Is anybody here working in Europe?
I know in the UK, there are very few jobs around. I haven't heard (throught friends of friends etc) of any people losing their jobs yet but most of the offices are not hiring.

I'm in Scotland... tis the same here. Times were really good only a year ago, so I left my permanent job to take up part-time contract work. But there are no more jobs or contracts now that that first one finished.

Some good things, though:

In London, say, it's almost trendy to be an unemployed professional at the moment and all over, it's not like the unemployed person need feel singled-out as some sort of underachiever.

I have all that free time I've always wanted to see what I'm capable of, in a variety of fields, without the constraints of pleasing a boss / client / having to 'fit in' to a mediocre scenario, etc. etc.: time for some HI CONCEPT EXPLORATIONS :-)

Any sort of radical change is a great excuse for a re-evaluation and a refreshment of what really drives you in life... taking hold of those dreams again.

Now I'm off to see my recruitment agent: not that she has any jobs on the go but it adds a 'job seeking activity' to my list come Friday, when I sign on for my dole money.

And real money? Well, the great thing about earning so little as an architect is that it's not such a big difference to be earning nothing at all ;-p

HOK maybe hiring...

Check you local office. They're doing a second university in Saudi Arabia.

Solidred, I like your style.

:-)

with this whole issue of jobs laying off/etc.... has anyone delayed making a drastic move to another state/etc...

I'm considering 3-6 months in the Gulf
I also considered commuting every week between Scotland & London... I have a friend in the States who used to fly to work (IT Consultant) after all, but then binned it: London's most fun without the pesky work bit. But Dubai? I guess you stand back and admire your latest skyscraper whilst getting obscenely rich (relatively speaking) with nothing to spend it on except... a month's partying back in ol' London town...

PS Brazil's recently discovered a large off-shore oil deposit - my guess is Rio could be a great place to be in a few years' time... for all sorts of reasons ;-)

that's easy...
as architects we always want to fly away to jobs somewhere.
at times like this, we should be also looking into our own community, looking into environment around us and create and think about ways to contribute without large amounts of money involved.
i certainly understand the survival and job situation, needing a paycheck but we also have to develop some new grounds where we can apply our knowledge and expertise. rather than going through a list of places where they might be hiring for the same old same old.
dubai is not the answer. they will hit the bottom line too, if not already. i am sure they are screening the news like hawks because a panic on the gulf can stop all that development like an emrgency brake..

why would you get rich being a cadmonkey in the desert? maybe if you sold bentley's or gold plated furniture.

Start tracking firms that have done work in the Middle East. Many of them are getting followup work.

In Dubai I know that they pay a person on my level about the same or slightly more.

The interesting thing is that a lot of the work there is being done by American or European firms -- (i.e. the HoKs, Genslers, etc). So they pay by company standards many of times.

Oh and knowing Arabic is not an advantage since you can live your whole life there without using a word of it.

This is all based on personal experience.

Just curious, anyone here considering leaving the field?

yup....... many times.......

qo3x12w ^ stated Davis Partnership in Denver laid people off and I recently heard they were doing work in Dubai...along with a couple other firms from here.

Thanks Orhan - that's the best and most positive thing I've heard in a while.

I secretly want to get laid off.

brand avenue, yes I am planning my exit out of the profession, at least in the traditional sense.

oh, and we had a round of layoffs yesterday.

that was fast strawbeary, weren't you just hiring two weeks ago?

sorta. we are hiring if any one of 5 projects goes into production, and I'm pretty sure at least 3 of them will. But I could be wrong.

and I should say, duh, the layoffs were in another office.

if would have known about the way the profession is... i would have went to trade school.....seriously

Ohran, thanks: wise words.

As for the profession, I've been dreaming of escape routes ever since I started. The weird thing is that I love *architecture* more and more... so many fascinating aspects of it and its potential. It's just that as an employee one's crushed by the dead-weight of commerce... I should set up my own thing but... hmm... commerce again.

Anyone thought of doing a PhD?

Solidred,

Discussion of pros and cons for doing a PhD is an occasional topic here. You should search the threads, and you'll find a lot of questions and insight.

Solidred - do you want to be an academic? I've heard PhDs are gruelling, and can narrowly focus your architectural thinking...it's all about defining the question. I don't think I could do one...a MArch is enough for me, thanks.

I moved states about 6 months ago for my current job. I'm glad I moved, things are slowing down where I was, and how they are hitting LA pretty hard. We are going through rounds of layoffs though. It's awful and I really feel for the younger staff that have just come out of school or have limited office experience.

I've been trying to get out of the "profession" for a while, but feel compelled to stay. Architecture is fascinating but it can suck the life out of you at times. Maybe time to switch gears and write a book or something...

I've written hundreds of pages of text over the last few years... about ten of which are directly about architecture ;-p
As for PhDs (briefly, not wishing to stray off topic) my brother started two, so I know they require a certain sustained single-mindedness, which I'm hardly good at. I just want something that requires some intellect; that puts deeper thinking to some sort of worthwhile use.

I've written hundreds of pages of text over the last few years... about ten of which are directly about architecture ;-p
As for PhDs (briefly, not wishing to stray off topic) my brother started two, so I know they require a certain sustained single-mindedness, which I'm hardly good at. I just want something that requires some intellect; that puts deeper thinking to some sort of worthwhile use.
[will now check out those PhD threads... :-)]

Someone can feel fee to stop me, but is it just me or does this kind of bullshit always happen during republican administrations?

1981
1987
1991
2001
2008

it's global though
...mind you, hang on a sec...

Talked to some of the pricipals about the economy for architects and they all said it's "not like the 70's." All of them started in the early to mid 1970's and said the late 70's were awful. 1981 was when Volker raised short term interest rates super high to kill the rampant inflation but the general economy had been reeling since at least the '79 oil embargo, probably earlier given what I've been told about the '70's. I was pretty young then to remember much.

I've heard that back then everyone would get registered fast as possible because if you were unemployed you could always "hang your shingle" and try do get work freelance. Several bosses have said the lack of interest in taking the ARE is because the economy has been generally good for so long. 20+ years with only a hiccup here and there.

My fear is that what we have in store is worse than the 1970's and will mirror the 1930's more. Architects might get jobs in gov't sponsored "make work" type projects, but private capital won't be spent on building. I think a bigger portion of our work will come from retrofit/remodel stuff. Making existing buildings more energy efficient and space efficient will be a big deal when nobody has cash to spend on luxuries. Recently I've seen some retail remodel/rework projects to make existing "power centers," malls, etc., more transit/pedestrian oriented. Have a feeling that work will continue, while the "new" buildings on empty sites will dry up.

so with the way loans/economy is right now..... do you think folks will be able to get college loans?


might be time to get a CDL and drive a truck.....

my friends that are still in grad school said the incoming class this past september was the smallest it's been in a number of years

MArch, next year it will be the largest it's been in years.

In a way, it's a good opportunity for many people who have 4-year or other non NAAB-accredited degrees to go back to GRAD school after being laid off.

very true archmed

I'm not so sure that grad school programs will be flush with students in the coming years. When times are tight people usually are adverse to spending money, higher education included. It'd be interesting to check student population at major universities during economic downtimes but my guess would be that student enrollment was down in the 70's and jumped in the 80's when the economy started rolling again.

Archinect might not be the best cross section of the architecture community as a whole since most people here seem to be closely aligned and/or hold academics in high regard. Those already inclined to attend grad school might view an economic downturn as an opportunity since employment is tight. However I belive the vast majority will be risk adverse to spending money/taking on debt when the future outlook is dim.

What I do think will happen is a prolonged downturn will drive many people away from traditional architecture firms. In the short term it will balance the supply/demand of our services, in the long term a shortage of talent may arise in coming years. I've always advocated an across the board reduction in the number of professionals in this business, mostly to negotiate higher fees by inverting the supply/demand curve. Unfortunately I think the people in our profession that should be retiring will hang on since their retirement accounts have shrunk while hiring freezes will keep out young talent. The end is a major brain drain in the not so distant future. Similar as mentioned above.

Taking on a lot of debt for architecture school is CRAZY!!!!

My community college program has had an increase in enrollment. Graduate school? There would have to be some payoff.

When the economy is bad many people go back to school. My parents are both professors at different universities and they said that both schools reported record attendance figures during the post 9/11 2001 recession.

Those figures are based on the percentages of non-traditional students enrolled -- they can be anyone from ages 28 and up who have either opted for a career change or to buttress their current degree with another specialized degree. I know people doing this now because of the recession.

i would like to do my m.a. in industrial design........

make, i spent $8K a year to go to one of the top research institutions in the world. sure it isn't pocket change, but its nowhere near the debt you speak of

i would like 60k more in debt

RTKL's LA office already laid off 70, and it is said would be more

MArch06


That's sound! Which school?

berkeley - one caveat of course, CA residency. but that simply can't be beat

When I leave NYC for good next summer, If I can't find a decent architecture gig in 6 months I'm just going to accelerate my application to graduate schools, probably for an M.B.A in Development. I figure grad school would be a great place to get out of the economic shitstorm for a few years. Sure I'll rack up huge debt, but the degree should pay for itself.

I work at a very tiny high-end residential firm in NYC. One week in september me and my boss were bemoaning the fact that we were short on staff, two weeks later my hours got cut and it looks like even our blue blood client base may be tightening the purse strings with downtown whipping itself into a frenzy. I'm concerned for my job.

Oh, and on a side note, most of my nuclear family works for AIG...

AIG is socialist now right? When does universal insurance start can you tell me?

so, is anyone working in a job thats not in architecture right now?

i am. mr. mom at your service

Grad school enrollments tend to spike during economic downswings. People decide it's a good time to go back to school and ride it out. M.Arch enrollments were very high in the early 90s, after architecture tanked that time.