Who is this though? You mean like new firms? As long as there's some institutional memory, no noobs to be seen. In other words, I (relative
"newbie") don't to ANYTHING unless I'm told haha.
I've only worked in offices in MN and CO. In all six offices we did cartoon sets. It may be a regional thing?
Aug 8, 24 3:54 pm ·
·
BulgarBlogger
I understand the value and the purpose and I'm all for it. I'm just saying that in NYC, there seems to not be a big emphasis on this. Let me guess, there are many folks that still do hand drawing in your office? What is the median age of your employees?
BulgarBlogger - everyone in our office is proficient in Revit. Everyone can correctly and accurately model a project without asking 'how'. A few of us will do hand sketching when needed. Other than that, we use Bluebeam. The average age in our office is 31 ish.
A cartoon set is a rough plan for the sheets that you want to include in the construction document set, and the drawings, schedules, or other information to show on each sheet.
I feel like cartoon sets have lost some of its usefulness with the use of Revit and other programs that have automatic referencing and page numbering.
Aug 13, 24 12:55 pm ·
·
BulgarBlogger
How do you know how to charge a client if you don't know what 100% completeness looks like? What does a program have anything to do with being able to quantity the amount of work and its level of difficulty / complexity to produce? Whether the cartoon set lives in digital form or physical form, you still need to do something to be able to visualize what you're "in for" as far as time and effort- yeah?
Our youngest intern is 23 and knows what a cartoon sets is.
I could read Almosthip's comment as from a older person who doesn't understand Revit just as easily as a younger person who isn't familiar with cartoon sets. Not all projects need cartoon sets.
A cartoon set is a rough plan for the sheets that you want to include in the construction document set, and the drawings, schedules, or other information to show on each sheet.
An example of an extremely simple cartoon set for an extremely simple project.
Pretty much. An ask by a larger client of ours so we're doing them a favor. Like I said, super simple. Kind of nice to be able to 'turn off' my brain for a project and know exactly the what and how. ;)
aren’t we all using concept of placeholder /wip drawings to all the projects? Layers of information are added as the project progresses through SD/ DD/ CD. We, as a principal consultant , determine which information during specific milestones
are to be formally issued to clients/ consultants ( pre costing / tender etc ) .
Well said - as in construction scheduling there is a critical path of events that should be observed - I'm so old I remember
when they used to call a "Mass" building heavy timber construction ...
A "cartoon set" has a much different meaning for our Bluecorn Planning & Development firm - we generate a project layout which includes a scaled (2D AutoCAD) Site Plan, a dimensioned Floor Plan(s), a building section or a number of required sections, and all Elevations - the owner approves these drawings before the we go any further - we comply with a SF not to exceed or a defined budget per SF - our local general contractors will give you a fairly accurate price per SF based on building type or this current information is available from the plan rooms or is public information (government buildings) - if we are the Project Administrator then these abbreviated bid sets are emailed to all subcontractors, vendors, and suppliers for quoting for the development spreadsheet for the owner - the architectural firms then provide the owner with their competitive proposals - the consulting engineers are vetted by us and also provide competitive proposals - the reason to use this methodology is owners and developers have to obtain funding for their projects which may take a substantial amount of time or need to go back to Design-Development for any number of reasons and they are not bound by expensive A/E or consultant contracts ...
Aug 24, 24 12:21 am ·
·
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Cartoon Sets
Do any of the newbie generations of architects do cartoon sets anymore?
We do. Our team ranges in age from 24 to 52.
Typically we use Revit to create them. AKA - create the sheets needed and note what goes where.
Absolutely, for sets and presentations. My office isn't newbie, but I've been inculcated.
The question is do the NEWBIES do cartoon sets. No, not unless someone tells them to.
Who is this though? You mean like new firms? As long as there's some institutional memory, no noobs to be seen. In other words, I (relative "newbie") don't to ANYTHING unless I'm told haha.
Alternate question, are there firms that have stopped doing cartoon sets?
Also, I was taught to do cartoon boards in grad school for final presentations.
I call it "buying the project". Yes. It's done.
I'm not convinced. I think a lot of young people don't know what this is.
It may be so in your firm / area.
hm - idk. Im in NY
I've only worked in offices in MN and CO. In all six offices we did cartoon sets. It may be a regional thing?
I understand the value and the purpose and I'm all for it. I'm just saying that in NYC, there seems to not be a big emphasis on this. Let me guess, there are many folks that still do hand drawing in your office? What is the median age of your employees?
Did anyone teach them?
BulgarBlogger - everyone in our office is proficient in Revit. Everyone can correctly and accurately model a project without asking 'how'. A few of us will do hand sketching when needed. Other than that, we use Bluebeam. The average age in our office is 31 ish.
I call the whole set cartoons.
Like this?
No. More like I'll have the cartoons ready by Wednesday.
that's funny ...
WYM by cartoon sets? Layout of drawings onto sheets? determine number of pages?
A cartoon set is a rough plan for the sheets that you want to include in the construction document set, and the drawings, schedules, or other information to show on each sheet.
I feel like cartoon sets have lost some of its usefulness with the use of Revit and other programs that have automatic referencing and page numbering.
How do you know how to charge a client if you don't know what 100% completeness looks like? What does a program have anything to do with being able to quantity the amount of work and its level of difficulty / complexity to produce? Whether the cartoon set lives in digital form or physical form, you still need to do something to be able to visualize what you're "in for" as far as time and effort- yeah?
Almosthip - huh?
Pardon my ignorance, I can't see how a cartoon set has anything to do with automatic referencing and page numbering of CD's.
I suppose you could callout references on the cartoon set however that seems rather excessive and not something that's been done since hand drafting.
Chad - do you see what I'm talking about now? These younger kids have absolutely no idea what this is...
How old is Almosthip?
How old are you BulgarBlogger?
Our youngest intern is 23 and knows what a cartoon sets is.
I could read Almosthip's comment as from a older person who doesn't understand Revit just as easily as a younger person who isn't familiar with cartoon sets. Not all projects need cartoon sets.
So what exactly is a "cartoon set" to an architectural office or design practitioner? - no one discussed that ...
A cartoon set is a rough plan for the sheets that you want to include in the construction document set, and the drawings, schedules, or other information to show on each sheet.
An example of an extremely simple cartoon set for an extremely simple project.
CDOT salt shed?
Pretty much. An ask by a larger client of ours so we're doing them a favor. Like I said, super simple. Kind of nice to be able to 'turn off' my brain for a project and know exactly the what and how. ;)
Of course, I've now jinxed myself . . . .
Thank you- a story board of sorts ...
Pretty much! On an actual project I'll put more notes about things and assign people to certain drawings.
aren’t we all using concept of placeholder /wip drawings to all the projects? Layers of information are added as the project progresses through SD/ DD/ CD. We, as a principal consultant , determine which information during specific milestones
are to be formally issued to clients/ consultants ( pre costing / tender etc ) .
Well said - as in construction scheduling there is a critical path of events that should be observed - I'm so old I remember when they used to call a "Mass" building heavy timber construction ...
A "cartoon set" has a much different meaning for our Bluecorn Planning & Development firm - we generate a project layout which includes a scaled (2D AutoCAD) Site Plan, a dimensioned Floor Plan(s), a building section or a number of required sections, and all Elevations - the owner approves these drawings before the we go any further - we comply with a SF not to exceed or a defined budget per SF - our local general contractors will give you a fairly accurate price per SF based on building type or this current information is available from the plan rooms or is public information (government buildings) - if we are the Project Administrator then these abbreviated bid sets are emailed to all subcontractors, vendors, and suppliers for quoting for the development spreadsheet for the owner - the architectural firms then provide the owner with their competitive proposals - the consulting engineers are vetted by us and also provide competitive proposals - the reason to use this methodology is owners and developers have to obtain funding for their projects which may take a substantial amount of time or need to go back to Design-Development for any number of reasons and they are not bound by expensive A/E or consultant contracts ...
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