Forget about it!! For all things Architecture related, look no further than archinect.com

you cant leave the cult

bump

anyone???

you mean the salary poll right beneath the discussion link on the left?
humm maybe

- ok, a-hole - where'd this "the world owes me a free living" attitude come from?

do you pay dues? do you know the aia loses money on this survey? why should the dues paying membership subsidize your sorry ass so you can negotiate a raise many, many times larger than the cost of the survey?

now, if you want to re-ask the question in a polite, respectful manner, i'll be happy to look up the information you need in my copy of the latest survey - that'd be the copy I paid for with my own money.

rebel-maybe you should read the whole entry ....

Digger I dont think the world owes me a free living. I think every architect knows that. I just figured that i would take advantage of the information and discusions that are being shared on this website.
I would greatly appreciate a copy of that survey that I would gladly pay you for. If you want we can work something out. Email me

- as one of those "greedy people at the the AIA" who volunteered my time to help conduct the latest compensation survey, I'll be happy to look up the information you need and post it here, for free.

Tell us your degree, years of work experience, job level and whether you're in Manhattan or elsewhere in the metro-area. I'll post the info on Monday, when I return to the office.

Enjoy the rest of your weekend.

it was posted on some website a while back, but i think the aia found out and had it removed (heaven forbid that kind of information become public)

anyway, the local aia has it on file and i'd assume the nyc office does as well.

the aia doesn't have a problem with this information circulating and certainly doesn't intend for it to be a secret. excerpts and summaries of this research have been published in many publications and e-letters. aia has produced several in-depth workshops on the survey results at aia national conventions and other aia events.

but, try to understand that aia spends a lot of its members' money conducting, and publishing, a scientific and comprehensive survey that provides very detailed, and very well organized, information. (even archinect has recognized how difficult that is to accomplish.) for that reason, the full aia survey is copyrighted.

even though there is a moderate charge for the complete survey, the membership still underwrites the cost of this work. members do receive a nice discount - non-members, who didn't contribute to the cost of this work, don't get that price break.

I find it odd that in a forum where so many lambast the low fees clients are willing to pay for our firms' intellectual property and the supposedly low wages firms are paying for our individual work, so many expect aia to simply 'give away' the full results of reliable research that took a lot time, effort and expense to produce and publish.

let's try to be fair here, people. you don't want to give away what you know, or have created, for free. why do you expect aia to operate differently? the aia is not a charity - it's a professional association.

i gotta remember this thread next time a 'what has the aia done for me?' conversation starts...

is this information provided to aia members for free or is there a fee?

has anyone actually used the info provided in the survey and parlayed that into more money? just curious. now that i can actually join.

like real estate appraisals and Kelly's Blue Book, salary surveys are not designed to get the seller a "higher" price, nor are the designed to get the buyer a "lower" price. mostly, they're about documenting, in a factual manner, actual transactions that take place in the marketplace. that way, both the buyer and the seller can approach their own transaction in a well informed manner.

regardless of how it is designed quizzical, isn't the buyer/seller price pretty much what it's used for?

a case of a product being used in a manner other than intended? ;-)

- if, by "isn't the buyer/seller price pretty much what it's used for?" you mean the parties use a survey to help them reach a fair, market oriented price then yeah, I guess so.

quizzical,
i suppose that's the macro view of it, but my point is that the reality of those who directly consult it is this: employers use to to keep labor costs down and employees use it to ask for raises. i don't understand why you say that the survey isn't designed for this.
in other words - a published survey ain't without an attitude.

do employees who are paid at a level higher than the survey would suggest "use the survey to ask for raises"?

do employers who find in the survey that their prevailing wages are below average for their community " use the survey to keep their labor costs down"?

surveys are benchmarks and nothing more. how you - or your employer - use that data is a personal decision. but, having the data available to both parties brings a certain objectivity to an otherwise murky process.

right now, I see a fair number of firms that have hired "average" folks during the recent expansion at wages that simply are not sustainable during "normal" times. who do you think is going to be at the front of the line when firms start having layoffs?