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Stumbling into post-modernism

Mark Anthony

The other day I was approached by someone on Youtube because I said, "God Bless you." to someone and an atheist just happened to read it. This gentlemen's profile states,

"I'm a happy atheist! :) But I'm pissed off at stupid people! I love beating Christians in debates! I win every time, because I'm governed by reason and logic."

I figured I wanted to break someone who was so pompous and so I began to persuade him (outside of God, but he didn't know that) and this is how the conversation went...

Me:god bless you.
Him:Even if there was a god, why would it care about blessing anyone?
Me:If you make something wouldn't you take precautions to make sure it was being maintained? Maybe, maybe not.
Him:Well, all we are dealing with is someone's imagination. Who gives a crap about any god at all. Let's all wake up and live together without delusion.
Me:I'm not going to force my religous beliefs on anyone, and I don't think you should either. Religion is shaky ground, it's just best to respect difference of opinion.
Him:You can't "force" your beliefs on anyone.. all you can really do is share them! If you don't want to talk about this topic, then by all means, don't converse! It's that simple! But don't think others will do what *YOU* say! haha Religion needs to be shaken up more. It's time we all came to reality. I don't respect lies and ignorance.

This is where I shift from talking about religion and start talking about his views of reality.

Him: (to someone else)Truth is the degree to which a statement corresponds with reality. You have no evidence of any god, so you saying you have the "truth" is a molestation of the word. You need to first learn how to think logically and rationally. You don't. I can help you. And Josh McDowell is a joke for an author.
Me:Truth and reality are alligned only in a world of equal perception. That is to say that, truth, is a communal experience. To claim one thinks with logic and rational which lead to truth is in a sense hypocritical. Cultural experiences and biasis develop the connections for these truths. The views one claim are only logical to those in the same realm.
Him:Truth is that which is determined to exist within reality, buddy. And no, I don't subscribe to your solipsism. Truth does not change per person. Only interpretation. No, we only know things using logic and reasoning. You have been tricked. Cultural experiences don't change reality. Logic is universal, not relative. If one denies logic, they merely don't know how to think

Him: (To the author of the video)You aren't the sharpest tool in the shed, but you sure are hot. I would love to have you in a 'lil schoolgirl skirt outfit...
Me:This comment disgusts me.
Him:It doesn't feel good when your virtual reality, your world filled with your imaginary friend that you think is always there... is shaken up, does it? No, in a perfect world, your solipsism, your idea that we should ignore ignorance, doesn't work. Logic and reason prevails over religious ignorance.
Me:My perception is that of a post-modernist ideal. To say that they are solipsistic is naive. Everything that we experiencve is an abstraction and those abstrations form altered truths. Alphabets are symbols that we have given accidental meanings to. The same can be said for almost anything. Science and mathematics are merely coherent accidental abstractions. The problem with most people is their ability to assume. They develop opinions that nestle securely into their culture and claim them as truths. Although they are all assumptions. The argument I propose is not one of glory but reason. Reason is a word, along with others, that has been molested. Not for its definition but through the context from which that definition has derived.
Him:It's not naive at all. You attempted to suggest that truths can change. They cannot and do not. Only our interpretations. As for the rest of what you've said, I don't see the relativity.
Me:'Truth' changes all the time! It used to be 'truth' that the world was flat and not round. As knowledge expands in proportion to culture so does 'truth'. In a sense there is no truth, only ideas and philosophies. What you think of as truth is only one idea in a sea of many. What makes something appear to be true is that it is excepted throughout a vast community. But this does not make it any more true than the idea of a single person.
Him:Truth can change, but reality does not. Truth is our best effort at interpreting reality. We determine truth using logic, reasoning and objective evidence.

I was bored with him by this point and I had gotten him to flip-flop on what he thought truth was. I considered it a victory. Any thoughts from anyone else?

 
Apr 25, 07 5:24 pm
Carl Douglas (agfa8x)

'Debates' between theists and atheists are exceedingly boring.

Apr 25, 07 8:03 pm  · 
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Mark Anthony

I'm sorry that this didn't appeal to you.

Apr 26, 07 12:29 pm  · 
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switters

why is this on archinect? go to church or not-church, whatever the case maybe.

May 9, 07 7:22 am  · 
 · 
207moak
May 9, 07 8:26 am  · 
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