It's like anything else -- consider the consequence. At many, many firms, is there a consequence?

I hear you. Just got into a big argument with a client (who's since become a good friend) about a small remaining balance after a project was completed. He's rich, yet he's still fighting paying off the little chump change he owes me. Goddam its frusterating.

*Warning- becoming friends with a client makes them think they can take advantage of you....

I was reading 'what they dont teach you at harvard business school' over the weekend...


one of the things the author made clear... don't work for friends

I've worked for architects who contribute to the problem by continuing to provide services knowing that the client has not paid for months. Architects fear gaining a reputation of being difficult to work with. Does anyone have experience with lawyers or accountants? Do they continue to work after not being paid?

Quote from the TV show Scrubs:

Dr. Cox: Honey, if you are coming in, I just might go ahead and phone up my pool-man and my architect so we can populate the room with just as many useless people as possible.

I have shifted to a 30 day delinquency equals completely stopping work, refusing to release content, and a place in the back of the line. Luckily, there is plenty of work right now, if things were tight, I might feel differently. Of course, this is all in my contracts, so they agree to it up front anyway. I decided that I can't afford to have repeat clients if they never paid the first time, and I don't want their friends either.
j

Sorry about the second consecutive post, but I forgot to mention; my accountant (actually my "bookkeeper") can write himself checks from my account to pay past due payments (its in his contract), my lawyer can sue me and use all kinds of "legal" tricks to make sure I pay, in fact he seems to work harder when he doesn't get paid, unfortunately I become his target rather than his client at that point. As an architect, there is little I can do to get my money, especially after the permit is granted.
j

for me...... models payment is due once the model is delivered.... payment 1-2 over night........in full.....

i'm still trying to figure out the other stuff....

clients will pay for bricks but not dwg's


2:37am

Submit a bill that says "2nd notice" or "3rd notice" in big red letters on the invoice. It goes straight to their pride. Also, remind them your work it copyright protected and if they want to use it they need to fufill their end of the contract. Otherwise, they will not have your permission to use your drawings for anything.

We have it in our contract that interest will start to be applied after the second notice. They don't always believe we'll do it (and sometimes we don't), but the first time they see that interest tacked on we usually get a check pretty quickly.

You can always call the client and begin with a sentence that doesn't leave any room for "if" payment is going to be made (like "when should we be expecting your check?" if you want to be blunt). If the client expresses that they're having difficulty then offer to accept a payment plan over a few months.

Do NOT threaten the client in any way. For example don't threaten or even hint at legal action unless you're 100% committed to following through. And don't threaten that you'll file a lien unless you're 100% sure that you can do that in your state AND your project was at a stage for which this would be allowed (usually this requires that construction has at least started, using your plans) AND you're really going to do it. If you threaten anything like this and then don't follow through then the client can turn around and sue you for harrassment.

x-client

I have a project which I took thru Planning and Zoning which functions with an Architecutral Review Subcomittee. I secured the permit, and the client stiffed me. We have a signed contract for the project which is payment is associated with phapes of the project. After securing the permit i invoice him for the work done. He said I can't build from these drawings, and he ask me what it wou d take to finish the job. I told him we have a contract and it was for said amount. I invoiced him for the work done and he slected not to pay. Well a year has come and gone and I noticed excavation construction going on at the site a couple weeks ago. I called the City Planner if the owner had ever come back with revised drawings for his project. Seems he hasn't so I spoke with the Building Offical and ask him what he had submitted for drawings on his project. Seems he might be using my P&Z drawings to build his building. I'm going to go see my lawyer (client) and see if he can come to my assistance. I will let him direct me if I should drop in for a friendly visit with the building official or if he (my lawyer) should make the visit. I would like to squash this x-client like a bug, but I would be happy to get my fee and attorney cost. Heck maybe I can request he post a sign infront of his building for a year or two letting people know I was the Architect. Then again maybe it isn't such a good idea building from design development documents.

In a lot of the projects we have worked on, my office often times fabricates several pieces. One of our clients doesn't want to pay for the hardware to hold the shit up so we are contemplating going in and removing all of it. He gave us a key to go in and install it...I guess he didn't consider the fact that we can now go in and take it out, too.

This is an excellent thread and a question I've asked myself many times.

I am aggressive enough (or perhaps naive enough) to think that failure to pay should result in the stoppage of work. However, none of my project managers has ever actually stopped work or held payment until the invoice was paid.

A tangential discussion is the subject of asking for additional services. Contractors are not bashful about submitting a change order, and the client usually agrees to pay for them. However, architects give away so many free services or fail to submit an addtional service request in a timely manner. (which lowers our value as a profession, yada yada yada - it's been discussed before)

(Has it been a rough week for anyone else?)

Snooker
How come it took til you secured the permit before the client said the project could'nt be built from the drawings?. If he used your drawings as a resub. Use the "freedom of information act" to obtain a copy. I had a similar situation happen to me. I informed the client they had used my drawings without might my permission. This was after nine months of not hearing from them. They weren't happy about it but realized they were dead wrong and paid up

snooker, it also looks like that would have been an easy one to get your money thru small claims court. or a collection agency (which i've used and is effective)

we have a client that has told us more than once that he already sent the check! we never seem to get it.

What I don't understand is the check business in the US: in Europe payments are made by bank transfers. There never is a discussion about checks being lost in mail, not received or similar excuses. Not that payment morale is any better here.

I have heard lawyers take half their fee up front - and people go with it. that is when you start to whonder what architects have done to the world to be treated so baldy by clients. But then architects get a lot of respect while lawyers lawyer's don't, but that doesn't pay any bills.