chances and some really uneven reffing...
well that was a complete crock of shit
I'm really ashamed of how the dutch played. There should have been two red cards in the first half (van bommel en de jong), which were both stupid attacks. I've always thought that the Netherlands would never become world champion, so I've taken pride in being known as the country that plays the most attractive football. And in this case, we had neither: crappy playing and still winning nothing. Today, Spain was better, quite simple. the Netherlands (robben) should've scored twice. And true, the referee wasn't really to our advantage, the spanish begging for cards was really annoying, but all in all we've lost because our team didn't want to play football, but was just aiming to destroy the spanish play. I'd rather lose with brilliant football, like in the last euro cup...
Well done to Spain, but everyone knows the real winners are the only unbeaten team at the 2010 World Cup - New Zealand.
i think de jong didn't get the red because the ref realized he had given out too many effing cards at that point. spain was diving all over the place the whole game. the ref gave 2 yellows on plays he didn't even see.
the blatant miss on the deflection of sneijder's free kick set up the win.
i'm pretty convinced the ref was bought. the lack of subjectiveness in his calls was pretty obvious.
mueller takes the golden boot
forlan takes the golden ball
and that was a less interesting final than zizou's.
bold statement diabase.
i like it.
username, i don't think de jong's attack was blatant. he clearly had his eye on the ball the entire time. von bommel's challenge i don't think deserved a red either. don't forget spain had 5 yellows to the netherlands 9. at least two by the dutch were undeserved. in the end it was an evenly physical game. the ref influenced the game a bit, but the dutch should have been able to play through it. they were just outplayed by the spanish.
the only time robben should have fallen he didn't...go figure. puyol deserved a red card there..but didn't get one because robben stayed up for once...and then gets a dumb yellow for following the ref.
all you need to know about uneven officiating is that van bommel somehow only had two(...really?) yellows the entire tourney (out of 17 fouls). the guy was a hack the entire time and somehow didn't get carded for 88% of them...several of his offenses were straight reds if he played for many other teams...why he got so much respect i'll never know.
ah well.. good not great game..chances both ways...sad and glad that it didn't go to pks...no team deserves to lose in pks or in the 116th minute really.
and since when did iniesta become such a flopper? and why did webb call a foul every time he fell?
blech......not the game anyone was expecting. Hacking aside, the game was there for Holland to steal even though Spain played better...Robben will be seeing that play in his nightmares for the rest of his life....
because he's old. Veterans always get much more respect. It happened the same last year in the euro champions Barça-Bayern Munich, that guy is tough -and dirty-.... in fact, that's Van Bommel 'natural' style, he played for Barça 5 or 6 years ago, and all he did was foul after foul.. of course he only lasted 1 (maybe 2, I don't remember) years here in Barcelona.
ah, and Iniesta always falls... he's a small guy, he does what he can, not so physically strong -well, Messi, is small too and falls less, but he's faster-
I'm pretty sure someone told Xavi and Puyol, Barça's captains, what happened in Barcelona this last saturday -the biggest demonstration since 1977, biggest than the one against the war in Irak in 2003-, and it was nice to see them waving a catalan flag down there after the final -even if some people saw it as a kind of 'expiatory' act-...
it made the whole thing less painful for catalans (and lots of TV and radio commentators and 'aficionados' in Madrid got pretty angry yesterday, some were even insulting them for doing that... fuck them all, fascist spanish bastards.... one day, I hope, we'll see a Catalan team winning this thing).
glad it's all over anyway...
thank you football, futbol, soccer, etc... thank you for another display of something all nations have in common. thank you for the beautiful game. thanks for the intelligent strategies, display of endurance, skill, mistakes of human kind, thanks for the joy. thanks for the nationalism of positive kind.
thank you the players for putting it all out there.
thank you south africa, africa altogether, europe, americas, asia, oceania and last but not least, the world...
thank you the fans, living room coaches, back seat referees, bad tv announcers, espn, architects who designed the stadiums and workers who built them.
finally, thank you the musical instrument called vuvuzela, the real buzz of this world cup!
yeah, thanks Africa for your first WC...!
we hope to see more international sports events in the black continent in the near future.
...now it's ... Brazil 2014!.. A World Cup in Brazil... I think it's going to be fun! soccer in the stadiums, soccer in the streets, soccer in the beach and soccer in the favelas (on the roofs)! :)
(and my apologies for hijacking a bit this thread and bringing in some politics... you know, in the end, they are all always related)
As far as football and politics are related: I'm curious (and/or afraid) what the Fifa will do to the inhabitants of the favela's...
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