250/SF is not crazy, but you may have trouble finding a lot that will allow three stories.

Very feasible greenlander. 200k is about the going rate for a buildable lot thats connected to the grid, probably big enough to accomodate a 3000 to 4000 sf house.

I've built several houses in LA (not for me, for clients) where the owner acted as the builder. We've been able to do 'custom' keeping it close to a 150/ s.f.

Its no pipe dream...

ditto silverlake.

could you be more specific in LA about where you hope to build? or if you're not sure yet, what are you looking for in a lot/neighborhood? there are parts of los angeles where this is feasible, and others where it would probably be impossible. also, given that you haven't selected alot yet- why three stories? in my experience, it can be much more difficult to build three stories than two, or even two + basement.

the three stories thing is something im sort of obsessed with. i really want a compact vertically oriented house as opposed to the more horizontal houses you typically see in the city. i guess if i had to put forth a reference im thinking of a more open loosian type house. im hoping to find a more urban lot as opposed to something in the hills or suburbs. im thinking of low 2000's sq ft. maybe 2500.

i remember going to someone's (an architect) house opening party maybe 2 years ago someplace i think, not sure, north of the 10 and south of ktown. or perhaps maybe a tad south of the 10. the house was at the end of a cul de sac, was v modest in sq footage. i think 1 story and 2 bedrooms, but v nice large open living area, and v interesting triangularish backyard space. def wouldnt be called a prime real estate area but they definitely got a lot of bang for their buck w the house. and geographically in a v central location. so in a way i would like to find a lot that is maybe an oddball lot bc of its shape or maybe it has a weird location. i live in the industrial district near the 10 and alameda and just over the river or near it there are lots of areas that look underutilized to me. but again i have no idea of the availability or feasibility of building in those areas.

and if someone could fill me in on the difficulties of 3 stories vs 2 stories other than the zoning issues. im wondering where i might be able to do this. but if in the end i end up w a lot that is not so urban and more open the 3 story thing makes less sense.

if i could do $150/ sq ft that would be fantastic. im really out of the loop on prices right now so thats helpful to hear. construction wise im thinking as basic as possible.

and this is probably obvious to those whove done this before but i was wondering how difficult it is to get financing when the house isnt even built yet. for example if say you default on an existing home at least the creditors can take the house. im wondering whether the fact that the house is speculative makes the financing more complicated.

the goal is to be capable of putting down 15-20% by end of yr but well see. if i could get away w less better.

sorry if this seems garbled but this is all v new to me.

i dont think there is any particular difficulty between 2 and 3 story house. most height zones would allow 3 story houses unless it is on a weird hill side or something. my client built a decent 3000 sq. ft home on a hillside for 400k. if you sub out the job and supervise it well, you can do it easily with the perimeters you've mentioned. it starts to get expensive with heavy foundation requirements, unusual shapes, pricey finishes and unresolved details.

most of the cost savings exists in programming, planning and in design, it should. that means right foundations, no tricked out framing/roofs, no getting wild with electrical outlets and light fixtures etc. learn to live with some mediocre workmanship here and there too. you can still have a nice kitchen from ikea, hardwood floors, decent kitchen counters, non flashy but good looking plumbing fixtures, decent aluminum sash and wide fleetwood sliders, nice doug fir 1 lite doors, open stairs, sectional metal garage door, nice landscape, even indoor outdoor fireplaces with stone hearths, etc.

i want to build a small foot print 3 story house too someday. it is nice to leave most of the lot freed for a nice garden and outdoor living.
i also think normal 8' ceilings are really cool along with luxurious 9' if you like the heights.
do it, if you have the money and time and 'found the lot'. try to finish on schedule though, because that is the difference between losing and making good on it.

3 story residence requires 2 means of egress (unless the third story is 500 s.f. or less)

Orhan

did you need a third parking space with the 3000sq ft in hillside?

Free Ramos and Compean,
that is true. but second eggress can be attached to exterior and max. travel to it not to exceed 50'.

mdler, no. but the plan check was in 2005. i don't know if anything changed. we also built one house on r2 lot. because of the irregular shape and hillside condition, it wouldn't be possible to build two units, thus 4 car garage.

house is technically 4 stories. exterior stair in the back is result of what frac is talking about..

sorry 'my web' site is laughable at the best, from where i tried to link the pictures. it should work fine as url link.
it is just to show you what 400k built on a los angeles hillside.

Nice and simple Orhan... Great ideas with low budget.
I like the starway on the side the best, and the shading system.
It makes the facade particular while staying simple at the same time.

yeh of course. ive been out of the loop so long i forgot about things like egress.

anyhow nice house orhan. for 400k 3000 sq ft thats pretty impressive.
and that includes the garage space?

and the lot cost only 200k? thats a pretty central spot.

either way the construction level in that house is pretty much what im thinking. so thats good to now. im not really going to do much tricked out stuff.

thanks guys.
garage is another 400 sq. ft. price includes it. house is 1500 sq. ft. at footprint. i got extra 12' added to 33' ht limit because lowest and highest natural grade difference was more than 20' around the house (5' out), a little known height calculation rule. i only used 7 feet of it but it made the whole thing work. you still had to be 33' or lower from any point to nearest grade though. there are all kinds of little calculation methods in and around hillsides. you just need to ask to an old timer plan checker though. definetly spend some time at the planning dept. if you have a hillside lot.
give me a call if you have other questions. good luck.

OA alot of great advice.....but it the guy is looking for an architect....I would vote for you...! Seems like you have a good handle on economic quality design and all of the regulations which go along with making ones way down the path to a new home.

the height calculation is a little BS in my opinion. The renovation that we are doing (the concrete wall pics I have been showing) involved putting a new swimming poot that was attached to the foundation of the house. Even though the bottom of the pool is at a higher elevation that the bottom of the existing pool, the fact that it is physically attached to the house means that we have to measure the overall height of the house from the bottom of the pool, and not from the adjacent grade...

yes, there are some bs like that.
also, there is a rule in r-2 zone, two unit construction would require 2 car parking each. but if you convert existing single house on site to two unit later, you are only required to provide 1 parking each. forcing people to micky mouse stuff like that.

Nice project Orhan. I think I've seen that around, its in Silverlake, right?

Btw, do you have subs you regularly work with? Your point about workmanship is a good one at thats my big struggle right now.
Finding good, cheap guys is hard....

that is why you have two sets of dwgs...one for the city and one for the contractor

thanks silverlake. yes it is there across from siete mare taco stand.
i have some subs that are reasonable and nurturing; painter, electrician, tile-stone, concrete work, welder. and have access to some others.

wow - I've been trying to see those photos but I can't seem to load them... we do design build and there is no way we could do a house for $150 on a hillside, even for ourselves not including the labor cost... the only way I can see you could do that is to use all unlicensed subs with no insurance and/or guys off the street for a lot of it - orhan??
But then we also can't deal with mediocre work so we wouldn't hire the lowest bidder for most anything. I'm still having a hard time believing that 400k number though - I think you're easily at 100/sf just for the foundation and materials.
I would tell you $250 would probably be a realistic minimum for a hillside, and there aren't a lot of easily buildable lots for 200K right now though I haven't looked a huge amount.
I have also heard that you can't really get financing for empty lots (people seem to pay cash), and you may need approved permits to get a construction loan &/or a contractor on board.

i just lost the long response i have just written.
yes r.a. rudolph,
the contract was 375k but the contractor brothers were fired in the middle after the rough work was done. who had an expired lic and lost a lot of weeks not doing anything at the job site.up to that point all work (foundation, framing, rough electrical, plumbing and roofing) were done by 2 men crew and with a rented bobcat. there wasn't even temporary power connected and tools were powered by a little noisy generator.
there were no bonds, insurance and the owner-developer was bit of a cowboy who didn't mind taking risks.
materials came from liquidator type of places and lumber was purchased just before the prices were doubled.

most of the finish work done by people who were between jobs and just wanted to keep their crews busy.
i got little shocked when we put the order for entire ikea kitchen with a total of +,- 2000$.

and it was pure luck that some of the stuff didn't go majorly wrong.

you are right about $250 under kosher circumstances and i shouldn't advertise this as a realistic situation.

in SF you don't need second means of egress or whole-house sprinkling unless you're four stories...thought that was CBC/UBC though, not SFPD...

we just completed permitting on a 3 over B where we argued that the basement was in fact a basement and not a real storey, hence no need for secondary egress off the renovated attic/third floor.

if they had said nope, it's definitely a storey then it would have been technically a four storey building requiring sprinkles etc.

such a pain in the ass, the definition of a storey/basement though, and how it relates to site. this was on a site with grade sloping in two directions, so the building heights were different at each corner of the house. the numbers calc'd out differently depending on your datum, which helped in our presentation.

thanks that makes me feel better... a lot is possible if you're willing to take risks and do it yourself, but we've heard so many horror stories it usually doesn't work out that well.

also, for some #s - we just built a 650 sq.ft. addition w/2 car carport and green roof and it cost us around 150K (haven't added all the receipts up yet because I'm afraid to know the truth but that was our loan and it's gone).
So that's without the labor and o/p. on a flat lot. but we did do some expensive things (like the green roof - not green at all when you see how much lumber is needed to support it).

orhan r.a. rudolph if the house was on a flat lot what do you think the sf ft $ comes out to?

although the $150 stills seems impressive as hell, im still prob thinking im going to get stuck w something around $200-$250.

r.a. $150 for 650 sq ft w carport? what pushed the price so high other than the green roof. just curious

I will build you a house for $1000 ft sq

custom bi-fold doors, 10' ceilings, steel support for carport, expensive bathroom (stone slabs on the wall, fancy fixtures, good tile sub, wall-mounted toilet, frameless shower door - guess we have a bathroom fetish), tankless water heater, LCD wall mounted tv and surround sound (professionally installed), ceiling height built-ins (laquer painted w/reasonable cabinet guy but still big & custom)... and a few other finicky things, like plywood siding w/custom sheet metal detailing on the exterior & blued steel fireplace surround & skylight well.

you can see a few photos at rst73.com (Atwater II)- we'll have some more finished photos up soon.

I think for a client we would have done this for about $350/sf, and I feel the workmanship is comparable to $450/sf or more for a high end builder, but then its our own house so lots of sweat equity..and the green roof easily added 15K to the cost, probably more like 20K. Pricey for an inaccesible roof (haha), but the plan is to someday tear down the existing 500sq.ft.bungalow and build a 2 story living/kitchen & a couple more bedrooms upstairs.

greenlander1,
you should design some schematic plans and start pricing things to find where you are at. once the material is quantified, you can work towards the unit price brakedown and installed prices. don't let material cost fool you though. installation is another story and there are other things to factor in such as delays, weather, accesibility for delivery and on site storage, scheduling, inspections and their aftermath, difficulty levels of detailing etc. etc. the things to keep in mind when planning. and last but not the least, don't forget to factor in tomorrow's cost for today's plans.

Absolutely it is possible to build a new home in Los Angeles. Like everything in the construction industry, you will get out what you put in. So if you truly wish to do it on your own, just keep in mind how much work you will need to be putting in to get a good result (a beautiful new home). Often times I believe that it is best to put in the money and hire a professional to have the job done right. But if you have the knowledge, time, money, and man power, then go for it!