CTA Tattler is reporting, via the Chicago Tribune, that the proposed Illinois Budget for 2010 has money in place for New CTA Cars as well as funding for preliminary work on the circle line.
I'm trying to think exactly who will ride it. I'm definetly for the expansion, but how will this work. Will it primarily serve people who live in one neighborhood and work in another? Ie. you lwork in lincoln park, and now you'll be able to choose to live on the westside or near southwest side because you can take this train and circumvent having to go through the loop and transfer? That sounds like an appealing prospect. Of course I'll use it when visiting friends in other neighborhoods, but it seems like that type of ridership alone won't support an entire line. What do you think, in what other scenarios will people use it regularly?
I understand the route, but is the traffic between these areas that high? Is the idea to inspire new business growth in these neighborhoods because of the new convenience in reaching them from other areas of the city?
When hipsters from Bridgeport need to go my some new slim fitting women's jeans they can take the circle line to Westown, and when monied hipsters need to go see gohst arcade on archer they to can take the circle line down to B-Port. It'll be the hipster superhighway
true about the hipster highway... that, it will be.
its about inter neighborhood travel to a certain extent, but it seems to be more about making EVERY metra line connect to the cta, as well as significantly cutting down travel times to and from the airports. For instance, it might take a good 30 min or so off the trip from lincoln park or other red line neighborhoods to ohare, or Wicker Park to midway... in that regard it will be a huge time saver.
beyond the short term time saving benefits though, its the infrastructure that truly matters to me... im a firm believer of the 'if you build it they will come' mantra in regards to transit... examples of it are all over the city... so to my mind, exposing new areas to rail stations can be nothing but good for that communities economy...
yes... i lived on the green line for many years...
perhaps you dont get around the city that often, because if you did, youd see pretty quickly that in general, there is far, far more development in the blocks surround el stops than in the space between... id recommend looking at the entire north/northwest side of the city for an example. Or for a more recent example, check out what the orange line is doing to the south west side. Ask chicago lifers how massive an impact the orange line has had on the development of the southwest side from bridgeport to midway...
I like funding for mass transits systems as well, but I'm not always sure if spending the money on expansion is the best idea, particularly when the quality and maintenence of the existing lines are in such poor condition. I suppose the worry is simply will these lines increase ridership and use of the system to justify their costs? it is huge up front investment to build them, but it is also a long term expense to maintain, we are talking about a huge amount of new track being added to an already massive system.
The circle line will be huge for the west side. Too bad its just now being rebuilt. Thats right it was torn down years ago. You can still catch a glimpse of it over the UP West tracks about near Damen - theres an old bridge over the Metra Tracks - that was the old version of the circle. Then there was the humbolt Park line, the congress A and B, the Garfield Park line, all on the West Side.
If you read the book Block by Block, the history of the Westside it tells the story of how the Machine disinvested in the Westside because it didnt vote their way ie republican leaning / and slowly the west was neglected, the trains, sewers and streets, and bulldozed for new machine voting southern blacks. Most of the whites moved over the county line to DuPage and the westide never recovered. And its a shame because thats really where the soul of the city was.
The south side of the green line is in bad shape with acres upon acres of vacant land steps away from the el stops. The presence of an EL stop will not always be followed by economic growth. The land that the circle line is slated to pas through is not prime for redevelopment in the same way Archer Ave along the Orange line was. There is a prison, and a lot of freight and light manufacturing. If gentrification occurs there those freight handling and manufacturing jobs will move elsewhere. If you get off the green line at 43, 47, 51 Garfield, 63 Cottage Grove, or Ashland and you will find the majority of the land on the blocks that these stations sit on vacant.
Besides with 8mill the CTA can get a consultant and form a committee of Daily cronies and make some nice posters and conduct studies. We will need six more zeros to actually make it work and actually build / rebuild the circle line. Didn’t the rehabilitation and renovation of just the stations along the brown line cost Billions? How much more expensive will new tracks and stations be?
Well the Green line is prob going to get the olympics so I wouldnt worry too much down there. What it needs is more white folks - The southside has become 100% black past bridgeport. Low income black - blacks with money move out. Blame your federal government for that disaster on a massive scale that no one seems to want to talk about.
The Circle will have the United Center, UIC, The Illinois Med District, Intersection with the red, blue (2x), green, Orange and Pink lines, West Loop Loft District, Meatpacking District / Fulton Market, Ashland Ave Corridor, Pilsen and B-Port / Archer - A lot of people working service jobs will travel this
Essetialy Its an Ashland Ave. Corridor train, travel Ashland anytime at rush hour and you will see its pretty busy.
Heres that bridge just north of the UC which i think could use som parking lot lanscaping. Chicago a green city? Yeah right..
I love that bridge. It's part of the old Paulina corridor which the CTA is going to rebuild. It connected the Logan Square line to the Van Buren leg of the L.It went over the Lake St L.
Only the CTA could get away with leaving it there to rust until it fell down!
I think the Metra UP line uses it as a signal bridge - But would'nt it be cool to recondition it for the ne circle line? Look how high up it is - at least 25 feet above the Metra which is about 13 / 14 feet above grade. Imagine the view towards the city.
The story of Bill Thompson and his wife being robbed at gunpoint by 3 men in the lobby of their building at Barry and Sheridan is interesting. And I didn't know that Balaban, another resident of the building, moved to LA and became president of Paramount Pictures:
Did anyone that the AFl-CIO is talking to Kelleher about investing in the Spire?
Chicago Spire developer in talks with AFL-CIO for funding
A deal with the trusts could also mean thousands of union jobs for members
By Mary Ellen Podmolik | Tribune reporter
March 24, 2009
Representatives from AFL-CIO Housing Investment Trusts are meeting with Chicago Spire developer Shelbourne Development Group on Tuesday to advance preliminary discussions that could have the deep-pocketed pension fund help pay for construction of the stalled skyscraper.
Discussions between the trusts and Irish developer Garrett Kelleher began in January, but the talks are in the "embryonic stage," said Tom Villanova, president of the Chicago and Cook County Building Trades Council, which represents 24 trades locally.
"The main thing is jobs," Villanova said. "We can use our own funds to benefit members. The Spire is going to be five years of construction, which is just phenomenal for us. It's thousands of jobs."
An investment by the pension fund would make the project a 100 percent union job.
"Obviously, the idea of pulling the unions together and making this a 'Made in America' project is very positive," said project spokeswoman Kim Metcalfe, who confirmed ongoing discussions with the union.
"We're exploring all of the financial options with the economy as challenging as it is, but clearly this is long-term," Metcalfe said. "We're working toward the success of the building. We continue to actively market the building. Clearly, the construction of the building is on pause, but nothing else about the building has stopped."
The break in construction has left a hole 110 feet wide and 76 feet deep at 400 N. Lake Shore Drive, making the Spire a worldwide symbol of the recession and shut-down credit markets. It has had numerous liens filed against it as consultants and contractors involved in the initial work sought payment for their services. Architect Santiago Calatrava, who designed the twisting building, filed liens against the project in October for more than $11 million.
The union has three investment trusts, including the Building Investment Trust, a pooled real estate fund with more than $2.5 billion in assets as of Dec. 31. It was created in 1988 as a vehicle to provide competitive risk-adjusted returns for its participants, as well as a way to create jobs in commercial real estate projects for its members.
The Chicago market has proved to be the biggest beneficiary of the fund, with more than $1 billion invested in local projects, including senior and affordable housing and Trump International Hotel & Tower, Villanova said.
The trust, Villanova added, also is interested in investing in the construction of an Olympic village, should Chicago win the 2016 Games.
I think we did, I am against it being located in Grant Park because it is too expensive for average parents to visit there with parking being as expensive as it is and there is no convenient connection via the CTA. It should be located in a real neighborhood with rail CTA and decent road access. Why not Logan Square, Washington Park, or Garfield Park, A real neighborhood with real children who don’t have very much to do indoors when the weather is not so nice? The lake shore yuppies have a children’s museum (glorified indoor playground) already in the Science and Industries and Field Museums. Not to mention the Zoo, cultural center, the thing across the street from the cultural center, Millennium Park, The Art institute, the Shed Aquarium, the Planetarium, Nature museum, Petting Zoo, and the Harold Washington Library. There is already too much of a concentration of cultural institutions in one small space. Within 3 miles of Navy Pier there are more than 35 museums, cultural centers and sculpture gardens. I think spreading the wealth around and using the museum as a catalyst for positive urban development is a better use on the 10-30 million instead of an tripped out underground bunker.
But first we need to oust Daily and all his corrupt cronies. If I was elected mayor I would fire everyone from the 9th floor up. Any bets on who the next Daily official will be to be inedited on federal corruption charges?
I like the notion that Yuppies are a force of change? Well if we placed something that they want in a place that could benefit from additional foot traffic all the more reason to steer this and other cultural projects to underserved, economically struggling neighborhoods. It might help keep some businesses open and create opportunities for new businesses. I don’t know were this falls on the conservative scale of socialism but if the city is going to build the thing why not place it in a location that could yield larger social and economic benefits, location can make a huge difference in the numbers of people positively and profoundly impacted by this project. No more taxpayer funded museums within 3 miles of Navy Pier. Use the public funds to foster development in deserving underserved communities such as the West Side. Not to mention locating out of the loop can greatly reduce the cost per square foot.
I dont know where the notion of urban yuppies as a bad thing came from - I mean in Chicago and NY the yuppies reinvigorated downtown and made urban life doable for the non-poor who where only urban by fact they had nowhere else to go. I remember going to my grandparents' and great aunts in the city when I was young and there wasnt anything cool about their non-yuppie decaying neighborhood. If anything we need more yuppies. I even know yuppie plumbers - the manual laboring yuppie is a fact. Young guy, owns his own plumbing service, lives large downtown. Prob makes as much as 3 architects.
Seriously, even if you wanted this to support yuppies, you could place it in a loft of other neighborhoods, such as wickerpark, bucktown, logan square etc. Atleast then you would be putting it in an area that has children.
Incidentally, who among you are Young (perhaps under 35?)
Urban Professionals?
I am and I drink coffee. But I don’t have a dog so maybe I’m only half a Yuppie. Consult the list of stuff white people like to determine how much of a Yuppie you are.
Im not advocating Grant Park, I agree many neighborhoods should be first in line for such a museum ( is museum the right word? Really - its a romper room)
This is a debate as old as the city - the neighborhoods vs. the downtown growth coalition. You see it in TIFs which funnel money to downtown, road repairs, allocation of greening funds and museums. Its why 3/4 of the southside and about 90% of the westside are unihabited. The government pays people to live there. Everyone else said fuck it a long time ago.
The AFL /CIO financed the martina city complex to if I recall. Thats actualy the kind of things pension funds and insurance companies used to invest in.
The question remains however - Is the Spire still FUGLY? Seems a bit Roccocco for Chicago
I think income is irrelivent to yuppie ness. My intent was just to point out how silly a supposed block of people it is. There is no yuppie movement, it is just a large number of people with greatly varying interests, incomes, neighborhoods, etc. etc.
We have some things in common, but others we completely disagree over. The only overwhelming yuppie trait seems to be that 99% of them come up with an excuse for why they aren't a yuppie.
I think income is irrelivent to yuppie ness. My intent was just to point out how silly a supposed block of people it is. There is no yuppie movement, it is just a large number of people with greatly varying interests, incomes, neighborhoods, etc. etc.
We have some things in common, but others we completely disagree over. The only overwhelming yuppie trait seems to be that 99% of them come up with an excuse for why they aren't a yuppie.
i dont think the spire is FUGLY at all...
honestly i think the spires aesthetic will be largely dwarfed by the shear size of it... i hope hope hope hope hope it gets built...
Chicago has changed since its last set of landmarks were constructed... i want this new chicago to have one as well (outside millenium park)
Id really like to see comissions such as the spire go to Chicago architects and structural engineers. The drilldo is just not doing it for me. The scallops as vortex softening elements seems like post - rationalistation to me. I'd much perfer something akin to SOM's 1997 proposal for 7 S. Dearborn. Streamlined, structural idea is exposed as relief cuts, classic chicago super core with cantaliever slabs, prominant mast. Love it.
i wish the chicago spire and 7 south dearborn were built. the skyline would look really cool with 6 super tall towers instead of the 4 that are there now.
yeah... im with you, 7 s. looks great... im a fan...
and as for the drill form... perhaps its a post rationalized structural design, but there is no denying that it would significantly reduce wind loads, as the highest loads occur at the corners... i personally feel like the spiral concept works a bit to well to be written off as completely post rationalized archi-crap... though synergy would be more apt to speak on that point...
Functionally, I dont see the appeal of living above the 50s or 60s - its a chore to get down, in an emergency your kind of screwed. The views would be great but you really have to like the height. I guess if I was super loaded and it was my "in town" apartment it would be cool. But for everday living it might get old.
eh.... i dont know... they are pretty stringent about waiting times on elevatoring in towers like that... id be suprised if your trip from the penthouses up top to the lobby would take more than a min or two door to door, especially in such a luxurious tower...
Aggregate Chicago
CTA Tattler is reporting, via the Chicago Tribune, that the proposed Illinois Budget for 2010 has money in place for New CTA Cars as well as funding for preliminary work on the circle line.
link
What about a shipment of new fir?
Circle lines gonna be tits
I'm trying to think exactly who will ride it. I'm definetly for the expansion, but how will this work. Will it primarily serve people who live in one neighborhood and work in another? Ie. you lwork in lincoln park, and now you'll be able to choose to live on the westside or near southwest side because you can take this train and circumvent having to go through the loop and transfer? That sounds like an appealing prospect. Of course I'll use it when visiting friends in other neighborhoods, but it seems like that type of ridership alone won't support an entire line. What do you think, in what other scenarios will people use it regularly?
Pilsen / Tri Taylor / B-Port / West Town / Lincoln Park all connected without having to go through the Loop
I understand the route, but is the traffic between these areas that high? Is the idea to inspire new business growth in these neighborhoods because of the new convenience in reaching them from other areas of the city?
When hipsters from Bridgeport need to go my some new slim fitting women's jeans they can take the circle line to Westown, and when monied hipsters need to go see gohst arcade on archer they to can take the circle line down to B-Port. It'll be the hipster superhighway
true about the hipster highway... that, it will be.
its about inter neighborhood travel to a certain extent, but it seems to be more about making EVERY metra line connect to the cta, as well as significantly cutting down travel times to and from the airports. For instance, it might take a good 30 min or so off the trip from lincoln park or other red line neighborhoods to ohare, or Wicker Park to midway... in that regard it will be a huge time saver.
beyond the short term time saving benefits though, its the infrastructure that truly matters to me... im a firm believer of the 'if you build it they will come' mantra in regards to transit... examples of it are all over the city... so to my mind, exposing new areas to rail stations can be nothing but good for that communities economy...
If you build it they will come? Have you been on the Green line?
yes... i lived on the green line for many years...
perhaps you dont get around the city that often, because if you did, youd see pretty quickly that in general, there is far, far more development in the blocks surround el stops than in the space between... id recommend looking at the entire north/northwest side of the city for an example. Or for a more recent example, check out what the orange line is doing to the south west side. Ask chicago lifers how massive an impact the orange line has had on the development of the southwest side from bridgeport to midway...
I like funding for mass transits systems as well, but I'm not always sure if spending the money on expansion is the best idea, particularly when the quality and maintenence of the existing lines are in such poor condition. I suppose the worry is simply will these lines increase ridership and use of the system to justify their costs? it is huge up front investment to build them, but it is also a long term expense to maintain, we are talking about a huge amount of new track being added to an already massive system.
The circle line will be huge for the west side. Too bad its just now being rebuilt. Thats right it was torn down years ago. You can still catch a glimpse of it over the UP West tracks about near Damen - theres an old bridge over the Metra Tracks - that was the old version of the circle. Then there was the humbolt Park line, the congress A and B, the Garfield Park line, all on the West Side.
If you read the book Block by Block, the history of the Westside it tells the story of how the Machine disinvested in the Westside because it didnt vote their way ie republican leaning / and slowly the west was neglected, the trains, sewers and streets, and bulldozed for new machine voting southern blacks. Most of the whites moved over the county line to DuPage and the westide never recovered. And its a shame because thats really where the soul of the city was.
The south side of the green line is in bad shape with acres upon acres of vacant land steps away from the el stops. The presence of an EL stop will not always be followed by economic growth. The land that the circle line is slated to pas through is not prime for redevelopment in the same way Archer Ave along the Orange line was. There is a prison, and a lot of freight and light manufacturing. If gentrification occurs there those freight handling and manufacturing jobs will move elsewhere. If you get off the green line at 43, 47, 51 Garfield, 63 Cottage Grove, or Ashland and you will find the majority of the land on the blocks that these stations sit on vacant.
Besides with 8mill the CTA can get a consultant and form a committee of Daily cronies and make some nice posters and conduct studies. We will need six more zeros to actually make it work and actually build / rebuild the circle line. Didn’t the rehabilitation and renovation of just the stations along the brown line cost Billions? How much more expensive will new tracks and stations be?
Well the Green line is prob going to get the olympics so I wouldnt worry too much down there. What it needs is more white folks - The southside has become 100% black past bridgeport. Low income black - blacks with money move out. Blame your federal government for that disaster on a massive scale that no one seems to want to talk about.
The Circle will have the United Center, UIC, The Illinois Med District, Intersection with the red, blue (2x), green, Orange and Pink lines, West Loop Loft District, Meatpacking District / Fulton Market, Ashland Ave Corridor, Pilsen and B-Port / Archer - A lot of people working service jobs will travel this
Essetialy Its an Ashland Ave. Corridor train, travel Ashland anytime at rush hour and you will see its pretty busy.
Heres that bridge just north of the UC which i think could use som parking lot lanscaping. Chicago a green city? Yeah right..
link
I love that bridge. It's part of the old Paulina corridor which the CTA is going to rebuild. It connected the Logan Square line to the Van Buren leg of the L.It went over the Lake St L.
Only the CTA could get away with leaving it there to rust until it fell down!
I think the Metra UP line uses it as a signal bridge - But would'nt it be cool to recondition it for the ne circle line? Look how high up it is - at least 25 feet above the Metra which is about 13 / 14 feet above grade. Imagine the view towards the city.
It would also make a great site for a house.
Fun photoblog windypixel
The story of Bill Thompson and his wife being robbed at gunpoint by 3 men in the lobby of their building at Barry and Sheridan is interesting. And I didn't know that Balaban, another resident of the building, moved to LA and became president of Paramount Pictures:
http://chicagocrimescenes.blogspot.com/
remember dancing in the basement to this when you were little?
ma baker
even better
macho macho duck
I liked macho macho duck.
Did anyone that the AFl-CIO is talking to Kelleher about investing in the Spire?
Chicago Spire developer in talks with AFL-CIO for funding
A deal with the trusts could also mean thousands of union jobs for members
By Mary Ellen Podmolik | Tribune reporter
March 24, 2009
Representatives from AFL-CIO Housing Investment Trusts are meeting with Chicago Spire developer Shelbourne Development Group on Tuesday to advance preliminary discussions that could have the deep-pocketed pension fund help pay for construction of the stalled skyscraper.
Discussions between the trusts and Irish developer Garrett Kelleher began in January, but the talks are in the "embryonic stage," said Tom Villanova, president of the Chicago and Cook County Building Trades Council, which represents 24 trades locally.
"The main thing is jobs," Villanova said. "We can use our own funds to benefit members. The Spire is going to be five years of construction, which is just phenomenal for us. It's thousands of jobs."
An investment by the pension fund would make the project a 100 percent union job.
"Obviously, the idea of pulling the unions together and making this a 'Made in America' project is very positive," said project spokeswoman Kim Metcalfe, who confirmed ongoing discussions with the union.
"We're exploring all of the financial options with the economy as challenging as it is, but clearly this is long-term," Metcalfe said. "We're working toward the success of the building. We continue to actively market the building. Clearly, the construction of the building is on pause, but nothing else about the building has stopped."
The break in construction has left a hole 110 feet wide and 76 feet deep at 400 N. Lake Shore Drive, making the Spire a worldwide symbol of the recession and shut-down credit markets. It has had numerous liens filed against it as consultants and contractors involved in the initial work sought payment for their services. Architect Santiago Calatrava, who designed the twisting building, filed liens against the project in October for more than $11 million.
The union has three investment trusts, including the Building Investment Trust, a pooled real estate fund with more than $2.5 billion in assets as of Dec. 31. It was created in 1988 as a vehicle to provide competitive risk-adjusted returns for its participants, as well as a way to create jobs in commercial real estate projects for its members.
The Chicago market has proved to be the biggest beneficiary of the fund, with more than $1 billion invested in local projects, including senior and affordable housing and Trump International Hotel & Tower, Villanova said.
The trust, Villanova added, also is interested in investing in the construction of an Olympic village, should Chicago win the 2016 Games.
I forget, have we discussed the Chicago Children's Move to Grant Park on here? Where do you guys stand on the issue.
Sorry I intended to type the Chicago Children's Museum, but you knew what I meant... right?
I think we did, I am against it being located in Grant Park because it is too expensive for average parents to visit there with parking being as expensive as it is and there is no convenient connection via the CTA. It should be located in a real neighborhood with rail CTA and decent road access. Why not Logan Square, Washington Park, or Garfield Park, A real neighborhood with real children who don’t have very much to do indoors when the weather is not so nice? The lake shore yuppies have a children’s museum (glorified indoor playground) already in the Science and Industries and Field Museums. Not to mention the Zoo, cultural center, the thing across the street from the cultural center, Millennium Park, The Art institute, the Shed Aquarium, the Planetarium, Nature museum, Petting Zoo, and the Harold Washington Library. There is already too much of a concentration of cultural institutions in one small space. Within 3 miles of Navy Pier there are more than 35 museums, cultural centers and sculpture gardens. I think spreading the wealth around and using the museum as a catalyst for positive urban development is a better use on the 10-30 million instead of an tripped out underground bunker.
But first we need to oust Daily and all his corrupt cronies. If I was elected mayor I would fire everyone from the 9th floor up. Any bets on who the next Daily official will be to be inedited on federal corruption charges?
Thanks, I think that is a really strong arguement. I appreciate that you didn't even need to dwell on the history of Grant Park issues.
Grant Park is for day trippers and tourists. the yuppie of chicago don't go to those places very often.
The yuppie of Chicago saved it from ruin and brought good coffee to town. Love your local yuppies - you need them.
I like the notion that Yuppies are a force of change? Well if we placed something that they want in a place that could benefit from additional foot traffic all the more reason to steer this and other cultural projects to underserved, economically struggling neighborhoods. It might help keep some businesses open and create opportunities for new businesses. I don’t know were this falls on the conservative scale of socialism but if the city is going to build the thing why not place it in a location that could yield larger social and economic benefits, location can make a huge difference in the numbers of people positively and profoundly impacted by this project. No more taxpayer funded museums within 3 miles of Navy Pier. Use the public funds to foster development in deserving underserved communities such as the West Side. Not to mention locating out of the loop can greatly reduce the cost per square foot.
I dont know where the notion of urban yuppies as a bad thing came from - I mean in Chicago and NY the yuppies reinvigorated downtown and made urban life doable for the non-poor who where only urban by fact they had nowhere else to go. I remember going to my grandparents' and great aunts in the city when I was young and there wasnt anything cool about their non-yuppie decaying neighborhood. If anything we need more yuppies. I even know yuppie plumbers - the manual laboring yuppie is a fact. Young guy, owns his own plumbing service, lives large downtown. Prob makes as much as 3 architects.
Seriously, even if you wanted this to support yuppies, you could place it in a loft of other neighborhoods, such as wickerpark, bucktown, logan square etc. Atleast then you would be putting it in an area that has children.
Incidentally, who among you are Young (perhaps under 35?)
Urban Professionals?
I am, though I don't drink coffee.
I am and I drink coffee. But I don’t have a dog so maybe I’m only half a Yuppie. Consult the list of stuff white people like to determine how much of a Yuppie you are.
Im not advocating Grant Park, I agree many neighborhoods should be first in line for such a museum ( is museum the right word? Really - its a romper room)
This is a debate as old as the city - the neighborhoods vs. the downtown growth coalition. You see it in TIFs which funnel money to downtown, road repairs, allocation of greening funds and museums. Its why 3/4 of the southside and about 90% of the westside are unihabited. The government pays people to live there. Everyone else said fuck it a long time ago.
i guess im a yuppie.... but can you be a yuppie on a very low 5 figure income?
i love coffee...
that article about the spire is fantastic... that would be a great thing if the afl cio can negoiate the continuation of construction there...
aaaaaaaaaaaaaand
2000!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
wowooooooooooooooooooooooo
go sox
The AFL /CIO financed the martina city complex to if I recall. Thats actualy the kind of things pension funds and insurance companies used to invest in.
The question remains however - Is the Spire still FUGLY? Seems a bit Roccocco for Chicago
Go Sox
I think income is irrelivent to yuppie ness. My intent was just to point out how silly a supposed block of people it is. There is no yuppie movement, it is just a large number of people with greatly varying interests, incomes, neighborhoods, etc. etc.
We have some things in common, but others we completely disagree over. The only overwhelming yuppie trait seems to be that 99% of them come up with an excuse for why they aren't a yuppie.
I think income is irrelivent to yuppie ness. My intent was just to point out how silly a supposed block of people it is. There is no yuppie movement, it is just a large number of people with greatly varying interests, incomes, neighborhoods, etc. etc.
We have some things in common, but others we completely disagree over. The only overwhelming yuppie trait seems to be that 99% of them come up with an excuse for why they aren't a yuppie.
i dont think the spire is FUGLY at all...
honestly i think the spires aesthetic will be largely dwarfed by the shear size of it... i hope hope hope hope hope it gets built...
Chicago has changed since its last set of landmarks were constructed... i want this new chicago to have one as well (outside millenium park)
go spire
and sox
Id really like to see comissions such as the spire go to Chicago architects and structural engineers. The drilldo is just not doing it for me. The scallops as vortex softening elements seems like post - rationalistation to me. I'd much perfer something akin to SOM's 1997 proposal for 7 S. Dearborn. Streamlined, structural idea is exposed as relief cuts, classic chicago super core with cantaliever slabs, prominant mast. Love it.
7 S. Dearborn
Isn't Calatrava a big driving force behind the spire? Was their ever any competition for that one?
by the way, that 7 S. Dearborn does look really cool.
i wish the chicago spire and 7 south dearborn were built. the skyline would look really cool with 6 super tall towers instead of the 4 that are there now.
yeah... im with you, 7 s. looks great... im a fan...
and as for the drill form... perhaps its a post rationalized structural design, but there is no denying that it would significantly reduce wind loads, as the highest loads occur at the corners... i personally feel like the spiral concept works a bit to well to be written off as completely post rationalized archi-crap... though synergy would be more apt to speak on that point...
Functionally, I dont see the appeal of living above the 50s or 60s - its a chore to get down, in an emergency your kind of screwed. The views would be great but you really have to like the height. I guess if I was super loaded and it was my "in town" apartment it would be cool. But for everday living it might get old.
eh.... i dont know... they are pretty stringent about waiting times on elevatoring in towers like that... id be suprised if your trip from the penthouses up top to the lobby would take more than a min or two door to door, especially in such a luxurious tower...
2 min is enough to pass out in the elevator and pee myself after an archinect meetup
yes...perhaps... but its not much longer than it might take to get to the door of a 3rd floor walk up... if you can even make it...
7 S Dearborn is ok. It doesn't show much imagination. Look at Foster's highrises or have a competition.
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