strawbeary...sorry to hear about the paycut...but count your blessings...at least you're still employed and have health insurance...you may need to cut back on somethings and tighten your belt...but its better than being laid off and looking for work in this economy.
aw, that sucks Strawbeary. And the whole idea of a paycut scares me- mostly because i'm just making it now... i know i couldn't make it with a paycut, and yet i'd be scared i wouldn't find a job.
although quite frankly, i'm a little burnt out and it could be a good bump for me to move on.
maybe this recession will start to encourage people to turn off the news, tune out NPR every once in awhile, and actually pay attention to what is going on around them instead of relying on talking heads.
The 50% pay cuts may be a means to bide time while the recovery and economic stimulus bill comes around. Any idea how long they are in effect? Another sinister aspect might be an attempt to reduce the firm’s obligations under the state unemployment laws.
Any one who is a registered architect should register with their respective state Capital Development Boards. In Illinois you get put in a pool for small odd jobs like adding a bay to a snow plow maintenance facility or a bathroom renovation in a university building. Also much of the energy saving efforts specified in the stimulus bill will probably come in the form of widow and roof replacements which in Illinois require an architect’s stamp for public buildings. This is not major work so RFPs are not always issued but there are set rates for small projects under a set amount ($150,000 I think). Some firms avoid this type of work like the plague since there are very strict guidelines in text size and sheet layout. Other states are different but if you are licensed there should be a place to get in line for a small job or two. Those of you with a job and some time should use that to set up the title blocks and text sizes so that if this work becomes available you can get rolling fast and possibly save your job.
i'll just point out a couple of things to everyone who feels like the job cuts being documented are too far towards the intern/entry level end vs. being more equitably spread around:
first, for all of us (myself included) who started the firms at which you're employed, this is our livelihood as well. each of us may have all kinds of other reasons driving our respective firms, but i'll be the first to say a large part of my own reasoning was to make a certain level of income. as the owner, i've got every reason to try and protect that income, even in down times.
second, the main reason people hire firms is because of the implicit guarantee the owner (principal, etc.) makes in ensuring the organization will continue to exist for the duration of their project. if i put myself at a high degree of exposure, financially, to continue to pay people with no billable time to support it, i'm jeopardizing much more than a few employees incomes.
thirdly, almost every principal in every firm has an equity stake for both the losses, as well as the gains, their firms make. the line of credit i'm expending to try and keep you on board in some level? i had to personally guarantee that with my house, car, etc. if i blow the wad to keep an employee around, and the firm fails subsequently, is that employee going to return those wages they earned doing nothing productive? right. personally, i'm going to do my best not to let it get to that point. (and to illustrate, if a typical employee costs a firm 7,000/mo in direct and indirect expenses, how long are you going to keep 50 around when they're not needed? at 350K per month? are you kidding? you'd let them all go too, especially if there is no work on the immediate horizon.)
in sum, as the owner, i've got to do everything possible to keep the firm, as an entity, going unless i can safely bring to closure. i'm on the hook for everything - liability, financially, etc. principals, like it or not, drive the incomes of firms. they're going to be the last to go. interns are more expendable in the grand scheme of things. sorry if it's not what you want to hear, but it's a brutal truth you learn to accept when it's your neck on the line.
where to go from here? become the boss. make something happen. protect yourself. it's all you can do right now.
Currently, I'm employed and recently licensed. (thank goodness!) But, I was laid off in 2007 and 2008. Laid off after 9|11 as well. I've been in the profession 10+ years. I love architecture. I would never trade my schooling. And, I've learned tons in the real world of architecture firms. But, if I get laid off again, then I would be done. Too much starting over and absolutely zero safety net.
tidalwave, I hear your frustration, but aren't layoffs like this common in every other field right now too? For example, newspapers and other print journalism are hemorrhaging employees - our local monthly home magazine (an arm of another bigger monthly) just folded, so all the writers plus all the photographers, stylists, etc that worked for it are now out of work, too. Not to mention any kind of retail sales are currently in the crapper. I just don't think architecture is the only field that suffers periodic layoffs.
outed, thanks for your post. Even if difficult to hear the truth! I think it's important for employees, especially young interns who haven't had the benefit of being exposed to the workings of their firm, to understand how things look from the owner side. Good luck keeping on.
On the other hand, any firm that hands down a 50% pay cut to some and a measly 5% to others deserves whatever bad karma they get. Yes, I would suffer a bit under even a 5% loss in wages right now - I've always lived very close to the bone financially - but come on. That's asinine.
I'm an intern living in an expensive city so you can imagine how shitty my pay is to begin with. I already practically live paycheck-to-paycheck while I pay off my student loans and obnoxiously high rent fees that were all gouged in the 2000s.
If I got a 50% pay cut, I would leave the profession and seek another profession until everyone who fucked things up are in jail where they belong and when the architecture profession actually gets it's shit together. We all love architecture but we have to live too.
lb - i'm with you. we specifically chose not to lower anyone's salary (except my own during the lean months) and made cuts instead. i personally can't stomach the thought of cutting salary vs. letting someone go. if i've asked you to work, i'll pay it.
I hope you guys who have been laid off have contacted your student loan holders to tell them so - I think you can stop paying while you're unemployed if you make arrangements with them.
even you can tell your student loan provider you lost your job, they will only allow u to stop paying for like 6 months and interest keep accumulating (Archmed, you are right) and I just check that.... so I am just paying the minimum payment with the UI checks.... and hopefully the UI checks will come soon...
I really hate that you have to buy into this insane whore-dom of debt to have access to a quality education. I really, really hate it. To the point of killing brain cells which invalidate the 20k I am looking at for an undergrad degree.
It seems that the stimulus bill (at the time of writing this report) will directly create 5,000 +- Jobs in the Architecture profession. But this report only counts the jobs from the proposed projects from the conference of Mayors. The profession is, or was, employing 200,000 + people so it can directly preserve 2.5%. However there are other programs not counted in this report that might bump up that number. Then there is the indirect effect this could have on new “Green Economy” jobs. Those green jobs have to be conducted somewhere and that is where architects might get some more work. High-Tec industrial manufacturing might be a major growth area due to direct grants, and guaranteed loans. Factories may not be glamorous but they can keep the firms up and running.
I believe the weatherization of existing housing is another area that could work if architects look at ways to streamline some of the design processes. For example in major cities large portions of neighborhoods are built in the same manner at about the same time, one could find many homes with similar conditions and similar solutions, make a standard set of plans as a base and edit as needed. I will be eagerly awaiting the passage of the bill so that I can get a look at the grant application process. Could design firms or unemployed professionals act as expediters for home owners to get a grant, design, and permits? It may be difficult to make a profit but it might cut losses until more substantial work can come in.
guys what do you think when my ex-firm paid me 2 weeks of severence (my last day was on Dec 10th) and today the unemployment office gave me a letter and said I am disqualified from the claim because I am STILL COLLECTING severance pay from that firm....?
(can a firm lie to the unemployment office like this?)
I don't think they lied, most likely they are just incompetent or crappy bookkeepers. You will of course appeal the unemployment department ruling, just make sure that you inform both the former firm's principal and HR person (if there is one) that you are doing this beforehand so they have a chance to clean up their act.
Depends on the state but you will probably have to wait 2 weeks till you are eligible for benefits after you last received benefits. Did you have any vacation hours accumulated? Read the website’s rules section carefully. Try calling, best time is right when they open. If you are in a major city and can’t get through try calling one of the unemployment offices in a rural area of your respective state they all have the same set of rules and can access info through their network. Your former employer may be challenging your eligibility, when you file they do check with your employer and if they are not careful in what they say they might send the wrong impression and cause the department of employment security to question your eligibility. In most cases if this was an error you will get the balance of what was owed you. Also most states require direct deposit, did you set this up? If you are filing in a state of a previous employer that you left to take a job in another state which you were most recently laid off, the unemployment office might not have the info on the last place of employment. This is often the case when you hop over state lines for work, talking to a real person will help clear this up. You may be ineligible if you did not work for 6 -9 months, this could be the problem.
this may be a stupid question, but since we're on the topic of unemployment, do you need to be laid off to collect it? i graduated into this horrible economy, am i shit out of luck when it comes to unemployment?
em, I was with the firm for over 2 years, and i waited 2 weeks, after the severance pay period plus my vacation time before i set everything up with the UI office. Direct deposit is an option, but it is not required.
MArch, I think you are screwed. I was in the same situation in 2001, and at that time I was not eligible. If I had to do it over again I would have applied for welfare...
In four months of active searching, I've been invited to one interview out of only three reasonably local (commuting distance) jobs advertised that I applied for. The interview was focused around a presentation on a predefined topic all interviewees were asked to prepare. This had the following effects:
1) I've never worked so hard preparing for an interview my entire life
2) The presentation afforded me the opportunity to actually demonstrate my commitment to the kind of work they do and how I can absorb and marshall the relevant data
3) I got the job!
you busted your ass preparing for the meeting, presented yourself to have a positive can-do attitude, and positioned yourself above your competition. your efforts are no different (or shouldn't be) than what a firm does in securing any project. you responded to their rfp and got selected.
from what you describe the firm expected to receive quite a few resumes and needed to standardize the interview format to create a level playing field for the candidates. this is much like what many public sector clients do when interviewing architects.
I know of one local firm that put their entire staff on 30 hour work weeks...and no pay for those 10 hours not worked.
All of their interns and mid-level staff are looking for 2nd jobs, and that's only a 25% pay cut. One friend said he can cover the mortgage, utilities and other fixed monthly bills but groceries is killing him & his family. He's looking into food shelf options.
The FOOD SHELF....have architects - professionals with 5+ year college educations been reduced to begging for food to feed their families?
Wage deflation is a scary scary thing. If you watch the news they talk about price deflation. Sure, home prices are down, but unless you are buying today most people are locked into a fixed mortgage payment already. Consumer discretionary goods are down but who is really buying a new 60" plasma screen these days? Gasoline is down, but is anyone planning a road trip? Meanwhile, groceries are up by significant margin. The cold winter is not making my utility bills cheaper. Property taxes are up. I look at my monthly household budget and don't see any savings anywhere over past years.
Meanwhile I'm not expecting a raise or bonus this year. I cannot fathom something like a 50% pay cut. It's easy to see how even a small wage cut can put some real hurt into the people that make up this profession. If this downturn lasts long enough I cringe at what will be left of our profession....I imagine a swiss cheese of upper management and fresh out of school newbies that will work for almost free.
aquapura: Krugman and places like Calculated Risk have been talking alot about wage deflation, etc. It's a big issue. Last year before I was let go, I had to work with a paycut. That's hard when you are living paycheck to paycheck. And, that is not factored into the unemployment numbers.
To be clear if you had an hourly job while in school and they lay you off after you graduate then you may be eligible but the benefits might be very low. Unemployment typically looks at the last 6 quarters to determine an average. If you had a fellowship or stipend while in school then you will not be eligible for unemployment. Part time work counts towards unemployment in most states, those of you in red states are worse off than in blue states. But unemployment spans state lines, when filing choose carefully and file in a state that you have worked in, over the last 6 quarters, that have the most lenient rules. If you paid taxes there then you can file there just move back or claim you parents or relatives house as your residence.
Question for all of you all: WTF is the point of reducing people's pay without reducing their hours? Presumably, the lack of revenue in the firm that causes the wage reduction corresponds to a lack of work to be done - is it really worth it to keep people sitting around at their desks panning and zooming when there is nothing to do but improve the CAD Standards? In my experience an underutilized staff is pretty poisonous to office culture.
Good managers would make sure that time is not wasted. Even if there is not paid work to do, the time can be productively spent:
Learn new software, improve your skills in software.
Study and become an expert in some aspect of our trade (lighting, acoustics, green, wood frame structures, etc.)
Work on marketing material, contact clients, develop an e-newsletter and send it out.
Clean up the office, purge and update the library, clean up deadfiles
Improve your office standards for cad
Bone up on building codes.
Develop checklists for procedures that you do often to make them easier.
Set up systems for billing, tracking profits on jobs, better production of RFP's etc.
None of this is "busy work". It all will ultimately positively improve the bottom line when things turn around.
as mentioned above, the thought of trying to cut peoples salaries (vs. letting some people go) just doesn't seem right to me (and i'm the owner in this equation). trust me, we've all got money issues and it absolutely tears me up to even think of laying someone off, but i bet if most firms took a vote, everyone would rather people get laid off (even if it's them) before everyone taking a collective hit for the team. i've argued this with other firm owners who are doing the pay cuts/time cuts. my ultimate point is always this: how long do you really think this is going to last? if you think (like most of us) that it's not going to get any better overall through this year and well into the next, how long do you think people can live with a lower standard of living? my guess is not very long. if you're doing it to bridge a 2-3 month gap, then be upfront about it, say why you're doing it, and if it doesn't look like things will pan out, go ahead and make the cuts and restore everyone else to whole.
archie - you have a great list of things you think people would already know to do (sadly they don't). the rub is that if there is only so much income coming in, how long can you cover the difference doing overhead type work? a week is one thing. a month another, a year is out of the question.
I should clarify, my paycut IS accompanied by reduced hours, and we laid off 1/2 the staff before going to paycuts for the remaining. It's that bad. Lately, I have 2 proposals going out every week and a billable job with a client breathing down my neck and can't possibly actually do just 32 hours. Corporate welfare. Meanwhile, the cronie sitting next to me surfs the web and IM's all day and calls it marketing.
The layoffs vs. paycut thing came up where I work. Basically management said we are in a service industry and our clients expect us to be here working 40 hours/week during normal business hours. Thus, layoffs will happen to balance the workload to full time working staff, but hours/pay will not be cut to balance it the opposite way.
They did say that if things appear to be recovering a paycut might be considered just to keep staff on board for an in sight pick up in work. A temporary thing that will save money in the long run over highing and training new staff.
There is actually a large cost to firing someone vs. cutting their hours. They are then up for unemployment, cobra payout and more. I learned from my corporate .com days that it was much more expensive to lose someone you had trained than it was to find a way to retain them.
it is not as black and white as when we have work you are hired and when not, you are fired. everyone would be served better to be freelance all the time if that were the case.
Layoffs....layoffs......
Our firm made a "horizontal" cut...1 Principal, 1 associate principal and other firm leaders at the top were let go in addition to interns.
The worst mistake firms can make right now is to let the interns and mid level staff feel the full brunt of the receession.
What saddens me is to see friends of mine with masters degrees who are licensed with 5+ years in the industry leaving the profession for good.
Marlowe, can you blame them?
We're all victims of someone else's mistake. We've done nothing wrong here.
good riddance. let the weeding commence.
strawbeary...sorry to hear about the paycut...but count your blessings...at least you're still employed and have health insurance...you may need to cut back on somethings and tighten your belt...but its better than being laid off and looking for work in this economy.
aw, that sucks Strawbeary. And the whole idea of a paycut scares me- mostly because i'm just making it now... i know i couldn't make it with a paycut, and yet i'd be scared i wouldn't find a job.
although quite frankly, i'm a little burnt out and it could be a good bump for me to move on.
maybe this recession will start to encourage people to turn off the news, tune out NPR every once in awhile, and actually pay attention to what is going on around them instead of relying on talking heads.
The 50% pay cuts may be a means to bide time while the recovery and economic stimulus bill comes around. Any idea how long they are in effect? Another sinister aspect might be an attempt to reduce the firm’s obligations under the state unemployment laws.
Any one who is a registered architect should register with their respective state Capital Development Boards. In Illinois you get put in a pool for small odd jobs like adding a bay to a snow plow maintenance facility or a bathroom renovation in a university building. Also much of the energy saving efforts specified in the stimulus bill will probably come in the form of widow and roof replacements which in Illinois require an architect’s stamp for public buildings. This is not major work so RFPs are not always issued but there are set rates for small projects under a set amount ($150,000 I think). Some firms avoid this type of work like the plague since there are very strict guidelines in text size and sheet layout. Other states are different but if you are licensed there should be a place to get in line for a small job or two. Those of you with a job and some time should use that to set up the title blocks and text sizes so that if this work becomes available you can get rolling fast and possibly save your job.
i'll just point out a couple of things to everyone who feels like the job cuts being documented are too far towards the intern/entry level end vs. being more equitably spread around:
first, for all of us (myself included) who started the firms at which you're employed, this is our livelihood as well. each of us may have all kinds of other reasons driving our respective firms, but i'll be the first to say a large part of my own reasoning was to make a certain level of income. as the owner, i've got every reason to try and protect that income, even in down times.
second, the main reason people hire firms is because of the implicit guarantee the owner (principal, etc.) makes in ensuring the organization will continue to exist for the duration of their project. if i put myself at a high degree of exposure, financially, to continue to pay people with no billable time to support it, i'm jeopardizing much more than a few employees incomes.
thirdly, almost every principal in every firm has an equity stake for both the losses, as well as the gains, their firms make. the line of credit i'm expending to try and keep you on board in some level? i had to personally guarantee that with my house, car, etc. if i blow the wad to keep an employee around, and the firm fails subsequently, is that employee going to return those wages they earned doing nothing productive? right. personally, i'm going to do my best not to let it get to that point. (and to illustrate, if a typical employee costs a firm 7,000/mo in direct and indirect expenses, how long are you going to keep 50 around when they're not needed? at 350K per month? are you kidding? you'd let them all go too, especially if there is no work on the immediate horizon.)
in sum, as the owner, i've got to do everything possible to keep the firm, as an entity, going unless i can safely bring to closure. i'm on the hook for everything - liability, financially, etc. principals, like it or not, drive the incomes of firms. they're going to be the last to go. interns are more expendable in the grand scheme of things. sorry if it's not what you want to hear, but it's a brutal truth you learn to accept when it's your neck on the line.
where to go from here? become the boss. make something happen. protect yourself. it's all you can do right now.
So - how to be an agent of great design without getting ayn randy-dollar crazy? Is it possible?
Currently, I'm employed and recently licensed. (thank goodness!) But, I was laid off in 2007 and 2008. Laid off after 9|11 as well. I've been in the profession 10+ years. I love architecture. I would never trade my schooling. And, I've learned tons in the real world of architecture firms. But, if I get laid off again, then I would be done. Too much starting over and absolutely zero safety net.
tidalwave, I hear your frustration, but aren't layoffs like this common in every other field right now too? For example, newspapers and other print journalism are hemorrhaging employees - our local monthly home magazine (an arm of another bigger monthly) just folded, so all the writers plus all the photographers, stylists, etc that worked for it are now out of work, too. Not to mention any kind of retail sales are currently in the crapper. I just don't think architecture is the only field that suffers periodic layoffs.
outed, thanks for your post. Even if difficult to hear the truth! I think it's important for employees, especially young interns who haven't had the benefit of being exposed to the workings of their firm, to understand how things look from the owner side. Good luck keeping on.
On the other hand, any firm that hands down a 50% pay cut to some and a measly 5% to others deserves whatever bad karma they get. Yes, I would suffer a bit under even a 5% loss in wages right now - I've always lived very close to the bone financially - but come on. That's asinine.
I'm an intern living in an expensive city so you can imagine how shitty my pay is to begin with. I already practically live paycheck-to-paycheck while I pay off my student loans and obnoxiously high rent fees that were all gouged in the 2000s.
If I got a 50% pay cut, I would leave the profession and seek another profession until everyone who fucked things up are in jail where they belong and when the architecture profession actually gets it's shit together. We all love architecture but we have to live too.
i hear that archmed! don't live to work, work to live! keep your passions for your hobbies!
lb - i'm with you. we specifically chose not to lower anyone's salary (except my own during the lean months) and made cuts instead. i personally can't stomach the thought of cutting salary vs. letting someone go. if i've asked you to work, i'll pay it.
I hope you guys who have been laid off have contacted your student loan holders to tell them so - I think you can stop paying while you're unemployed if you make arrangements with them.
yes you can LB, i did just that
But the crazy thing is that you still accumulate interest.
It's not fun getting totally screwed over like that.
yeah that is also true, although i'd rather be on the hook for months of interest than defaulting on the loan
even you can tell your student loan provider you lost your job, they will only allow u to stop paying for like 6 months and interest keep accumulating (Archmed, you are right) and I just check that.... so I am just paying the minimum payment with the UI checks.... and hopefully the UI checks will come soon...
I really hate that you have to buy into this insane whore-dom of debt to have access to a quality education. I really, really hate it. To the point of killing brain cells which invalidate the 20k I am looking at for an undergrad degree.
Very interesting post from the AIA
http://aia.org/aiaucmp/groups/aia/documents/pdf/aias078714.pdf
It seems that the stimulus bill (at the time of writing this report) will directly create 5,000 +- Jobs in the Architecture profession. But this report only counts the jobs from the proposed projects from the conference of Mayors. The profession is, or was, employing 200,000 + people so it can directly preserve 2.5%. However there are other programs not counted in this report that might bump up that number. Then there is the indirect effect this could have on new “Green Economy” jobs. Those green jobs have to be conducted somewhere and that is where architects might get some more work. High-Tec industrial manufacturing might be a major growth area due to direct grants, and guaranteed loans. Factories may not be glamorous but they can keep the firms up and running.
I believe the weatherization of existing housing is another area that could work if architects look at ways to streamline some of the design processes. For example in major cities large portions of neighborhoods are built in the same manner at about the same time, one could find many homes with similar conditions and similar solutions, make a standard set of plans as a base and edit as needed. I will be eagerly awaiting the passage of the bill so that I can get a look at the grant application process. Could design firms or unemployed professionals act as expediters for home owners to get a grant, design, and permits? It may be difficult to make a profit but it might cut losses until more substantial work can come in.
Getting creative:
http://www.komonews.com/news/local/38783672.html
Word has it, he's lined up a lot of work and has now teamed up with another person to do so.
guys what do you think when my ex-firm paid me 2 weeks of severence (my last day was on Dec 10th) and today the unemployment office gave me a letter and said I am disqualified from the claim because I am STILL COLLECTING severance pay from that firm....?
(can a firm lie to the unemployment office like this?)
I don't think they lied, most likely they are just incompetent or crappy bookkeepers. You will of course appeal the unemployment department ruling, just make sure that you inform both the former firm's principal and HR person (if there is one) that you are doing this beforehand so they have a chance to clean up their act.
Depends on the state but you will probably have to wait 2 weeks till you are eligible for benefits after you last received benefits. Did you have any vacation hours accumulated? Read the website’s rules section carefully. Try calling, best time is right when they open. If you are in a major city and can’t get through try calling one of the unemployment offices in a rural area of your respective state they all have the same set of rules and can access info through their network. Your former employer may be challenging your eligibility, when you file they do check with your employer and if they are not careful in what they say they might send the wrong impression and cause the department of employment security to question your eligibility. In most cases if this was an error you will get the balance of what was owed you. Also most states require direct deposit, did you set this up? If you are filing in a state of a previous employer that you left to take a job in another state which you were most recently laid off, the unemployment office might not have the info on the last place of employment. This is often the case when you hop over state lines for work, talking to a real person will help clear this up. You may be ineligible if you did not work for 6 -9 months, this could be the problem.
pst money is faith based.
how long will you keep believing?
this may be a stupid question, but since we're on the topic of unemployment, do you need to be laid off to collect it? i graduated into this horrible economy, am i shit out of luck when it comes to unemployment?
em, I was with the firm for over 2 years, and i waited 2 weeks, after the severance pay period plus my vacation time before i set everything up with the UI office. Direct deposit is an option, but it is not required.
I will call again to the UI office tomorrow.
MArch, I think you are screwed. I was in the same situation in 2001, and at that time I was not eligible. If I had to do it over again I would have applied for welfare...
March, I believe you have to be laid off.... getting fired, you quit, or not having a job doesn't qualify for unemployment...
that's what i thought....
in most states, if you get fired for misconduct no, incompetency, etc - yes
In four months of active searching, I've been invited to one interview out of only three reasonably local (commuting distance) jobs advertised that I applied for. The interview was focused around a presentation on a predefined topic all interviewees were asked to prepare. This had the following effects:
1) I've never worked so hard preparing for an interview my entire life
2) The presentation afforded me the opportunity to actually demonstrate my commitment to the kind of work they do and how I can absorb and marshall the relevant data
3) I got the job!
congrats solidred!
solidred.
congrats.
you busted your ass preparing for the meeting, presented yourself to have a positive can-do attitude, and positioned yourself above your competition. your efforts are no different (or shouldn't be) than what a firm does in securing any project. you responded to their rfp and got selected.
from what you describe the firm expected to receive quite a few resumes and needed to standardize the interview format to create a level playing field for the candidates. this is much like what many public sector clients do when interviewing architects.
now you've got to keep it!
I know of one local firm that put their entire staff on 30 hour work weeks...and no pay for those 10 hours not worked.
All of their interns and mid-level staff are looking for 2nd jobs, and that's only a 25% pay cut. One friend said he can cover the mortgage, utilities and other fixed monthly bills but groceries is killing him & his family. He's looking into food shelf options.
The FOOD SHELF....have architects - professionals with 5+ year college educations been reduced to begging for food to feed their families?
Wage deflation is a scary scary thing. If you watch the news they talk about price deflation. Sure, home prices are down, but unless you are buying today most people are locked into a fixed mortgage payment already. Consumer discretionary goods are down but who is really buying a new 60" plasma screen these days? Gasoline is down, but is anyone planning a road trip? Meanwhile, groceries are up by significant margin. The cold winter is not making my utility bills cheaper. Property taxes are up. I look at my monthly household budget and don't see any savings anywhere over past years.
Meanwhile I'm not expecting a raise or bonus this year. I cannot fathom something like a 50% pay cut. It's easy to see how even a small wage cut can put some real hurt into the people that make up this profession. If this downturn lasts long enough I cringe at what will be left of our profession....I imagine a swiss cheese of upper management and fresh out of school newbies that will work for almost free.
congrats solidred!
you should definitely celebrate!
Congrats, brother!
It's great to hear nice pieces of news on such a downbeat thread! You've inspired a lot of us!
congrats solidred!
aquapura: Krugman and places like Calculated Risk have been talking alot about wage deflation, etc. It's a big issue. Last year before I was let go, I had to work with a paycut. That's hard when you are living paycheck to paycheck. And, that is not factored into the unemployment numbers.
To be clear if you had an hourly job while in school and they lay you off after you graduate then you may be eligible but the benefits might be very low. Unemployment typically looks at the last 6 quarters to determine an average. If you had a fellowship or stipend while in school then you will not be eligible for unemployment. Part time work counts towards unemployment in most states, those of you in red states are worse off than in blue states. But unemployment spans state lines, when filing choose carefully and file in a state that you have worked in, over the last 6 quarters, that have the most lenient rules. If you paid taxes there then you can file there just move back or claim you parents or relatives house as your residence.
Congrats solidred!
Question for all of you all: WTF is the point of reducing people's pay without reducing their hours? Presumably, the lack of revenue in the firm that causes the wage reduction corresponds to a lack of work to be done - is it really worth it to keep people sitting around at their desks panning and zooming when there is nothing to do but improve the CAD Standards? In my experience an underutilized staff is pretty poisonous to office culture.
congrats solid! but werent you happy in the haze of your drunken hour??
i agree with Janosh... underutilized, as well as undermotivated, staff = bad bad office environment.
Good managers would make sure that time is not wasted. Even if there is not paid work to do, the time can be productively spent:
Learn new software, improve your skills in software.
Study and become an expert in some aspect of our trade (lighting, acoustics, green, wood frame structures, etc.)
Work on marketing material, contact clients, develop an e-newsletter and send it out.
Clean up the office, purge and update the library, clean up deadfiles
Improve your office standards for cad
Bone up on building codes.
Develop checklists for procedures that you do often to make them easier.
Set up systems for billing, tracking profits on jobs, better production of RFP's etc.
None of this is "busy work". It all will ultimately positively improve the bottom line when things turn around.
ok, my ex firm just layoff 5 people (out of a 45 ppl LA firm) in Boston, 2 LA, 2 Senior LA and 1 associate...
janosh -
as mentioned above, the thought of trying to cut peoples salaries (vs. letting some people go) just doesn't seem right to me (and i'm the owner in this equation). trust me, we've all got money issues and it absolutely tears me up to even think of laying someone off, but i bet if most firms took a vote, everyone would rather people get laid off (even if it's them) before everyone taking a collective hit for the team. i've argued this with other firm owners who are doing the pay cuts/time cuts. my ultimate point is always this: how long do you really think this is going to last? if you think (like most of us) that it's not going to get any better overall through this year and well into the next, how long do you think people can live with a lower standard of living? my guess is not very long. if you're doing it to bridge a 2-3 month gap, then be upfront about it, say why you're doing it, and if it doesn't look like things will pan out, go ahead and make the cuts and restore everyone else to whole.
archie - you have a great list of things you think people would already know to do (sadly they don't). the rub is that if there is only so much income coming in, how long can you cover the difference doing overhead type work? a week is one thing. a month another, a year is out of the question.
I should clarify, my paycut IS accompanied by reduced hours, and we laid off 1/2 the staff before going to paycuts for the remaining. It's that bad. Lately, I have 2 proposals going out every week and a billable job with a client breathing down my neck and can't possibly actually do just 32 hours. Corporate welfare. Meanwhile, the cronie sitting next to me surfs the web and IM's all day and calls it marketing.
"I HAVE PEOPLE SKILLS!!"
What are the top ten movies for architects laid off or fearing a layoff in 2009?
Office Space
Fountain Head
The Edukators
The layoffs vs. paycut thing came up where I work. Basically management said we are in a service industry and our clients expect us to be here working 40 hours/week during normal business hours. Thus, layoffs will happen to balance the workload to full time working staff, but hours/pay will not be cut to balance it the opposite way.
They did say that if things appear to be recovering a paycut might be considered just to keep staff on board for an in sight pick up in work. A temporary thing that will save money in the long run over highing and training new staff.
Guess I'm ok with that policy.
There is actually a large cost to firing someone vs. cutting their hours. They are then up for unemployment, cobra payout and more. I learned from my corporate .com days that it was much more expensive to lose someone you had trained than it was to find a way to retain them.
it is not as black and white as when we have work you are hired and when not, you are fired. everyone would be served better to be freelance all the time if that were the case.
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