Be careful not to rock the boat too much as a new employee. The firm may have previously evaluated and declined the software you want to use, and you may be walking into landmines by insisting that you have it.

On the other hand, if you know the firm uses a certain software, you might ask about the process for obtaining a copy on your machine.

Finally, be prudent in your requests and only ask for software that you know you will need for a specific project. I've seen former colleagues insist on software that they ultimately did not use.

I guess it depends a bit on where you are going and why they are hiring you. If someone looked at my 3D work and was hiring me to be the 3D guy because of what they saw I'd expect them to provide me with the tools I need to do the job they expect.

If on the other hand I was being offered a job at Pixar I wouldn't expect them to buy FormZ for me.

At least find out before hand what they have and what you're getting into. If possible discuss the process with the employees, I had an employer who was a real salesman and would pretty much tell you what they thought you needed to hear to accept the job.

I know it sounds a bit rediculous to base your employment on software but I don't think I could ever again accept a job at an office that uses Power Cad. It was the biggest waste of time and it's so in-accurate it's pathetic. Yes it's just a tool, but when you need a screwdriver a hammer aint much use.

...especially if one is at least in part being hired on the strength of portfolio work the look of which employers want quickly replicated. My guess is that they not only want me to produce these drawings personally but that want them from the teams they want me to pm. Having the right tools can be pretty important

I've been in this situation before and I'm currently in one now. You should get an advocate to vouch for you. In other words, just send your boss a link to a project done in fRor vray and compare it to the current (most likely outdated) renderer that you use. This is my best strategy.

I'm not registered and I'm not an associate or anything, I've only got one year of experience, and I've found the best way to have any kind of sway with anything is the obvious knowledge gap with technology that many of the older people simply don't know.

the question is whether its really a needed application cuz they all cost money.

vado's right. If you decide to leave the firm, how pissed are they going to be that they had to buy special software for you? How much time and effort will the IT person need to spend to get the program operational for you?

Screw the IT people. They are dicks anyway.

If you absolutely need it, try selling the idea... tell your boss about the advantages of using that software over others and how it will improve workflow/productivity/quality of work/etc. The worse that can happen is getting a "no."

I understand the cost issues, but business is business. And if you get behind the times in terms of pretty picture-producing software for good clients who often love to eat things like that up, there are plenty of other firms out there.

If it were up to IT people they wouldn't even allow us to use photoshop or sketchup. They are usually education-less assclowns who are often overpaid by architecture.

i always learned the software the office used.

except for 3d, cuz they didn't have any yet. this was 90's so i got them to buy fmz. they were happy. so was i.


personally i would ask. maybe it can be framed in neutral way so it doesn't sound diva-like. that is, not a request or demand, but an expression of opinion about 1 software over another, a question about budget for software aquisitions, etc.

guess it depends where you are in the hierachy and how comfortable you are asking for things. i do believe people are not given anything they don't ask for...so if it means anything to you, could be least frustrating path if you bring up early. they may laugh or think you are an arrogant bugger...but really, unless you are desparate for work what have yo got to lose by asking relavent questions that might affect your productivity...?

I think you should ask to get to know what is expected of you.
If they are only hiring you to be a cad monkey, they aren't going to want to give you rendering programs and photoshop and such. That may make a difference as to whether you want to take the job or not. On the other hand, if you're being hired to do renderings, it should be important they give you what you're familiar with. If you have a nice picture in your portfolio you made with Vray and photoshop, they should know that you may not be able to create the same quality with a free version of sketch up.
It's not in your interest or your employer's for you to be doing something you don't know how to do. Personally, I know VIZ and MAX and AutoCAD, so if a firm is using Microstation and FormZ, I would just not be very productive, and I know I would probably not meet their expectations. That's definitely something they should know before we're both invested in a job.

Wait till you chose a firm, start, and then spend a week or two familiarizing yourself with their CAD software set-up. If it's not to your satisfaction AND there is a significant upgrade available that somehow firm's not aware of, then you could start discussion with person who heads up your group or studio to find out how these decisions are made. Don't press issue until you understand firm's IT dynamics, so that you don't prematurely wreck your reputation as a team player/nice guy/good hire.

dependency on a specific software program is the quickest way to obsolescence and being pigeonholed. your skills should extend beyond how to make pretty pictures in only one or two programs. get over it and take advantage of the new office to increase your knowledge and professional value. flexibility is more important the longer you plan on sticking around. (this only applies to offices using real professional level software, if they use home-cad or think that sketch-up can produce photorealistic simulations, then run, run away)

If my new job didn't have powerpoint, I'd be in trouble!

Thanks al! Good advice :)

I thought of this thread after bringing some 3d work home for the first time in a while - I noticed two things that I think made me much more efficient while working at home, and I said to myself, next job, I'm asking for these:

1: high res monitor(s). home is a 6 year old 22" CRT running 1920x1440. Work is a 4 year old 17" LCD running 1280x1024. I think I'll ask for a 30" LCD running 2540x1560 or whatever it is.

2: good graphics card. home is a quadro 3500, work is a quadro nvs280. not trying to draw while watching a slideshow is niiiiicccee. I'm asking for a quadro 1700 minimum next time.

I'm thinking employers should jump for that pretty easily. it'd basically work out to a $1600 one time cost that's a write off.

I'm still trying to get photoshop 2 years later. When I need to do something, I just stay late and use someone's else's computer.

manamana, I've been tempted to buy myself better hardware to use while at work. Relatively cheap for the high returns in workmanship, speed...

perhaps an employer's perspective on this topic might be somewhat useful. as a general statement, we want all of our employees to be productive -- it's in our interests for them to be so. having said that, there are two main problems with specialized software -- a) it's very expensive, and b) it usually can't be shared. And, don't even get me started on "software envy" issues that arise when you buy one person a license and don't buy it for everybody.

I just did a quick web search on some of the more common applications talked about here:

Rhino: $800
Photoshop CS3: $630
Maya: $1,950
3 ds Max: $3,400
vray: $760

These are not trivial purchases -- especially in quantity.

We'd love to have lots and lots of software like this in our offices, but the licensing restrictions tend to be such that we cannot put them on our network and share them among our staff, on a check-out basis, like we can with our AutoCAD, MicroStation and Revit licenses. When we buy stuff like this, it typically has to be loaded on a single machine, then tends to sit unused for long periods of time, isn't always available to others who may need to use it, and eventually gets lost as machines migrate around the office.

Or, we build a specialty high-end machine (or so) and ask someone to be our dedicated high-end software specialist -- which quickly leads to burnout and frustration, 'cause that person gets overworked and isn't getting broad experience.

We're really open to creative solutions to this problem -- but, I can tell you that simply throwing money at it to buy a bunch of licenses that will be inefficiently used and managed isn't a solution that most firms can adopt.

Software envy? From my desk I can see some people with the massive huge monitors and superpowerful computers. All day they pump those expensive 3D programs. But jokes on them because the PM's (myself included) tell them what to do with the software. Point is, 3D CAD monkey is an entry level position. If you specalize in that you'll never move beyond it to management levels. Who cares what software they use...just make sure you get diversity in your experience and someday you'll be happy to have the crappy computer and be telling the fresh grad what to do with the pumped up computer.

I suppose if you ask for hardware or software, that it how it'll be seen - that that's what (and all) you care about. part of the current professional generation gap I suppose.

I've seen what quizical has mentioned...usually in smaller firms with only one or two digitally savy people. young folks come in all hot on whatever software they sorta learned in college, and are eager to impress in any way possible. Basically management doesn't get sufficient info to make a practical decision on what to standardize around, and just goes with what the excitable youngster is saying they need.