And yes Steven now it happen again --- but what is it that is happening, didn't I just give a-f a link , and don't you think a-f after not reading the answer he ask even given to him, will claim that I offtrack the tread.
Think about it, the next "critic" of 3dh will be either some dirty mails in my mailbox or a-f who been answered so many times claiming I hijack the tread ; how much do that small credit cost --- nothing for those two Ted and a-f who would happily copy your book ; "you just uses the alfabet how can you copyright that, you just used the letters allready there".
... anyway, I'm so sorry for provoking this thread to go out of hand. I will also bookmark the [C]Space Pavillion page. The project is very nice and it the claims of theft from Per really upsets me.
Thank's --- but I am sure anyone who read these treads see the same pattern, And no one are more sad about it than I, that tread after tread are invated by the same two or tree bored retired . But it is a pattern that came from the usenet, a place I know before ,was the playground for those charecters ---- as I said I also pity a charecter who become so involved in hystericly trying to harm another person , but it happened before --- and realy I am sorry for these persons becaurse posting dirty mails, or going into any tread where a particular other guy post, just to throw more dirt and then arogantly with a grin , claim that now this guy again hijacked a tread and using all the other dirty tricks, --- just the fun knowing they ,protected by a covard fake name, can reach out and harm a nice guy --- well as it happened for this guy "Jeanneret" , he ended up menatly ill , he proberly had problems before, -- but he did exactly the same thing , and only proven that there allway's are a backlash when you do those things ---- beside offcaurse I agrea, that if you are so bored and so arogantly rigid minded , that you ask the same "expalnation" 20 times , and the words you write obviously uncover, that what you are doing, is grinning spreading poison , and you think it is fun, ---- well then I pity the guy, becaurse doing so, you tell more about yourself, than the guy you harras.
It is a sick game, and yes, I seen how it backlash --- I mean nomatter what a covard you are, then being so obsessed harming a nice guy, just becaurse you can do so protected by a fake name, don't change the facts about what sort of person you are, --- and those charecters are the same ones -- that's easy to track down --- who the first few years claimed 3dh didn't work, that no one would invent such a silli system, later after the serpentine pavilion , they claimed I did not invent it ---- and if anyone havn't answered , it is them ; a small group who get their evil joy harassing some guy who stand out, the followers of the class bully, a bicycle mechanic, a retired truck driver and a retired school teacher who found this nice place to be a better place, to punish the clever guy "who think he is someone" --- I am collecting the vorse of their mails, they has to be moved with aspestos glowes , and yes they are a great source about what jeloux minds, what bored retired school teachers think about this hippie architects, and guy's who think they are someone ---- as soon as you dig further into it, say trace back the sender and find their posts on usenet, it is often in some right wing discussion group, where they retire after going here to amuse themself , --- try read some of their silli claims, you be surprised and decide than those who are not mentaly blind, can not hear, and those who can can only read their own writing and newer, even you give them links and answer polite , they turn to the same bad habbit as five years ago when they first joined some evil clown usenet hero, who found his victim.
As I said I am sad it happen again and again, but this is Hate Crimes, ---- they allway's thirst for pover, and these retired old men several times have been very exited , if they could just succes their Hatecrime , and cheat people into their dirty game ; remember it all started with this guy who happily shared a brilliant new idear, and doing just that, brought forth the dirtyist and most unplesant in a particular group of people, a group I got to know quite well, even as you proberly will emagine, people I would like to lay off their unhealty obsession ---- on the other hand, knowing what they "protect" ; robbing artists intelectural property, dirty hate campains even towerds my Legal Graffiti ,that others --- well when a professor who you know are one of the most poverfull idealists call it genuine art --- and one of those charecters ,start even throw dirty private mails, then you know that crowd, --- and this site know them aswell, know them as those who as soon as Per Corell post one mail, will post ten and then claim Per Corell "again" hijacked a tread, people who don't contribuate a tread as this with anything byt harassing Per Corell, people that post dirty mails, when you politely answer their questions for the 20' time.
And yes I guess they partly succesed to poison my life more than the average reader of the fora. --- I will let that be their joy and succes, as true, they succesed poison my life and destroy my possibility to earn my credit, but they are also promoting hatecrimes and robbing artists credits, -- nice guy's wouldn'tyou say, and what do they earn except the joy the evil joy.
life is too short - if someone is sending you hate mail via archinect send the isp to paul and he should sort it out -
this is a discussion board whose mission is to debate critical issues concerning the built environment. contrary to what Steve implies: we have not highjacked the tread: the conversation is about ownership of creative ideas and specifically with the influence of sublime references - something we deal with every day.
I disagree with your position and have said so - you disagree with me - so fine. you read far to much inbetween the lines. it has nothing to do with hate crimes. we just disagree.
That's ok , --- Where the disagreament shuld origine fail my mind ; I mean what's obsessive being a skilled artist who find solutions and overly share a varaity of issues, and only become uncomford when silli questions replace openly sharing, --- You read an architect fora, but are you open for develobment, open towerds the fact that artists are all different, that a piece of design can be more than a fancy piece , that there are way deeper sources to knowleage than when the designer make chairs, the architect floor plans, the engineer complain --- denmark has a long tradision for these things , and newer was I met with same intolerance, on the opposite in this contry we don't look at the political idears with a particular skilled artist, but my impression from this site, about how people with a bit more fantasy are met, seem to be very dependant of their social skills rather than their abilities. On one side , the most dull talks about impossible art is apriciated highly, on the other hand , a masterpiece in the N.Y. subway being valued to halve a million , is washed off the wall after it has been a pleasure and apriciated for 20 or more years, --- becaurse a graffiti cleaning patrol was bored.
--------- Your own native art , art in a class of a mona lisa , just washed away , nytimes brought the story. And was it the tradisional multy color graffity no, not at all , it was a piece apriciated by so many, untill it just before it was reconised and protected becaurse of it's obvious touch with the newyorkers , was destroyed by an anti graffity gang.
------ Such things is what you notis being a dane, the thirst for dull silli words and the arogance towerds the obvious real arts.
Then about arts --- how come all complains is personal attacks, not or rather newer a genuine critic about my works ; wouldn't you say it is strange that people can read my thoughts and with poison in their mind, are capable to tell everyone , what Per Corell not is going to answer or what Per corell think ? Wouldn't a real critic about my works be more relevant, more relevant than complains about what you don't understand , --- there are much people don't understand about today's art, but look around and see if you can even reconise the genuine pieces, ask yourself it a mona lisa was washed away, becaurse dull words and projects and money art , replaced the genuine core, --- I has a right as artist, to be able to publish my works, and I has a right expecting , that the critic here in a fora trying to hold a high standard, is not made by arts haters, who instantly "critic" the art by throwing dirty mails or do all that evil they allway's wished to do , to all those modern artists they could not harm.
What I do here, what I been doing here and other places on the web, is to publish my work --- sadly peoples hate against artists then made it so, that instead of making critic towerds what I published, they --- maybe becaurse one is a retired bicycle mechanid who masqurate as architect, or is a retired building worker maybe even a carpenter who grew the normal hate towerds architects, well there are many resons, --- but in the end, and proberly becaurse I realy know more than they, they turn to personal attacks and silli questions no engineer ever would ask --- without even reconising the newthinking without even being surprised how Per Corell can turn from architecture into painting, -- and then succes so good as painter.
Maybe for you , a few of these issues count, -- the stoneage wall paintings in the caves must be destroyed as they progress graffiti ---- and indeed this acturly happened, some of our culture's early artistic works , realy have been washed away by arogant graffiti haters who will newer reconise if something simular to a modern mona lisa was just in front their face. And belive me, I newer wished anything else than being able as artist, to publish my work ; now what offending act do you realy see in that, and my defending myself against a raging crowd of bored retired school teachers and retired wood workers, what can be wrong in that, --- if you want art ,then you can not cencur , that only enforce the real artists you shuld know that, but please remember "who" allway's hated art, remember why and try being a bit more tolerant towerds people who in fact is only sharing a happy messeage.
I answered any question unless offcaurse those questions was obviously not about my works, but mabye that is just the issue, --- no one else than you ,claim I don't answer "those questions" , and the last 20 times you claimed I don't "answer those questions" , maybe even the past 30 times you in one or two lines , claimed I don't answer those questions, -- you happily failed to tell what questions you talk about.
I answered "questions" about 3dh by adding easy to read graphics, --- in your case I often replied with a picture of the Manzard house --- every time I asked you, what is realy "wrong" with that structure, You newer answered.
I think it is not just absurd but also extreemly rude to cover behind a fake name and strike out , to harm some nice guy, and isn't it strange, that it is only you who claim I newer answer --- if I don't ever answer how can you keep on talking ; isn't the fact that I answer allright, but I don't answer to your screwed up picture of me, or is it infact your screwed up picture of me, -- I mean all the strange things you been saying about me, even reading my mind and grinning about what you emagine I "think". --- ain't that just a bore and what's the basic for your obsession, can you ever say something nice about anyone ; I just wonder.
I've followed this "tread" with some interest and wonder; where is the science to 'prove' your so called method works? I mean whenever a 'new' idea comes about a few things are deployed - along with your so-called 'fancy graphics' - mathematical equations, the physics involved, scale models, historical precedent, and some sort testing of the 'hypothesis', yet nothing but 'fancy graphics' are ever produced by this phantom pathologically insane person. How is it we get lulled into these debates. The questions are never answered, and when asked they are often deemed irrelevant. The software or program doesn't exist, we can't buy it, you can't see it - beyond the 3d image produce by god knows what program.
Produce the science, produce the math, produce someone with a doctorate in advanced structures, and moreover produce a real, tangible building that someone has not died in, and has enjoyed their life experience habitating said space.
What you forget, and I put that politely, because I don't think beyond your imagination of how structure = architecture you can comprehend that architecture is more than a structural frame - something Calatrava seems to miss as well. Perhaps you should contact Santiago, and you might get some validation, but until you produce the above; you and your methods are no more important than "The Simpsons" are to the American political system.
These are very difficult questions to answer in fact -- but what I read is, that you don't know how a CAD program work, so becaurse you don't know that "the math." is allready there in the CAD program , then you see past anything you can read here ;
If things don't conform to your expertations --- then you will not allow it, you see past the fact that here are the first real structural system, that allow the build in Math. of the CAD program to generate a buildable structure, you don't even know if it is and yet you claim it is not ; where are the logics in that ?
In fact I think I would say no to your A-f and Ted's respect, I know your agenda and your screwed picture of art , architecture, and fine arts --- in fact I am refusing your points of view, your whole attitude towerds newthinking and creativity, I don't want your allowance your respect or anything from you.
And there it is, confirmed by the creator, it's the little 10101011100's that justify this 'work'. Math, science and doctoral dissertations or tested hypothesis are not required.
per's program isn't about structural mechanics, it is about the spatial mechanics of creating a honeycomb system for which the structural mechanics already work, more or less, due to it's redundancy. shipbuilders work the same way. per is a boatbuilder. no one can figure this out, which says a lot about the structural know-how of architects. it is based on a rule-of-thumb for boat building that lies more in the form of the structure than the depth of its members. all per's program does is calculate these shapes. that's all it needs to do.
O RLY? I think that is quite clear to everybody. Didn't you follow the 3DH competition thread? The problem is that Per claims anybody who is doing anything vaguely similar to a egg-crate / 3DH / whatever structure is ripping him off.
no, i don't follow these 3d h threads. why you are people are so obsessed with per's accusations simply baffles me. it is the most entertaining thing about archinect. also, there are several posts above questioning why per's system works. i just explained it for those people.
le bossman, the issue really isn't about whether or not it works, it's about someone claiming ownership of something that inherently exists in nature. My attempt here is to dispell this notion that he somehow invented something, he clearly hasn't, even you recognize that fact. Modelling a honeycomb structure in some 3d program does not make him an owner or creator. In order to claim or lay claim to a new method for building, it requires more than just 3d modelling, it requires testing of methods and proving it does what he says. Until he relents and proves this works and is a model of efficiency, that he and he claims is fact, this "method" will be a residue on the edges of cyberspace.
i always felt that per was trying to claim ownership of the program itself, and this is what was stolen from him. even per, as a boat builder, knows that he didn't invent the honeycomb structure itself. shipbuilders have been using this proven method for decades.
What program? No one has ever seen a program. Clearly, above he is stating, and has stated several times on several different threads, that people stole his methods.
If this is lisp routine, a script, or some other software, then if it can be proven that those elements have been utilized, then we are in agreement, but he never states that bossman, never. In fact he can't.
Thank's realy I am just obsessed by the sheer oppotunities, that computers now realy are used best, case 3dh become realised, it will be a whole different future. My ownership are to read the wishes, spoken or non spoken , the expertations of various designers and well known architects to prosper, to extract this new architecture, we cirtainly could profit from, I am not going to defend my rights from the glimpse of suddenly realising the real brick wall, -- the very basics of what I was doing my calculations on so to say , as how stupid isn't a lot of frame structures where instead of transvrcing the forces right into the strongest vector by realising the build structure in a different way , and gosh, now we only need two planes, to build litteraly anything, --- no one thought about that before.
They was high climing fighting some stupid polymesh entity, while I was filtering the points out , for matrix calculations or transformations, got a buntle of juicy AutoLisp programs for all sorts of things , for me the ownership mean nothing, if just the world started to realise the true matter of the new things.
A lot of what is said against 3dh, is realy quite irelevant, still what I can't understand is how everyone lost direction -- 3dh is not about my ownership, but it is a serious result of many years of work, I don't talk about promoting or the past many years, the years I spended with old projectors and fact is, that this 3dh thing was newer ment as a source of conspiraty if I can push the world with 3dh what would the credit mean, still your resons not to allow me, what artists been allowed since de vinci and rock and roll , this new perspective will rock everything, and realy, it is not that a bad thing, that things get cheaper to build and stronger by structure, I paint, I left this 3dh things years ago beside, most things said sort of against 3dh must be totaly irelevant, what effect on a method do it have, what we think per corell think.
Everything being stated about what I think are serious silli, why shuld I think even, when projecting images.
You know, even with this pavilion thing, what will be right, will be a full blown 3dh , some various anchor fittings, fittings made to install a particular strength even that can be done so neat, holes fittet with round steel rods, just a suggestion, and realy, 3dh most way's need hardly any structural anchors, the floors walls and other paneling will alone deliver the strength .
3dh are made for any form , but not only round forms just becaurse it is the best for just that, boxes work fine with 3dh, but there you also can model with just the requirements you want it's just still a fact, that 3dh also make great boxes, offcaurse delivery of something better than 3dh would aprove, still my experience is, that complicated things ,can be to complicated. 3dh is strait out, it is so simple that it is almost silli and maybe, but only maybe a small fraction of the possible structures, will need structural anchors , yet was that a bad thing ?
when you make a box with 3dh, do you do it as one solid piece, or make the walls out of 3dh panels and assemble them together, and then engineer the joints?
besides, maybe per did invent the method. either that or he's insane. either way, he can't be wrong. he is probably some kind of surrealist. i trust his word as a dane: Per Corell invented 3dh, in some form or another, even in parallel to other people, or after they did without knowing about it. what new methods have anyone else come up with?
When I make a box I make another a bit smaller, that I subtract the first bos to get walls, their thickess refpect in the resulting structture thickness, the framework surface when two 90 deg. to eachother planes independant of the tradisional 3 but thereby also offcaurse within, the displacement of the tree tradisional ones.
Generating an array of offsets sections expanding these into solids the thickness of the material projected within, still the important issue is how this framework interact and deliver, way further than what we deserved.
i see. it is a solid subtraction operation. i can see the structural advantages of this but as a builder i'd rather make separate elements and connect them, but obviously it is difficult to moment joint wood. it would also be difficult though to cut out the entire section of a building in one piece, even for a small one.
a-f, this is a serious discussion about the possibilities of 3d-h, not about ruining some nice guy who's just proposing a new method. sure, per is a little eccentric, but like kramer said, "most geniuses are"
"it would also be difficult though to cut out the entire section of a building in one piece, even for a small one."
Not at all and that's where this method surprises you, huge frames as I prefere call the individual sections , is sheet materials, for that there allready are a number of way's to assemble a lot of smaller pieces into one, remember the computer hold the intire frame, all the frames in exact one to one measures, but fact is that 3dh ask shorter span in fact shorter than you think ,but all those issues are trivial, you can even cut the sheet lengthen assembly into the frame itself while the nc cutter cut's it shape, it also prepare the ends for even a dove tail ,but please , what is it that happen when you glue two sheets together, can't you place the butt join on the middle of the other sandwich sheet , ---- maybe you then think the cutters has to have the maximum size being cut, not at all there are something called callibration that sort of move the works plane along the frame so any piece can be cut, but realy it's frames are shorter than you think think about it, it's all short frames as they don't go from top to bittom but tranverse the form from one side to the other.
The whole assembly arear on both frames by all assembly places , can be cut away, so there be a round hole where you think there are trouble sliding them together, there are now a round hole in both frames instead of the strait slot there are a circular hole, that's where you place the assembly fitting, such one shuld be easy, but there are many choices, please show a bit innovation ,and I am sure we tomorrow will have ten different way's. --- remember all "problems" you think you will face, are allready solved with today's technikes, and the structure work different than you emagine --- what about if you wanted floors at varying hight what do that cost extra in conversional construction, here it offer itself cheap, as a side effect of a different attitude towerds the structure.
Here floors and volumes within the boundries are all your design --- be sure that if you model freely, subtract solids add solids, then the structure will flow it's shape around those subtracted volumes, floors are made union a solid , if you want a wall place a solid with the measures of the wall union it with the raw model, and when you slice your sections, after finding the right world to do it -- tradisional vertical and horisontal are trivial for the method, not needed and often much more exiting a structure without following the tradisional 3 planes , as we are only making the structure itself -- the rooms can be square or round 3dh don't care, it only provide a magic gadged to generate a structure -- that structure are just one material, now we don't have 300 planks , nails, all various materials that othevise go into a structure how there are only one, and emagine what efficiency come out of using only one material to make what asked 300 before.
--- offcaurse you are not forced to do that 100 pct., guess I has to say .
okay so you are sandwiching pieces. i assume this can be done in the field, which negates the possibility of having to fit entire unbroken cross-sections together. i assume by "round hole" you mean creating a large void at the end of your tool path so the round area your tool creates (that conflicts with the piece to be inserted) goes away. do you have images of built projects?
Again, if those people with this pavilion realy wanted that pavilion and the structure was not the issue, then 3dh would be the right choice.
Easy -- emagine a smart assembly gadged and a bit creativity combining various treads of mesh , winding their own form paralell to eachother feathering the whole structure, maywe even a huge dove tail join of two different matters of 3dh in different orientation.
It allow you work with any form any scale, there it is not different than the tradisional, that can also be scaled, but it often make little sense , where here, it can mean everything. Different structures in individual scales can be locked within a rougher structure, varying angle of the section planes can make a build in structural anchor ,as if the structure try to collapse, it instantly are held and supported by build in volumes of structure , with the opposite properties.
But offcaurse , if the form are not the issue, then why chose so difficult a form , a form that will challance all other methods , all other than 3dh.
I am not an architect I am designer, and I am sure it is better to realise the "problem" here, as realy, there are many different solutions, some that allow a particular flex, so the structure plus it's floors and walls, all become intirely earthquale safe, -- by intirely I mean that the mean for the porpus, the flexible and calculated new assembly slot piece replacement unit, are thruout the intire structure, minimising critical arears. Remember 3dh is an offer, but also an offer that you can make it better.
bossman, much of this was covered in the 3dh competition thread. i know it's a lot to wade through, but there are some answers about 3dh details in there that don't usually come out in these exchanges with per in random threads.
the 3dh competition thread was actually kind of cool. i know that apurimac, liebchen, and myself were considering entering, but i think we all eventually burned out.
i thought you might have images of other products you've built. i've worked on similar egg crate structures before, with CDX plywood, MDF, and latvian birch, but i don't have the resources to explore the idea for the sake of itself. i worked on a trade show booth a few months ago that we were able to put together with no fasteners using a technique like this, which made things easier for obvious reasons. using a single MDF sheet, you can serrate it, as you know, to fit with the other pieces and powder coat each piece so it doesn't need to be touched up on site. everything fits together perfectly, and it looks like the 3d model actually.
A very simple , I know maybe irelevant in this particular case, -- but try look to the details, it's acturly fun so easy possibilities with this 3dh just mountain;
It is a very somple frame set for a trawler hull --- but if you can realise the examples are only examples and that I am not trying to design a trawler again, --- but this is about how different things become with just a small change, these double frames are in fact very exiting , they form part a box as you see, all slots will be possible in steel and instead of frames od sheet, there will be box frames , frames that NO one would be able to detail so precicely and in this fasion ever before, seen any before, realised any of the exiting oppotunities with any system you been offered before, -- well case you say no to both and realise what else you say NO to, your reaction seem a bit inmature, but what shuld I care.
"no, i don't follow these 3d h threads. why you are people are so obsessed with per's accusations simply baffles me. it is the most entertaining thing about archinect. also, there are several posts above questioning why per's system works. i just explained it for those people."
If you don't read his threads then that is why you don't understand why people are so agitated with him. If you read them all you will see.
It's all been gone over before. He does this exact same thing he is doing with you every time. He attacks other people and derails perfectly good threads, this is how it works:
He takes advantage of the good nature of new or infrequent posters unfamiliar with him (le bossman for example) who don't realize he's trying to suck them in. Then he makes himself a victim by making delusional claims to ownership of ideas that belong to no one. Someone asks him a question about "his" system. He tells them how simple their mind is for not understanding or provides a link to a pciture as an "answer". If you're not convinced, he bashes all those who engaged him for poisoning the thread and detailing it for the original posters thread.
The few threads and people who have actually tried to help him and bring something positive and productive to 3DH (like the 3DH competition) have also been "poisoned" by him, but of course he always blames it on these “uset troll scumbag evil clown Nazis”. It’s always our fault.
Now regarding "Per's" system:
He has a very creative notion of what constitutes intellectual property. It’s also one of the more controversial areas of intellectual property in that it’s “innovation” derived from common historical knowledge.
He himself admits it's applying boat building techniques to architecture. So if you he didn't develop it, how is it his? So he uses a computer to do it, boat builders do to.
In strict legal terms I believe the Pritzker Prize winning architect Siza, along with Souto de Moura and Balmond, whom Per claims stole his idea could sue him for libel. He has no legal claim to this "idea".
Per's defense was you can not say a text does not belong to someone because they did not invent the language. The problem Per is you are not presenting a text, you're not even presenting a language, you are presenting a few letters from the alphabet arranged differently, claiming it's a new alphabet.
Honestly it's so transparent I'm shocked that anyone is rushing to his defense. But that's just it he structures it so others see him as the victim as well and then they attack those who are questioning him.
The only way not to inflame the situation or derail the thread is to follow MADianitos' advice. I'm trying to stick to it.
Oh that's just nothing "we" seen a lot of that before , --- havn't you ?
Nowit's my time to ask ;where, and please look , what is it you see ?
But that is nothing right, you done that in bundles ,try me, show some guts instead of poison , try forget how long you's are this is not about that, but you wouldn't realise would you na, it's about bragging and if that guy are more clever than you, you just cut off the tread right, well I can show you that, and that is where you sold out and I stopped being part of your game.
Oh you americans are great academics right ? If newthinking are different and don't conform to your expertations than it don't "count", nothing new must be different than anything "we" know allready right ???? Becaurse that is what you call brave new idears and newthinking, poisoning, harassing and cheating. Great academics.
puh-lease. i know enough to know who per is. what do you mean by "suck them in?" suck me in to what? it is as Bill Murray said in Meatballs 4: "It just doesn't matter"
if you ask me all of us just need to spend more time clicking and less time typing.
And I know and feel with you ; it hurt, it hurt so much to give that credit , it is not good not good at all , it is better to show some brave academic arogance and some honest thives mind, combine crime with academics ; as this is not about discussing exiting design and new methods , no good hell no , it forst about finding some nippick detail and say "that detail is not academic" , you don't uses academic methods so your results are Nil, we better give it to one of ours , thivery work better with today's arts world that's what you think right , offcaurse you did shutting your mouth when seing all that painting.
How rude can academics be ; in the same discussion they even twist things around to find a new angle to rob it. While speaking with you they hide a knive at their back , ready to stab you if they can replace honesty with dheat --- Oh how brave an academic world and how exelent arogant someone here kind of speak to himself about the oppotunities to refine thivery --- but I know it hurt, it hurt so much it hurd to give those credits, --- then it's better vasting them and continue this new lead in arts and science. Perfected arogant robbery.
Damm how arogant , talk about a more refined way to make the robbery with the guy you want to rob ; I am pleased not to be Fine enough for you gentlemen.
And Bill is right: THAT is just the attitude we don't need. It just doesn't matter. Because all the REALLY good looking girls are still going to go out with the guys from Mohawk because they have all the money.
Sorry chinoXL63 and congrats on the competition. I'll follow the blog.
Wow !!! when did this happen ??.... Obviously I should have been checking Archinect more often that i have of late ... but great .. we have our own thread here !!
Well being part of the "construction team" .. I have to say that it's been wonderful working on the pavillion. Everyday we have a new problem... but it gets sorted out by the end of the day. It's a big challenge to build this thing, but it's great.
Per ..... where did you come back from? ... The last time I was on, you were banned !!!! you're back on now .. Oh well ....
Chino .. Congrats again ...
I have to say that it's great posting on archinect again ... It's been a while.
thanks sporadic...and thanks even more for the work on the pavilion. you guys are doing a great job, and it's fantastic to see this thing materialise. we really couldn't do it without your guys help!!
please introduce yourself next time i am on site...or at the opening on friday. or maybe i've already met you? i've tried to make it a point to meet everyone and thank them for their help, but i know i haven't met everyone.
thanks again.
by the way, steel should be there friday!! they finished off-site assembly yesterday, and everything fit PERFECT. nice. they are painting and finishing today. delivering on friday.
[C]Space Pavilion Blog launched...
You really have a unique way of avoiding answering don't you?
I just given you a link ;
http://home20.inet.tele.dk/h-3d/kineserier.jpg
http://home20.inet.tele.dk/h-3d/
And yes Steven now it happen again --- but what is it that is happening, didn't I just give a-f a link , and don't you think a-f after not reading the answer he ask even given to him, will claim that I offtrack the tread.
Think about it, the next "critic" of 3dh will be either some dirty mails in my mailbox or a-f who been answered so many times claiming I hijack the tread ; how much do that small credit cost --- nothing for those two Ted and a-f who would happily copy your book ; "you just uses the alfabet how can you copyright that, you just used the letters allready there".
... anyway, I'm so sorry for provoking this thread to go out of hand. I will also bookmark the [C]Space Pavillion page. The project is very nice and it the claims of theft from Per really upsets me.
Steven read above -- I told you ...
per don't worry. i know some people don't understand you, but i do. i know.
Thank's --- but I am sure anyone who read these treads see the same pattern, And no one are more sad about it than I, that tread after tread are invated by the same two or tree bored retired . But it is a pattern that came from the usenet, a place I know before ,was the playground for those charecters ---- as I said I also pity a charecter who become so involved in hystericly trying to harm another person , but it happened before --- and realy I am sorry for these persons becaurse posting dirty mails, or going into any tread where a particular other guy post, just to throw more dirt and then arogantly with a grin , claim that now this guy again hijacked a tread and using all the other dirty tricks, --- just the fun knowing they ,protected by a covard fake name, can reach out and harm a nice guy --- well as it happened for this guy "Jeanneret" , he ended up menatly ill , he proberly had problems before, -- but he did exactly the same thing , and only proven that there allway's are a backlash when you do those things ---- beside offcaurse I agrea, that if you are so bored and so arogantly rigid minded , that you ask the same "expalnation" 20 times , and the words you write obviously uncover, that what you are doing, is grinning spreading poison , and you think it is fun, ---- well then I pity the guy, becaurse doing so, you tell more about yourself, than the guy you harras.
It is a sick game, and yes, I seen how it backlash --- I mean nomatter what a covard you are, then being so obsessed harming a nice guy, just becaurse you can do so protected by a fake name, don't change the facts about what sort of person you are, --- and those charecters are the same ones -- that's easy to track down --- who the first few years claimed 3dh didn't work, that no one would invent such a silli system, later after the serpentine pavilion , they claimed I did not invent it ---- and if anyone havn't answered , it is them ; a small group who get their evil joy harassing some guy who stand out, the followers of the class bully, a bicycle mechanic, a retired truck driver and a retired school teacher who found this nice place to be a better place, to punish the clever guy "who think he is someone" --- I am collecting the vorse of their mails, they has to be moved with aspestos glowes , and yes they are a great source about what jeloux minds, what bored retired school teachers think about this hippie architects, and guy's who think they are someone ---- as soon as you dig further into it, say trace back the sender and find their posts on usenet, it is often in some right wing discussion group, where they retire after going here to amuse themself , --- try read some of their silli claims, you be surprised and decide than those who are not mentaly blind, can not hear, and those who can can only read their own writing and newer, even you give them links and answer polite , they turn to the same bad habbit as five years ago when they first joined some evil clown usenet hero, who found his victim.
As I said I am sad it happen again and again, but this is Hate Crimes, ---- they allway's thirst for pover, and these retired old men several times have been very exited , if they could just succes their Hatecrime , and cheat people into their dirty game ; remember it all started with this guy who happily shared a brilliant new idear, and doing just that, brought forth the dirtyist and most unplesant in a particular group of people, a group I got to know quite well, even as you proberly will emagine, people I would like to lay off their unhealty obsession ---- on the other hand, knowing what they "protect" ; robbing artists intelectural property, dirty hate campains even towerds my Legal Graffiti ,that others --- well when a professor who you know are one of the most poverfull idealists call it genuine art --- and one of those charecters ,start even throw dirty private mails, then you know that crowd, --- and this site know them aswell, know them as those who as soon as Per Corell post one mail, will post ten and then claim Per Corell "again" hijacked a tread, people who don't contribuate a tread as this with anything byt harassing Per Corell, people that post dirty mails, when you politely answer their questions for the 20' time.
And yes I guess they partly succesed to poison my life more than the average reader of the fora. --- I will let that be their joy and succes, as true, they succesed poison my life and destroy my possibility to earn my credit, but they are also promoting hatecrimes and robbing artists credits, -- nice guy's wouldn'tyou say, and what do they earn except the joy the evil joy.
per -
life is too short - if someone is sending you hate mail via archinect send the isp to paul and he should sort it out -
this is a discussion board whose mission is to debate critical issues concerning the built environment. contrary to what Steve implies: we have not highjacked the tread: the conversation is about ownership of creative ideas and specifically with the influence of sublime references - something we deal with every day.
I disagree with your position and have said so - you disagree with me - so fine. you read far to much inbetween the lines. it has nothing to do with hate crimes. we just disagree.
That's ok , --- Where the disagreament shuld origine fail my mind ; I mean what's obsessive being a skilled artist who find solutions and overly share a varaity of issues, and only become uncomford when silli questions replace openly sharing, --- You read an architect fora, but are you open for develobment, open towerds the fact that artists are all different, that a piece of design can be more than a fancy piece , that there are way deeper sources to knowleage than when the designer make chairs, the architect floor plans, the engineer complain --- denmark has a long tradision for these things , and newer was I met with same intolerance, on the opposite in this contry we don't look at the political idears with a particular skilled artist, but my impression from this site, about how people with a bit more fantasy are met, seem to be very dependant of their social skills rather than their abilities. On one side , the most dull talks about impossible art is apriciated highly, on the other hand , a masterpiece in the N.Y. subway being valued to halve a million , is washed off the wall after it has been a pleasure and apriciated for 20 or more years, --- becaurse a graffiti cleaning patrol was bored.
--------- Your own native art , art in a class of a mona lisa , just washed away , nytimes brought the story. And was it the tradisional multy color graffity no, not at all , it was a piece apriciated by so many, untill it just before it was reconised and protected becaurse of it's obvious touch with the newyorkers , was destroyed by an anti graffity gang.
------ Such things is what you notis being a dane, the thirst for dull silli words and the arogance towerds the obvious real arts.
Then about arts --- how come all complains is personal attacks, not or rather newer a genuine critic about my works ; wouldn't you say it is strange that people can read my thoughts and with poison in their mind, are capable to tell everyone , what Per Corell not is going to answer or what Per corell think ? Wouldn't a real critic about my works be more relevant, more relevant than complains about what you don't understand , --- there are much people don't understand about today's art, but look around and see if you can even reconise the genuine pieces, ask yourself it a mona lisa was washed away, becaurse dull words and projects and money art , replaced the genuine core, --- I has a right as artist, to be able to publish my works, and I has a right expecting , that the critic here in a fora trying to hold a high standard, is not made by arts haters, who instantly "critic" the art by throwing dirty mails or do all that evil they allway's wished to do , to all those modern artists they could not harm.
What I do here, what I been doing here and other places on the web, is to publish my work --- sadly peoples hate against artists then made it so, that instead of making critic towerds what I published, they --- maybe becaurse one is a retired bicycle mechanid who masqurate as architect, or is a retired building worker maybe even a carpenter who grew the normal hate towerds architects, well there are many resons, --- but in the end, and proberly becaurse I realy know more than they, they turn to personal attacks and silli questions no engineer ever would ask --- without even reconising the newthinking without even being surprised how Per Corell can turn from architecture into painting, -- and then succes so good as painter.
Maybe for you , a few of these issues count, -- the stoneage wall paintings in the caves must be destroyed as they progress graffiti ---- and indeed this acturly happened, some of our culture's early artistic works , realy have been washed away by arogant graffiti haters who will newer reconise if something simular to a modern mona lisa was just in front their face. And belive me, I newer wished anything else than being able as artist, to publish my work ; now what offending act do you realy see in that, and my defending myself against a raging crowd of bored retired school teachers and retired wood workers, what can be wrong in that, --- if you want art ,then you can not cencur , that only enforce the real artists you shuld know that, but please remember "who" allway's hated art, remember why and try being a bit more tolerant towerds people who in fact is only sharing a happy messeage.
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/2379/sta60034editedzc8.jpg
http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/8165/sta60155fy6.jpg
i don't know Per, maybe it has something to do with your way of resorting to insults when you don't know how to answer questions?
Answers about what,
I just given you a link ;
http://home20.inet.tele.dk/h-3d/kineserier.jpg
http://home20.inet.tele.dk/h-3d/
I answered any question unless offcaurse those questions was obviously not about my works, but mabye that is just the issue, --- no one else than you ,claim I don't answer "those questions" , and the last 20 times you claimed I don't "answer those questions" , maybe even the past 30 times you in one or two lines , claimed I don't answer those questions, -- you happily failed to tell what questions you talk about.
I answered "questions" about 3dh by adding easy to read graphics, --- in your case I often replied with a picture of the Manzard house --- every time I asked you, what is realy "wrong" with that structure, You newer answered.
I think it is not just absurd but also extreemly rude to cover behind a fake name and strike out , to harm some nice guy, and isn't it strange, that it is only you who claim I newer answer --- if I don't ever answer how can you keep on talking ; isn't the fact that I answer allright, but I don't answer to your screwed up picture of me, or is it infact your screwed up picture of me, -- I mean all the strange things you been saying about me, even reading my mind and grinning about what you emagine I "think". --- ain't that just a bore and what's the basic for your obsession, can you ever say something nice about anyone ; I just wonder.
I've followed this "tread" with some interest and wonder; where is the science to 'prove' your so called method works? I mean whenever a 'new' idea comes about a few things are deployed - along with your so-called 'fancy graphics' - mathematical equations, the physics involved, scale models, historical precedent, and some sort testing of the 'hypothesis', yet nothing but 'fancy graphics' are ever produced by this phantom pathologically insane person. How is it we get lulled into these debates. The questions are never answered, and when asked they are often deemed irrelevant. The software or program doesn't exist, we can't buy it, you can't see it - beyond the 3d image produce by god knows what program.
Produce the science, produce the math, produce someone with a doctorate in advanced structures, and moreover produce a real, tangible building that someone has not died in, and has enjoyed their life experience habitating said space.
What you forget, and I put that politely, because I don't think beyond your imagination of how structure = architecture you can comprehend that architecture is more than a structural frame - something Calatrava seems to miss as well. Perhaps you should contact Santiago, and you might get some validation, but until you produce the above; you and your methods are no more important than "The Simpsons" are to the American political system.
JAL
Don't do it Kevorkian... can't you see it's pointless?
These are very difficult questions to answer in fact -- but what I read is, that you don't know how a CAD program work, so becaurse you don't know that "the math." is allready there in the CAD program , then you see past anything you can read here ;
http://home20.inet.tele.dk/h-3d/
If things don't conform to your expertations --- then you will not allow it, you see past the fact that here are the first real structural system, that allow the build in Math. of the CAD program to generate a buildable structure, you don't even know if it is and yet you claim it is not ; where are the logics in that ?
In fact I think I would say no to your A-f and Ted's respect, I know your agenda and your screwed picture of art , architecture, and fine arts --- in fact I am refusing your points of view, your whole attitude towerds newthinking and creativity, I don't want your allowance your respect or anything from you.
And there it is, confirmed by the creator, it's the little 10101011100's that justify this 'work'. Math, science and doctoral dissertations or tested hypothesis are not required.
Thank you Per, thank you very much.
fine
per's program isn't about structural mechanics, it is about the spatial mechanics of creating a honeycomb system for which the structural mechanics already work, more or less, due to it's redundancy. shipbuilders work the same way. per is a boatbuilder. no one can figure this out, which says a lot about the structural know-how of architects. it is based on a rule-of-thumb for boat building that lies more in the form of the structure than the depth of its members. all per's program does is calculate these shapes. that's all it needs to do.
O RLY? I think that is quite clear to everybody. Didn't you follow the 3DH competition thread? The problem is that Per claims anybody who is doing anything vaguely similar to a egg-crate / 3DH / whatever structure is ripping him off.
no, i don't follow these 3d h threads. why you are people are so obsessed with per's accusations simply baffles me. it is the most entertaining thing about archinect. also, there are several posts above questioning why per's system works. i just explained it for those people.
le bossman, the issue really isn't about whether or not it works, it's about someone claiming ownership of something that inherently exists in nature. My attempt here is to dispell this notion that he somehow invented something, he clearly hasn't, even you recognize that fact. Modelling a honeycomb structure in some 3d program does not make him an owner or creator. In order to claim or lay claim to a new method for building, it requires more than just 3d modelling, it requires testing of methods and proving it does what he says. Until he relents and proves this works and is a model of efficiency, that he and he claims is fact, this "method" will be a residue on the edges of cyberspace.
i always felt that per was trying to claim ownership of the program itself, and this is what was stolen from him. even per, as a boat builder, knows that he didn't invent the honeycomb structure itself. shipbuilders have been using this proven method for decades.
What program? No one has ever seen a program. Clearly, above he is stating, and has stated several times on several different threads, that people stole his methods.
If this is lisp routine, a script, or some other software, then if it can be proven that those elements have been utilized, then we are in agreement, but he never states that bossman, never. In fact he can't.
Thank's realy I am just obsessed by the sheer oppotunities, that computers now realy are used best, case 3dh become realised, it will be a whole different future. My ownership are to read the wishes, spoken or non spoken , the expertations of various designers and well known architects to prosper, to extract this new architecture, we cirtainly could profit from, I am not going to defend my rights from the glimpse of suddenly realising the real brick wall, -- the very basics of what I was doing my calculations on so to say , as how stupid isn't a lot of frame structures where instead of transvrcing the forces right into the strongest vector by realising the build structure in a different way , and gosh, now we only need two planes, to build litteraly anything, --- no one thought about that before.
They was high climing fighting some stupid polymesh entity, while I was filtering the points out , for matrix calculations or transformations, got a buntle of juicy AutoLisp programs for all sorts of things , for me the ownership mean nothing, if just the world started to realise the true matter of the new things.
A lot of what is said against 3dh, is realy quite irelevant, still what I can't understand is how everyone lost direction -- 3dh is not about my ownership, but it is a serious result of many years of work, I don't talk about promoting or the past many years, the years I spended with old projectors and fact is, that this 3dh thing was newer ment as a source of conspiraty if I can push the world with 3dh what would the credit mean, still your resons not to allow me, what artists been allowed since de vinci and rock and roll , this new perspective will rock everything, and realy, it is not that a bad thing, that things get cheaper to build and stronger by structure, I paint, I left this 3dh things years ago beside, most things said sort of against 3dh must be totaly irelevant, what effect on a method do it have, what we think per corell think.
Everything being stated about what I think are serious silli, why shuld I think even, when projecting images.
You know, even with this pavilion thing, what will be right, will be a full blown 3dh , some various anchor fittings, fittings made to install a particular strength even that can be done so neat, holes fittet with round steel rods, just a suggestion, and realy, 3dh most way's need hardly any structural anchors, the floors walls and other paneling will alone deliver the strength .
3dh are made for any form , but not only round forms just becaurse it is the best for just that, boxes work fine with 3dh, but there you also can model with just the requirements you want it's just still a fact, that 3dh also make great boxes, offcaurse delivery of something better than 3dh would aprove, still my experience is, that complicated things ,can be to complicated. 3dh is strait out, it is so simple that it is almost silli and maybe, but only maybe a small fraction of the possible structures, will need structural anchors , yet was that a bad thing ?
when you make a box with 3dh, do you do it as one solid piece, or make the walls out of 3dh panels and assemble them together, and then engineer the joints?
besides, maybe per did invent the method. either that or he's insane. either way, he can't be wrong. he is probably some kind of surrealist. i trust his word as a dane: Per Corell invented 3dh, in some form or another, even in parallel to other people, or after they did without knowing about it. what new methods have anyone else come up with?
When I make a box I make another a bit smaller, that I subtract the first bos to get walls, their thickess refpect in the resulting structture thickness, the framework surface when two 90 deg. to eachother planes independant of the tradisional 3 but thereby also offcaurse within, the displacement of the tree tradisional ones.
Generating an array of offsets sections expanding these into solids the thickness of the material projected within, still the important issue is how this framework interact and deliver, way further than what we deserved.
i see. it is a solid subtraction operation. i can see the structural advantages of this but as a builder i'd rather make separate elements and connect them, but obviously it is difficult to moment joint wood. it would also be difficult though to cut out the entire section of a building in one piece, even for a small one.
... not to mention assembling two unbroken cross-sections... physically and topologically impossible.
a-f, this is a serious discussion about the possibilities of 3d-h, not about ruining some nice guy who's just proposing a new method. sure, per is a little eccentric, but like kramer said, "most geniuses are"
"it would also be difficult though to cut out the entire section of a building in one piece, even for a small one."
Not at all and that's where this method surprises you, huge frames as I prefere call the individual sections , is sheet materials, for that there allready are a number of way's to assemble a lot of smaller pieces into one, remember the computer hold the intire frame, all the frames in exact one to one measures, but fact is that 3dh ask shorter span in fact shorter than you think ,but all those issues are trivial, you can even cut the sheet lengthen assembly into the frame itself while the nc cutter cut's it shape, it also prepare the ends for even a dove tail ,but please , what is it that happen when you glue two sheets together, can't you place the butt join on the middle of the other sandwich sheet , ---- maybe you then think the cutters has to have the maximum size being cut, not at all there are something called callibration that sort of move the works plane along the frame so any piece can be cut, but realy it's frames are shorter than you think think about it, it's all short frames as they don't go from top to bittom but tranverse the form from one side to the other.
The whole assembly arear on both frames by all assembly places , can be cut away, so there be a round hole where you think there are trouble sliding them together, there are now a round hole in both frames instead of the strait slot there are a circular hole, that's where you place the assembly fitting, such one shuld be easy, but there are many choices, please show a bit innovation ,and I am sure we tomorrow will have ten different way's. --- remember all "problems" you think you will face, are allready solved with today's technikes, and the structure work different than you emagine --- what about if you wanted floors at varying hight what do that cost extra in conversional construction, here it offer itself cheap, as a side effect of a different attitude towerds the structure.
Here floors and volumes within the boundries are all your design --- be sure that if you model freely, subtract solids add solids, then the structure will flow it's shape around those subtracted volumes, floors are made union a solid , if you want a wall place a solid with the measures of the wall union it with the raw model, and when you slice your sections, after finding the right world to do it -- tradisional vertical and horisontal are trivial for the method, not needed and often much more exiting a structure without following the tradisional 3 planes , as we are only making the structure itself -- the rooms can be square or round 3dh don't care, it only provide a magic gadged to generate a structure -- that structure are just one material, now we don't have 300 planks , nails, all various materials that othevise go into a structure how there are only one, and emagine what efficiency come out of using only one material to make what asked 300 before.
--- offcaurse you are not forced to do that 100 pct., guess I has to say .
okay so you are sandwiching pieces. i assume this can be done in the field, which negates the possibility of having to fit entire unbroken cross-sections together. i assume by "round hole" you mean creating a large void at the end of your tool path so the round area your tool creates (that conflicts with the piece to be inserted) goes away. do you have images of built projects?
Again, if those people with this pavilion realy wanted that pavilion and the structure was not the issue, then 3dh would be the right choice.
Easy -- emagine a smart assembly gadged and a bit creativity combining various treads of mesh , winding their own form paralell to eachother feathering the whole structure, maywe even a huge dove tail join of two different matters of 3dh in different orientation.
It allow you work with any form any scale, there it is not different than the tradisional, that can also be scaled, but it often make little sense , where here, it can mean everything. Different structures in individual scales can be locked within a rougher structure, varying angle of the section planes can make a build in structural anchor ,as if the structure try to collapse, it instantly are held and supported by build in volumes of structure , with the opposite properties.
But offcaurse , if the form are not the issue, then why chose so difficult a form , a form that will challance all other methods , all other than 3dh.
"do you have images of built projects?"
I am not an architect I am designer, and I am sure it is better to realise the "problem" here, as realy, there are many different solutions, some that allow a particular flex, so the structure plus it's floors and walls, all become intirely earthquale safe, -- by intirely I mean that the mean for the porpus, the flexible and calculated new assembly slot piece replacement unit, are thruout the intire structure, minimising critical arears. Remember 3dh is an offer, but also an offer that you can make it better.
bossman, much of this was covered in the 3dh competition thread. i know it's a lot to wade through, but there are some answers about 3dh details in there that don't usually come out in these exchanges with per in random threads.
the 3dh competition thread was actually kind of cool. i know that apurimac, liebchen, and myself were considering entering, but i think we all eventually burned out.
i thought you might have images of other products you've built. i've worked on similar egg crate structures before, with CDX plywood, MDF, and latvian birch, but i don't have the resources to explore the idea for the sake of itself. i worked on a trade show booth a few months ago that we were able to put together with no fasteners using a technique like this, which made things easier for obvious reasons. using a single MDF sheet, you can serrate it, as you know, to fit with the other pieces and powder coat each piece so it doesn't need to be touched up on site. everything fits together perfectly, and it looks like the 3d model actually.
okay then.
A very simple , I know maybe irelevant in this particular case, -- but try look to the details, it's acturly fun so easy possibilities with this 3dh just mountain;
http://home20.inet.tele.dk/h-3d/Trawler-dbl.jpg
It is a very somple frame set for a trawler hull --- but if you can realise the examples are only examples and that I am not trying to design a trawler again, --- but this is about how different things become with just a small change, these double frames are in fact very exiting , they form part a box as you see, all slots will be possible in steel and instead of frames od sheet, there will be box frames , frames that NO one would be able to detail so precicely and in this fasion ever before, seen any before, realised any of the exiting oppotunities with any system you been offered before, -- well case you say no to both and realise what else you say NO to, your reaction seem a bit inmature, but what shuld I care.
"no, i don't follow these 3d h threads. why you are people are so obsessed with per's accusations simply baffles me. it is the most entertaining thing about archinect. also, there are several posts above questioning why per's system works. i just explained it for those people."
If you don't read his threads then that is why you don't understand why people are so agitated with him. If you read them all you will see.
It's all been gone over before. He does this exact same thing he is doing with you every time. He attacks other people and derails perfectly good threads, this is how it works:
He takes advantage of the good nature of new or infrequent posters unfamiliar with him (le bossman for example) who don't realize he's trying to suck them in. Then he makes himself a victim by making delusional claims to ownership of ideas that belong to no one. Someone asks him a question about "his" system. He tells them how simple their mind is for not understanding or provides a link to a pciture as an "answer". If you're not convinced, he bashes all those who engaged him for poisoning the thread and detailing it for the original posters thread.
The few threads and people who have actually tried to help him and bring something positive and productive to 3DH (like the 3DH competition) have also been "poisoned" by him, but of course he always blames it on these “uset troll scumbag evil clown Nazis”. It’s always our fault.
Now regarding "Per's" system:
He has a very creative notion of what constitutes intellectual property. It’s also one of the more controversial areas of intellectual property in that it’s “innovation” derived from common historical knowledge.
He himself admits it's applying boat building techniques to architecture. So if you he didn't develop it, how is it his? So he uses a computer to do it, boat builders do to.
In strict legal terms I believe the Pritzker Prize winning architect Siza, along with Souto de Moura and Balmond, whom Per claims stole his idea could sue him for libel. He has no legal claim to this "idea".
Per's defense was you can not say a text does not belong to someone because they did not invent the language. The problem Per is you are not presenting a text, you're not even presenting a language, you are presenting a few letters from the alphabet arranged differently, claiming it's a new alphabet.
Honestly it's so transparent I'm shocked that anyone is rushing to his defense. But that's just it he structures it so others see him as the victim as well and then they attack those who are questioning him.
The only way not to inflame the situation or derail the thread is to follow MADianitos' advice. I'm trying to stick to it.
And this one ;
http://www.designcommunity.com/scrapbook/images/1969.jpg
Oh that's just nothing "we" seen a lot of that before , --- havn't you ?
Nowit's my time to ask ;where, and please look , what is it you see ?
But that is nothing right, you done that in bundles ,try me, show some guts instead of poison , try forget how long you's are this is not about that, but you wouldn't realise would you na, it's about bragging and if that guy are more clever than you, you just cut off the tread right, well I can show you that, and that is where you sold out and I stopped being part of your game.
Oh you americans are great academics right ? If newthinking are different and don't conform to your expertations than it don't "count", nothing new must be different than anything "we" know allready right ???? Becaurse that is what you call brave new idears and newthinking, poisoning, harassing and cheating. Great academics.
puh-lease. i know enough to know who per is. what do you mean by "suck them in?" suck me in to what? it is as Bill Murray said in Meatballs 4: "It just doesn't matter"
if you ask me all of us just need to spend more time clicking and less time typing.
And I know and feel with you ; it hurt, it hurt so much to give that credit , it is not good not good at all , it is better to show some brave academic arogance and some honest thives mind, combine crime with academics ; as this is not about discussing exiting design and new methods , no good hell no , it forst about finding some nippick detail and say "that detail is not academic" , you don't uses academic methods so your results are Nil, we better give it to one of ours , thivery work better with today's arts world that's what you think right , offcaurse you did shutting your mouth when seing all that painting.
How rude can academics be ; in the same discussion they even twist things around to find a new angle to rob it. While speaking with you they hide a knive at their back , ready to stab you if they can replace honesty with dheat --- Oh how brave an academic world and how exelent arogant someone here kind of speak to himself about the oppotunities to refine thivery --- but I know it hurt, it hurt so much it hurd to give those credits, --- then it's better vasting them and continue this new lead in arts and science. Perfected arogant robbery.
Damm how arogant , talk about a more refined way to make the robbery with the guy you want to rob ; I am pleased not to be Fine enough for you gentlemen.
le bossman
The above post is exactly what I'm talking about.
And Bill is right: THAT is just the attitude we don't need. It just doesn't matter. Because all the REALLY good looking girls are still going to go out with the guys from Mohawk because they have all the money.
Sorry chinoXL63 and congrats on the competition. I'll follow the blog.
for those interested, the pavilion is now on-site. for site photos and updates check the blog - http://cspacepavilion.blogspot.com
-a.
Wow !!! when did this happen ??.... Obviously I should have been checking Archinect more often that i have of late ... but great .. we have our own thread here !!
Well being part of the "construction team" .. I have to say that it's been wonderful working on the pavillion. Everyday we have a new problem... but it gets sorted out by the end of the day. It's a big challenge to build this thing, but it's great.
Per ..... where did you come back from? ... The last time I was on, you were banned !!!! you're back on now .. Oh well ....
Chino .. Congrats again ...
I have to say that it's great posting on archinect again ... It's been a while.
thanks sporadic...and thanks even more for the work on the pavilion. you guys are doing a great job, and it's fantastic to see this thing materialise. we really couldn't do it without your guys help!!
please introduce yourself next time i am on site...or at the opening on friday. or maybe i've already met you? i've tried to make it a point to meet everyone and thank them for their help, but i know i haven't met everyone.
thanks again.
by the way, steel should be there friday!! they finished off-site assembly yesterday, and everything fit PERFECT. nice. they are painting and finishing today. delivering on friday.
Block this user
Are you sure you want to block this user and hide all related comments throughout the site?
Archinect
This is your first comment on Archinect. Your comment will be visible once approved.