Go. If the option is to stay in the US, I would go. I travelled in China last year and if I were younger I would seriously think about it, even now I would do intermittant periods.
I think the most annoying thing is pollution actually, but they seem to still like each other if that's not a bit of a simplification. They seem to know what society is/can be, they have transportation and public space. At this point in time, I would certainly give it a try.

Ok, thanks.

What really turned me off about last nights interview was the interviewers saying something to the affect of,

"...there really is no natural areas near Shenzhen (no hiking or skiing), and we work very long hours (8am-10pm) most days.." eeek.

The long hours dont really scare me, but getting fat and slow does.

I live in Colorado for a reason. The dilemma is that I have a very good portfolio and there aren't many great firms in CO. So I'm waiting it out, working, saving money, but pretty much hating a lot of my projects (read: fast food joints, subdivision planning, and a school every now and then).

No, I would not do those hours!

I'm currently working in Asia (recent graduate B. Arch from the States) as a junior designer and getting paid roughly around 12K a year (working 7 days a week about 12 - 14 hours a day). It's true that living standards here are lower so a sub-par salary is to be expected, but then again I work at an Asian firm not a U.S satellite studio. To put things in perspective, 12K a year means no $$$ for fun.

In my opinion, if you haven't even stepped foot in China, I would not recommend re-locating. From the way you describe yourself, it would seem like you would have a miserable time in Shenzhen. But then again you'll probably be in the office everyday so you really won't experience much of the city anyways. LOL. Just to point out, there is nothing natural about Shenzhen.

If you need more information, just ask.

P.S. I'm not bashing Asia or anything, I like the work I do so I can deal with the salary.

junior deisgner with 2 year experience should expect around 15,500 RMB a months especially in shenzhen.

also. just tell them how much you are getting paid now and plead ignorance about the china market price. Get them to give you an offer.

7 days a week 12 to 14 hours a day??? What kind of an existence is that? What level of productivity can you expect from a mushy, overworked brain? This is unhealthy for both the designer and the overall project...

I have seen firms in US that have similar (yet not that extreme) work culture, and I blame it on mismanagement rather than a product of ambition. Have you ever seen someone working in AutoCad for 12 hours straight? It's a slow motion replay of a dude getting hit in the crotch with a football.

On the other side, I know a few people who have worked in Japan and Korea that pulled in crazy hours. For good portions of the day they had nothing to do, yet were expected to be there nonetheless. Mind boggles.

@Larchinect: If you love Colorado, I could not even recommend Boston or Chicago as a new home for you, let alone a Chinese city doing industrial revolution, modernism, and post-modernism at the same time.

Shenzhen is one of my favorite cities in China! I have many fond memories of that little town across the border and have made some great friends there. It's always been more of a vacation stop for me rather than a permanent place though.

It is less congested/polluted than its northern neighbors its also a short train ride to Hong Kong which opens up whole new world of opportunities.

Hopefully you've already travelled throughout China before thinking about making the jump across the pacific...I would expect a greater culture shock in Shenzhen rather than a city like Shanghai

Anyways, things to do in Shenzhen...the night life is behind Shanghai and Beijing but their is an ever growing expat community there. Meeting people is especially easy, probably easier than the more developed cities. As far as outdoor activities you'll always see people outside doing something, it's just a part of chinese culture to be outside exercising. The old folks at least...I'm sure gyms are plentiful since it's urban core is fairly western so I wouldn't worry too much about being lazy. Hiking is do-able it just takes more effort than in Colorado since it normally involves a bus of train.

Salaries tend to be higher there because there is a definite shortage of expat architects. In fact it's not uncommon to make double what an architect in Beijing makes, depending on firm of course. The hours you listed do trouble me though..yes it's not uncommon to work weekends and work long hours but business hours are still 9-6. But if you are working 8am-10pm and have more free weekends then that is definitely worth it. After a few months of working 60-70 hour weeks you either start to hit your stride or crumble so it all depends on how you find a way to work some fun into your schedule.

I'm not sure if AllBlack! is still on the board, he owns a firm there and would be your best source of knowledge.

Best of luck and if you have any specific questions feel free to PM me and I can ask my friends in SZ about more things to do.

Realised I still want to go.., old or not!

So, the interview tonight turned out to be a call to make an 'informal job offer.'

Within literally the first minute of the call the manager on the other end of the line said "...the interviewers comments from (last night) were very positive and they would like to extend me an informal offer.."

They offered me roughly $10k USD equivalent less than what I get paid now plus benefits, though I haven't looked over the package yet.

The position is 'Mid-Level Designer 4-6 yrs' though I would consider myself a strong junior-mid level candidate here in the states. I asked a few questions about design opportunity and office life--all pretty straight forward answers.

I'd love to make a trip to China, but this doesn't sound like the opportunity I'e been waiting for. I feel lucky and gratefull to already have a secure job.

@gotzmilk--

thanks for the response and advice. So, you take home 12k/month RMB?? So, that would work out to about $22k USD/ year?

That seems pretty low, though I have to admit i wasn't offered much more. I'm debating on whether I should share the actual figure.

@Macpod--

Thanks. Thats actually exactly what I did and they made an offer tonight. I'm debating on whether it is worth it to counter. They offered me a little more than that calculated after taxes.

I'll just share-- 32k (USD)/yr pre tax. I have 1 week to notify.

I got the feeling that they had 10 more designers to call after me.

32k is not bad depending on the firm. If you really think the firm is worth having on your portfolio then go for it.

you can always ask for a salary review if you think they really like your work

I am an expat in Beijing and 32k USD would be incredibly easy to live with here. I am not familiar with costs in Shenzhen, but I know people who live comfortably here for just over half of that amount.

To put it in perspective, a waitress here earns less than 3500 USD a year.

I am an expat in Beijing and 32k USD would be incredibly easy to live with here. I am not familiar with costs in Shenzhen, but I know people who live comfortably here for just over half of that amount.

To put it in perspective, a waitress here earns less than 3500 USD a year.

@ smarchitect: What is the tax structure in China? Do you also have to pay uncle sam? If you are making 10x more than a waitress I assume you would be in a high tax bracket, no?

15% tax

unless you are getting cash in hand. which is not that uncommon. but if thats case the u wont be getting a work permit from them.

@ steelstuds, I am not sure of the tax structure, I work for a Chinese firm and get paid in cash. I feel like most foreign offices are much more legit in terms of their practices. I also know of people who work at firms registered in Hong Kong, so they are taxed from there instead of the rest of China.

$32k seems pretty fair for me for a junior position in China.

Shenzhen is not exactly lovely (a brand new city) but it is quite neat and literally a metro ride to Hong Kong and Macau. That can be a relief whenever you are too tired of mainland China (also important if you are not in a work visa and need to go outside the country) or you need to travel to the US via HKG.

Also, it is very well connected to most of South Asia (Cambodia, Vietnam, Malaysia, Singapore, etc.) and the weather, at least during the winter, is far better than in Shanghai or Beijing.

So there is a good transit system with opportunity to do 'some' travel?

I have not even visited china, so I am apprehensive. I want to take the opportunity, but I dont want to get over there and find that I'm miserable and potentially ruin future opportunities at other offices of the same firm or otherwise burning bridges.

In case of a opportunity like this, I'd advise you to think about "what's the worst thing that could happen".

It could be that you don't enjoy living in China - but you can only tell that after you've been there.
It could be that you'd return to the USA after some months - then you've got a nice adventure and something interesting to add to your resume.
It could be that you feel you'd have too little time outside work - only you can decide if you can live with that.
It could be that you think you cannot live off the salary ...

etcetera. Simply think about what would be a good reason not to do it. Otherwise, just take the chance, it doesn't sound too bad to me (depending on what kind of work you'll actually be doing, and what kind of projects you'll be working on etcetera)...

usernametaken--

I think you're right. The only complication for me is that I have a job already.

This is too much of a risk for you. On the other hand chinese employers should not be surprised if foreign staff leave after a few months because they can't handle the culture! Turn it down and go on a trip using your earnings then you'll know whether you can live there or not.