Hello All, I am trying to find drawings (plans, sections, elevations) of classical and renaissance architecture such as parthenon, pantheon, florence cathedral etc. in form of drawings. Anybody know of any database online?
even sepia as a reprographic method wasn't available yet, i don't think. reprographics as we know it - a light exposure/chemical process - wasn't really even developed until after the 1720's. before that reproduction of drawings was pretty much by hand.
recognizable forms of reprographics didn't really come into common usage until some time during the 19thC. as late as 1910, making a print was still a process that might take two hours per drawing.
none of this, though, is what modularnyc wants, i don't think. is it just old drawings of buildings in a classical or renaissance style you're looking for?
I am thinking that modular wants drawings or facsimiles of original drawings.
Since you all are being picky nerds, I would like to remind all of you that a "blueprint" itself doesn't exist. It's not printed. Nor is it "blue" at least the part that is "printed." Technically, a blue print is a positive negative. Like a daguerreotype.
If there are or ever were drawings for the pantheon, I can guarantee you they no longer exist.
Hadrian got his feelings hurt because he was told that he was awful at the field of architecture by one of his architects Apollodorus. When Hadrian ascended to power, he had Apollodorus put to death.
Other than that, no one knew what the purpose of the Pantheon was for 200 something years after the construction. Even then it was murky at best.
It is known that the building has been rebuilt at least three times by 250 AD. By the 1500s or so, most of the building had been completely stripped.
There has been an accurate model reproduction of it.
The Parthenon as well as the Pantheon were probably not drawn on paper. The Greeks rarely used paper -- unless one was "fucking loaded."
Cornell keeps some stuff around about the architecture of antiquity.
There's also Arles: Le Cirque Romain, Art and Architecture of Late Antiquity and the Middle Ages @ Cornell, Byzantine Architecture @ New Jersey Institute of Technology, Art and Architecture of the Byzantine East @ Willamette, Byzantine Architecture Project @ Princeton, Christus Rex WEB and Classical Architecture @ ANU.
There might be some information on Perseus digital library from Tufts University.
i find the best way to find images of the type you seek is to either go to a library or search for the individual buildings rather than a single source online.
the library is the easiest and will provide the best material when it comes to accuracy.
i have a large collection of books on classical architecture. they are not mysterious nor hard to find. frankly i would imagine it is harder to find a book on zumthor than on palladio. if you absolutely need to find images online then i recommend trying as above.
Students from the Ecole des Beaux Arts in 19th C Paris often went on measuring trips and created beautiful (if not always accurate) reconstructions of classical buildings. Check out the Beaux Arts copy books such as Vignola and Arthur Drexler's exhibit catalog from the show of drawings at MOMA in the early '80's.
Here is a start from Google Books . The cover illustration is even blue.
For the Renaissance, go to the original sources, Serlio, Palladio, Alberti all published "Books of Architecture" illustrated with their work.
It is the Firenze Duomo Museum (Florence Duomo) I visited the museum last year and they had drawings from the building of the dome-probably reproductions, but not sure...but they may have something on their website.
Also check out the Victoria and Albert Museum on-line and see if they have anything...they have a large collection of architectural drawings and plasters that were used in the 19th c.
there will be survey drawings of any of the buildings that qualify as archaeological sites - you'll just need to find the archaeological reports. Lots of sources like Banister Fletcher will have drawings of the buildings you want - the only problem is they are likely to be kind of schematic, so if you need accuracy regarding as-built, you might be better elsewhere.
What is the deal with copyright for classical etchings such as those of piranesi, etc? Is it like certain classical music that is so old that you can reproduce it royalty-free in most settings? Can I freely reproduce a copy of a Piranesi etching without being affected by copyright?
Have you looked at Piranesi publications? If there are copyrights on them, it should be noted in the article(s) somehow.
Oct 19, 09 10:52 am ·
·
2005.11.10
When I went to the Fine Arts Library of the University of Pennsylvania on 14 May 1999 it was to see an actual etching of the Ichnographia of the Campo Marzio for the first time. I felt sure I would see the Ichnographia at the Penn library because within the "Illustration Credits" of Jennifer Bloomer's Architecture and the Text (p. 215) it states:
"Giovanni Battista Piranesi, details from Il Campo Marzio dell'Antica Roma: Ichnographia. Etching, six plates. Used by permission of the Fine Arts Library of the University of Pennsylvania."
I asked at the reference desk about Il Campo Marzio..., and I was told there was no such holding in the catalogue. I mentioned the citing in Bloomer's book, and I even went into the book stacks and got Bloomer's book itself to show the librarian. The head librarian was called and he thought to look in the old card catalogue of the Rare Book Room--Penn was then still in the midst of filling data onto it's fairly new online book catalogue and the Rare Book Room holdings were not yet in the electronic catalogue. Sure enough, Penn does possess a 1762 edition of Il Campo Marzio..., but even that was hard to find because the call number on the card was a typographic error. Alas, I finally had an actual Ichnographia unfolded in front of me and within minutes I discovered that the plan I was now looking at was not entirely the same as the plan reproduction that I had up till then been used to looking at. And architectural history changed a little bit that day.
Then knowing that the Ichnographia exists in two versions, I went back to Bloomer's Architecture and the Text to see which version of the Ichnographia are reproduced in detail there. Strangely enough, the details of the Ichnographia reproduced in Architecture and the Text DO NOT match the 1762 Ichnographia at the Fine Arts Library of the University of Pennsylvania.
2009.10.19
Sometime late 2007 I came in possession of the Spring 1980 edition of Penn In Ink, the newsletter of the Graduate School of Fine Arts University of Pennsylvania. On the inside back cover is offered "An Original Peranesi [sic] Offering -- The Graduate School of Fine Arts is pleased to offer from its Rare Book Room collection to its alumni, students, and friends a limited edition reproduction of an original Giovanni Battista Peranesi [sic] engraving, the 1762 composite plan of Ancient Rome dedicated to Robert Adam, as shown above."
There may indeed be a second (state) original engraving of the "composite plan of Ancient Rome" (ie, the Ichnographia Campus Martius) within the Rare Book Room collection of the Graduate School of Fine Arts, but, nonetheless, the reproduction offered does not match the (first state) Ichnographia engraving within the Il Campo Marzio publication within the Graduate School of Fine Arts Rare Book Room.
Oct 19, 09 11:35 am ·
·
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anybody know where I can find classical/renaissance blueprints?
Hello All, I am trying to find drawings (plans, sections, elevations) of classical and renaissance architecture such as parthenon, pantheon, florence cathedral etc. in form of drawings. Anybody know of any database online?
thanks in advance
they had diazo machines in the 1500s?
That's ridiculous. I believe that they used sepia prints.
houseofmud is right, of course, everything was sepia back then. Very romantic.
I don't know of any online database (though I'm sure several exist) but you might want to start with Sir Banister Fletcher.
even sepia as a reprographic method wasn't available yet, i don't think. reprographics as we know it - a light exposure/chemical process - wasn't really even developed until after the 1720's. before that reproduction of drawings was pretty much by hand.
recognizable forms of reprographics didn't really come into common usage until some time during the 19thC. as late as 1910, making a print was still a process that might take two hours per drawing.
none of this, though, is what modularnyc wants, i don't think. is it just old drawings of buildings in a classical or renaissance style you're looking for?
I am thinking that modular wants drawings or facsimiles of original drawings.
Since you all are being picky nerds, I would like to remind all of you that a "blueprint" itself doesn't exist. It's not printed. Nor is it "blue" at least the part that is "printed." Technically, a blue print is a positive negative. Like a daguerreotype.
If there are or ever were drawings for the pantheon, I can guarantee you they no longer exist.
Hadrian got his feelings hurt because he was told that he was awful at the field of architecture by one of his architects Apollodorus. When Hadrian ascended to power, he had Apollodorus put to death.
Other than that, no one knew what the purpose of the Pantheon was for 200 something years after the construction. Even then it was murky at best.
It is known that the building has been rebuilt at least three times by 250 AD. By the 1500s or so, most of the building had been completely stripped.
There has been an accurate model reproduction of it.
The Parthenon as well as the Pantheon were probably not drawn on paper. The Greeks rarely used paper -- unless one was "fucking loaded."
Cornell keeps some stuff around about the architecture of antiquity.
There's also Arles: Le Cirque Romain, Art and Architecture of Late Antiquity and the Middle Ages @ Cornell, Byzantine Architecture @ New Jersey Institute of Technology, Art and Architecture of the Byzantine East @ Willamette, Byzantine Architecture Project @ Princeton, Christus Rex WEB and Classical Architecture @ ANU.
There might be some information on Perseus digital library from Tufts University.
you may want to look at the work of James "Athenian" Stuart who documented many Greek structures in the 18th century.
modularnyc,
i find the best way to find images of the type you seek is to either go to a library or search for the individual buildings rather than a single source online.
the library is the easiest and will provide the best material when it comes to accuracy.
i have a large collection of books on classical architecture. they are not mysterious nor hard to find. frankly i would imagine it is harder to find a book on zumthor than on palladio. if you absolutely need to find images online then i recommend trying as above.
Students from the Ecole des Beaux Arts in 19th C Paris often went on measuring trips and created beautiful (if not always accurate) reconstructions of classical buildings. Check out the Beaux Arts copy books such as Vignola and Arthur Drexler's exhibit catalog from the show of drawings at MOMA in the early '80's.
Here is a start from Google Books . The cover illustration is even blue.
For the Renaissance, go to the original sources, Serlio, Palladio, Alberti all published "Books of Architecture" illustrated with their work.
See if you can find anything here..
http://www.operaduomo.firenze.it/
It is the Firenze Duomo Museum (Florence Duomo) I visited the museum last year and they had drawings from the building of the dome-probably reproductions, but not sure...but they may have something on their website.
Also check out the Victoria and Albert Museum on-line and see if they have anything...they have a large collection of architectural drawings and plasters that were used in the 19th c.
there will be survey drawings of any of the buildings that qualify as archaeological sites - you'll just need to find the archaeological reports. Lots of sources like Banister Fletcher will have drawings of the buildings you want - the only problem is they are likely to be kind of schematic, so if you need accuracy regarding as-built, you might be better elsewhere.
Off Topic Question:
What is the deal with copyright for classical etchings such as those of piranesi, etc? Is it like certain classical music that is so old that you can reproduce it royalty-free in most settings? Can I freely reproduce a copy of a Piranesi etching without being affected by copyright?
Has anyone else seen Blew Prince: so many answers, so little inclination. by Rita Novel?
Off Topic Attempt To Answer:
Have you looked at Piranesi publications? If there are copyrights on them, it should be noted in the article(s) somehow.
2005.11.10
When I went to the Fine Arts Library of the University of Pennsylvania on 14 May 1999 it was to see an actual etching of the Ichnographia of the Campo Marzio for the first time. I felt sure I would see the Ichnographia at the Penn library because within the "Illustration Credits" of Jennifer Bloomer's Architecture and the Text (p. 215) it states:
"Giovanni Battista Piranesi, details from Il Campo Marzio dell'Antica Roma: Ichnographia. Etching, six plates. Used by permission of the Fine Arts Library of the University of Pennsylvania."
I asked at the reference desk about Il Campo Marzio..., and I was told there was no such holding in the catalogue. I mentioned the citing in Bloomer's book, and I even went into the book stacks and got Bloomer's book itself to show the librarian. The head librarian was called and he thought to look in the old card catalogue of the Rare Book Room--Penn was then still in the midst of filling data onto it's fairly new online book catalogue and the Rare Book Room holdings were not yet in the electronic catalogue. Sure enough, Penn does possess a 1762 edition of Il Campo Marzio..., but even that was hard to find because the call number on the card was a typographic error. Alas, I finally had an actual Ichnographia unfolded in front of me and within minutes I discovered that the plan I was now looking at was not entirely the same as the plan reproduction that I had up till then been used to looking at. And architectural history changed a little bit that day.
Then knowing that the Ichnographia exists in two versions, I went back to Bloomer's Architecture and the Text to see which version of the Ichnographia are reproduced in detail there. Strangely enough, the details of the Ichnographia reproduced in Architecture and the Text DO NOT match the 1762 Ichnographia at the Fine Arts Library of the University of Pennsylvania.
2009.10.19
Sometime late 2007 I came in possession of the Spring 1980 edition of Penn In Ink, the newsletter of the Graduate School of Fine Arts University of Pennsylvania. On the inside back cover is offered "An Original Peranesi [sic] Offering -- The Graduate School of Fine Arts is pleased to offer from its Rare Book Room collection to its alumni, students, and friends a limited edition reproduction of an original Giovanni Battista Peranesi [sic] engraving, the 1762 composite plan of Ancient Rome dedicated to Robert Adam, as shown above."
There may indeed be a second (state) original engraving of the "composite plan of Ancient Rome" (ie, the Ichnographia Campus Martius) within the Rare Book Room collection of the Graduate School of Fine Arts, but, nonetheless, the reproduction offered does not match the (first state) Ichnographia engraving within the Il Campo Marzio publication within the Graduate School of Fine Arts Rare Book Room.
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