ill answer number 4 for you.... this forum is a great resource in itself; search through it, and you'll find plenty of people answering many of the same questions.

good luck.

one thing you dont like about your job is that its not intellectually rewarding,,, I dont see how you are going to achieve that with a real estate degree,, or at a developer's office,, i think ull make things easier for yourself if you clearly state your goals,, as much as possible...

BuiLi

I was actually doing some research on this topic the other day. This article answers the question of how much you might make starting out as a developer. http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EIN/is_2005_Sept_22/ai_n15625989
The websites of some of the schools offering MRED programs (USC, Columbia, Cornell, etc.) are also very helpful in answering these types of questions.
That being said, I tend to agree with fays.panda that you might want clarify what it is you truly want. I personally believe that you'll never get anyplace good if you're just running away from your last thing. If you do your research and truly contemplate whether or not the work of a developer will be satisfying to you, then you'lll be in a position to make a wise choice.

Best of luck and I hope you find what you're looking for.

Your first year in an office is never going to be intellectually rewarding.

drew,

That article has a copyright date of 2005, which was right in the middle of the real estate boom. I'm very skeptical that an entry level salary for an MRED would still be in the 6 figure neighborhood in today's economy. A lot of the companies listed in the last line of that article are in pretty dire straits right now.

i agree, you really cant be at a crossroads after 1 year

i think your expectations for the beginning of your career as an architect were amazingly unrealistic
if you dont mind me asking, what did you expect to be doing your first year working? what tasks did you think you would get?

that being said, if you have always been interested in real estate development, maybe you just chose the wrong career to begin with

like everyone said before, if you defined your goals a little better, you might get some better advice
its unclear (maybe to you also) whether you are just bored in your office or if you actually would be better off not an architect

: like others have said above, I think you may be a bit premature to be considering a career change after only 1-year, unless you really weren't all that serious about architecture in the first place.

However, that being said, I can almost guarantee you that an MBA in finance from a good school will prepare you better for a job outside of construction and real estate ... at least, if all you're interested in is making a pile of money.

I suggest you start by asking "what do I want to do?" rather than "what do I want to be" -- if you can't see yourself in any role other than that of an architect, I'd look around for a firm that better suits your ambitions. If you can't imagine yourself doing anything other than financial analysis and making deals, then real estate or a career in finance might be your ticket.

I worked in architecture for four years before taking my MBA ... but I really enjoyed those four years and sought the extra education to enhance my abilities as a licensed architect. Admittedly, I did work in RE development for a few years after grad school, but I always gravitated back to private practice, which is where I am now.

By the way, if you want to work in real estate, I'm inclined to think a degree in "real estate" probably would be a better complement to your architectural training than a degree in "finance". Real estate is MUCH more than just finance.

Good luck!

my roomate is a developer...he has nicer stuff than me

Thanks all for the helpful comments and criticisms.

It's true I am guilty of prematurely considering a change of career path after having only worked for a yr.

I've always wanted to work in the building industry. I chose to enter the architecture industry b/c I was swayed by the seduction of the creative and 'glamorous' programs provided by architecture schools. I think a lot of ppl could agree with me on that when they were students. And I think alot of ppl would agree that the first yr out of school is quite a jarring contrast from school...even for those who work in design oriented firm like I do. This is not a complete shocker to me as I had expected as much, but it has also made me question what if I had gone the other way.

I've always been interested in the business side of the industry-the complexity of deals and decisions that goes into the realization of a building or piece of development. Now (yes prematurely) I've been wanting to be involved in the big picture...not only in the physical and formal aspects of building but also about the whole process from financing, deals, negotiations, risks, to the physical outcome.

Now after working long hrs drafting and specifying high end fixtures and hearing always hearing the discontent coming from alot of the more senior persons...I am more inclined to give my interest in real estate a try. There is a somewhat disdain for developers by architects b/c of the bad reputation...but I just think that its funny how a lot architects, despite their condescending remarks, are always looking to work with developers and rely on them for big commissions...b/c developers do have a tremendous impact on the building industry. And progressive developers are doing alot of good the the city.

Also financially, I figured that if I am to work long hrs to pay my dues, I rather be compensated well for it...rather than having to live from pay check to pay check and sometimes having to burden my family. I will also be learning the bigger picture while I am at it.

Ultimately I would love to (just as anybody in the profession would love to) one day be able to not only manage my own office but also be able to finance, implement and take on most of the major decisions in designing a building project. That, I guess would be my pipe dream.

So here is my long winded explanation. Being a young naive and inexperienced professional I hope ppl can see where I am coming from. I will spend more time practicing architecture to get more experience but I also want to plan out where my goals and interests before I put all my eggs in one basket.

So if anybody has any more helpful advice I would welcome it. I know that there are a lot young professions who will read this post are wondering the same thing so more helpful advice and less of the archinect cynicism would be great

Biulu, I think a lot of people have been where you are; and you seem to have a good understanding of what you want and which options you may have. As for timing, the sooner you can figure it out the happier you'll be... Again, I suggest using this forum and searching for past discussions. Also speak to people that you come across at work, people who are doing what you want to do, how they got there, network for possible jobs, etc.

Quizzal, great advice.

you need a mentor...preferably a positive one and someone outside your own office.

many of the grad students here at university of tokyo archi-school went on to enter finance and real estate. not sure why, but am pretty sure the lure of money is part of it. in tokyo, 6 figures income seems to be pretty reasonable if you work hard. for some the income is also close to zero when times are hard (commission based job).

based on the people i know i would not assume you will have much better job satisfaction. in big company and depending on a job you may simply be switching from doing rhino renderings to doing powerpoint presentations. like any job the range of work is infinite.

if you want more money then it is one way to get to it, no doubt. if you want to be happy, i don't know. depends on your personality.

BuiLi, I'm guessing by your name that you're asian, and by your impeccable and peculiar brand of English specifically from Hong Kong.
I'm not sure if you work in the West, but your background and an arch degree coupled with any sort of US business degree will make for a rich and rewarding career in the East.
Frankly I'd recommend at least another year of arch practice before going into business school, meanwhile you should visit the local university or college used book store and pick up a used finance, economics or marketing textbook and see if you actually that sort of stuff before taking the plunge to go into business school (MBA or MRED).

Steven has some good advice.

Generally, you can tell where you are going to end up in a career path by looking at the people in 'front' of you. However, if the people in front of you are'nt really good examples of what you can achieve in the industry then this approach is flawed. A mentor in a position that you think is impressive and worth pursuing is a great idea.

If you are keen on jumping the fence anyway [as I have] then best of luck. Remember that nothing is forever, and leaving the narrow constraints of traditional architecture practice does not mean you can't come back [witness quizzical]. I'd argue than an employee or principle who actually knows how development works is far more important to architecture practice than someone who knows how to draw and detail.

A question from someone outside of the US - it seems to be mandatory to get a degree for real estate or an mba. Is this really necessary? Can't you just take your b.arch or whatever, a bit of bollocks and networking and start in development?

diabase - you raise a good question. of course, it always depends on the skills, drive and personality of the specific individual. I've seen people work in r.e. with, and without, formal training in the discipline...so it certainly can be done successfully.

imo, having the academic credential in business or r.e. to supplement an education in architecture will send signals to prospective employers, lenders, partners and tenants that won't be sent with an architecture degree only. I think it conveys a balance and sensibility that many developers don't necessarily believe is common among architects.

However, John Portman is a perfect example of someone who brought no particular academic training in r.e. to the table ... however, the story is that he found a client (or so) who was willing to mentor him in the things that real estate developers need to know.

BuiLi-

I have a lot of developer and broker friends and queried them on this issue.

Their first reactions were along the lines of, "Has this person read a newspaper or turned on a tv in the last week?!!? Real estate (commercial and residential) is going to suck for a while....in the U.S. at least)"

2nd reaction: For now, audit some development classes, brush up on your calculus, stats and finance skills. Start networking in the classes and join a real estate networking group. Don't assume that the architecture degree is going to impress anyone-in fact, it could hinder you.

3rd question/reaction: Can this person take getting kicked to the gutter a lot and be fearless? Development is not for the weak-willed-you definitely have to hustle to get the capital and grab the deals. All of my dev friends are self-described "sharks".

Take what you will from the above, I say go with your gut and do what makes your life enjoyable. Whether that's quitting your current job and leaping into development or slowly testing the waters, only you can decide-good luck!

Not all developers are equal, as not all architects are equal. If the developer is a good one - like most other good businesses - they will not expect you to know everything before you start.

Before blindly getting into development, research and hunt down the best developers to work for. Arguably, they will probably be more design focused which means that your particular skill set will come in handy.

Development and property broking are two completely separate industries. Its like comparing architects and product reps.

I made the jump into development work and am sort of hedging my bets for the near term learning about how to handle non-performing loans as it looks like development work will on hold for quite some time.

My boss actually worked in architecture for a few years after receiving his B. Arch years ago. Has no formal training in RE and the office does property management for almost a billion sf of residential in the Valley.

But that possibility I think is pretty hard now. These days you def need a basic background in finance if you are going to tackle development on a larger scale.

And network like a mofo.

Also you have to understand real estate development. Its all about comodification. The mindset, the lingo, the terminology and tasks are nothing like we architects deal with. We get a glimpse of their world when we work for them but we only see the tip of the iceberg of what goes on behind the scenes. Sealing with lenders. Taxes. How to account for sales, where to put exspenses on a balance sheet, again - taxes taxes taxes. If you think architecture is mundane, imagine the hundreds of hours reworking your accounting to avoid huge tax exspenses or timing a market to record sales in another quarter - are that type of individual?

As mentioned above, you need to clarify your goals. What do you want?

And as they say, "knowing what you want is the hard part...".

mdler, when you say "my roomate is a developer...he has nicer stuff than me",
you are not really making the case to be a developer! First time i heard of a developer being a roomate

BuiLi,

I don't think that you haven't seen the architecture profession enough as I found your analysis is objective and precise. It is better for you to know what you want rather than spending an extra 5 years and decided to switch.

You have only finished BA (Arch) now I supposed and you'll have to do BArch or MArch and AIA. The amount of money and time you'll put into the profession will be double or triple than what you put in now.

It has well been discussed that Architect as a professionals is being marginalised. Indeed nowadays, architect does not have much liability, the structural liability goes to the engineers and a lot of other liability goes to sub contractors. A lot of work are done by other consultants. project are managed by PM. The most demanded position in architecture office is, senior architects or job runner, who attend tremendous amout of coordination meetings that no architecture student will want to continue if they know what they will do. senior architects are in demand because a lot of architects quit the profession before they reach that level. All of my classmates in an Ivy graduate architecture school has changed to Project management if not real estate.

Also for those who has suffered to reach a design position, will sell the design cheap. If they don't sell the design cheap they cannot compete with the established architectural practice. Also you need a very well-off family to back you up.

To be honest, I think our marginalization of our professional could attribute to the protectionism for the established architects on one hand and the educational detachment to the reality on the others. I don't see it is wrong to earn a decent living and it is not right to be a sacrificial architects either.