"The Arab emirate of Dubai will build a replica of Lyons," we read, "under a $685M deal signed with the French city last week." This brings up the interesting question of whether an entire city can franchise itself.
its like ZiZeK and his idea about a product and its lack of its own malignant property. in this case, lyon/dubai is lacking the malignant property that is lyon.
Atleast Lyon is getting paid for it.
The Venetian (In Las Vegas) didn't give Venice anything!
I wonder if the people of Lyons get any of the money...
Perhaps they should all be paid to move to dubai and keep living there...
Why is this so hard to believe? As mhollenstein says about Vegas, that is the prime example. Many people may not have the resources to go to the Original Venice, but can easily go to the Vegas version. I've even heard that some people think that the Vegas Venice is better than the original?
I say Good on them. Just think about the ski hill Dubai built awhile back. That would be the most amazing thing if I grew up and spent my entire life in a sweltering heat. In fact I'm gonna head to the indoor waterpark right now and hang out on the "beach" and get outta this -40 degree cold snap we're in here.
But wouldn't it be easier just to follow the lead of Peter Cook, and start designing these roaming walking cities that could be rented out to the highest bidder. Think about how convienient that would be....we wouldn't have to travel, we could have our respective countries brings the culture to you. "Ooh, have you heard who's coming to town next month? Prague! Damn that's gonna be a great show!"
"Was Dubai ever really interesting? It jumped the shark straight out tha gate."
Dubai is an interesting phenomenon, unless all you are interested in is backyard remodels.
Interesting fact is that no one here on the boards is criticizing the Frenchies.
I get to go to Dubai at the start of March. I expect to be horrified by the grotesque extravagance, in a mildly sexual way. Like "ooh, don't do that, that's disgusting, uhuh, oh! That's too much, slow slow slow baby. so huge, ahhh" beading in perspiration, taking photos, sweltering. The whole thing is a big porn shoot. I expect to feel a little bit tarnished afterwards, drained...
I fully intend to go snowboarding in the desert snowdome.
The sovereign wealth funds that are coming out of the seven Emirates (Qatar, Abu Dhabi, Dubai etc) are keeping the London construction market alive. Richard Rogers/Candy & Candy's latest in Chelsea, and Renzo Piano's Shard of Glass are prime examples of Middle Eastern funding.
Oil money similarly kept many construction professionals in business during the downturn in western economies in the 1970's, the one that was pre-saged by the construction of the World Trade Centre, Sears Tower, Hancock Tower.
As well as making replicas of the west in the middle east, they are making (economically) middle-eastern outposts in the west. Because of the non-shareholder long-term nature of the sovereign wealth funds, their feasibility calculations are far different from a traditional western bank/private equity fund, thus otherwise unfundable projects are getting off the ground. Globalisation pays my wages.
A big thankyou goes out to the Sheikhs and Emirs.
I expect Abu Dhabi's greener approach to have the more successful/attractive long-term future than Dubai.
I will criticize the Frenchies...Just like i do the builders of Vegas and for that matter the mega-tainment-cities of the oil-rich despots..
First of all, they generally aren't thinking at all about their environmental impact or in a totally superficial way (lets add turbines).
Which is personally why i agree with Psyarch, that Abu Dhabi's green approach (ie: Masdar city et al) will be the better long term investment.
Such projects (like the new Lyon or the newest weird tower) for the most part do not help to develop any sort of local sense of place or contextualism for these countries.
Additionally, there are many options between the two extremes ie: backyard remodels and working in Dubai..
Psyarch,
i don't think you really have any idea what you're talking about:
for starters, Qatar is a whole other country that doesn't have anything to do with the UAE, as a matter of fact it isn't even a neighboring country of the Emirates....
no offence, bro...
This is really not worth arguing, but you did mention Qatar as one of the 7 emirates, and since you're goin there in March, i thought you should at least know that the 7 emirates (of the UAE) don't include Qatar.
Good intention...
have fun there...
Bro!
As you are practically local, what's the news from the other side of the gulf? Tehran fascinates me. In a twist I lived there (as a child) before the revolution.
I'm told that in the immediate aftermath of 9/11 much of the oil money that had been being invested in the West was turned towards more local investments around the Gulf. Does Qatari/UAE money impact Iranian construction?
we all know the only reason this is being built is for the $$$. its a tourist attraction.
so really this is no different than the big box stores and stucco boxes we put up every day. its just got a little twist. now were trampling on sacred ground. putting stucco boxes up is a disgrace. but nothing like taking something beautiful like lyons which isnt just buildings and roads. but a wonderful place on this earth. now were going to make it an item by replicating for the almighty $$$. this is ridiculous. might aswell clone jesus to preform miracles on pay per view.
well then so much for creating anything original to enjoy. architecture should be a record or humanity (flw) but our generation has no record. we will only be known as the generation that just copied a bunch of stuff for a few bucks
Architecture's seen worse periods of stagnation and repetition shaner. Hell, if it weren't for the massive Beaux Arts craze in the 19th century we never would have gotten something as radical as modernism to react to it.
Feb 7, 08 12:53 am ·
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Has Dubai jumped the shark?
"The Arab emirate of Dubai will build a replica of Lyons," we read, "under a $685M deal signed with the French city last week." This brings up the interesting question of whether an entire city can franchise itself.
Lyons-Dubai
Can we try people in international court for lack of taste?
I mean, this is just disgusting.
i can't wait to visit the lost ruins of Dubai in the not too distant future.
Good on them for trying... atleast they believe in the power of architecture.
just when i thought dubai couldn't get any uglier...
mhollenstein, don't count on it, but u might be able to visit the middle-eastern version of Los Vegas soon enough.
they're trying to out-jump itself every time.
Yes...
And i couldn't believe this when i read it.. How does a city "franchise" itself?
Franchise? France gave itself away a long time ago. Franchise Schmanchise.
its like ZiZeK and his idea about a product and its lack of its own malignant property. in this case, lyon/dubai is lacking the malignant property that is lyon.
Atleast Lyon is getting paid for it.
The Venetian (In Las Vegas) didn't give Venice anything!
I wonder if the people of Lyons get any of the money...
Perhaps they should all be paid to move to dubai and keep living there...
do they believe in the power of architecture or the power of imagineering?
you totally missed the point of malignant content.
or else i did.
At least one can try to roll a Hard-8 in Vegas.
point taken Steven, they believe in one and the same, but if i was writing the marketing brochue, i would go with "Imagineering!"
Was Dubai ever really interesting? It jumped the shark straight out tha gate.
Why is this so hard to believe? As mhollenstein says about Vegas, that is the prime example. Many people may not have the resources to go to the Original Venice, but can easily go to the Vegas version. I've even heard that some people think that the Vegas Venice is better than the original?
I say Good on them. Just think about the ski hill Dubai built awhile back. That would be the most amazing thing if I grew up and spent my entire life in a sweltering heat. In fact I'm gonna head to the indoor waterpark right now and hang out on the "beach" and get outta this -40 degree cold snap we're in here.
But wouldn't it be easier just to follow the lead of Peter Cook, and start designing these roaming walking cities that could be rented out to the highest bidder. Think about how convienient that would be....we wouldn't have to travel, we could have our respective countries brings the culture to you. "Ooh, have you heard who's coming to town next month? Prague! Damn that's gonna be a great show!"
"Was Dubai ever really interesting? It jumped the shark straight out tha gate."
Dubai is an interesting phenomenon, unless all you are interested in is backyard remodels.
Interesting fact is that no one here on the boards is criticizing the Frenchies.
I get to go to Dubai at the start of March. I expect to be horrified by the grotesque extravagance, in a mildly sexual way. Like "ooh, don't do that, that's disgusting, uhuh, oh! That's too much, slow slow slow baby. so huge, ahhh" beading in perspiration, taking photos, sweltering. The whole thing is a big porn shoot. I expect to feel a little bit tarnished afterwards, drained...
I fully intend to go snowboarding in the desert snowdome.
The sovereign wealth funds that are coming out of the seven Emirates (Qatar, Abu Dhabi, Dubai etc) are keeping the London construction market alive. Richard Rogers/Candy & Candy's latest in Chelsea, and Renzo Piano's Shard of Glass are prime examples of Middle Eastern funding.
Oil money similarly kept many construction professionals in business during the downturn in western economies in the 1970's, the one that was pre-saged by the construction of the World Trade Centre, Sears Tower, Hancock Tower.
As well as making replicas of the west in the middle east, they are making (economically) middle-eastern outposts in the west. Because of the non-shareholder long-term nature of the sovereign wealth funds, their feasibility calculations are far different from a traditional western bank/private equity fund, thus otherwise unfundable projects are getting off the ground. Globalisation pays my wages.
A big thankyou goes out to the Sheikhs and Emirs.
I expect Abu Dhabi's greener approach to have the more successful/attractive long-term future than Dubai.
Sameolddoctor.
I will criticize the Frenchies...Just like i do the builders of Vegas and for that matter the mega-tainment-cities of the oil-rich despots..
First of all, they generally aren't thinking at all about their environmental impact or in a totally superficial way (lets add turbines).
Which is personally why i agree with Psyarch, that Abu Dhabi's green approach (ie: Masdar city et al) will be the better long term investment.
Such projects (like the new Lyon or the newest weird tower) for the most part do not help to develop any sort of local sense of place or contextualism for these countries.
Additionally, there are many options between the two extremes ie: backyard remodels and working in Dubai..
Psyarch,
i don't think you really have any idea what you're talking about:
for starters, Qatar is a whole other country that doesn't have anything to do with the UAE, as a matter of fact it isn't even a neighboring country of the Emirates....
no offence, bro...
But, Qatar is an Emirate (not one of the UAE), and does have a sovereign wealth fund...
And is in fact about 20 miles from the UAE
bro
This is really not worth arguing, but you did mention Qatar as one of the 7 emirates, and since you're goin there in March, i thought you should at least know that the 7 emirates (of the UAE) don't include Qatar.
Good intention...
have fun there...
Bro!
As you are practically local, what's the news from the other side of the gulf? Tehran fascinates me. In a twist I lived there (as a child) before the revolution.
I'm told that in the immediate aftermath of 9/11 much of the oil money that had been being invested in the West was turned towards more local investments around the Gulf. Does Qatari/UAE money impact Iranian construction?
wtf?? this is ridiculous
we all know the only reason this is being built is for the $$$. its a tourist attraction.
so really this is no different than the big box stores and stucco boxes we put up every day. its just got a little twist. now were trampling on sacred ground. putting stucco boxes up is a disgrace. but nothing like taking something beautiful like lyons which isnt just buildings and roads. but a wonderful place on this earth. now were going to make it an item by replicating for the almighty $$$. this is ridiculous. might aswell clone jesus to preform miracles on pay per view.
You may think its a disgrace, but many people will enjoy it. Its their world too.
well then so much for creating anything original to enjoy. architecture should be a record or humanity (flw) but our generation has no record. we will only be known as the generation that just copied a bunch of stuff for a few bucks
nice
lol, our generations impact is in the atmosphere, not in concrete.
Architecture's seen worse periods of stagnation and repetition shaner. Hell, if it weren't for the massive Beaux Arts craze in the 19th century we never would have gotten something as radical as modernism to react to it.
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