Has anyone here worked on senior housing/ assisted living project before? Are they typically more complicated to work through than regular housing projects?
It depends on the context, ie is it just a old folks home or is it an aging in place community that allows for continued living in a neighborhood/ complex of buildings that has varying degrees of occupation such as independent living, supported Living and acute care. the last requires rooms be more hospital like and have full time nursing staff which does make for a more complicated building. Independent living is more or less like most townhomes but might have wider doors for wheelchairs use or future use etc. the planning and success are less to do with the physical building and more to do with the experience of living there and how people can interact as they age.
Maybe more of an old folks home and if it has assistance, very minimal.
Do you know under what circumstances these things get gov't subsidies/ financing?
I'd think that if the organization that runs the facility is a non-profit, they might be able to secure some funding... I'm not sure how it works in for-profit situations (aside from the usual green stuff). The assisted/independent living projects I've worked on were completely funded by private investment.
Yep I work for developer but 90% of the stuff is just RE investment, I'm just brainstorming right now.
toaster, I'm thinking that the for-profit stuff would generally not be able to get public funding either. Was some fantasy my boss threw out there. But who knows maybe it isnt.
I have heard of situations where there are tax credits issued to developers doing affordable housing. but the application process is extremely complicated and the margin is pretty small.
Targeting retirees is a much better market than targeting the assisted living market. Much less regulation as well. Probably better for destination markets. I have worked with both in the past, and both are still strong markets, rich people still want a place to retire and everyone else is still getting older. I have a friend in Minnesota who is doing this sort of stuff, email me and I can connect you two to discuss it.
j
Both markets ( affordable independent living and private assisted living) can be very profitable, but stay away from affordable assisted living, it is difficult to do well and make money.
In either case, you have to know what you are doing or you will get killed. For the affordable housing, usually funded by state tax credits, it is a difficult market to break into with no experience, and given the current rate that developers are getting when they sell the tax credits ( It is crazy low right now), it is harder to do in this economy.
For private assisted living, a developer can make money but has to have a strong source of investment money, and great marketing as well as care.
And hire an architect who knows what they are doing. There is way way more to designing for seniors than just knowing the regulations. They face many specific issues due to their age, and designing to address those specific issues can greatly enhance their quality of life, especially when you get into dementia and memory care facilities.
thanks archie, Ive done a bit of research here and these tax credits are really the key. Def in this env't I would reckon that kind of money is drying up like in private sector too.
I am also hearing that one these projects its the developer who gets the good deal.
For the architect, the affordable housing is more profitable. I think it is for the developer as well, since there is more competition in the private assisted living, and it is very competitive at the upper income levels.
for the assisted living, the developer part is just a small part of the deal- you really have to know health care, have great staffing, etc. I think the most successful people start with a helathcare/ assisted living background, then go into the development of projects.
For affordable housing, it can be very profitable. I know several developers who live very lavishly! The key is that it takes time, since you usually have to own the properties for some time before you can sell them or get a good payback. The capital expense is not very high since it is mostly financed, and a lot of it is government money, but the problem is getting that first job. To get awarded the tax credits, you go thru a very competitive process, and a lot of the points you can get are based on your experience and track record. So here is how you would do it; partner with a more experienced developer who needs you because you know the local people who you need to support the project, and you can manage the project locally. Then once you have some experience, you can go in on your own for projects. I did the exact same thing as an architect; I worked with a firm who was doing a project locally and they were across state. Once I had a couple of jobs on my resume I was able to get work on my own.
One thing I heard was that a lot of these affordable housing projects were being done by contractor/ developer businesses and that the contracting part since there are no private clients hovering over the projects to keep the construction costs down. Have you heard of that?
Like there is this big affordable hosuing project in Baldwin Park built into this hillside - increidble amounts of excavation, grading, etc to place the building- its next to LA. Whenever I look at it I find it hard to believe bc I couldnt imagine anyone building on that site from the private sector since it wouldnt pencil out. But I guess that is also a matter of inefficiency in the public sector.
A memory care unit is specific for people with dementia or Alzheimers. It has features like a "wandergauard" system to keep people from wandering away, and should be designed to address many issues specific to people with dementia. For example, no mirrors; people with Alzheimers very commonly get 'stuck' in their minds at a younger age. They may think they are 28 and just had their second child. If they see themselves in a mirror at 85 it is quite a shock to them.
Around here, I have not heard of one developer doing the contracting as well on affordable housing. I think due to the tax structure, it would be more difficult to get the tax credits if the developer acted as both the gc and the developer. You would have to have a strong track record at both I would think. For a developer with marginal experience, it would be best to team with a contractor and architect with a lot of experience in the field.
Has anyone here worked on senior housing before?
Has anyone here worked on senior housing/ assisted living project before? Are they typically more complicated to work through than regular housing projects?
tv ears saved my marriage!!!
huh?
It depends on the context, ie is it just a old folks home or is it an aging in place community that allows for continued living in a neighborhood/ complex of buildings that has varying degrees of occupation such as independent living, supported Living and acute care. the last requires rooms be more hospital like and have full time nursing staff which does make for a more complicated building. Independent living is more or less like most townhomes but might have wider doors for wheelchairs use or future use etc. the planning and success are less to do with the physical building and more to do with the experience of living there and how people can interact as they age.
Maybe more of an old folks home and if it has assistance, very minimal.
Do you know under what circumstances these things get gov't subsidies/ financing?
don't you work for a developer?
I'd think that if the organization that runs the facility is a non-profit, they might be able to secure some funding... I'm not sure how it works in for-profit situations (aside from the usual green stuff). The assisted/independent living projects I've worked on were completely funded by private investment.
Why are you asking?
Yep I work for developer but 90% of the stuff is just RE investment, I'm just brainstorming right now.
toaster, I'm thinking that the for-profit stuff would generally not be able to get public funding either. Was some fantasy my boss threw out there. But who knows maybe it isnt.
I have heard of situations where there are tax credits issued to developers doing affordable housing. but the application process is extremely complicated and the margin is pretty small.
Targeting retirees is a much better market than targeting the assisted living market. Much less regulation as well. Probably better for destination markets. I have worked with both in the past, and both are still strong markets, rich people still want a place to retire and everyone else is still getting older. I have a friend in Minnesota who is doing this sort of stuff, email me and I can connect you two to discuss it.
j
Both markets ( affordable independent living and private assisted living) can be very profitable, but stay away from affordable assisted living, it is difficult to do well and make money.
In either case, you have to know what you are doing or you will get killed. For the affordable housing, usually funded by state tax credits, it is a difficult market to break into with no experience, and given the current rate that developers are getting when they sell the tax credits ( It is crazy low right now), it is harder to do in this economy.
For private assisted living, a developer can make money but has to have a strong source of investment money, and great marketing as well as care.
And hire an architect who knows what they are doing. There is way way more to designing for seniors than just knowing the regulations. They face many specific issues due to their age, and designing to address those specific issues can greatly enhance their quality of life, especially when you get into dementia and memory care facilities.
thanks archie, Ive done a bit of research here and these tax credits are really the key. Def in this env't I would reckon that kind of money is drying up like in private sector too.
I am also hearing that one these projects its the developer who gets the good deal.
Sorry, I mean in one of these projects...
good lord, my brain to keyboard connection is not working today.
I am also hearing that in these affordable projects its the developer who gets the good deal.
Archie, which market do you think is more profitable and difficult to enter btw affordable independent living and private assisted living?
I agree about staying away from affordable assisted living, that seems like a difficult market and a difficult project...
For the architect, the affordable housing is more profitable. I think it is for the developer as well, since there is more competition in the private assisted living, and it is very competitive at the upper income levels.
for the assisted living, the developer part is just a small part of the deal- you really have to know health care, have great staffing, etc. I think the most successful people start with a helathcare/ assisted living background, then go into the development of projects.
For affordable housing, it can be very profitable. I know several developers who live very lavishly! The key is that it takes time, since you usually have to own the properties for some time before you can sell them or get a good payback. The capital expense is not very high since it is mostly financed, and a lot of it is government money, but the problem is getting that first job. To get awarded the tax credits, you go thru a very competitive process, and a lot of the points you can get are based on your experience and track record. So here is how you would do it; partner with a more experienced developer who needs you because you know the local people who you need to support the project, and you can manage the project locally. Then once you have some experience, you can go in on your own for projects. I did the exact same thing as an architect; I worked with a firm who was doing a project locally and they were across state. Once I had a couple of jobs on my resume I was able to get work on my own.
I'm working on a Memory Unit at the moment....yes it is part of a private sector assisted living home.
One thing I heard was that a lot of these affordable housing projects were being done by contractor/ developer businesses and that the contracting part since there are no private clients hovering over the projects to keep the construction costs down. Have you heard of that?
Like there is this big affordable hosuing project in Baldwin Park built into this hillside - increidble amounts of excavation, grading, etc to place the building- its next to LA. Whenever I look at it I find it hard to believe bc I couldnt imagine anyone building on that site from the private sector since it wouldnt pencil out. But I guess that is also a matter of inefficiency in the public sector.
What's a Memory Unit?
A memory care unit is specific for people with dementia or Alzheimers. It has features like a "wandergauard" system to keep people from wandering away, and should be designed to address many issues specific to people with dementia. For example, no mirrors; people with Alzheimers very commonly get 'stuck' in their minds at a younger age. They may think they are 28 and just had their second child. If they see themselves in a mirror at 85 it is quite a shock to them.
Around here, I have not heard of one developer doing the contracting as well on affordable housing. I think due to the tax structure, it would be more difficult to get the tax credits if the developer acted as both the gc and the developer. You would have to have a strong track record at both I would think. For a developer with marginal experience, it would be best to team with a contractor and architect with a lot of experience in the field.
greenlander: YES, very!
More complicated, more expensive, more time consuming, more satisfying
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