Why place individual solar panels on top of a pre-existing roof when you could just build an entire roof with solar technology integrated into it? Elon Musk, CEO of the financially underperforming Solar City and Tesla, sees it as an obvious solution. According to CNNMoney, he said that "If your roof is nearing end-of-life, well, you've got to get a new roof anyway. And so, why not have a solar roof that's better in many others ways as well?"
Although details on the solar roof are still elusive, Musk did note in a blog post that he'd like to build the roofs by integrating SolarCity's technology and Tesla's home battery storage systems.
For more on Musk:
43 Comments
Musk is all marketing, no substance. I talked to an electrical engineer who specializes in UPS systems (backup power supply, so pretty much an expert on batteries), and after he crunched a bit of math on the Tesla home battery specs I was informed that it might be good enough to give you 2 to 5 hours of power. 2 at the average residential energy consumption rate, and 5 if you only have the barest essentials running (lights and hvac etc). So it's not like this tech is getting you off the grid and completely off fossil fuel energy, it might reduce your consumption from the grid just enough to give you some "green" bragging rights, but not enough to -really mean anything.
After dismantling Tesla battery capacity, he then went into his issues with the (non)viability of using solar panels being used as a primary energy source, and the battery lifecycle issues that Musk doesn't want anyone to think about. Given that the battery is dead after a specified number of charge/discharge cycles (he was not impressed with how few of those Tesla cells allow), and that those cycles are destined to be frequent because of their storage capacity - all of this is kind of designed to make Musk $$$ on battery service and sales.
"If your roof is nearing end-of-life, well, you've got to get a new roof anyway"
More throw away consumerist culture, but this time with a saviour complex!
All that aside, integral solar roofs (however Musk might imagine this to work, since it's the roofing material that is typically short lived relative to the roof structure it protects) are not the future for solar energy. Solar paint is, because you can paint any part of anything with that stuff. I also kind of like this video by Robert Murray-Smith (same guy) for some perspective.
Forget Elon Musk, remember Nikola Tesla, the man who actually made amazing contributions to science prior to having his name dishonored by charlatans.
that statement is dumb by Elon Musk, like really dumb. When someone says "roof is nearing end-of-life" what they mean is the asphalt roofing - which is essentially weatherproofing membrane. Everyone knows that who has ever purchased or sold a house or gone to Home Depot. Only if the new roofing membrane is in place of the asphalt roofing membrane does that statement make sense. That technology has been around for 20 years at least but NO one does it for practical reasons. The article reads more like he is suggestesting taking the framing off as well, which would include insulation. Thats a lot of risk to a home owner when all they have to do is mount modules to existing weatherproof and structurally sound roof. Maybe he should of hired an architect? (I also find these tech guys to be overly confident in their avarage intelligence, and they make worse clients, like the kind you want to just smack silly)
threadkilla, you MUST be a licensed architect. Perhaps that is why you have no vision at all. If you think Musk is not a visionary, you know nothing about, well, vision. Keep cranking on them backyard remodels!
Some seriously narcissistic and hubristic commentators here (threadkilla,Olaf Design Ninja), deriding the great man Elon who's shoes they aren't fit to polish.
You two reprobates are nothing more than shit on this man's heels, in his brief time on earth this monumental genius is changing the world, and for the better, he has a virtually 100% record of outwitting his detractors, and you two turds will be flushed down Elon's toilet like the rest of them.
haha keno'neill i guess your reading skills are poor and you know even less about architecture and roofs. read the article. i said his statement is dumb dipshit.
It's a laugh when these futurists come out of the woodwork and call folks who critique these "visionaries" dinosaurs, fossils, shit on this man's heels? Generally what futurists lack is context and experience. A true visionary in the solar field was Stanford Ovshinsky, next time you find yourself stuck under Elon's heel ask him about that great man.
You can't even string a sentence together, are you dyslexic too?
keno'neill welcome to archinect. walk me thru why i should install a solar roof instead of replacing my asphalt shingle roof with a 15 year warranty by any laborer off the street and simply removing and re-installing modules? it costs me say $10k for a ranch home. if part of your solar roof goes bad do you replace the whole thing? its a module for reasons. i do not think Elon as brilliant as he is has the capacity to take on the construction industry especially when his marketing ploy is non-sensical to begin within. in shoet clueless and inexperienced. Bucky Fuller could not do it, Elon Musk sure as hell can not.
It's a laugh when these futurists come out of the woodwork and call folks who critique these "visionaries" dinosaurs, fossils, shit on this man's heels? Generally what futurists lack is context and experience. A true visionary in the solar field was Stanford Ovshinsky, next time you find yourself stuck under Elon's heel ask him about that great man. - Mr Wiggin
- Where's your private rocket company, electric car company, and 12 billion dollars in the bank then if you're so clever genius?
Musk is clearly a forward thinker and most of today's so called experts in his field just can't keep up. Roofing is an obvious weakness in today's building techniques and Musk will soon have a serious solution even his slow witted detractors can understand.
One post here said He asked "an electrical engineer" about the Musk's battery venture. Why not ask Musk?
so you will suck his cock because of that? wow Keno'neill you have convinced me
i had vision my freshman year....what is cold fluid applied roofing? you going to tell me Elon Musk caught up with a seriously advanced and effective solution to roofing with 30 year warrantees...i am waiting for an intillegent comment by one of you worshippers of Elon Musk.
ODN, you're an idiot, an ad hom lowest common denominator idiot at that, get a life instead of deluding yourself that you're smarter than Elon Musk you pathetic clown.
thank you for your intelligent response. informative. educated. and on point......so the construction industry makes cars and space seem like childs play - but you haven't the slightest clue and neither do any of Elons lemmings. Elon might know, he tried a Trump like media ploy, he needs better speech writers - Elon.
ODN, your bizarre ramblings are actually quite symptomatic of a serious psychiatric disorder.
What medications are you on and are they having any beneficial effects?
keno-neill
your IGNORANCE is amazing.
your STUPITIDY
is a sign of
well your stupidity
hey fuck face, ignorant monkey named Ken
what is a Roof?
keno'neill in a nutshelll and most monkees from the tech sector -
i'm sorry, I'm fast loud and rude
I apologize, I just don't know how to deal with your low level of intelligence. How do I address you? Mr. Ignorant? Mr. Uneducated? Mr. Monkey Face?
Do you just suck Elon's cock all day or do you know how a roof is made?
i have a hard time gauging drunk stupid whores like yourself? for christ sake, do you at least believe in SataN?
yes I'm the crazy one. as a prophet of your generations stupidity, let me point out facts....Elon ain't got shit worked out.
kenn, since you're half retarded I thought I would give you a shot...
god bless!
Olaf, it's really good that you know how to put a roof detail together. I'm sure it makes you very employable. What people like Elon do is suggest and develop stuff that might seem outrageous now, in common practice, but will become the norm in due time. I'm sure detractors said the same thing about electric supercars, reusable space shuttles and the like.
Mr Wiggin, I will look up mr Stanford, but that doesn't make Musk any less visionary.
"so the construction industry makes cars and space seem like childs play - but you haven't the slightest clue and neither do any of Elons lemmings."
Most of the functional innovations for the old fart construction industry come from outside the field....just saying.
Elon may be onto something, but having his pissboy come and defend him, well, I'm getting a good idea what Elon's cock tastes like, but I wish he would brush once and awhile.
all I wanted was an intelligent response, thank you sameoldoctor. pretty sure Ken whatever is Ricky B anyway....
I though the criticism against Elon musk was directed at the hyperloop.
if he makes an affordable, maintenance free roof that lasts 30 years with solar panels on it, the solar panels wouldn't be the innovative part. A really expensive disposable roof with solar panels on it would be less practical. Perhaps fine in new construction where zoning requires you to plant those little developer trees, but those like me that live in older neighborhoods where the developer trees have had a chance to grow won't get as much sun
curt's comment is so much win. Thank you curt for what you do.
Everyone else: jeez, really?
oddly enough Donna that was kind of what i was saying (curts point) and then keno went little nutts and qouted what i had actually written about Ricky B a few days ago sort of (i do not feel like looking it up) hence my suspicion keno is Ricky B or Keno who cannot read well decided to respond as such too which I decided well then - here is a psychotic rambling god bless.....anyway the news article and the statement is still Naive and yes Dumb. Yes Elons statement is dumb. carry on.
wait....you guys did a podcast with him or the roofing division. wild guess...toodles
I was responding more to the personal attacks lobbed people's way for being skeptical of Elon's proclamation, and trying to remind folks that the visionaries of the world regularly piggy back off ideas that have been around for a while. As an aside, y'all fixate on R-B too much, you're just feeding into the madness...
Solar paint, look it up.
@sameolddoctor - no, i'm not licensed, but I will take that as a complement. @olaf - we're on the same page here, I think... @donna - aside from calling out Musk for the charlatan he is, what did I say that's so offensive?
i know threadkilla. all i did was note the statement was dumb and ask for a Practical explanation of the idea from his supporters. too which no real answer was given....and maybe my cranky tactics are fast loud and rude - but its just an effective tool and frankly influenced by my environment...jusrlt got off the 6 train where a homeless man in our car walked thru the car with his hands down the back of his pants letting us know where his finger was and at the end licking them, the rest would just be too offensive for you kids...reality is offensive. i apologize.
"aside from calling out Musk for the charlatan he is, what did I say that's so offensive?"
Charlatan - is that what sore losers call people that have made it?
threadkilla, you didn't, sorry, guess my "everyone else" was directed at anyone talking about cocks.
You two reprobates are nothing more than shit on this man's heels, in his brief time on earth this monumental genius is changing the world, and for the better, he has a virtually 100% record of outwitting his detractors, and you two turds will be flushed down Elon's toilet like the rest of them.
Hey guys I figured out Elon's username here.
haha tduds ++....ok donna so i just want to get this straight - cock is more offensive than charlatan, more offensive than monkeyface, drunk and whore, and satan. got it;) .....btw the linked news article is weak in journalism, not the archinect link..... at this current moment and most likely 25 years intonthe future nothing will overtake asphalt shingle roofing or CFA roofing.
so i read a few more articles on this. its a solar city developed product and his frame of mind is Modern Architecture 101, maybe he just finished Le Corbs "Towards a New Architecture". Again, maybe the tech savvy attitude and his bank account will make it happen.........qouting ----- There are solar shingles out there, and other types of building-integrated solar PV, but as Elon hints, they have not been competitive except in niche markets up till now. Elon & Peter seem convinced the coming SolarCity product is. The solar roof will be manufactured at the new SolarCity Gigafactory in Buffalo, NY. Elon stated, “it’s really important to manufacturing in-house because its panels control the aesthetics and ideally really design. It’s kind of like making a custom car, like when somebody orders a car from Tesla. They will pick a wide array of options. That car will be custom made to their preferences. You really want the roof custom made to the individual customer as a kit and then sent to…the delivery team to get installed.”
Elon Musk’s Promise of “Solar Roofs” Has Echoes of a Rust Belt Failure ........ https://www.technologyreview.com/s/602147/elon-musks-promise-of-solar-roofs-has-echoes-of-a-rust-belt-failure/
(Some of) You dumb fucks really think Elon Musk is an ignorant loser, I guess. Im sure you are all right, keep dreaming of the Tesla that you will never be able to afford (yes, even the cheap one)
just because the hyperloop or solar roofs may not be well developed yet doesn't mean he's an ignorant loser. we don't have to pick such an extreme. we could just form rational opinions on a case-by-case basis.
samdolddoctor when did I say Elon was dumb, i said his statement is dumb. because it is a dumb statement.
His specific plans may not be developed but the solar roof idea is old, and frankly proven technology. Best example is this Rolf Disch designed community in Freiburg - with solar panels as the roof finish already in 2000.
The idea is not controversial. These homes produce more energy than they consume and been doing it for a long time. Batteries are a thing, and the weak link, no doubt, but that is what Tesla is aiming to solve, even if its not there yet. My guess is that maintenance is also resolved by now after 15 years experience with whatever problems come with the system (Disch claims he has 40 years experience doing this). Trees are another thing, definitely. So you dont put these in places that have lots of trees, no worries. Share with your neighbors who have taller buildings or whatever.
So yeah, Musk is a bit incautious with his comments about life-cycle, but who cares. We need to be moving this direction regardless so I'm all for it.
Also something I'm for is to, you know, stop listening to our friends who think they have figured out why musk is a moron. Because that is just dumb.
From what i can see, he really isn't innovating in the solar roof concept, since solar roofing materials have been around for at least 15 years (that I know of) and roofs made completely from solar panels have been around longer. Some products are shingle type products, others are more flexable to be integrated into standing seam roofs. I actually don't know the details of what sort of system Elon is planning, but I don't imagine it is doing to be substantially better than what is already out there.
I think the major difference is the delivery method, in which case if he uses the solar city method, you get the roof for more or less free, but instead of paying the electric co for the power, you pay solar city. (it's been a while since I looked into solar city, so I am not completely sure I am remembering this right)
My opinion, is Elon isn't an idiot but I think he may be a little overrated. Success in business doesn't mean you are necessarily smarter than anyone else, it just means you are good at convincing people that you have something they want (look at Trump). I think in general he has been doing good work, funding R&D for things, that will hopefully pay out for him and society in the future.
I think the most annoying thing about the coverage of this is that it implies that he is inventing the solar roof, instead of taking existing technology and changing the way it is sold/distributed. He may have engineers/researchers making tweaks to the existing products, but they are really nothing new under the sun.
Also, probably the dumbest statement* in this thread was this from threadkilla:
"If your roof is nearing end-of-life, well, you've got to get a new roof anyway"
More throw away consumerist culture, but this time with a saviour complex!
No, replacing your roof is not part of consumerist throw away culture, roofs wear out and need to be replaced from time to time or they start leaking. Also, I am pretty sure Elon understands that you are just replacing the shingles, not the entire roof framing-sheathing, that is what most normal people understand when you tell them you need to replace your roof.
One of the advantages to the integrated solar roof is that the weight is about the same as asphalt shingles, so you don't need to engineer for the point loads you do when you have structured panels installed. Disadvantage (at least last time I looked into the products, about 8 years ago) was that the Energy production per square foot was much lower than panels (about half If I recall correctly). however, this is somewhat offset by the fact that you are covering the whole roof, not just part of it.
*Dumbest statement that was not merely an attack on another poster, or Elon, all those statements were dumb, but really don't need to be addressed.
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