Has the whole situation over the last two or three years had a noticeable impact on the range of tasks you perform at the office? Are you doing more or less in terms of general office duties (answering phones, mailing, bookkeeping and general office support type tasks)?
To prospective employees and the unemployed:
In addition to learning Revit, Sketchup, Vray, Autocad et cetera... Are you also learning valuable office skills other than software? What are you learning? What have you discovered you really like doing (other than what you went to school for)?
To employers:
Outside of architecture (and its related practices), what skills do you value most from employees? Are you looking for employees that can do multiple jobs at once (HR, Accounting, Administrative Assistant)? Do you find being office savvy to be particularly important? Would you hire someone that has less (or even no direct) experience in architecture if they have an amazing set of other office skills?
I am putting this out there for some simple reasons-- everyone knows a lot of offices (big and small) are laying off people left and right. Some of them are big names, some are no names.
But despite seeing some of these firms axe people left and right, why is it that some of these firms seem to be hiring for other things? I have seen 3 jobs from 3 big name companies hire things like Bookkeeper (part-time junior project manager), Administrative Assistant (part-time site planner) and my favorite Financial Manager (part-time model builder).
I'm just seeing what your impressions are on this.
I'm definitely doing more, when there is work to do. The economy is extremely wild right now. We go 3 or 4 weeks of almost nothing to do but wait for input from clients. When we get input and green lighting we go like mad for 2 or 3 weeks to finish, fast tracking everything. There's no regular schedule anymore and work tasks are guarded over like Hyenas protecting a piece of meat thrown into a cage. Learning Revit, doing the detail library and organizing samples was pretty much done by the end of 2008. We might be going back to 2007 salaries this summer, so that's good news. We wont be hiring until at least 2011 or beyond, assuming we get more work and get paid for work we have liens for.
I'm going into my 11th month of full time unemployment (I was half time for several months before that). What have I learned . . . I've learned that I make an excellent housewife, err house-gf. I really don't mind laundry and cleaning all that much, and having all day to make dinner means that I can make homemade pastas and breads from scratch or braise meat for 3 hours on a weeknight. Plus my gardening has really taken off - I now have the time to start many things from seed in the early spring, saving money and getting the variety I want, plus I have extras to give away to friends. And of course I can now go to the gym or run my errands in the middle of the day.
I've also learned to slow down and stop getting so upset at long lines or bad traffic. When I failed to get upset in line this weekend at lowes, the man behind me said, "wow, you must not have anywhere to be" . . .
Sure, sometime I get painfully depressed about loosing a part of my identity. I've worked so hard for so long to become an architect. I went to an ivy league school, was a top student, and later a highly regarded employee. It's devastating to not be able to find work, but I'm so glad I spent the time to build a life for myself outside of architecture.
And yeah, I finally gave in and took a revit class just so I could say I knew it even though I think it's a little ridiculous - I've learned plenty of programs on the job and excelled at them in no time. But now I can put it on my resume and hopefully not be weeded out. But in the end, I'd rather work for the company that appreciates my strong education, attention to detail, elegant portfolio, and ability to manage a project smoothly, than the one who want to add a revit-monkey to their staff.
"But in the end, I'd rather work for the company that appreciates my strong education, attention to detail, elegant portfolio, and ability to manage a project smoothly, than the one who want to add a revit-monkey to their staff."
So learning to manage the tool properly and to use it elegantly, craft models with excellent attention to detail, manage the model so that it can run smoothly, communicate with staff members to ensure that everything is done efficiently, and to utilize the benefits that are so often overlooked because people take the training course and say 'perfect, I know Revit know'...
To those interested in acquiring a job : Very few people are looking for 'Revit Monkeys' right now, there are quite a few of those. What employers are looking for are people who understand BIM software intimately and can give them what they are looking for, a return on their (huge) investment in the software. This program really does kick ass, and the better you understand it the better your position is in the rapidly evolving industry.
I know how hard everything seems but there are indeed jobs out there, I had four offers in 3 states this summer and I'm only taking one of them.
Holy shit, you people have the combined read comprehension of a group of drunken Rhesus Macaques.
In addition to learning Revit, Sketchup, Vray, Autocad et cetera... Are you also learning valuable office skills other than software? What are you learning?
HAVE ANY OF YOU LEARNED HOW TO READ? STAMP AN ENVELOPE? PRINT A PAYROLL CHECK?
In an architecture office, people generally do things with software.
The firm that I work for currently employs about 15% of the staff as 'Administrative Assistants' who take care of everything non-software related. Literally all correspondance with the outside world is supposed to happen through these people.
I have never had to stamp an envelope, and definitely have come nowhere near stamping a payroll check (direct deposit), and I am sure that working in the office has only been detrimental to my ability to read as I spend countless hours examining Archinect forum shorthand.
I am doing far less at the office these days than I was two years ago, simply because there is no work at all. We have been 'bailed out' by a proxy of the government, and collect 90% of our original salaries if we manage to sit at our desks for forty hours a week.
*If* I were to hire someone, which I'm not, I'd want someone who could be office DJ and teach me advanced SketchUp plus the rudiments of Rhino and Revit. Also someone who would stay until 6pm working so I wouldn't be drinking alone at 5 - they don't have to start until 10, so it all evens out.
Sorry to be flip, Unicorn, but I'm also being honest. For context: I'm self-employed, do custom residential remodel work, and really can't imagine becoming so "legit" that I could ever actually have an employee.
Also, my employee would definitely be involved in EVERY aspect of the firm's operations - total transparency - it's just that it's not a very complex place and it's easier to be honest than coy.
As to the last phrase of your post, Unicorn: Financial Manager/part-time model builder? That can't be real. In my opinion this economy is TOTALLY about diversifying your skills and being able to turn all kinds of opportunities into paying gigs, however short, casual, or menial they may seem, but really? If your organization is complex enough to need a financial manager, then you need an expert, not someone who does it on the side while the glue dries!
It was real. It was all humdrum "blah blah blah accounting system blah blah expense reports."
They they dropped the glory bomb-- "Looking for a candidate who has an interest in architecture, planning and urban design. Knowledge of rendering, physical modeling and marketing a plus!"
I had to put a towel down on my seat while I applied for the job.
In a corporate firm, I'd expect some sort of administrative assistant, mail room clerk or possibly intern to handle more of the menial work.
But in smaller firms, your jobs duties maybe more diverse.
The reason I'm asking this was that I had seen a story about the Mayor of Deltona (a small 'backwoods' city in Florida [population 98,000]). Despite budget shortfalls, he reorganized the city so that employees job duties expanded. He eliminated positions but didn't directly fire anyone.
Anyways, his idea of "everyone does a little bit of everyone else's job" has saved the city millions of dollars. The city in turn has decided to refund people's property taxes and they've instituted a whole number of other programs (like free ASCPA spay neuter programs).
The amusing thing is that this guy is 32. Became Mayor when he was 27. Has absolutely no experience or gray hair for the job.
I've been reading up on this and it seems to be successful in other organizations where you have a bunch of desk jockies.
My point on revit, or any other software is that to be unemployed and learn it on your own is a little ridiculous because you don't have the same kinds of issues with coordination, graphic standards, etc that you would experience in a firm. I'm not saying that by taking a class I know the program, I'm saying that by taking a class, I can put it on my resume and not be weeded out for interviews. I learned autocad and vectorworks on the job and was able to draft very well in a matter of days, I don't imagine revit would be wildly different, particularly now that I've learned some basics.
To the original question - I've also applied to lots of job postings for marketing and/or administrative assistants playing up my experience with graphic design and marketing and most of the time, the response is, thanks, but we're actually looking for someone with a degree in marketing, communications, etc. I have however gotten interviews for non-advertised architecture positions out of these applications. But, often times, they look at their books again and "decided not to hire anyone right now."
And, I spent a few months studying for the GMAT and researching MBA and real estate programs thinking maybe it would be nice to have a better business background in case I'd like to start my own firm, go into development, or manage a larger firm. But, I'm still uncomfortable with that kind of investment if I can just go back to work sometime soon.
Yes, a lot of people have picked up the slack in ways they did not foresee when initially starting.
From maintain the office (ie. painting, light bulb changing) , to basic it work, to software installation, website design, and publication.
this is all "temporary" while the economy is bad. Its good or bad in my opinion, we are able to learn skills that we aren't normally exposed to but at the same time, it's not what we want to do and not what we were hired for...
i just hope the economy picks up so we can get qualified individuals to pick up these duties
One more note on Revit. I work as a temp BIM specialist(details and redline pick up - ) In the offices I have worked at, the regular staff is very very good at using Revit and a thorough knowledge is expected. Don't kid yourself and just learn the basics - you must know it well to do perfect work.
May 10, 10 6:49 pm ·
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Office structure and employment (sorry for beating a dead horse!)
Has the whole situation over the last two or three years had a noticeable impact on the range of tasks you perform at the office? Are you doing more or less in terms of general office duties (answering phones, mailing, bookkeeping and general office support type tasks)?
To prospective employees and the unemployed:
In addition to learning Revit, Sketchup, Vray, Autocad et cetera... Are you also learning valuable office skills other than software? What are you learning? What have you discovered you really like doing (other than what you went to school for)?
To employers:
Outside of architecture (and its related practices), what skills do you value most from employees? Are you looking for employees that can do multiple jobs at once (HR, Accounting, Administrative Assistant)? Do you find being office savvy to be particularly important? Would you hire someone that has less (or even no direct) experience in architecture if they have an amazing set of other office skills?
I am putting this out there for some simple reasons-- everyone knows a lot of offices (big and small) are laying off people left and right. Some of them are big names, some are no names.
But despite seeing some of these firms axe people left and right, why is it that some of these firms seem to be hiring for other things? I have seen 3 jobs from 3 big name companies hire things like Bookkeeper (part-time junior project manager), Administrative Assistant (part-time site planner) and my favorite Financial Manager (part-time model builder).
I'm just seeing what your impressions are on this.
I'm definitely doing more, when there is work to do. The economy is extremely wild right now. We go 3 or 4 weeks of almost nothing to do but wait for input from clients. When we get input and green lighting we go like mad for 2 or 3 weeks to finish, fast tracking everything. There's no regular schedule anymore and work tasks are guarded over like Hyenas protecting a piece of meat thrown into a cage. Learning Revit, doing the detail library and organizing samples was pretty much done by the end of 2008. We might be going back to 2007 salaries this summer, so that's good news. We wont be hiring until at least 2011 or beyond, assuming we get more work and get paid for work we have liens for.
I'm going into my 11th month of full time unemployment (I was half time for several months before that). What have I learned . . . I've learned that I make an excellent housewife, err house-gf. I really don't mind laundry and cleaning all that much, and having all day to make dinner means that I can make homemade pastas and breads from scratch or braise meat for 3 hours on a weeknight. Plus my gardening has really taken off - I now have the time to start many things from seed in the early spring, saving money and getting the variety I want, plus I have extras to give away to friends. And of course I can now go to the gym or run my errands in the middle of the day.
I've also learned to slow down and stop getting so upset at long lines or bad traffic. When I failed to get upset in line this weekend at lowes, the man behind me said, "wow, you must not have anywhere to be" . . .
Sure, sometime I get painfully depressed about loosing a part of my identity. I've worked so hard for so long to become an architect. I went to an ivy league school, was a top student, and later a highly regarded employee. It's devastating to not be able to find work, but I'm so glad I spent the time to build a life for myself outside of architecture.
And yeah, I finally gave in and took a revit class just so I could say I knew it even though I think it's a little ridiculous - I've learned plenty of programs on the job and excelled at them in no time. But now I can put it on my resume and hopefully not be weeded out. But in the end, I'd rather work for the company that appreciates my strong education, attention to detail, elegant portfolio, and ability to manage a project smoothly, than the one who want to add a revit-monkey to their staff.
"But in the end, I'd rather work for the company that appreciates my strong education, attention to detail, elegant portfolio, and ability to manage a project smoothly, than the one who want to add a revit-monkey to their staff."
I hear you on that, mar09. Well said.
Revit is the tool, right?
So learning to manage the tool properly and to use it elegantly, craft models with excellent attention to detail, manage the model so that it can run smoothly, communicate with staff members to ensure that everything is done efficiently, and to utilize the benefits that are so often overlooked because people take the training course and say 'perfect, I know Revit know'...
To those interested in acquiring a job : Very few people are looking for 'Revit Monkeys' right now, there are quite a few of those. What employers are looking for are people who understand BIM software intimately and can give them what they are looking for, a return on their (huge) investment in the software. This program really does kick ass, and the better you understand it the better your position is in the rapidly evolving industry.
I know how hard everything seems but there are indeed jobs out there, I had four offers in 3 states this summer and I'm only taking one of them.
Holy shit, you people have the combined read comprehension of a group of drunken Rhesus Macaques.
In addition to learning Revit, Sketchup, Vray, Autocad et cetera... Are you also learning valuable office skills other than software? What are you learning?
HAVE ANY OF YOU LEARNED HOW TO READ? STAMP AN ENVELOPE? PRINT A PAYROLL CHECK?
In an architecture office, people generally do things with software.
The firm that I work for currently employs about 15% of the staff as 'Administrative Assistants' who take care of everything non-software related. Literally all correspondance with the outside world is supposed to happen through these people.
I have never had to stamp an envelope, and definitely have come nowhere near stamping a payroll check (direct deposit), and I am sure that working in the office has only been detrimental to my ability to read as I spend countless hours examining Archinect forum shorthand.
I am doing far less at the office these days than I was two years ago, simply because there is no work at all. We have been 'bailed out' by a proxy of the government, and collect 90% of our original salaries if we manage to sit at our desks for forty hours a week.
*If* I were to hire someone, which I'm not, I'd want someone who could be office DJ and teach me advanced SketchUp plus the rudiments of Rhino and Revit. Also someone who would stay until 6pm working so I wouldn't be drinking alone at 5 - they don't have to start until 10, so it all evens out.
Sorry to be flip, Unicorn, but I'm also being honest. For context: I'm self-employed, do custom residential remodel work, and really can't imagine becoming so "legit" that I could ever actually have an employee.
Also, my employee would definitely be involved in EVERY aspect of the firm's operations - total transparency - it's just that it's not a very complex place and it's easier to be honest than coy.
As to the last phrase of your post, Unicorn: Financial Manager/part-time model builder? That can't be real. In my opinion this economy is TOTALLY about diversifying your skills and being able to turn all kinds of opportunities into paying gigs, however short, casual, or menial they may seem, but really? If your organization is complex enough to need a financial manager, then you need an expert, not someone who does it on the side while the glue dries!
It was real. It was all humdrum "blah blah blah accounting system blah blah expense reports."
They they dropped the glory bomb-- "Looking for a candidate who has an interest in architecture, planning and urban design. Knowledge of rendering, physical modeling and marketing a plus!"
I had to put a towel down on my seat while I applied for the job.
Oh, Donna! That was a perfect response!
In a corporate firm, I'd expect some sort of administrative assistant, mail room clerk or possibly intern to handle more of the menial work.
But in smaller firms, your jobs duties maybe more diverse.
The reason I'm asking this was that I had seen a story about the Mayor of Deltona (a small 'backwoods' city in Florida [population 98,000]). Despite budget shortfalls, he reorganized the city so that employees job duties expanded. He eliminated positions but didn't directly fire anyone.
Anyways, his idea of "everyone does a little bit of everyone else's job" has saved the city millions of dollars. The city in turn has decided to refund people's property taxes and they've instituted a whole number of other programs (like free ASCPA spay neuter programs).
The amusing thing is that this guy is 32. Became Mayor when he was 27. Has absolutely no experience or gray hair for the job.
I've been reading up on this and it seems to be successful in other organizations where you have a bunch of desk jockies.
My point on revit, or any other software is that to be unemployed and learn it on your own is a little ridiculous because you don't have the same kinds of issues with coordination, graphic standards, etc that you would experience in a firm. I'm not saying that by taking a class I know the program, I'm saying that by taking a class, I can put it on my resume and not be weeded out for interviews. I learned autocad and vectorworks on the job and was able to draft very well in a matter of days, I don't imagine revit would be wildly different, particularly now that I've learned some basics.
To the original question - I've also applied to lots of job postings for marketing and/or administrative assistants playing up my experience with graphic design and marketing and most of the time, the response is, thanks, but we're actually looking for someone with a degree in marketing, communications, etc. I have however gotten interviews for non-advertised architecture positions out of these applications. But, often times, they look at their books again and "decided not to hire anyone right now."
And, I spent a few months studying for the GMAT and researching MBA and real estate programs thinking maybe it would be nice to have a better business background in case I'd like to start my own firm, go into development, or manage a larger firm. But, I'm still uncomfortable with that kind of investment if I can just go back to work sometime soon.
I will answer this...
Yes, a lot of people have picked up the slack in ways they did not foresee when initially starting.
From maintain the office (ie. painting, light bulb changing) , to basic it work, to software installation, website design, and publication.
this is all "temporary" while the economy is bad. Its good or bad in my opinion, we are able to learn skills that we aren't normally exposed to but at the same time, it's not what we want to do and not what we were hired for...
i just hope the economy picks up so we can get qualified individuals to pick up these duties
One more note on Revit. I work as a temp BIM specialist(details and redline pick up - ) In the offices I have worked at, the regular staff is very very good at using Revit and a thorough knowledge is expected. Don't kid yourself and just learn the basics - you must know it well to do perfect work.
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