there's one on this site and i do believe her name is liberty bell.

Not licensed yet but approaching completion of IDP. Currently knocked up with offspring # uno. the "plan" was to wait until after registration to have children, but it has not worked out that way. I've been researching this and similar topics for some time, and it does seem (when women are successful in planning it!) that registration often happens prior to a family expansion, or after they've grown up a bit. I am sure that it will take me a bit longer now to get licensed, but to be honest I'm not so concerned with when as long as I get there.

small pots...thanks. thats prob the situation i'll end up in...even though it wasnt my ideal plan either. where have you researched/read about this issue? please share.

atsama, I finished registration the year I started trying to get pregnant. I really wanted to have the registration out of the way before embarking on the next project: having a kid.

Of the women I know with kids, it is as smallpotatoes said: they either got registered first or they haven't yet and are waiting for the kid(s) to be school age. When they are young there is just so little time in a day, and you DO want to have quality time with them, so you try to not overcommit yourself. Also, as smallpotatoes said again, it can happen later; as long as the license happens at SOME point it doesn't need to be right away. Priorities change once you have a kid, and I don't think having a license or not is that critical to *most* of the type of work (being an employee, that is) you will probably want to pursue after you become a parent, at least for a few years.

Of course, if you want to run your own firm, you'll need the license no matter what your child status is. Which is partly why I got mine first.

I had my child right after turning 36. Looking back, and four years in, I guess I think it's better to have the kid younger. You have more energy in youth, and your body can handle it better. I get sooo tired these days, and I know in part it is related to being 40 (things physically start to deteriorate pretty quickly at my age!) and part of it is the sheer quantity of energy, both physical and emotional, that a young child takes. Who knows, maybe a teenager will be even MORE exhausting, but I can't imagine it would be. Right now my kid is not at all self-sustaining, he needs me all the time, and he needs me to teach him things constantly. Teenagers start to have their own interests...I think!

I'm babbling, I really don't know what having a teen when I'm 50 will be like! One thing for certain about parenthood: you cannot predict it AT ALL except that it will be enormously impactful.

As for the studying and whatnot: I basically took one test every month-six weeks, and studied a bit beforehand then crammed the weekend immediately before. So it wasn't an enormous time commitment, but it was an effort that took time away from othe things (like renovating the house).

My simplistic advice is: get the license first. But if that doesn't work out, focus on how amazing parenthood is and don't stress the professionalism thing - there will be time to deal with it eventually. Everything will work out.

Mine is a similar situation to LB - got my license, quit my job just before the CA oral exam, and started a design/build company with my husband & a friend. Got pregnant after about a year, worked part time at home after she was born(20-30 hrs per week).

That worked out really well expect for the financial part - my husband and I were both flexible and around a lot, we've had so much time to spend with our daughter (now 21 months) and that has been great. We decided to start trying for a second after she was a year old (so the company had been going for a few years), and simultaneously sort of made the decision to give up on our own thing for a while because it just wasn't going to be feasible financially or mentally for us. Mainly it was probably me, because I could see that in order for us to really support us both I would have to work at least full time (and really much more since you're always working when it's your own thing), and I'm not ready to give up some of my time spent with the kids to do other people's kitchens & baths (the work we've been getting has not been very interesting).

So, currently I'm expecting a second and due mid-march, working about 20 hours a week for another architect (much less stress than working for myself), and doing the occasional small side thing as well, some drafting, some work for family, nothing stressful basically. My husband has just taken a consulting gig with a big construction company which allows him to work at home, so we're still in a great place in terms of flexibility and doing ok financially but without much stability, no health insurance (well, we have it but we're paying for our own, etc.). Even though it's risky, for the moment we hope it continues like this because we're able to be around so much, walk our daughter to day care 2 blocks away, hang out with her in the afternoons, etc., and we hope to be able to do the same with #2 for at least the first 6 months-year.

So many things to take into account, but definitely your priorities will change and career suddenly becomes a different issue and much futher reaching. I have to consider it in the long term, becuase I can't see myself really working full time for another few years. Breast-feeding also plays into it depending on how you feel about it. I ended up nursing her for more than a year, and the pumping thing didn't work well for me (sorry guys), so being able to work at home and be flexible about meetings etc. was key.

I would agree with LB that it would be a lot easier to get licensing out of the way before having kids, probably very hard to do it with small children, just from a mental exhaustion point of view. I also did one test a month and the whole thing took me a year. I think it probably has helped even with getting the part time jobs, although not at all crucial. And I can't imagine fully going out on my own again anytime soon, unless it's only one job at a time at which point I wouldn't be making much money.

I'm not sure if I would do it any different in retrospect. probably not, though I would say the old 'you can't do it all' adage has proven to be true for me.

forgot to add that we also added an addition to our house (we only had one bedroom), started when our daughter was about 3 months old. it's more or less done, still finishing up the kitchen. so it's possible to do a lot with little ones around, just very tiring...

atsama I had very little luck in finding documentable resources that related specifically to women in architecture. Sure there are magazines, blogs, and such that deal with the working-mom thing but architecture presents its own set of issues entirely. I ended up just asking everyone I knew or came in contact with, and was a bit dismayed to learn that:
1) most female principals of firms either decide not to have children or are married to their firm partner (allowing them flexibility while retaining design credibility)
2) the age-gap in our industry of women-of-childbearing-age (AIA's lingo, not mine) is largely due to professional women stopping out for a period of years to raise a family
3) It's difficult to find examples of working female architects that started a family and did not have to make some serious changes in their life to accomodate the kid.

Now, I understand that #3 seems sort of obvious, we are all comfortable that a woman should have to make professional sacrifices in order to have a child - which to me is a problem.
See this thread where we discuss at length:
http://www.archinect.com/forum/threads.php?id=61332_0_42_0_C

I think the issues smallp mentions above are relevant to almost any profession, perhaps more difficult for architects because we make relatively less money than say a lawyer or doctor, and that working part time becomes that much more of an issue.

BUT, and it's a big but because it's very rare, I am currently working for a woman architect who has two kids (divorced, and husband was not part of the practice) and manages to run a 7 person firm herself in addition to being a kick-ass designer and general cool person. She also somehow manages to spend lots of time with the kids, go out a lot, and stay fit?! It's possible, just takes an extraordinary kind of person to pull it off.

I also have several friends who are in their 30s and have kids and are working in various capacities, some part time, some full time, some teaching. There are many ways to go, and your changing priorities may even liberate you from the burden of the dream of starchitecture... depressing but better now than later, I think.

and for that last thing smallp said about making professional sacrifices, it somehow becomes more clear when you have kids that the sacrifice isn't as much of one as you thought, because you gain so much by not working so much.

!!!!Congratulations on the second time around, RA!!!!

We stopped at one, and that actually WAS a professional choice, as well as a financial one: me starting my own business and my husband being an artist just meant the prudent choice was that child #2 wasn't in the cards. And now I feel like I'm too old to have another. I hope I don't regret this later, but I'm pretty good at focusing on the positive.

One seems to be the ideal balance between having a life, a career, and a family. (I was a second kid)

wow, LB and RAR, thanks so much for your input. I have (not surprisingly) only a few role models at my job in this respect, most of my architecture school peers arent married so they arent thinking about this, and i just wanted some advice from those who've already done it. currently i am weighing three things...my job, having a kid, and being registered. i say my job, b/c i work at a firm that I LOVE, however, its a lot of urban design and master planning in addition to some architecture, and therefore, while i have already worked for 3 years, i probably need another 2-3 to finish IDP b/c not everything i do is applicable. but i am doing interesting work, and have been advancing at my firm, so its not like being unlicensed is holding me back (as LB pointed out above). i wanted to do some urban design, so i am really happy with the job.

however...i am feeling the pressure (all from myself) to get registered, so that we can start a family. i definitely come from a background that frowns on putting off kids for career ambitions (some would say, that by marrying at 28, i already delayed it long enough, believe it or not) and so there is a lot of internal conflict on this one. which leads me to wonder if i should actually find another job...one where i will just finish IDP quickly, and get registered.

so its all gotten tied up together - i.e. is getting registered first such an important goal that i should change jobs....? or do i just keep this job, get pregnant, and so what if i get registered in 5 years??

i actually have no ambition (i know, this is very un-architectural of me to admit) to start my own firm. i know how challenging that will be, but if i plan on being a mother, and involved in other things besides work, i think being an architect at a firm you don't own is challenge enough.. so, i dont have that driving me...its just the desire to get registration "out of the way."

As a middle-aged woman and licensed architect still practicing in Chicago, I can give you some insight regarding situation in Chicago. There is an active professional organization for women architects here, Chicago Women in Architecture. Many of the middle-aged "still-practicing" women architects here never married, or married but didn't have children. Secondly, many women architects who had children stopped at one (or twins) and didn't have their children until they were well-established professionally and in their late thirties.

Of course, there are very rare exceptions. One (only?) obvious exception is Carol Ross Barney, with her very successful and visible firm, who is a mother of now grown children. She is an excellent role model, but she alone can't beat "old boy cronyism" and Chicago's architectural work environment.

Otherwise motherhood doesn't mix well with architectural offices here. Firms would confidently wish a pregnant woman "good luck" as she was pushed out in the 80s. Now we can return from maternity leave but be viewed as "mommy track" worker-bees rather than promotable candidates.

SOM Chicago's 1st and only woman partner was compelled by her fellow partners to return only two weeks after birth. She left shortly thereafter. SOM hasn't named a woman partner in Chicago since, much less promoted a mother.

Women architects here have not had much success in making partnership at the larger offices. Most "successful" women architects left architectural practice, to go into owner-representative positions at institutions and real estate developers, mostly in 2nd-tier positions. Some women have "mom 'n pop" small practices, but it's difficult to earn a living wage after factoring office overhead costs.

Near mandatory long hours of architectural firms here often don't reconcile with time-requirements of motherhood. Double-shift nannies perhaps, to cover a 12 hour day? Nannies can get $26,000/year. Daycare costs here are sky-high at $12,000+/yr, like private school education. Since public schools are so poor in Chicago, you'll need same amount once your children are school-age for private school, or you'll move to expensive suburbs to have decent public schools, and then still reconcile after-school care, homework, and activities.

Of course women architects should have children, if they so desire, but please make sure you have a well-conceived (pardon the pun) strategic career plan if you desire to continue work in architecture.

thanks, chicagowoman. my husband is from chicago, and that is one of the places we are strongly considering.

there is a woman partner in my firm in NY (my mentor, i would say) who is in her mid 40s and has two kids - one she had RIGHT after she was registered, and the other years later when she had already established herself here. she is a very influential member of the firm, mostly b/c she is supertalented, and everyone loves her. but she is unique, i know. i am lucky to have her as a role model, but what you describe is more what i expect to find....

which is another reason why i feel the need to get registered now! if i am a licensed architect...i can pursue other positions (working for a public entity, for example) that may be more conducive to family life.

Atsama, several points related to your post:

Check w/your ob/gyn re: infertility rates related to your age and health history. As I recall, infertility increases dramatically only after 36, so at 28 you still have plenty time to reconcile your short-term career objectives.

Though it may have little impact on current salary, get licensed for longterm career flexibility. Later job opportunity will require architectural license (though there is no expectation that you "stamp" drawings) as a "threshold experience requirement" for more responsibility, better title, and higher paying position.

If your present firm's work is delaying completion of your licensing requirements, 1) ask for relevant work now; 2) change firms to obtain relevant work experience. Try to stay on your schedule.

If you're thinking of getting pregnant, make sure your employer's health insurance plan so you don't incur significant costs for prenatal, delivery, and well-baby care. If plan stinks, change jobs or go on your husband's plan.

If at new office, work for year+ before pregnancy. Young women have reputation for "abusing" health care plan/maternity leave policy of firms by not "earning the perks" with years of loyalty.

If you switch offices, select firm w/experience in "working mom" flexibility, such as part-time availability, flex-time availability, etc. for easing back into full-time work post-pregnancy. Many offices have such arrangements, but bad experiences with some women abusing such arrangements or not returning from paid maternity leave make some leery.

Explore career alternatives for post-licensing employment. My CWA women friends and I left architectural office practice because we wanted quicker career advancement and more interesting work than what was available to us at architectural firms. Switching sectors also increased our earning potential, important when you consider longterm cost of raising a child.

I worked at a real estate development firm for many years of very long hours before getting pregnant, had six weeks paid maternity leave and a nice baby shower, but returned as "worker bee" with still little hope of advancement and 50-hour weeks. Eventually I found a well-paying but low-profile position with institutional property owner, with far better work experience than if I was in an architectural office.

thanks. all good things to consider. i am currently in a job that i love, and that has flexible maternity policies...but i dont know if i can get registered here quickly enough. that is the sticking point. i've been here 3+ years, i've even gotten promoted, and i get paid well (for this profession).
having a kid in this job would be a good idea in 1-3 years. but...i dont know if i'll be registered yet! i've brought up the "relevant work" thing several times...and i'll bring it up again...but i dont feel i can say "look, i want to have a kid in the next 2-3 years, but i need to be licensed first, and you guys have to help me" to a male senior partner during my review....

Maybe not, but you CAN say "I'm eager to get registered as soon as possible, and here are the ways in which you can help me achieve that goal". You need to approach it as a win-win, wherein you become a more effective employee because your knowledge is well-rounded and your employers don't have to come up with the plan of action themselves because you have it all figured out.

No need to mention getting pregnant in this plan.

Atsama, if you feel office needs you and likes you, then you should pursue subject in earnest with relevant principal and "office workload manager". Firms won't automatically know or care about your interests or needs. The "quiet hardworkers" are kept working solely on basis of firm's priorities, and so will you, unless you clearly prioritize your own interests and politely but persistently discuss them with the firm. Be proactive, lobby for better assignments best for your long-term career objectives.

Remember the expression "squeaky wheel get's the grease"? It's so true in the work environment. You don't need to be obnoxious, but you clearly need to monitor your treatment within the firm to make sure that you're not stymied by the firm's manpower assignments. Your firm should at least give you assignments for half your time that are relevant to licensing requirements, otherwise consider whether they're dealing with you in bad faith. Remember, they may be relying on your "nice girl" cooperation to not challenge your work assignments.

I find that this is such a tough issue and, to be honest, I'm surprised it doesn't come up more with young women. I'm a senior undergrad and I want to apply to an M.Arch program, but I definitely want to have kids down the road, and I'm not too keen on having them later in life if I have a choice. As a result, it's hard for me to decide if it's really worth it to go through all of the expenses and years of schooling and work to get my registration when it seems that I may never work a single day as a registered architect...

I have a good head for business and a lot of other career options so it's tough to decide what to do. I have a passion for architecture but I'm afraid of my own ambition and don't want to be caught up in my career so much that I disregard having a family altogether. I can see it happening to me.

I'm really struggling with the decision to pursue my M.Arch or not. I could spent gazillions of dollars on my degree and possibly never have the chance to use it, or I could go out and earn (who knows?) gazillions of dollars in the same period of time doing something else, and afford myself a lot more flexibility.

Did any of you experience the same struggle? We've all grown up being told we could be whatever we wanted to be, but reality hits you pretty hard if you're a woman and you want a family. I think it's commonly accepted now that it's not possible to be extremely successful in both one's career and motherhood at the same time.

to chicagowoman and LB - i have mentioned it before, and i actually got myself off a very long-term masterplanning project so i would be available for more relevant work when it came around. but actually, a few of us here (men and women) who are feeling similarly are considering saying something as a group - the whole strength in numbers argument - and i may arrange a meeting with a partner myself. thanks for your great advice, i realy appreciate it. hopefully this thread will grow...and more people can benefit from your words of wisdom!

auntdahlia: this is the struggle i play with every day! i literally think some days that i wish someone at my ivy league "you can do anything you want" university would have added that asterisk in early about considering the future. not sure i would have chosen my path differently...but if i had been thikning about it the whole time, i might have planned better, or at least been better prepared for this stage of my life. i also feel somewhat deceived, as you sound you do, by being raised (with the best intentions of course) to believe i could literally accomplish anything, but also being raised to believe that raising a family and being a responsible mom is also at the top of the list. but no one ever said that its nearly impossible to do both!

It is nice to see so many women popping up on this thread to offer their own experiences with this issue but you know what isn't nice? That not a single man has!

before i posted this...i searched all the archinect archives b/c i was sure there must already be a thread on the topic...but all i found was the larger women in architecture thread that smallpotatoes referenced above.

if any men who are partners (or husbands) or just architects out there want to offer how it looks from their end....don't be afraid, we won't bite!

Sorry, barry has, of course. But he's the only one.

Does anyone have any experience with leaving the husband at home to take care of the kids while you, the mother, go back to work? I'm very curious about this plan, both the positives and negatives. It strikes me as sad that no one has mentioned it yet. (I know Steven Ward and his wife debated it.)



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Also, atsama, look into whether or not you can begin taking the tests before you finish IDP--many states let you start testing early, and then once you have proof of completion of IDP you take that and your test scores and get your license. Some of my friends have even done this out of state--I know Texas allows you to test during IDP--and then paid for the reciprocity with their home state after completion. This may be a way for you to shorten up that schedule, if you are concerned about it.

Also, tally up your hours at your current firm--you may have more than you think. Set up a meeting with your supervising architect and see which work you can slot into which categories--a lot of that stuff is more flexible than you think, and you might be further along than you realize.

Also, from reading up on reciprocity recently I can tell you that it's often only around $100 and 3-4 weeks plus like a 2 page application. In a couple states you set up an interview as well, to demonstrate knowledge of the local arch. laws. Since you will already be practicing in that state anyway, you will already know these laws. It's worth looking into.

i would be an excellent house husband.

myriam - im in NYC, and so far, we cant do anything concurrently. interesting idea bout working around it by trying to get registered in a state that does allow, and then pay for reciprocity...never thought of that, although it seems like a bit of a scam...
re:hours, i have been keeping track, i have a pretty good idea of where i am, there are still big chunks missing, and if i just can't get there here, then i guess i figure what my priorities are, and if it means leaving my job...so be it.

No scam, perfectly legit. (Anyway no less of a scam than the entire IDP system itself! If you have to jump through inane and costly hoops, may as well skirt around the fire as best as possible!) You do have to pick a state that does not have a residency requirement. As I mentioned, I know people who did this from MA --> Texas so I know that route at least works.

myriam, my husband stayed home until our son was about 18 months old. I took off about a month, then gradually worked back into full time.

Pumping at work sucked (ha!) and I felt I was ALWAYS rushing round to get to work/and or get home to our son. I couldn't have done it if my husband hadn't stayed home...I mean I couldn't have left him with a stranger (our family network is far away) When our son turned 18 months, my husband opened a business and at that point I was very eager to quit my job and be with him. Now, I work from home on residential projects while our son goes to preschool 4x a week. He's almost 4 now. Looking back, I wouldn't have done it differently. I've not finished the ARE. Not from lack of trying---more from lack of studying, the 6 month setback after failure, and no incentive when our family funds are so tight. Blech.

I can't add much more that LB or RA hasn't already said. With a kiddo, your priorities change. Everything I thought I ever knew about life (I'm 38) has been shaken and turned upside down. I wouldn't trade that for anything.

Do you think a woman architect in an architectural firm earns enough to afford a "house husband"? Not in Chicago. Most of the married male architect dads I know, regardless of age, have working wives (often at higher salary) rather than stay-at-home wives. The cost-of-living here almost mandates a two-income household for an architect with children, or otherwise independent financial sources subsidizing the household.

Given subject of "house husbands", I know couples where husband has the secondary job while the wife has primary "bigger earner" job that requires travel and long hours. These women often shoulder a great deal of the household and childcare obligations nonetheless, resulting in high stress levels and unhappy family life.

There should be a separate thread about architects whose households are heavily subsidized by family wealth or other significant financial resources, to see how prevalent it really is.

One of my current client couples is a high-power female executive and the wonderful house husband who stays home and indulges his passion for cooking while also dealing with every single bit of shuttling kids to school and activities, parent-teacher conferences, and the house renovation. They are amazingly cool and seem very happy with this arrangement.

And I should say that what my husband's art career/teaching doesn't bring in financially is MORE THAN made up by how much of the child/house work he shoulders. I'm a disaster waiting to happen without his help.

I should have added that my husband did work a job....just not while I was at work, and fewer hours at a higher hourly rate than mine. (He's not an architect) We were like a tag-team....

my husband, if i made enough $$ would be happy to stay home, at least for a while, with our future kids. but as many of you pointed out....since we're not high powered executives with those salaries....not really possible.

thanks again to all for your input. no decisions yet....but i have decided that i'd best work on my portfolio so if i want to leave, i am equipped to. now on to searching the site for good portfolio advice, since i am way out of practice!

My cousin is a very happy house-husband who takes care of everything, as far as I know, and his wife is a family-practice doctor with her own practice. They both seem very happy with the arrangement and so do the kids. This has been the model I most want to follow. They are exceptionally wonderful people. They also live in an area with a very low cost of living (countryside), which is a bit easier as a doctor than as an architect of course.