That guy had some problems with people nicking his photos, I think, so he protected his shots. Remember, kids, Flickr (and most photogs) prefers that you include a link to the photo's page, even when hotlinking!
But yeah, I've seen these pics, I know it's still under construction, but it looks somehow much more sinister under Beijing's grey skies than in the (brightly colored) renderings. Maybe the LED animations running across the skin will liven it up, here's hoping those made the final cut on the add/alternate list!
can anyone imagine all of these Olympic era buildings being torn down in some future political movement? it's pretty amazing to think that some random bob from the netherlands is allowed to build such a monster edifice in the heart of beijing. megalomania is fitting but colonial may also be quite appropriate.
You're right sevensixfive, the building is actually a concrete moment-frame structure encased in a tangled cage of steel. One of my structures teachers actually worked on the project at Arup and if i remember correctly he said the building had twice the amount of structure or a normal building. Its easy to see his point looking at it up close.
^seems like the concrete structure gives way as the towers reach the point of cantilever, when the steel diagrid structure takes over? I like that the concentrations of diagonal lines in the facade breaks correspond to the structural engineer's diagrams of the internal structural stresses.
those images are amazing. i don't think Rem was chosen randomly.
it will be very interesting if the skies actually clear up after chinese govt shuts down factories and stops traffic for that very purpose. maybe the renderings are based on the work/pollution slowdown period of the olympic games :-)
Liebchen: I like that the concentrations of diagonal lines in the facade breaks correspond to the structural engineer's diagrams of the internal structural stresses.
Is this actually true? I hope so, because I love this kind of "honest decoration" - it means something, it's like a contemporary version of telling stories of the saints all over the Gothic cathedrals. Only tons better. But knowing Rem it seems those lines could actually be, only, decoration.
I'm embarrassed to admit I'm liking the building more as I see actual photos instead of models. But wait, "like" isn't the right word. It's awesome in the real meaning of that word: terrifyingly overwhelming and commanding respect even if the respect is based in fear. The thing, despite all the (major) political problems, despite the horrid environmental implications of using 2-3x as much steel as a typical building would demand - the damn object ends up being pretty stunning.
all this iconic architecture. all coming out of little blue styrofoam models. seems to me that its all really the accomplishment of engineers and little to do with architects. god, we have to consult a structural engineer for the size of a freakin simpson strap or j anchor. maybe they used all the steel to reinforce the building against the icbm that is pointed at it, (as when our war with china happens in 2030 over them trying to collect the debt we owe them) we will most likely take out chinese tv first.
"A diagrid system 'exoskeleton' has been adopted on the external faces of the building to give a tube structure that will resist gravity and any lateral forces. The positioning of the columns and diagonal tubes reflects the distribution of forces in the surface skin of the building.
The columns of the diagrid have the same exposed width but the depth varies according to the load, while the diagonals are all 1m x 60cm plate girders, with only the steel thickness varying. The building is set to break the Chinese design codes for such a structure, but this was expected for such an innovative design."
I've heard that the those exterior columns are more than simply a diagrid structure on the skeleton, but also weave in and towards the facade. I'm sure there might be some neat interstitial spaces, but when you consider the building is for a communications & media organization(not company) then in some ways the form is in the words of an engineer 40-60% efficient. The building is either great or a disaster, I"m still on the fence.
I keep hearing that it's a tube, structurally, but if you look at all that steel in the cantilevers, it doesn't look like a tube at all, just a superdense mesh of steel with columns and diagonals everywhere. I don't know how much usable space could be left inside.
I don't want to get so overwhelmed by this building's relevance that I fail to express delight that the race to build the up-over-and-down-again-somewhere-else tower has been almost won. And don't knock it's apparent lack of mobiusness-ness until you try to do it with a foam cutter. What is smooth space but smashed-up chunky?
from what i know of OMA the entire design is not just the result of a few little foam models.
from working with engineers i am not so inclined to give them the credit. the guys at arup i have worked with told me point blank they were'nt designers, just facilitators. which surprised me. not to make little of their contribution as it is surely quite large...but the architect is the one that starts it all and keeps it on track.
Someone had a fake Rem profile and a fake Ole Scheeren profile, too, but they've been deleted. The fake Ole left a comment on CCTV's page that was something like:
"Dude, you're so unstable ... programmatically! Structurally you're a fucking rock. I think."
that's what eisenman used to say about HIS loop building in the 'weak form' lecture he used to give, odb. the twisting, turning, looping-back ambiguity of his project was intentionally meant to communicate its non-phallic nature.
has rem made the same comments/claims about this one?
somehow the phallic metaphor seems...flaccid...this time because, despite cctv's non-phallic form, this project is certainly about a very historically-masculine projection/communication of power and control.
my partner pointed out to me a few days ago that cctv looks a lot like an un-built building by, i think, architecten cie, and that rem even wrote a letter to them apologising for building something similar to what they dreamed up...or something like that.
not that this is relevant to anything, but it reminded me that what rem is doing sits in a context of other architects exploring similar ideas and is not so standalone as many might wish or imply...
haven't heard rem talk about penises on this one. it is a grand and offputting building cuz of its bulk, but so is the convention centre he did way back when. is that also about power and control? sometimes, i think, program is just program and symbolism is not all its cracked up to be. i mean if this was a building with a big ol lenin on top type of thing it would be hard to argue, but when we come right down to it, its just big. big is not a value, is it? i can't remember.
trust me on this o d b, when you see this thing in real life, "subtle" is the last word that will jump into your head. Does it look like like a giant vagina instead of a penis? Maybe, but that still doesn't change the fact that it is awesome in the truest sense of the word.
it's more like two penises connected by a crooked bridge...
and to answer an earlier question, spatially TVCC will be much more interesting once completed...so i kind of like it more... (at least that's what i think from the construction tour i got)
but for pure icon eye candy, nothing beats the CCTV..
I think it looks great; and the form maximises the number of cublicles with windows...without building a doughnut shape building...but what do the chinese think about the "feng shui" ?
Jan 19, 08 4:43 pm ·
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Rem's Ode to Megalomania inches nearer to completion
Cool pic of CCTV:
Apparently they've joined the two towers. I saw it in Beijing last summer and I'm still in awe of it.
ok then
huh, first time i've never had a pic work off of flickr, anyway here's the link in case anybody's interested.
That guy had some problems with people nicking his photos, I think, so he protected his shots. Remember, kids, Flickr (and most photogs) prefers that you include a link to the photo's page, even when hotlinking!
But yeah, I've seen these pics, I know it's still under construction, but it looks somehow much more sinister under Beijing's grey skies than in the (brightly colored) renderings. Maybe the LED animations running across the skin will liven it up, here's hoping those made the final cut on the add/alternate list!
can anyone imagine all of these Olympic era buildings being torn down in some future political movement? it's pretty amazing to think that some random bob from the netherlands is allowed to build such a monster edifice in the heart of beijing. megalomania is fitting but colonial may also be quite appropriate.
I was thinking the same thing when i saw it with my own eyes in beijing.
then again, "Mega-projects are nothing new in China."
i fixed your image apurimac. flickr can be sneaky with how they display images.
these photos are by tom van dillen, aka dutch tom. i've been following his flickr stream for a long time.... excellent stuff
posted to news
thanks paul.
Working for a GC I can only imagine how big of a headache that project is to manage.
So. Much. Steel. And part of it looks like reinforced concrete, too.
Who likes the TVCC building better?
You're right sevensixfive, the building is actually a concrete moment-frame structure encased in a tangled cage of steel. One of my structures teachers actually worked on the project at Arup and if i remember correctly he said the building had twice the amount of structure or a normal building. Its easy to see his point looking at it up close.
^seems like the concrete structure gives way as the towers reach the point of cantilever, when the steel diagrid structure takes over? I like that the concentrations of diagonal lines in the facade breaks correspond to the structural engineer's diagrams of the internal structural stresses.
those images are amazing. i don't think Rem was chosen randomly.
it will be very interesting if the skies actually clear up after chinese govt shuts down factories and stops traffic for that very purpose. maybe the renderings are based on the work/pollution slowdown period of the olympic games :-)
Liebchen: I like that the concentrations of diagonal lines in the facade breaks correspond to the structural engineer's diagrams of the internal structural stresses.
Is this actually true? I hope so, because I love this kind of "honest decoration" - it means something, it's like a contemporary version of telling stories of the saints all over the Gothic cathedrals. Only tons better. But knowing Rem it seems those lines could actually be, only, decoration.
I'm embarrassed to admit I'm liking the building more as I see actual photos instead of models. But wait, "like" isn't the right word. It's awesome in the real meaning of that word: terrifyingly overwhelming and commanding respect even if the respect is based in fear. The thing, despite all the (major) political problems, despite the horrid environmental implications of using 2-3x as much steel as a typical building would demand - the damn object ends up being pretty stunning.
all this iconic architecture. all coming out of little blue styrofoam models. seems to me that its all really the accomplishment of engineers and little to do with architects. god, we have to consult a structural engineer for the size of a freakin simpson strap or j anchor. maybe they used all the steel to reinforce the building against the icbm that is pointed at it, (as when our war with china happens in 2030 over them trying to collect the debt we owe them) we will most likely take out chinese tv first.
Liberty Bell-
From here:
"A diagrid system 'exoskeleton' has been adopted on the external faces of the building to give a tube structure that will resist gravity and any lateral forces. The positioning of the columns and diagonal tubes reflects the distribution of forces in the surface skin of the building.
The columns of the diagrid have the same exposed width but the depth varies according to the load, while the diagonals are all 1m x 60cm plate girders, with only the steel thickness varying. The building is set to break the Chinese design codes for such a structure, but this was expected for such an innovative design."
This building gives me a hard on.
I've heard that the those exterior columns are more than simply a diagrid structure on the skeleton, but also weave in and towards the facade. I'm sure there might be some neat interstitial spaces, but when you consider the building is for a communications & media organization(not company) then in some ways the form is in the words of an engineer 40-60% efficient. The building is either great or a disaster, I"m still on the fence.
woot! Its a masterpiece
I love the automonuments :)
I keep hearing that it's a tube, structurally, but if you look at all that steel in the cantilevers, it doesn't look like a tube at all, just a superdense mesh of steel with columns and diagonals everywhere. I don't know how much usable space could be left inside.
I don't want to get so overwhelmed by this building's relevance that I fail to express delight that the race to build the up-over-and-down-again-somewhere-else tower has been almost won. And don't knock it's apparent lack of mobiusness-ness until you try to do it with a foam cutter. What is smooth space but smashed-up chunky?
it is really two masterpieces.
from what i know of OMA the entire design is not just the result of a few little foam models.
from working with engineers i am not so inclined to give them the credit. the guys at arup i have worked with told me point blank they were'nt designers, just facilitators. which surprised me. not to make little of their contribution as it is surely quite large...but the architect is the one that starts it all and keeps it on track.
CCTV on Myspace: link
Someone had a fake Rem profile and a fake Ole Scheeren profile, too, but they've been deleted. The fake Ole left a comment on CCTV's page that was something like:
"Dude, you're so unstable ... programmatically! Structurally you're a fucking rock. I think."
Why "Rem's Ode To Megalomania" as title...? Is this Rem's perceived megalomania or the Chinese people/state or....?
It's an important building.
I think Megalomania is more applicable to say the Moscow project that was recently posted here. Foster is the new SOM.
i thought this was supposed to be the anti-megalomania building...
remember--it's the least phallic skyscraper in the world!!
that's what eisenman used to say about HIS loop building in the 'weak form' lecture he used to give, odb. the twisting, turning, looping-back ambiguity of his project was intentionally meant to communicate its non-phallic nature.
has rem made the same comments/claims about this one?
somehow the phallic metaphor seems...flaccid...this time because, despite cctv's non-phallic form, this project is certainly about a very historically-masculine projection/communication of power and control.
my partner pointed out to me a few days ago that cctv looks a lot like an un-built building by, i think, architecten cie, and that rem even wrote a letter to them apologising for building something similar to what they dreamed up...or something like that.
not that this is relevant to anything, but it reminded me that what rem is doing sits in a context of other architects exploring similar ideas and is not so standalone as many might wish or imply...
haven't heard rem talk about penises on this one. it is a grand and offputting building cuz of its bulk, but so is the convention centre he did way back when. is that also about power and control? sometimes, i think, program is just program and symbolism is not all its cracked up to be. i mean if this was a building with a big ol lenin on top type of thing it would be hard to argue, but when we come right down to it, its just big. big is not a value, is it? i can't remember.
trust me on this o d b, when you see this thing in real life, "subtle" is the last word that will jump into your head. Does it look like like a giant vagina instead of a penis? Maybe, but that still doesn't change the fact that it is awesome in the truest sense of the word.
actually, i have seen it in real life.
it's more like two penises connected by a crooked bridge...
and to answer an earlier question, spatially TVCC will be much more interesting once completed...so i kind of like it more... (at least that's what i think from the construction tour i got)
but for pure icon eye candy, nothing beats the CCTV..
I think it looks great; and the form maximises the number of cublicles with windows...without building a doughnut shape building...but what do the chinese think about the "feng shui" ?
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