Hillary Clinton's latest ad campaign features an architect who claims Donald Trump almost put his firm out of business.
"Donald Trump hired my small business to design a clubhouse for the Trump National Golf Club," states Andrew Tesoro of Andrew Tesoro Architects. The ad intersperses Tesoro's account of working for Trump with video clips of the Republican presidential candidate espousing his business acumen.
"I sent a bill. It wasn’t paid," states Tesoro, who accuses Trump Organization representatives of "bullying" him into accepting a significantly reduced fee – just over a third of what the firm had billed.
"I didn’t feel that I had a lot of choice but to accept their low-ball offer. I had already paid out that money. That was money gone. That was just absorbed by me personally," Tesoro says.
The firm then sent that invoice. "And it wasn't paid."
Tesoro recounts visiting Trump, who said, "I really don’t think I should pay any more because I spent too much on this building.”
After deciding that a prolonged legal battle would be too expensive, Tesoro accepted half of the already reduced fee.
"It almost put me out of business," Tesoro continues. "We had to max out the credit lines to keep the little ship afloat and pay the rent, and I made virtually zero money for a couple of years, and lived on meager savings that were supposed to be for my son to go to school to keep from folding."
“You can’t run a country the way Mr. Trump has run his businesses," Tesoro concludes.
The ad continues a line of attack against Trump's business record that Clinton has been employing more and more frequently in the last few weeks. Watch the full ad here:
As a major developer, Trump has had more encounters with architects than your average presidential candidate. Find out more:
52 Comments
Yup. I have heard of quite a few subs getting fucked over by Donald Dump.
Jeezus - the sum of all nightmare clients is being considered for president?
Just the tip, and trust me, the full shaft is thick, hard, and full of spunk.
This is one of those reasons that I am leaning in not voting for Donald Trump. His treatment, as a client of professional services, appears to be atrocious. I can not say with any certainty about this as I am considering talking to Andrew Tesoro just to verify validity as we know politics is politics and I will like to get some direct first hand information that isn't post-edited by political editing and packaging team.
I have no reason to believe Andrew would be lying but this doesn't sound all too unsurprising.
I'm counting on Donald Trump to solve the debt problem by declaring bankruptcy.
$19 Trillion - whoops! Don't have it world banks, my bad.
Not sure why no one else see this perfect strategy.
Olaf,
Because it doesn't work that way for bankruptcy proceedings don't apply to governmental entities for U.S. bankruptcy laws does not apply to debts with other countries.
It works for ordinary private corporations but it doesn't work for government on international debt proceedings. Therefore, if U.S. government doesn't pay its debts, the other countries forecloses. Here's the thing, our net debt is much smaller than $19 Trillion. Here is why, while we have debts with countries, they also have debts with us. We can draw down our debts by debt cancellation by all coming to the table and clear out each other's debts bi-directionally and then effectively draw down the standing debt to what is remaining. This will allow us all (all the countries) to going through a debt cleanup proceeding and then clean up the paper work so we have a cleaner picture of what and where we actually stand, debt-wise.
Most of this can be struck out with a pen vs. actual cash transaction.
This means the real debt picture would be cleaner and clearer. We owe China X amount and China owes us Y amount and then we or China pays the net difference based on the amount remaining.
Theoretically, a debt cleanup can be done in literally a month's time working through all the paper work if everyone got their act together. The remaining U.S. debt can be cleared in literally 5 years flats if we just got the shit done. It can be done over 10-15 years if we tighten up the belt a little bit and bring our operational budget in line with the money the U.S. government gets through taxes and other account receivables.
rick it was joke now go find something to do dumbass.
So you are saying Trump doesn't value the work done by architects? That should already be self evident!
Either way, Trump sounds like a certain kind of shady businessman who makes money by scamming everyone he comes by. The Hillary campaign is smart to point this out. If they somehow lose then America will be in the same boat as Tesero... Trumps true aim is probably to sell every American asset down the river
Can't wait until the white house is gilded in gold leaf and a TRUMP sign is posted on the lawn. maybe trump can scam OPEC and other MNC's in favor of America? then we send in our army if anyone complains.
*not endorsing him, just playing out a hypothetical here.
The only good thing that would come out of trump being president would be late night comedy shows.
Olaf,
Sure, albeit not very funny of a joke considering it is obvious that countries can't apply bankruptcy proceedings but there is something that could be done IF and I mean if every damn nation were to just come to the table and actually clear the debt.
The country's real net debt when you take the debt we owe minus the debts owed to us is substantially less.
We owe about around $6 Trillion to Foreign countries and foreign countries owes us around $6 to $7 trillion. The other debts are owed to the U.S. citizens, banks, other agencies (basically robbing peter to pay paul), etc. We have some unfunded obligations on top of what is national debt but they aren't technically outstanding obligations to the future.
A lot of the debt with regards to foreign countries can be address with just a strike of a pen. Some of it will have to involve a little bit of cash transaction but at the end of the day, we are owed more by foreign countries than we owe foreign countries.
We will certainly need to address the over spending and stop running the country in an insolvency state and run the nation on an actual legitimate balanced budget from the actual money from the taxes. The budget would also have to set aside a percentage of the income to pay for its other debts. It also needs to consider its unfunded obligation. In turn, over the next 50-75 years, we might be able to clear the entire national debt again for the first time ever since the 19th century.
Just living on credit only means you are really insolvent. Remember, humans are mortals so when you croak, you'd have unpaid debts. The only reason the government hasn't yet seen this all hammering down on us is because the government doesn't just keel over and die like mortal creatures. It's just passed off as if it never matters.
Therefore, it's not exactly unrealistic or undoable. It is all just cleaning up the books so the real debt picture doesn't get too cloudy when it can be cleaned up and written off by cancelling off or partially cancelling off debts owed both ways based on amounts due to respective parties. If I owed you, $10 and you owed me $11. We can clean up the debt picture by you cancelling the $10 debt and I cancel the equal amount of the debt you owe me and then you owe me really just $1. In reality, China owes us maybe $100 Billion to $250 Billion or so (hard to know the exact numbers not these $1.5 Trillion figures. The debt we have with China is just under the debt they owe the U.S. so the amount really owed in the picture is much smaller. The real picture will look more realistic and manageable with each other when we really see the real net debt amounts.
So realistically, it just takes coming to the table. In addition, cleaning up this mess will also mean that we don't need half of all these bean counters to try to keep track of the cluster f--- of debt accounts on both account receivable and account payable side of the big accounting ledger.
With that regard, it is quite doable. Why it doesn't happen, makes no sense. I doubt politicians care.
Before everyone/anyone freaks out about the national debt, keep in mind that it's at its lowest rate relative to GDP since 1972.
FFS, Rick ... read this, incorporate it into your programming (or vocabulary if you are indeed human and not a computer), and move along.
Guys this joke isn't funny because when you take it literally it's unrealistic.
Janosh-
It's important to distinguish between debt, which is the total owed by the government, and deficit, which is the current fiscal year budget shortfall. The current annual budget deficit may be down, but the national debt is at the highest level it ever been, as a percentage of GDP.
http://www.tradingeconomics.com/united-states/government-debt-to-gdp
The budget deficit maybe down but that means the GDP is down and with a national debt but lets look at really where the national debt is? The debt own to foreign governments is a little over $6 Trillion of the $19 Trillion. The debt foreign governments owes us is about 1.1x-1.125x of the debt we owe them. This is about the operating proportion we have been operating. In short, we have been lending more to foreign countries than we been borrowing from in the sum balance. So you might say we have around $6.2 Trillion owed to foreign countries/investors. Foreign countries and all owes us about $7 Trillion. Take the $19 Trillion minus $7 Trillion and we have about $12.1 Trillion debt in reality not including unfunded obligations that only needs to be paid eventually.
We still have $5.3 Trillion of Intergovernmental holdings.... basically (money we borrowed from peter to pay paul). That leaves $6.8 Trillion that the debt held by the public excluding foreign governments/investors.
The remaining debt isn't too bad but oh but we do still have a BIG problem that dwarfs the debt..... This doesn't include the a number of non-included obligations. This alone would bring the debt figures over $60 TRILLION with all the federal obligations taken into account.
In order for us to trim that much out of the government debt in 20 years, we would have to shut down everything for 20 years. That debt load will take 50 to 75 years to clear with inflation and tax dollars and no increase in ALL the social programs and strapping our government operation to a $2.5 Trillion a year limit. This means, social security payments cut to 1/3 the amount it is. Military spending will have be cut to 1/3 it's current levels and other spending to 1/3 its current level and operate within a much tighter limit. We have to literally gut the federal government and shut down or extremely focalize the federal government programs. Limiting EPA to issues involving Federal lands ans state -level "EPAs" (department of environment quality... yada yada yada) managing all cases other than Federal lands. We would have to tighten down on all these different programs in order to clear the debt if we want to be nationally debt and federal obligations free and actually operating within tax budget........... by the end of the century.
The current $19 Trillion ain't shit. It's the other federal obligations not typically part of the national debt picture that is more concerning as they will typically translate to national debt figures at some point in the future. What I see in the future is the $60-70+ Trillion national debt in my life time from all this stuff we have now obligated but not in the national debt figures (YET!) I also see an uncalculated future obligations over the next 20-30 years becoming national debts in about 50+ years from now.
How does the U.S. address those issues, I don't know. It sounds more like punting it down the road. It's just going to snow ball into a hideously huge problem and it already looks hideous.... now.
Consider the source
This issue is being perpetuated by The Forward (Yiddish: פֿאָרווערטס; Forverts), also called The Jewish Daily Forward, an American newspaper….with the headline – “Meet Donald Trump’s Jewish Architect Who’s Now Helping Hillary Clinton”….what’s “Jew” have to do with it? If it were me would a newspaper headline read - “Meet Donald Trump’s Lutheran Architect Who’s Now Helping Hillary Clinton”? Tells me all I need to know….that and his whiny voice.
Hillary most definitely has my vote now, not that she didn't already, but I can very well relate to Tesoro. He is awesome in the video by the way.
I have some hippy dippy type residential clients who are doing t me exactly what Trump did to Tesoro. Just like Trump I'm sure they have ways of rationalizing it in their minds such that they think they aren't bad people. I might just forward them this Clinton video. Hopefully they will be rightfully horrified to recognize their own actions in Trump's.
I've had wealthy clients try to renegotiate fees halfway through a project, and I have heard many variations of "I'm not paying you any more money...I've paid you enough, and this project is costing me too much as it is." The Art of the Deal.
That's why we only work with a contract in place that calls for monthly billing for work completed to date...NEVER milestone-based progress billing. That way guys like Trump can't get more than thirty days ahead of you, and then try to stiff you. You also need to be ready and comfortable with stopping work if they don't pay.
Some savvy clients and attorneys will try to put language in the contract that says that, in the case of a dispute over fees, you MUST continue work while the dispute is being negotiated. Never agree to such a clause. That opens the door for pricks like Trump to screw you.
^ I get all the negatives about “developers” & brash behavior, but where are the facts from Wendel Whiner? What’s news about architects getting the zig-zag from clients? Let’s see the contract. Have any of these so called facts been vetted? It’s a political hack piece…I’m going to do a commercial that says Hillary raped me in a airport restroom…why not nobody will check….what idiot would whine about his business affairs nationally other than someone who makes a profession out of whining?
Found this archival footage of the Tesoro’s first day in NYC…he hasn’t changed a bit.
http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/two-on-the-town/n9226
Of course, this is a partisan political hit piece, and of course, the facts would need to be vetted....but this rings true to me. I have been in business relationships with men like that many times. They believe that they are powerful, you are weak, and they can revise any contractual relationship to get what they want, because they have attorneys and they hold all the cards. Sometimes you simply have to walk away, as it appears Mr. Tesoro did, because to fight it would be too expensive and take too much bandwidth.
I could never vote for Hillary, because her view of the world is so opposed to mine. I think she would be an awful president. But Trump has given every indication that he is a truly horrible human being. I think he is amoral, in the sense that he has no central guiding philosophy except expediency. This story about Tesoro is in perfect alignment with that, and is fully consistent with everything I have seen. Even if some of what Trump says happens to align with my politics (if he really means it, and that's not at all certain), I just don't think I can pull the lever for such a creature.
^ Other than Ford, Carter & Reagan which of the past 10 presidents didn’t lie to the American people?
A better test is to ask - Did Trump lie to Tesoro? Would Hillary have? Why not try out a non-lying prick this time, isn’t 7/10 enough?
All of the Presidents lied. All the politicians lied. They all do. It is the definition of politicians.
8. Reagan? Lied, Iran-Contra
^ Ok 8/10
I didn't say anything about lying. I said he is a horrible person.
^ Which of the last 7/10 presidents weren’t “a horrible person”? Isn’t that what the American people always want? Either way we’re going to get another one, why not one that isn’t also a liar?
Choose one that isn't running for political offices.
obama seems to be a pretty good person. you think he's horrible because of the 1,063 lies, or the dysfunctional congress he has to work with?
by the way, i watched the snl video you linked. tesoro was not in it, and not referenced in it. that means you lied, right?
you also said the source is a jewish publication. where does that come from? the youtube video is linked from hillary's you tube page, and this story can be found on her website. it's a political advertisement, and it's on an architect forum because an architect is at the center of the ad.
surely there were lies somewhere with carter during the iran hostage crisis and sheltering the shah?
if you want to spend some time vetting previous and current administrations, could you look these up and see if they're true? i think we can assume this is only related to embassy protection, so try to limit the fact checking to the intent.
I haven't read this whole thread, but Carrera, are you arguing that Trump would be a better president than Clinton, and if so, how do you see a Trump presidency being beneficial to our country, economically and socially, as opposed to a Clinton presidency? I'm asking seriously. No memes or articles or ranting, just seriously asking your opinion based on your many years running a business.
Also, just related to the ad: yes, anyone who has run a business knows there are some people who see everything as a zero sum game; if they don't squeeze you as far as they can to "win" all that they can then they feel they've lost. Strangely, in my personal (and somewhat limited) experience the worst of this bunch have all been Evangelical Christians; go figure.
Carter is lying sack of shit. That thing about sweaters being a good substitute for keeping the thermostat at a comfortable temp? Total BS.
I think Carter is a good man, but a sadly misguided politician. However, he's absolutely right about the sweater thing. :)
This is what I found on Andrew's Site:
“…Mr. Tesoro is a fine architect with imagination and spirit. [The Clubhouse] fits perfectly on its glorious hilltop site…rooms are beautifully proportioned, light-filled spaces…Andrew Tesoro is a dedicated, enthusiastic, talented, and solid professional… a top-notch architect.” – Donald J. Trump
The Guy really likes the Cake and the Frosting....
Donna, appreciate the cogent response….was churches for me too, won my “Most Stiffed” category, mostly Lutherans though.
You & everyone on here makes their living building things that are vertical….Trump spent his life building all things vertical, he’ll go wild funding buildings because it’s in his blood, despite all the presidential distractions…don’t people naturally tend to gravitate to the things they love & know? Clinton on the other hand will deliver the same old saw “infrastructure”, all things horizontal, civil engineers will be the ones to prosper not architects….she supports unions…poison, the real reason they created NAFTA, no jobs - no buildings ….and it’s infinitely easier to fund/build roads, no thinking, faster, no dreaded architects involved. Which do you design? Which of the two candidates is pro-business? Which one is a businessman/woman? Even if you don’t own a business your family depends on one every day.
98% of the decisions out of Washington have zero effect on your daily life, your everyday comings & goings, think about it..…but this time around there is one thing that is different, that will help architects, and that one thing is Trump’s passion for building things that aren’t flat.
Go ahead get all passionate about all the things you can’t change and have no real effect on your daily life….immigration, Black Lives Matter, the poor & hungry, public transportation etc….things I’m passionate about too, but where the rubber meets the road in my life is my family because nobody is looking out for them, or yours, other than you & me…believe me.
“Horrible person”? Should we send a nice guy to Washington so they can eat him/her for breakfast? You need a “horrible person” to deal with horrible people…he’s not moving into your house…nothing Trump will do will reach your micro life…except 1 thing.
Economy? Fundamentals are horrifying, numbers are being whitewashed by Obama to get Clinton elected (nothing unusual), but after Christmas it’s going to correct in a bad way and who will be there to correct it? Hillary has openly stated that economics isn’t her strong suite, publicly announced she’s putting “Bill” in charge….and while he has a good record he didn’t do it quickly or in a crisis….it’s going to take assholes & elbows this time….unless you all want to sit home and wait.
Asking you Donna, as a woman, if you had a foundation would you take a donation from Saudi Arabia, or politely decline? Who owns Clinton & who owns Trump, because that’s who’s really going to end up running this country.
For the record the first president I voted for was George McGovern, voted for Jimmy Carter too…love “nice guys”, but this is no time for a “nice guy”.
Thanks for asking, sorry to be long.
I can play it vertically or horizontally.
Anyway, I look at Trump as more closer to Joseph Stalin and Nikita Khrushchev than he is to Ronald Reagan. Think about it. Khrushchev's leadership resulted with the building of the Berlin Wall.
Ronald Reagan's leadership legacy (albeit not his sole effort but politically as President) resulted in the fall of the Berlin Wall. Remember: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtYdjbpBk6A
Ronald was about tearing down walls. Donald is about building walls. Donald is antithetical to Ronald in this sense.
Therefore, I am more perplex why Donald wants to build a useless f---ing wall between U.S. and an allied nation? They have tunnel boring machines that will grind through any concrete wall (reinforced or not). They have construction companies with that equipment and frankly, some of those companies are owned by owners of the drug trafficking businesses. So while the drug traffickers are a minority of Mexicans, the vast majority are not drug traffickers.
While we need to improve border patrol and border/immigration enforcement, building some 2000+ mile "Berlin Wall" just isn't what U.S. is about. Reinstituting quarantine stations for any immigration to the U.S. where those who have not been vetted will be more closely scrutinize before allowing them to either continue on or be sent back. However, I don't agree with any "religious test" because that is illegal to enforce and contradicts a slew of laws.
the ad here says that when donald trump hires architects, he doesn't pay them. you can't make money as an architect when your clients don't pay you.
obama helps architects. part of his environmental stance is to fix or replace old buildings that are not energy efficient so we have more sound infrastructure. government buildings bridged the recession for a lot of architects.
if you remember, the economy was in the shitter when obama started. he oversaw many of the policies, including the bailouts started by his predecessor, that got us out. if the economy does go to shit again in december, it would be better to have people managing it who understand how our fiat economy works, and what tools are available to them. hillary may not know how to fix a plummeting economy, but she knows volker and bernanke and yellen and a host of other people who are actually involved with what government does. trump knows that to win, you have to screw everyone else. it's not in your interest or your family's interest to be screwed by trump.
Carrera, I've always thought culture, community, society, America, whatever you want to call it, was about looking out for you and your own but also your neighbor, your friend, and the people you don't even know that make up this place.
^ I wish it were that way, but that would be the world of The Greatest Generation, people born around 1900 through 1924. We have transitioned to a Kim Kardashian world where 30% of Americans don’t know what the Holocaust was; 20% believe that the Sun revolves around the Earth and 29% of Americans are unable to correctly identify the current Vice President…over 10% of the entire population is addicted to illegal drugs…..However, 22% are able to come up with the name of every member of the Simpson family…that’s the world we live in today and nobody with those stats gives a shit about your family.
We today (depending on community) live in the Wild West, towns will burn this summer and they didn’t in the 1950’s. 1967, that was the “C” Change when the lying began, we live with a government that lies to us about everything, our healthcare, our food and the real state of our safety and wellbeing and they have engineered us out of doing anything about any of it. In 1900 75% of the adult populated voted, in 2000 it was 48%...people have rightly given up, tuned it all out, including you and your family.
Plenty of good just around you, but overwhelmed by the predominance of bad today…no one is policing the government or the police….so what alternative do most Americans have but to look inward and rely on themselves?
I hear you, Carrera, but I also wonder about the general zeitgeist, both in the US and internationally, if Trump is elected.
If Clinton is president, it's business as usual. She's safe. She's respected if not liked on the global stage. Trump is a global laughing stock and I fear if he's elected the US's reputation as a leader is seriously deteriorated. *That* is not good for business.
As to curt's point about the US: I am a Communitarian. Not a communist, a Communitarian. I think we do not and cannot exist as individuals. My freedom exists only insofar as you are willing to acknowledge that it exists, and vice versa, so I want to see policies that benefit everyone, especially those who need help more than I do. Which is why, in many ways, the question always comes back to the economy: if the economy is strong more people in the lower income levels tend to have jobs or at least the social safety net is funded, maybe even through the kind of public-private partnerships that I'm exceptionally skeptical of but have done good in many instances.
Also, I just despise the Republican party's positions on almost every issue, so for me even if Jon Stewart was running on the R platform I'd have to vote against him LOL. I want to see the left have more power, so in a way I'm voting for the party not the person.
It's too easy to just say "It doesn't affect me and I can take care of myself anyway." That's the Libertarian cop-out.
that would be the world of The Greatest Generation
it's also the world of the millenials. millenials and us 'X'ers can't turn to baby boomers for help, because baby boomers don't help anyone but themselves. so, when government is full of boomers, we know we can't look to government for help. when private industry is full of boomers, we can't turn to private industry for help.
what we need to do is get rid of the boomers in government, get rid of the boomers in insurance that cause healthcare to be so expensive, get rid of boomers in finance that make monetary policy that only benefits a few, and replace them all with decent people who care about something other than themselves. then government will be stronger, healthcare will be stronger, and the economy will be stronger.
Boomers are not the problem, although it is understandable why they get the blame.
After the 1980 election, the Republican party conceptually reframed the body politic of America into a nation of everyone against everyone else.
Trump is a boomer and a perfect example of that attitude.
Hillary is a boomer and is not an example of that attitude.
Trump or Frump?
So this guy billed an entire project at once (design to construction) and only got 1/3 of the original contract amount? What ever happened to best practices? Bill monthly and stop work or hold drawing if the bill isn't paid within predefined terms....that should be the lesson from this add.
All developers are shrewd and rightly so. We as architects need to know how to be the same way in all contractual dealings.
Yep, very true. If you bill monthly, your client can't get too far ahead.
Shrewd is one thing, and dishonest and unfair is something completely different, however.
Never once have I met a developer that is truly trustworthy. They are always trying to get something for nothing...it is the climate of that sector of our industry. This guy looks like he's been in business long enough to know that, and should only blame himself for not handling the business side of his operation correctly.
I've withheld drawings a few times, and it worked perfectly....always faster/cheaper to pay the bill than find someone else to finish the work (or start from scratch if the contract was written right). Doing so earned a significant amount of respect from the client, and brought repeat business in each case.
^ I agree, but having built a lot over 40 years you can’t believe how many people try to screw the developers….thefts, skip out on bad work, endless lying, unions call OSHA if you don’t “pay up”…endless, you get distrustful & jaded to a point you think everybody is out to screw you then at some point you start screwing back just to maintain your balance....think in some cases it gets read as untrustworthy.
As an architect I withheld drawings twice. First time the client took my 75% finished set of prints, gave it to another architect who cut my title block off, pasted his on – case closed. Second time brought a professional liability law suit; the client just sued me for three things he just thought up till I said “uncle” So 0 for 2 here.
*bump*
It is untrustworthy, but it is also just the nature of the game....can't really blame the player for using an advantage when they have one.
Trump is national suicide. Even rednecks know deep down they are being used.
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