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IDP Hour Documentation for AXP Supervisor residential projects.

Donatello D'Anconia

I need to record 1090.5 IDP hours between Project Development & Documentation and Construction & Evaluation under Setting A. I am currently working on two residential projects, one in Japan and one in the United States. For the Japan residence I am working with a registered Japanese architect, for the United States residence, I am the General Contractor (there is no architect).

I am being supervised for both of these projects by registered NCARB architects.

What documentation do I need to log in order for my experience report hours to be accepted by NCARB? Is the approval of my AXP supervisor(s) enough?

As for the AXP supervisor, does it matter if they are in my current state of residence or the state of the residential project or a state different from both? Should I use the same supervisor for both projects?

I'd appreciate advice from someone who is currently working for NCARB. Thanks.

 
Oct 16, 20 3:25 pm

I was going to help, but then I noticed you're only looking for advice from someone currently working for NCARB. You might try actually contacting NCARB if that's your criteria. https://www.ncarb.org/contact

Crap, that was advice. Sorry.

Oct 16, 20 6:48 pm  · 
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Donatello D'Anconia

Thanks Everyday Architect. I've tried contacting NCARB in the past and they don't always respond, I'll try again though and post here if I hear back from them. Do you know of any forum member that works for NCARB? I assumed this being the most popular forum on architecture that surely NCARB would have someone looking at it? I guess I should open my query up to any advice, do you know of anyone who has had a supervisor submit hours for a project that was not contracted through the supervisor? Maybe anyone who has submitted hours on behalf of an AXP candidate can answer too?

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There is another forum where you're more likely to find NCARB employees. It's actually run by NCARB employees. Here's a link to their general discussion area: https://are5community.ncarb.org/hc/en-us/community/topics/200964088-General-Discussion

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Even that probably isn't necessary. Try reading page 18 here: https://www.ncarb.org/sites/default/files/AXP-Guidelines.pdf

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Donatello D'Anconia

Thanks Everyday Architect for pointing me to page 18, which answers one of my questions:"your supervisor does not have to be registered in the jurisdiction where they or you are located." I'm assuming it doesn't matter then that both projects aren't located in either of our jurisdictions either. Also according to page 18, it sounds like doing daily emails, with weekly meetings is enough to qualify as "Direct supervision":"'Direct supervision'" of an AXP participant must occur either through personal contact and/or remote communication (e.g. email, online markups, webinars, Internet), provided that your supervisor maintains control over your work and has sufficient professional knowledge to determine the competency of your performance." The thing that has always tripped me up is on page 15 though:"In order to qualify, these hours require direct supervision by an AXP supervisor licensed as an architect in a U.S. or Canadian jurisdiction in an organization engaged in the lawful practice of architecture." Specifically "...in an organization engaged in the lawful practice of architecture." Maybe my poor English isn't helping here, but I'm confused as to who/what needs to be "in an organization engaged in the lawful practice of architecture". Is it the supervisor? Is it the AXP candidate? Is it the project? Is it some combination of these?

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You need to be employed in an organization engaged in the lawful practice of architecture. Experience Setting O is for experiences "if you are not currently working for an architecture firm" (page 16). 

In my opinion, the two situations you describe in your OP -- 1) working for a registered Japanese architect, and 2) working as a general contractor on a project -- do not work for Experience Setting A. In the first, you are not being directly supervised by an architect licensed in a US or Canadian jurisdiction. In the second, you are not employed by an architecture firm. 

Your first situation may work for Experience Setting O as outlined on Page 20, "For experience gained outside of the United States and Canada: Direct supervision by an architect not registered in the United States/Canada engaged in the practice of architecture.

Your second situation may also work for Experience Setting O and is also explained on Page 20 where it explains what will work for "Design or Construction Related Employment." In this situation your AXP supervisor does not need to be licensed. 

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Donatello D'Anconia

I've maxed out my experience Setting O unfortunately. Luckily, I am employed by an organization engaged in the lawful practice of architecture, but these two projects I've mentioned are not through that organization, which is why I was asking if it matters if these projects are part of said organization or not. What do you think? It sounds like to be safe though, I should actually funnel the second project through the architecture firm and have them employ me so the project is under their organization. This will require some weird paperwork, but I can't see any immediate issues.

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Why are you worrying about the two projects if you’re employed by an architectural firm? Do they not have work for you to do?

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Donatello D'Anconia

My superior refuses to sign hours and my understanding is that they have no legal obligation to sign them. Others might suggest I find a new employer, but I enjoy my job and it pays well (not to mention the current job market with COVID-19). I'm fine with procuring IDP hours through moon-lighting, but I just wanted to make sure that I procure them in a manner acceptable to NCARB.

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Why do they refuse to approve your hours?

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Donatello D'Anconia

They've never given a straight answer and have usually brushed it aside by stating that now isn't the right time and just to give them more time (been going on two years now though). I personally think they are paranoid that if I have a license I will look for other employment or go out on my own. Regardless, unless I can take some form of legal action against them, then this is sort of beside the point of this thread, though it does provide backstory to my pursuit towards generating my own AXP hours.

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Something seems off about this to me. I’ve heard of some supervisors being petty about this type of thing, but it’s usually after you quit and want them to approve hours, not while you’re actively working for them. Maybe if you weren’t doing so much moonlighting for Japanese architects and general contractors, they would see you and someone just using them to get a license and start competing against them. Note that I’m not saying they are right to withhold approval of your hours. This all seems a little shady though.

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Donatello D'Anconia

I've only just started moon lighting this September, with the main objective of getting my AXP hours finished, which doesn't really explain the prior two years of not signing hours. For what it's worth, the Japanese client is a friend from my undergrad and I'm my own general contractor on the other house so it's not like I'm taking clients from my employer. We can continue down the history of how I've ended up in this situation, but I'm mostly focused on a way forward towards completing my AXP hours through these two projects under the supervision of a licensed architect. While my employer is indeed shady in this regard, I don't think they are doing anything illegal.

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Like I said above, I don’t think your moonlighting work can be considered Experience Setting A. Check with NCARB though. Maybe there is a way they can help you. I’d just try to talk to your employer though and figure out what the issue is. Perhaps they think it is more involved than it really is. If your boss is a member of the AIA you could always make a complaint that they are not abiding by the AIA Code of Ethics (there is a clause in there that members have a duty to the profession including providing reasonable aid to aspiring architects or something along those lines). If you get to that point though, it’s probably a lost cause and you’d be better off just finding a new employer. Good luck.

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midlander

i have no connection to ncarb or helpful advice, my comment below is a critique of the axp program not you:


the fact questions like this even come up shows what a broken process AXP is. this seems like a sincere attempt to work out a runaround to deal with not being in the position to get work experience in an architecture firm. i really believe ncarb and the state boards need to let go of the paradigm that architects are people who work in architecture firms and develop through personal mentorship by a master architect.


reality is much messier than this; good mentors are rare and of unpredictable availability; and the world requires architects who know much more than they can learn working for older architects. the internship program remains a holdover of medieval guilds and an apprenticeship model of career development. it's not suited to a fast moving liberal society.

Oct 16, 20 8:56 pm  · 
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Donatello D'Anconia

Thanks for your thoughts midlander. While I wholeheartedly agree with them, I find it hard imagining a future where NCARB or state boards let go of the AXP program.

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