You can email me, if you have questions, need advise etc. I worked at the Rotterdam office for a few years and still have a lot of friends there. (let me know whether you are an architect or intern, what your experience level is, and specifically if you know who you are interviewing with and if you know for what project . . . and i can probably tell you what to expect)

Sorry Will, being a new user i don't know how to get your email address?

But so far, I'm a graduate, applied for leonardo programme. Already did two internships.
More details later on...

to email, double click on my name and then double click on email then it should pull up an email window.

graduate meaning dipl ing or an american m arch, given that you're applying for the leonardo program, i assume the former?

I went to school in RD area recently. I had a few friends who worked at oma and a few school mates work there now. I can probably help you find a place to stay if you get a job. If you'd like to contact them, email me and I'll point you their way.

The office and the atmosphere seem-ed really intense but fantastic. Downstairs used to be the model shop and cctv and upstairs was competitions. Most people told me they worked 12-14 hours a day 7 days a week. I think this time of year there's an office football team. My intern friends normally got a day off after big deadlines which for them was about 3 days off in as many months.

Pay for interns at the time started at EUR350 per month and I think they feed the interns all day long. For the type of flat an intern or student would live in, 350 is enough to cover rent. As they worked 99% of the time, most interns seemed to do fine on that money.

All the people I ever met who worked at OMA were super nice and super thoughtful. The atmosphere for interns and students in RD is fantastic. When I was in town, everyone knew everyone and mostly partied together. Enjoy.

ok i don't have specific information because i never entered into the office. however i would not be SO optimistic because one of my seniors who is currently working for OMA as an architect told me just one sentence: they treat intern like shit.

i don't want to be negative, maybe you can figure out the issue youself later...

They do make you work really hard but if don't want to work, don't go to oma.
Neutlings Riedijk (sorry if I'm spelling this wrong) has/had a 4 day work week at just 8 hours a day and are also located in RD. Two French friends of mine worked there as interns. If you're French or speak French you might have a better chance there.

"12-14 hours a day 7 days a week" for EUR350/month?!

that's more than hard work, it's torture. i really lose a lot of respect for architects who expect that kind of work out of their employees, not that i have much respect for the employees who won't stand up against that kind of treatment in the first place.

In oma's defense, no one is forced to work their. Everyone's there for the experience, it's just like school only more so. If somone doesn't like the schedule and the pay, they're free to move along.

Additionally, like many other offices, oma is constantly working on many many competition entries. The sucess rate for these is less than 15%. So, to put this much energy into that many non-commission projects would be financially suicidal if an office like oma payed all employess a 'decent' wage. OMA and many other offices couldn't exist as the do (an build what they build) without this setup.

I would assume that on the whole, oma employees work twice (or more) as many hours as they bill for. This means that for an office that does so much researching and so many iterations at the front end of a project, the final result is much better than if they spent just as many hours as they bill. It's a labor of love for this crowd, especially the interns.

I'll second you bryan. Anyone working 12 hours day/7 days a week and only getting 350 euros/month is a sap and is hurting the profession as a whole. That's somewhere around 1 euro +/- an hour wage. I can understand wanting to work for a 'star-architect' and all, but have some self respect.

Like many countries, the Netherlands has minimum wage laws but I've been told there is an exception for 'interns' which has something to do with the assumption that most interns are students. This is how you can go for an interview in Holland and have someone tell you that they 'aren't allowed' to pay you more than 350.

I agree with bryan and A, but there's a very different status for intern between the USX and europe as a whole. I don't know why, but 350 euros is the usual slalry you get as an intern everywhere. In the states, an intern is paid like a young architect starting his career in Europe. It sucks, but that's the way it works here. The good aspect in most firms is that if you stay longer than three monthes, you usually get a decent salary (it's probably not the case at OMA though). I wasn't even paid when I did my three month internship...

I heard there were small incremental raises at three month intervals. A friend eventually was on some basis, after about 9 months or a year, where she was paid hourly at like 8 euros or something. But I do have friends who worked in Ireland and some scandinavian countries as interns for a better salary.

It is much better here in the US. An intern who is maybe into their first year of a bachelor can expect to make at least U$ 8-10 per hour even if they literally know nothing about autocadd or other software.

the point is there r other offices in the NL can pay 800-1000euro per month for intern. it's not a big money but at least can cover ur basic cost of living.

one interesting thing: 2 girls (my classmates) shared a flat with an intern in OMA who was from US. After a workshop in Belgium, they came back to R'dam and found this guy had murdered their washing machine. without question he should pay for the repairing charge. but he didn't simply because he was so poor...

"This is how you can go for an interview in Holland and have someone tell you that they 'aren't allowed' to pay you more than 350."

This is not true, there is no law in The Netherlands which says you can't pay interns more than 350 e. I did both my internships for 500 e. a month when I was a B Arch student (still am actually) at "star-chitect" offices here in The Netherlands, where 300 is the standard intern rate.

ideo: what do you count as intern? because I never heard of any office here who paid that money for a student-intern

Perhaps it's a lie but I was told " they 'aren't allowed' to pay you more than 350" at an interview at EEA in Rotterdam. I also heard the same from other individuals.

come to think of it, I believe I was told the same when I interviewed at Mecanoo (SP?) in Delft.

That's odd, I've done an 6 month internship at EEA and they paid me more than 350.

we have had intern/stagaires that after their 3 or 6 months period try and get a real contract. often they get offered a 'contract' in the range of 1000euros. this seems to satisfy some, and has worked for some german, spanish and italian ppl i know.

I'm back, had my interview a few days ago in rotterdam. Can confirm now: 370€ a month. Then (cant remember if beginning with or after the 4th month) it's 550 € a month.
Got to go... tell you guys more later on.

I had a few friends work in holland on their year out . between part 1 and part 2. I think there seems to be a lot of americans on here who still havn't figured out that there isn't this whole internship thing in europe or at least not as mugh of it and people should learn a little about the system before dissin' it. As far as I know in holland all students who work in offices before they are quallified get about $370 a month but this system is kind of created for the dutch student as from what I'm told they get a student grant on top of this and other allowences from the government -socialist type system. So that how they all don't die of starvation! for students going there its tough.

I think you're right, there are a lot of americans who don't understand the system and it took me a while after I was there to really get it.

Just to be clear an intern/stagaires is a student who has not completed the Dipl Ing. Usually doing a required work period for their diploma. Americans are rarely ever interns/stagaires at OMA, it happens but not often and usually in special cases it is a big work permit issue, i can explain further if necessary. Typcially the only americans hired have B Archs or M Archs and are technically called junior architects by the office if they have less than 2-3 years experience. Intern/stagaires pay can range from 350 to 1000 per month depending on how long you've been there and how valuable you are. A ducth guy who worked with me was getting 1200, because he'd been there 9 mos and was really good. Junior Architects pay is higher but there are a lot of factors there and most europeans who have there Dipl Ing are considered Architects (not Junior Architects that is primarily a term for the Americans).

Will, in general I would agree with your statement.
Unfortunetely this is not so much the case with OMA. The person I was talking to said: "Everybody who is a student or a not yet licensed architect (means graduate as well) and is working here is getting the intern salary. That's because of different graduation standards."

I really don't know if that was just exaggeration...or in general just a strategy of keeping costs low, probably both. Kind of sad, while your experience keeps me hoping.

ease, that comment suprises me although the structure is different now. well actually the difference is there is a structure and some level of standardization now. so the salary situation may have changed. being a "licenced architect" was never much of an issue when i was there, although it is very easy to get a dutch licence if you want to go that route.

so, all in all, from your experiences working in rotterdam,
is it worth the low pay?

i'm a landscape architect headed there in july for the two week program put on by the Academy of Architecture and Urban Design and would love to spend some time in an office afterwards.