I'm taking a night course in welding at my local vocation high school and was wonderig what kind of welding people recommend I learn. I've done some MIG work, but that was back in high school (in the same shop where I'm taking the class, oddly enough), I was thinking of refining those skills and learning some arc welding. Someone recommended that I jump straight to TIG welding aluminum, but I think that may be a bit too much at first. I guess my end goal is to have some skills that would help me out as far as contemporary design build type work (in the vein of HypeArc and M1/DTW).
Learn stick. If you can master this basic welding process, you can do all the others (tig). TIP: relax your body/arms when you weld (think Tai Chi movement) and your welds will be smooth. Autodarkening shield helps too.
I find that arc welding is not typically used for finish work and is more typical for structural connections. But, if you want to start your own metal shop, stick welding (arc) is certainly the least expensive way to go in the beginning. I started my metal shop for some small furniture pieces to supplement my architecture career and started with a very basic set of machinery (drill press, grinder, chop saw, arc welder, etc.). I found that using the stick welder for furniture pieces was possible (with a lot of skilled welding and grinding), but not really the right tool for the job.
I would hone your MIG welding skills and then get into TIG welding for finish/furniture work. I would also hone your other skills, ie. cutting, grinding, etc.
I had a few classes in weding before I changed my major to Architecture.
Stick welds are for thick metals. Reqiures fewer passes to build a weld
stick welders can be had cheap. But really needs a 220volt source
Migs are not to expensive 500.00 bought my Miller cricket XL. about 6 years ago. Its paid me back many times over. The Miller is a well built unit. Don't go for those 199.00 units they are junk. Mine came with flux core wire so you don't need sheilding gas. You are limited with what you can do with flux core. I converted mine to use sheilding gas and was able to well thin sheet metal without burning through. I think this the easist to learn and has the greatest across the board uses.
You can do steel, alum. stainless with mig when setup properly. And If you want you can weld upside down
Tigs are expensive. Produce very high quality welds Used in race car chassis and aircraft work. If you watch jesse james on Monster Garage he heads right the TIG machine and lays down a weld that looks like a row of dimes. Used on Magnesium, Aluminum, Stainless and steel. Requires alot of skill to get good.
I have a stick welder, wire feed, and a TIG, and out of all of them, I’ll admit I use the wire feed the most. It takes one hand, and it’s just so easy to zap things together. If I were in your position, and had the opportunity to take a class, I would learn TIG. Wire feed is like gluing, stick welding is for farmers, and TIG welding is an art form. If you master TIG, then you are a high priest. Learn TIG, but buy a wire feed…and an automatic lens…and long sleeves…and a band saw. All of this could be yours for about a grand and will not only make you the most popular person on the block, but could easily make your money back with some side projects. I built a railing this summer for $60.00 a linear foot, and that was cheap.
You will start to confuse steel scrap yards as goldmines!
Oh the possibilities!
Right now my battle plan is to polish up on my MIG skills since its been 6 years since I last touched a MIG gun, and then jump into the TIG side of things. If I don't get into TIG or don't get comfortable with it, I'll just take the course again in the winter when they offer it again. Its only $140 (including consumables) for 20 hours of shop time (but of course you can show up a bit early and stay a bit later). This time around my office is paying for it, so I don't have a problem covering it if I take it again to round off my skill set. Plus the shops at the school have pretty nice equipment - they have to buy the heavier duty stuff to take the beatings dealt to it by the high school kids.
Assuming the Mig class is 2 hours a night You'll have no problem picking back up in one night after 6 years.
Partly, why Tig is difficult is that you basically have to sit Tig gun on one hand, rod it the other your arms resting on a table and a foot on a pedal to control the arc. Kinda like patting your head and rubbing your belly at the same time.
If your into reading about welding heres a book for 20 bucks
"performance welding" by Richard Finch
Check www.motorbooks.com
there is a trade group - the national ornamental & miscellaneous metals association (nomma.org) that has numerous resources available with about 1000 members.
there are lots of welders. Welders are a hourly dollar competitive trade. In everything created for a client - someone who is paying is the only one who matters - they are always right - even when they are wrong.
There is a precept at work in your thinking - that you are going to put something "together." For all history - metal was joined by collaring, riveting or hot/cold forging two pieces of metal together. Edmond Fauce's welding torch changed that in 1903.
Now - Take a moment and reverse the concept of assembly into one of deconstruction - that allows you to construct the largest cost effective labor saving paradigm by subtracting material from the largest possible piece. Now make it look like whatever you could imagine........................ anything
What would you design & make????????????????????
What would be designable & practical if you did not have to depend on 'labor' from crafts or others?
If you are interested in really making an indent in what you design and fabricate - why not learn to master the computer format that feeds all job shop CNC manufacturing - what AutoCad was invented to do over 22 years ago. AutoCad was invented to cut tons of steel into finished parts with an oxyacetylene torch on a gantry. I have one buddy who turns 40,000 lbs of steel into finished whatever on a daily basis in LA. IT HAS NOT CHANGED IN ALL THAT TIME. Finished whatever is what in encoded accurately in .dxf.
Architects were fed CAD & .dwg without realizing that it now controls manufacturiing CAM - the result is boxes in architecture. There is no "standard"- but there is a universal potential to push the limits of what a machine can competitively create. Universal is what works uniformly in any job shop anywhere without headaches. It could be the gates of Versailles in titanium without a weld - just as easily as a gear.
.dxf is the key. " As drawn is as built "- and the delineation between design by architects - and the construction trade is purely artificial and obsolete. If you can master shallow arc geometry in a CAD world - you can make with any machine anywhere for pennies on the dollar what will be assumed by everyone as hand craft made with a hammer without breaking a sweat. It is the natural evolution of technology (a hammer used to be that) into a tool. Tools have an open aesthetic potential - technologies are assumed to be limited.
There is a great book: Joan Kahr's 'Edgar Brandt - master of art deco ironwork' out on harry abrams press. read the front piece. Brandt was the first traditionally trained blacksmith to toss the torch into his tool box. Retro-Purists were incensed. Too bad.
its 20th century successor for architectural or structural metal work is data exchange format - 128kb or less - closed polyline - native arc & radius.
Look at your computer mouse with a bit more respect. That is a hammer & torch to a great degree more than you might imagine. It might be a better tool for the job if you set aside some artificial constraints.
I'm actually planning on taking some CNC and CAD/CAM courses at my local community college. I'm fully aware of the implications and possibilities of technology in the manufacturing trades: my first jockey job was doing CAD in a machine shop that did replacement pieces for Marvel vertical bandsaws and manufactured their own model saw (when I was there it was the largest/most powerful on the market - or something like that). When I was a kid my father was a machinist and then worked in the injection molding field, so I've been around shops, machinery, etc for a long long time.
But now I must deal with more pressing issues: the Sox are up 3-0 at the top of the 6th in game 4. This is important shit in Massachusetts....
My friend in the aircraft construction industry says if you can't lay down a good line by stick, you can't weld. He also likes the glue that has replaced some welding and riveting.
I have a bit of a different suggestion and it is how I progressed. Learn to weld and cut with an oxy-acetylene blowpipe first to develop a feel for smoothly moving a puddle, getting proper penetration and the coordination of holding the blowpipe in one hand and the filler rod in the other. Once you get this down moving to other systems is pretty easy.
If you have access to TIG I would recommend you learn that next for achieving a more aesthetic bead.
What type of welding to learn?
I'm taking a night course in welding at my local vocation high school and was wonderig what kind of welding people recommend I learn. I've done some MIG work, but that was back in high school (in the same shop where I'm taking the class, oddly enough), I was thinking of refining those skills and learning some arc welding. Someone recommended that I jump straight to TIG welding aluminum, but I think that may be a bit too much at first. I guess my end goal is to have some skills that would help me out as far as contemporary design build type work (in the vein of HypeArc and M1/DTW).
What do you recommend?
Learn stick. If you can master this basic welding process, you can do all the others (tig). TIP: relax your body/arms when you weld (think Tai Chi movement) and your welds will be smooth. Autodarkening shield helps too.
Depends on what you want to do.
I find that arc welding is not typically used for finish work and is more typical for structural connections. But, if you want to start your own metal shop, stick welding (arc) is certainly the least expensive way to go in the beginning. I started my metal shop for some small furniture pieces to supplement my architecture career and started with a very basic set of machinery (drill press, grinder, chop saw, arc welder, etc.). I found that using the stick welder for furniture pieces was possible (with a lot of skilled welding and grinding), but not really the right tool for the job.
I would hone your MIG welding skills and then get into TIG welding for finish/furniture work. I would also hone your other skills, ie. cutting, grinding, etc.
Nothing beats the smell of a metal shop.
I had a few classes in weding before I changed my major to Architecture.
Stick welds are for thick metals. Reqiures fewer passes to build a weld
stick welders can be had cheap. But really needs a 220volt source
Migs are not to expensive 500.00 bought my Miller cricket XL. about 6 years ago. Its paid me back many times over. The Miller is a well built unit. Don't go for those 199.00 units they are junk. Mine came with flux core wire so you don't need sheilding gas. You are limited with what you can do with flux core. I converted mine to use sheilding gas and was able to well thin sheet metal without burning through. I think this the easist to learn and has the greatest across the board uses.
You can do steel, alum. stainless with mig when setup properly. And If you want you can weld upside down
Tigs are expensive. Produce very high quality welds Used in race car chassis and aircraft work. If you watch jesse james on Monster Garage he heads right the TIG machine and lays down a weld that looks like a row of dimes. Used on Magnesium, Aluminum, Stainless and steel. Requires alot of skill to get good.
Sorry for the poor spelling it's been a long day
I have a stick welder, wire feed, and a TIG, and out of all of them, I’ll admit I use the wire feed the most. It takes one hand, and it’s just so easy to zap things together. If I were in your position, and had the opportunity to take a class, I would learn TIG. Wire feed is like gluing, stick welding is for farmers, and TIG welding is an art form. If you master TIG, then you are a high priest. Learn TIG, but buy a wire feed…and an automatic lens…and long sleeves…and a band saw. All of this could be yours for about a grand and will not only make you the most popular person on the block, but could easily make your money back with some side projects. I built a railing this summer for $60.00 a linear foot, and that was cheap.
You will start to confuse steel scrap yards as goldmines!
Oh the possibilities!
Right now my battle plan is to polish up on my MIG skills since its been 6 years since I last touched a MIG gun, and then jump into the TIG side of things. If I don't get into TIG or don't get comfortable with it, I'll just take the course again in the winter when they offer it again. Its only $140 (including consumables) for 20 hours of shop time (but of course you can show up a bit early and stay a bit later). This time around my office is paying for it, so I don't have a problem covering it if I take it again to round off my skill set. Plus the shops at the school have pretty nice equipment - they have to buy the heavier duty stuff to take the beatings dealt to it by the high school kids.
Assuming the Mig class is 2 hours a night You'll have no problem picking back up in one night after 6 years.
Partly, why Tig is difficult is that you basically have to sit Tig gun on one hand, rod it the other your arms resting on a table and a foot on a pedal to control the arc. Kinda like patting your head and rubbing your belly at the same time.
If your into reading about welding heres a book for 20 bucks
"performance welding" by Richard Finch
Check www.motorbooks.com
Thoughts on welding - & metal work in general.
there is a trade group - the national ornamental & miscellaneous metals association (nomma.org) that has numerous resources available with about 1000 members.
there are lots of welders. Welders are a hourly dollar competitive trade. In everything created for a client - someone who is paying is the only one who matters - they are always right - even when they are wrong.
There is a precept at work in your thinking - that you are going to put something "together." For all history - metal was joined by collaring, riveting or hot/cold forging two pieces of metal together. Edmond Fauce's welding torch changed that in 1903.
Now - Take a moment and reverse the concept of assembly into one of deconstruction - that allows you to construct the largest cost effective labor saving paradigm by subtracting material from the largest possible piece. Now make it look like whatever you could imagine........................ anything
What would you design & make????????????????????
What would be designable & practical if you did not have to depend on 'labor' from crafts or others?
If you are interested in really making an indent in what you design and fabricate - why not learn to master the computer format that feeds all job shop CNC manufacturing - what AutoCad was invented to do over 22 years ago. AutoCad was invented to cut tons of steel into finished parts with an oxyacetylene torch on a gantry. I have one buddy who turns 40,000 lbs of steel into finished whatever on a daily basis in LA. IT HAS NOT CHANGED IN ALL THAT TIME. Finished whatever is what in encoded accurately in .dxf.
Architects were fed CAD & .dwg without realizing that it now controls manufacturiing CAM - the result is boxes in architecture. There is no "standard"- but there is a universal potential to push the limits of what a machine can competitively create. Universal is what works uniformly in any job shop anywhere without headaches. It could be the gates of Versailles in titanium without a weld - just as easily as a gear.
.dxf is the key. " As drawn is as built "- and the delineation between design by architects - and the construction trade is purely artificial and obsolete. If you can master shallow arc geometry in a CAD world - you can make with any machine anywhere for pennies on the dollar what will be assumed by everyone as hand craft made with a hammer without breaking a sweat. It is the natural evolution of technology (a hammer used to be that) into a tool. Tools have an open aesthetic potential - technologies are assumed to be limited.
There is a great book: Joan Kahr's 'Edgar Brandt - master of art deco ironwork' out on harry abrams press. read the front piece. Brandt was the first traditionally trained blacksmith to toss the torch into his tool box. Retro-Purists were incensed. Too bad.
its 20th century successor for architectural or structural metal work is data exchange format - 128kb or less - closed polyline - native arc & radius.
Look at your computer mouse with a bit more respect. That is a hammer & torch to a great degree more than you might imagine. It might be a better tool for the job if you set aside some artificial constraints.
machine parts - in reverse.assembled without any instructions in three hours.
http://www.ornamental-iron.com/publichtm/ornamental_iron_com_gallerya_1_1.htm
I'm actually planning on taking some CNC and CAD/CAM courses at my local community college. I'm fully aware of the implications and possibilities of technology in the manufacturing trades: my first jockey job was doing CAD in a machine shop that did replacement pieces for Marvel vertical bandsaws and manufactured their own model saw (when I was there it was the largest/most powerful on the market - or something like that). When I was a kid my father was a machinist and then worked in the injection molding field, so I've been around shops, machinery, etc for a long long time.
But now I must deal with more pressing issues: the Sox are up 3-0 at the top of the 6th in game 4. This is important shit in Massachusetts....
My friend in the aircraft construction industry says if you can't lay down a good line by stick, you can't weld. He also likes the glue that has replaced some welding and riveting.
Congrats, the curse has been lifted.
I have a bit of a different suggestion and it is how I progressed. Learn to weld and cut with an oxy-acetylene blowpipe first to develop a feel for smoothly moving a puddle, getting proper penetration and the coordination of holding the blowpipe in one hand and the filler rod in the other. Once you get this down moving to other systems is pretty easy.
If you have access to TIG I would recommend you learn that next for achieving a more aesthetic bead.
There you go DR!
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