Archinect
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When they must, how do architects prefer to deal with sales people?

Finjohn

Thousands of companies want to get in front of architects who can specify and/or recommend their products. It can be very annoying to get unexpected sales calls while you are trying to focus on a specific project.

What approaches from sales people do you appreciate and feel work best for architects and what approaches just annoy you?

 
Dec 15, 17 6:28 pm
Non Sequitur

don't call or drop by uninvited.  I'll contact you if I think your product is appropriate... and also, if you have free BIM/CAD and details.

If you drop by my office and you're peddling some nonsense green-washed jive, I'll black list you.


Dec 15, 17 6:50 pm
Finjohn

Thanks. I agree with this.

Don't call us, we'll call you. Or not.

Dec 15, 17 7:51 pm
randomised

This annoys me. All you want to know is how to trick us into buying more of your crap.

Dec 16, 17 3:38 am
Finjohn

No. You are stereotyping. Not all sales people are like that just like not all architects are arrogant and conceited. I was asking for advice so that I can help to avoid coming across such a salesperson as that.

randomised

All you care about is how you come across? Typical...

Finjohn

Everyone should care how they come across to others. What is so wrong about that? And I haven't tried to trick anyone into buying anything as you stated. I was only asking for advice.

randomised

"I was only asking for advice."

So you can find better ways of approaching us without us getting too annoyed and try selling us more your crap.

What you're talking about isn't sales, it's MARKETING.

Marketing people (as opposed to sales people - those who provide info and take orders) are routinely dismissed as a nuisance and an annoyance. They think their shit is better than all other shit because they profit from selling it, so they try to stick their shit in your face. They'll even give you a free taste! 

It's a con game. Focus on making great products or providing great services and you won't need marketing. The more marketing you need the shittier your product is.

Dec 16, 17 9:39 am
Finjohn

Thanks. Good advice and I agree.

Serious response: Know Your Shit. 

Translated: Be a *knowledge* resource for me, not just a provider of pretty images and pricing and free food. Know the technical aspects of your product inside and out. If I say I have this big an opening to fill with a security screen, come back at me with "The Model X can do that in four or six panels with no bottom rail required and a remote electronic motor. The Model Y is only two panels but will require a bottom rail, and the motor is not remote and can be noisy so that may affect your choice."


Dec 16, 17 9:43 am
Finjohn

Thank you. That is good advice.

kjdt

I agree with Donna.  Also realize that if you've been repping your current product for less than 5 years we may know more about it already than you do.  I don't expect the rep to be deeply and equally familiar with every single thing their company makes, but if I say "I just specified your purple grout on my train station project" and you say "we don't carry purple grout", even though it's on your website and in the color sample set that your company just mailed me last week - well then I'm going to be annoyed with you. 

Also don't send me heavy boxes of unsolicited samples.

Do send me wine for Christmas.

Dec 16, 17 10:20 am
Finjohn

Thanks. So far I am seeing the alcohol is good and product knowledge is vital.

Be careful with the alcohol some offices have strict rules regarding that. Best to ask before sending. also some firms get too much stuff and prefer a gift to a food bank especially this time of year.

tintt

agree with Donna. Stick to the basics of being able to answer questions and if you say you are going to do something like send some info or provide a quote then do it. I don't like to have to remind you to do things, so I don't and just do something else instead and you get blacklisted. 

And don't act like we are best friends, we have nothing in common.

Dec 16, 17 11:11 am
Finjohn

I agree. I hate when I just meet a salesperson and they act like they've known me my whole life.

tintt

You know what's annoying, someone who talks out of both sides of their mouths, like someone who says "If you have something an architect wants at the moment they will be your best friend, if you don't they will be arrogant and ignore you with their superior minded condescending attitudes which most have." and then 2 seconds later "I agree it was a condescending thing to say. I have found most to be very friendly and courteous with me. And yes I am. I am just asking for honest feedback from architects so I can avoid doing anything that is annoying or unprofessional." So which is it?  

Dec 16, 17 11:27 am
randomised

That's why they annoy the hell out of me.

tintt

right, and then they pretend they don't do it too

tintt

I've done sales in clothing stores. It's easy. Just be helpful and attentive, answer questions, etc. Make people feel good (thats why everyone does food.) I used this principle - everyone wants a different level of customer service, give it to them. Works like a charm.

Finjohn

I never said the former, I was only relaying what someone once told me and I disagree with them after meeting with several architects. The person that said that didn't last long here anyhow. To me it was due to their negative attitude.

tintt

Yes, I understood that someone else told you that, and then you conveyed it.

archinine
Salespeople are obnoxious period. I second others' sentiments. Put your cad/BIM details on your website, freely accessible. List a contact so I can call about specific detailing/pricing. DO NOT lunch n learn and claim to be knowledgeable etc then after I spec your product, ghost me, fail to respond to inquiries, have zero knowledge about your products.
Dec 16, 17 2:35 pm
Finjohn

Thank you for all of your tips and advice. I really appreciate it. I also appreciate that only 2 of you were negative and stereotyped all salespeople into one and the same group. To me we should never do this to any one group of people. "It is written, a tree shall be judged by it's fruit, not the whole orchard shall be judged by the fruit of a few bad trees."  ~ me. I chose not to do that for you group and would appreciate the same mature response in return. Peace and happy holidays to all!

Dec 18, 17 10:32 am
randomised

Just reread this thread after someone resurrected it from the dead, sorry for being such a douche, was totally uncalled for.

If you are a sales person or product rep, please consider the following:

The best thing a product rep or sales person can do is find out who is responsible for the firm's library and the firm's Lunch and learn (often not the same person) and coordinate with them if it is an update/cold call. Or deal with the people working on the project your product is being considered while keeping the library person in the loop.  

Don't let your work, information, or sample be the cause of a delay on a project get it to us in a timely manner or give us an accurate window of time to get it (Ironically window reps are terrible at this)

Don't drop off samples or mail us samples without permission (some of us have small library spaces)

Always send samples to a person at the firm care of library or project never send them to the firm without a name.

Put a date in every piece of lit and on every sample, the worst thing is sorting through a library and not having dates on things.

Email before a call.

Don't schedule cold calls and visits if you know a major project deadline is happening, especially important for small offices.

If there is more than two of you showing up at the office don't have an argument during your presentation.

Always assume the IT in-house will not work and have your own screen/laptop and speakers if you need to play a video. Also test the video before inviting us to sit down to the presentation so we don't waist time with IT issues, better to have a late start than to waste 5-10 min of time for 20-30 folks. (no you may not assume you can use our WiFi, we don't even know the passwords)

Over and OUT

Peter N

Dec 18, 17 11:20 am
Finjohn

Thank you very much Peter! I hadn't thought of some of your points. Especially about the library part.

senjohnblutarsky

Always contact someone in advance.  There is usually one person who schedules lunch and learns and meetings.  Don't spam everyone else.  If one of the other members of the staff needs you, it's a "don't call us; we'll call you" deal.  

Don't show up mid-morning or mid-afternoon.  Get there before we get heavily involved in something.  Early: bring by some breakfast food.  Midday: Lunch and learns are great.  Even better if they count for learning units. Afternoon: Don't do it. Evening: Maybe.  I've never had such an offer.  These beers other people are talking about don't happen. 

Don't throw a hissy fit if your product wasn't in a spec.  Just mention that you noticed it wasn't in there and you'd like to help out on future projects if you can.  I've had reps try to make me feel guilty.  That's a good way to not get included in the future.  

Be a nice person.  Remember names.  We have a couple reps who remember me and act nice.  I don't miss their stops because of this.

Know about the firm's projects your company has been involved in.  A little ego stroking never hurts. 

Know your competition.  Know if there is something different.  If there isn't anything different, acknowledge that.  Don't sell me some industry leading bullshit if there's no appreciable difference in product.  Now, if there is a difference, I want to know.  

If you don't provide A/E support, have the names and numbers of someone who does.  

IF YOUR WEBSITE REQUIRES ME TO MAKE AN ACCOUNT TO ACCESS DETAILS/PRODUCT INFORMATION, I WILL NOT BE USING YOUR PRODUCT.

Dec 18, 17 11:53 am
Finjohn

Great advice! Thanks. Our site doesn't require architects to create an account to access our details/product info. We do, however, need to give a password on our "Cad files" download area. I think we do that so our competitors can't see them. Does it bother you to need to contact someone for that pw or would that also make you say I won't be using this company's product? I do agree with you that it should be as user-friendly as possible.

senjohnblutarsky

A long time later: Yes. I'd probably try to find another manufacturer's details before having to ask for a password. Anyone can use a spoof account to get you to release a password. You'd only be slowing down your competition.

deeptimayeebehera

I wish all sales people to get to know this feedback.

Apr 12, 19 8:26 am
Finjohn

I agree. It has helped me very much. I appreciate all the great feedback. 

Apr 12, 19 6:05 pm
sameolddoctor
Wear something revealing
Apr 12, 19 11:12 pm
RickB-Astoria

I get the peddlers in the emails frequently. In their case, it goes into the delete or trash folder. When they call and leave a voice mail, it gets deleted. If I am interested in their products, I would have A) first looked at their offerings, B) I would have contacted them or purchased the product. When it comes to building design services, I research and investigate on my own and google will usually bring up their products in the search results in the first few pages if its any really good or horribly bad and the rest are likely to not be worth it but I usually do a fairly deep search through the results and also from postings on various forums and they may have links which I may follow through and look at and see. I really am not interested in sitting through their pitch and attempts to pressure me to get their product or select their products. I make selections of products based on project needs and suitability. 

I factor in the credibility of sources in researching on web forums. Architects, engineers, building designers, and contractors are sometimes credible. Some more than others from a real world practical point of view. I take in their experiences with products. Some of them are a little more adventurist than me so I get their take and experience (for good or for bad) and turn it into lessons I can learn from and avoid mistakes. 

As for CAD/BIM stuff, I sometimes look it over but I'm not going to make contact unless I am ready to use that product. If I don't contact them, I'm not trying to waste their time so they should not try to waste my time. If they want to talk to me, I say, don't. Don't waste both my time and their time. I'll reach out if I am ready to contact them and am seriously contemplating their stuff, I'll contact them. 

The ones I usually delete right away are those off-shore architectural rendering services. I just don't use off-shore or foreign rendering services for building design. It makes very little sense. I also don't usually use outside rendering services. There is very seldom the need for photorealistic rendering for most building design projects. They can be semi-photorealistic but don't need HDR photorealistic architectural rendering. It would be too much time is wasted in the rendering time to make sense for use in many small residential and light commercial projects. It makes no sense. It would be a misuse of time management.

More recently, I've been more working on some software projects than building design work due to moving up the schedule and increased priority for the software projects and have more often just delete the marketers nonsense to really look at them. In plain english, at this time, I frankly don't give a shit about what their 'products'. I have passed up pretty much all 100% of the multiple inquiries over the past few months for building design projects and even some projects that seems to be something that requires an architect license so I wasn't walking into that trap. 


Apr 13, 19 1:05 am
Finjohn

sameolddoctor - That doesn't work for men. Would you buy anything from this guy?


Apr 15, 19 1:50 pm
sameolddoctor

Depends on what he is selling, and to whom

shellarchitect

The shoes look nice

atelier nobody

Make them bring in a lunch'n'learn. Send all the junior staff who'll sit through anything for a free Corner Bakery sandwich and cookie.

Apr 15, 19 3:40 pm
tintt

and chips

curtkram

junior staff? I'm still up for a free sammich whenever I can get one!

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