everything is going swell in the architecture department of UCLA, a little artsy in my opinion. Our first project was to do a hand drawing of our model and now were going to translate it into computer.
unfortunately I have a two year old compaq Presario v2000 and it is slow when using autocad 2008, adobe suite, etc. I think it's time for a upgrade. Any suggestions-
1. the best for the "bang of the buck"
2. the top of the line, most expensive
3. it's cheap, but it works.
i like Macs, how they look and all that stuff, but in reality I can't work well with macs. I'm still a windows user and it will probably take some time for me to convert to a mac. If only there's notebooks that look like macs...
I bought a Dell Latitude D820 6 months ago, it's been a truly reliable laptop and i haven't had a single problem with it great for architectural work, rendering, etc.
I hear it's one of the laptops that princeton suggests for its architecture students, the other one is the macbook pro.
^ when you customize the options for HP notebooks, they're quite pricey when compared on getting the dell latitude that someone had suggested earlier.
almost bottleneck specs and 300-400 less. that's quite a deal.
for macs, why would i pay $2Gs to run windows when I can buy a windows notebook.
don't get me wrong, macs are one hell of a piece of device, but a little overrated I.M.O? well i never used it first hand for architecture, can any one give out reviews for architecture use?
AutoCAD won't run natively on Mac OS, but you can use ArchiCAD or VectorWorks (both of which are free for students). I don't have much experience in either, but I plan to start learning ArchiCAD as soon as I buy a Mac next month. Adobe Creative Suite, Maya, and MS-Office all run fine on the Mac.
Yes, Macs cost more, but you're paying for a fast, stable, intuitive Unix-based operating system that's tightly integrated with the hardware. A Lexus will cost more than a Ford; you get what you pay for.
Speaking of hardware, Apple's is #1 in relaibility. Dell, the McDonald's of PC makers, is dead-last.
I got a HP dual processor with a 17" screen for $500 on ubid. It's great. I'm so out of the loop though I didn't realize Vista is the standard, I had to pay my I.T. guy to rig it for XP so I could run all of my bootleg software. Since it was built for Vista, XP cooks on it.
I still think Macs are overrated in terms of quality.
My family has been a Mac family for about 12 years. Yea, remember when they were a small company before iPods hit it big and put them back on the map? I remember having my friends come over when I was in junior high and listen to them make fun of our computer because it was 'weird looking.'
In the past 12 years, we've gone through 2 desktops and four laptops. My sisters are graphic designers and fashion designers, hence our need for the latest and greatest in technology. Three laptops have all crashed and died and one of our desktops crashed (but did not die after we forked over about a few hundred for them to recover the system). Our desktop was old so it's more understandable. The laptops, all three purchased within the past 5 years, crashed within 2.5 years of purchase. I've had two iPods die and my old iSight would work intermittently. Their products are extremely overpriced. Extremely. Too bad their products are too sexy and keep me coming back for more.
Living in Gin, while they are a good company and produce good computers, don't expect them to be your computer Savior. They still are quirky and moody little organisms.
I bought a Dell in college 6 years ago for AutoCAD. While not nearly as sexy, the computer still works like a charm.
my 2003 toshiba satellite (the blue one that looks like the dashboard of some 50s car) is still awesome. got me through the grad program and is still my computer of choice on a day to day basis.
my newer desktop, not so much. my newer dell, not so much.
Dell Precision line. I've got the M90 (17") and it's amazing with Max, etc. Best looking PC I've seen, with the exception of a few Sony's (which seem to get horrible reviews)
I'd suggest looking at smaller ones for school.
I needed the next day warranty and reliability of Dell, otherwise I'd have looked at the Apples.
Tumbles: if that were true none of the other PC makers would be in business.
Really there are only 3-4 companies that actually make laptops. Quanta makes laptops for dell, acer, apple, hp, asus, and others using the same assembly lines pulling from mostly the same bins of internal parts.
And LIG, that rescuecomm survey is very flawed - they factored US market share with the percentage of service calls to one chain repair outlet. They did not factor in the highly likely possibility that apple customers are more likely to go back to apple itself rather than a third party repair outlet, which would skew the numbers.
the arch department at PSU requires that all arch majors buy a Macbook Pro at the beginning of second year, so i've been using this laptop for a year and a half now. I hadn't used macs before buying my laptop, and i kind of shunned them for being weird looking in highschool too. But it was love at first sight when i bought the Macbook, i had no trouble at all adjusting to it, they are unbelievably simple to use. it's a beautiful machine, everything has run flawlessly from day one and no one in my year has had even the slightest problem with their mac ( about 50 of us), so i would highly HIGHLY recommend getting the Mac, it's uneblievably fast, even compared to my friends high-end desktop, plus if you're a student you're going to be carrying the thing everywhere, and it weighs less than my textbooks. There really is no comparison between a Mac and a PC, i still use Pc's alot in the computer labs for CAD or 3ds, but i dread using them, i feel like i'm stepping back in time when i log onto a pc (maybe thats a little harsh, but i do avoid using pc's whenever possible). hope this helps in your decision.
"score of 88 beats Gateway's E-265M by a single point"
aside from being nowhere even remotely near twice as fast, and well within the margin of error for just about any software test, if you look at their comparison chart, they're not even comparing equivalent components.
I like the macbook pro, I might get one for my next laptop, but you have to look through the marketing and hype when it comes to apple.
seems to me that the uni should supply the same notebook to each student and thereby receive a lower price and in the spirit of a level playing field each student would have the same machine to use. just as you receive the same beat to hell desk and metal stool.
I really like the performance and appearance of Macs...but I am curious as to if you negate the usefulness of the Mac and its OS, if you have to run Windows for drafting and modeling programs...does anyone know if running Windows will hurt performance while trying to use these programs?
There's two ways to run Windows on a Mac, through Boot Camp and through a virtualization application such as Parallels or VMware Fusion.
Boot Camp comes included with the newest version of Mac OS X (which goes on sale at 6:00 tonight), and allows you to create a Windows partition on your hard drive and install XP or Vista on your Mac. You reboot directly into either Mac OS or Windows, and while you're running Windows, your Mac runs no differently than any other PC. Since you're only running one operating system, all your computer's resources are available to you. In fact, many people have reported that Windows runs much faster and is far more stable on their Mac than it ever was on their PC's, probably because all the hardware is so tightly integrated.
Using Parallels or VMware Fusion, you can run Windows alongside Mac OS X, and even have your Windows applications appear directly on the Mac desktop, minimized to the dock, etc. It's more convenient than rebooting, but since you're running two operating systems at once, you take a slight performance hit. Judging by the feedback I've read so far, VMware Fusion seems a bit faster and more stable than Parallels.
Also, with the newest releases of Parallels and Fusion, it's now possible to have the best of both worlds by installing Windows via Boot Camp, and also using that same Boot Camp partition to run Windows in either Parallels or Fusion. So you can boot into Windows via Boot Camp to run something resource-intensive such as complex modeling or rendering in 3D Studio MAX, or go into Windows via Parallels or Fusion if you need to do something like a quick AutoCAD sketch.
With any of the above options, you still need to purchase a copy of Windows separately. I'd recommend Windows XP Pro, as I have yet to hear a single good thing about Vista. I'm not sure about Parallels, but VMware Fusion will also allow you run Linux on your Mac, if you feel inclined to do so. So it could be like having three or more computers inside one box.
Apple went through a dismal period in the 1990's when they were stuck using dead-end technology to make computers that nobody wanted to buy, and I think they still suffer from a lot of negative stereotypes that date back to that period. Yes, they now have a very slick marketing department (as do Dell and Microsoft), but I think they're finally in a position where, for most people, their products actually do live up to the hype.
I agree. I've only used Vista on a few machines, but XP is a billion times better.
If MS doesn't do something, they are going to take a big hit when XP is no longer available.
'couse, with something like $170mil in the first weekend of the new Halo, they aren't hurting for cash.
I am keeping an eye on Apple. With MS f'in' up and Apple doing everythign right, it could be very soon that things start shifting (even the editor of PC Mag said he'd switch to Linux if MS didn't get Vista running well).
vista will get there, it'll just take another year or two. XP was terrible until a little after SP1 came out.
What I'm worried about is that driver compatibility will force me to switch before it's fully ready (new hardware that'll only work, or work better, on vista, while there are still big problems in other areas)
1. dell inspiron. for all everyone may say about dell laptops this is (at least has been) the most for your money. you can save about $1000 on a comparably equipped macbook pro (identical video card, same amount of memory, etc.. .)
2. the macbook pro is not the top of line notebook for 3d modelling/cad applications. people who love mac - value the stability of the operating system, interface, stylishness etc.. , over it's ability to crunch serious modeling polygons. the best vido card the macbook pro offers is identical to what is offered w/ the dell inspiron. the best notebook ideal for modeling and cad will come in the form of a mobile workstation like the dell m90 or similar. these systems are bulky, heavy, and not pretty - but if it's the work power that you're after...that's the way to go.
the debate about mac vs pc could go either way depending on personal preference until you get into the capacity of a workstation class pc. video card options, and hard drive capacity alone put those units at a higher level than a macbook pro. of course there are other things that one might value such as style, weight, ect.. , but a macbook pro could never keep pace (talking specifically about 3d/cad) w/ a fully loaded dell m90.
I wouldn't use a Mac Mini for anything architecture-related. It's fine for basic household stuff like email and web-surfing, but I doubt it could handle anything remotely as intensive as most architectural applications.
I was really hesitant to get a cordless mouse...until i used a Mx1000. The battery is annoying and I wish it was corded but it's a very comfortable and highly precise mouse. I've actually been looking to pick up a second one on the cheap to take into work. The ability to switch between click-scroll and smooth scroll is great for zoom functions in some 3D work, and when marking up long PDFs.
there is another company that makes high speed computers that fit into the size of mac minis (however they are pc based). Stunning and green, I always thought that would be a good little device to have sitting on my desk
FYI, Intel should be rolling out a new line of mobile chips in January that are much faster and cooler-running than the Core 2 Duos currently used in the MacBook Pros. There's a lot of speculation that Apple may update the MacBook Pro line at the same time. If you're considering a MacBook Pro, it might be worth waiting to see what they come out with in a couple months.
The Best Notebook for architecture students
everything is going swell in the architecture department of UCLA, a little artsy in my opinion. Our first project was to do a hand drawing of our model and now were going to translate it into computer.
unfortunately I have a two year old compaq Presario v2000 and it is slow when using autocad 2008, adobe suite, etc. I think it's time for a upgrade. Any suggestions-
1. the best for the "bang of the buck"
2. the top of the line, most expensive
3. it's cheap, but it works.
^He did say best NOTEBOOK in the tread tittle...
if you go for this deal, apple will hook you up with free shipping
iF YOU WANT A DECENT COMPUTER FOR YOUR BUCK, tHAT CAN HANDLE THE WORK LOAD
HP....GOOD PRICE..NICE SYSTEM
HP DV9500
I am using mine nonstop for Rhino, and Sketchup....Love it..
it works great...
the HP looks good.
i like Macs, how they look and all that stuff, but in reality I can't work well with macs. I'm still a windows user and it will probably take some time for me to convert to a mac. If only there's notebooks that look like macs...
once you go Tablet you never go back
Mac running OS X =
PC running Windows Vista =
I bought a Dell Latitude D820 6 months ago, it's been a truly reliable laptop and i haven't had a single problem with it great for architectural work, rendering, etc.
I hear it's one of the laptops that princeton suggests for its architecture students, the other one is the macbook pro.
hey LIG, my answer to your post is 'WHAT ?'
if your tight on budget, go for an HP. they're worth it because you can customize them really well. Mac Books are amazing,but $$$
^ when you customize the options for HP notebooks, they're quite pricey when compared on getting the dell latitude that someone had suggested earlier.
almost bottleneck specs and 300-400 less. that's quite a deal.
for macs, why would i pay $2Gs to run windows when I can buy a windows notebook.
don't get me wrong, macs are one hell of a piece of device, but a little overrated I.M.O? well i never used it first hand for architecture, can any one give out reviews for architecture use?
TabletPC
AutoCAD won't run natively on Mac OS, but you can use ArchiCAD or VectorWorks (both of which are free for students). I don't have much experience in either, but I plan to start learning ArchiCAD as soon as I buy a Mac next month. Adobe Creative Suite, Maya, and MS-Office all run fine on the Mac.
Yes, Macs cost more, but you're paying for a fast, stable, intuitive Unix-based operating system that's tightly integrated with the hardware. A Lexus will cost more than a Ford; you get what you pay for.
Speaking of hardware, Apple's is #1 in relaibility. Dell, the McDonald's of PC makers, is dead-last.
I got a HP dual processor with a 17" screen for $500 on ubid. It's great. I'm so out of the loop though I didn't realize Vista is the standard, I had to pay my I.T. guy to rig it for XP so I could run all of my bootleg software. Since it was built for Vista, XP cooks on it.
I still think Macs are overrated in terms of quality.
My family has been a Mac family for about 12 years. Yea, remember when they were a small company before iPods hit it big and put them back on the map? I remember having my friends come over when I was in junior high and listen to them make fun of our computer because it was 'weird looking.'
In the past 12 years, we've gone through 2 desktops and four laptops. My sisters are graphic designers and fashion designers, hence our need for the latest and greatest in technology. Three laptops have all crashed and died and one of our desktops crashed (but did not die after we forked over about a few hundred for them to recover the system). Our desktop was old so it's more understandable. The laptops, all three purchased within the past 5 years, crashed within 2.5 years of purchase. I've had two iPods die and my old iSight would work intermittently. Their products are extremely overpriced. Extremely. Too bad their products are too sexy and keep me coming back for more.
Living in Gin, while they are a good company and produce good computers, don't expect them to be your computer Savior. They still are quirky and moody little organisms.
I bought a Dell in college 6 years ago for AutoCAD. While not nearly as sexy, the computer still works like a charm.
my 2003 toshiba satellite (the blue one that looks like the dashboard of some 50s car) is still awesome. got me through the grad program and is still my computer of choice on a day to day basis.
my newer desktop, not so much. my newer dell, not so much.
Dell Precision line. I've got the M90 (17") and it's amazing with Max, etc. Best looking PC I've seen, with the exception of a few Sony's (which seem to get horrible reviews)
I'd suggest looking at smaller ones for school.
I needed the next day warranty and reliability of Dell, otherwise I'd have looked at the Apples.
Tumbles: if that were true none of the other PC makers would be in business.
Really there are only 3-4 companies that actually make laptops. Quanta makes laptops for dell, acer, apple, hp, asus, and others using the same assembly lines pulling from mostly the same bins of internal parts.
And LIG, that rescuecomm survey is very flawed - they factored US market share with the percentage of service calls to one chain repair outlet. They did not factor in the highly likely possibility that apple customers are more likely to go back to apple itself rather than a third party repair outlet, which would skew the numbers.
PC World: Fastest Windows notebook: The Macbook Pro
the arch department at PSU requires that all arch majors buy a Macbook Pro at the beginning of second year, so i've been using this laptop for a year and a half now. I hadn't used macs before buying my laptop, and i kind of shunned them for being weird looking in highschool too. But it was love at first sight when i bought the Macbook, i had no trouble at all adjusting to it, they are unbelievably simple to use. it's a beautiful machine, everything has run flawlessly from day one and no one in my year has had even the slightest problem with their mac ( about 50 of us), so i would highly HIGHLY recommend getting the Mac, it's uneblievably fast, even compared to my friends high-end desktop, plus if you're a student you're going to be carrying the thing everywhere, and it weighs less than my textbooks. There really is no comparison between a Mac and a PC, i still use Pc's alot in the computer labs for CAD or 3ds, but i dread using them, i feel like i'm stepping back in time when i log onto a pc (maybe thats a little harsh, but i do avoid using pc's whenever possible). hope this helps in your decision.
"score of 88 beats Gateway's E-265M by a single point"
aside from being nowhere even remotely near twice as fast, and well within the margin of error for just about any software test, if you look at their comparison chart, they're not even comparing equivalent components.
I like the macbook pro, I might get one for my next laptop, but you have to look through the marketing and hype when it comes to apple.
seems to me that the uni should supply the same notebook to each student and thereby receive a lower price and in the spirit of a level playing field each student would have the same machine to use. just as you receive the same beat to hell desk and metal stool.
I really like the performance and appearance of Macs...but I am curious as to if you negate the usefulness of the Mac and its OS, if you have to run Windows for drafting and modeling programs...does anyone know if running Windows will hurt performance while trying to use these programs?
I heard you can run windows and the mac OS simultaneously without rebooting.
I don't know if it's just me, but the macs are just all hype to me. But then again, many users here have given a good input on how they perform.
a dell seems intriguing which I'm looking into right now. and a mac. and a hp.
There's two ways to run Windows on a Mac, through Boot Camp and through a virtualization application such as Parallels or VMware Fusion.
Boot Camp comes included with the newest version of Mac OS X (which goes on sale at 6:00 tonight), and allows you to create a Windows partition on your hard drive and install XP or Vista on your Mac. You reboot directly into either Mac OS or Windows, and while you're running Windows, your Mac runs no differently than any other PC. Since you're only running one operating system, all your computer's resources are available to you. In fact, many people have reported that Windows runs much faster and is far more stable on their Mac than it ever was on their PC's, probably because all the hardware is so tightly integrated.
Using Parallels or VMware Fusion, you can run Windows alongside Mac OS X, and even have your Windows applications appear directly on the Mac desktop, minimized to the dock, etc. It's more convenient than rebooting, but since you're running two operating systems at once, you take a slight performance hit. Judging by the feedback I've read so far, VMware Fusion seems a bit faster and more stable than Parallels.
Also, with the newest releases of Parallels and Fusion, it's now possible to have the best of both worlds by installing Windows via Boot Camp, and also using that same Boot Camp partition to run Windows in either Parallels or Fusion. So you can boot into Windows via Boot Camp to run something resource-intensive such as complex modeling or rendering in 3D Studio MAX, or go into Windows via Parallels or Fusion if you need to do something like a quick AutoCAD sketch.
With any of the above options, you still need to purchase a copy of Windows separately. I'd recommend Windows XP Pro, as I have yet to hear a single good thing about Vista. I'm not sure about Parallels, but VMware Fusion will also allow you run Linux on your Mac, if you feel inclined to do so. So it could be like having three or more computers inside one box.
Apple went through a dismal period in the 1990's when they were stuck using dead-end technology to make computers that nobody wanted to buy, and I think they still suffer from a lot of negative stereotypes that date back to that period. Yes, they now have a very slick marketing department (as do Dell and Microsoft), but I think they're finally in a position where, for most people, their products actually do live up to the hype.
I agree. I've only used Vista on a few machines, but XP is a billion times better.
If MS doesn't do something, they are going to take a big hit when XP is no longer available.
'couse, with something like $170mil in the first weekend of the new Halo, they aren't hurting for cash.
I am keeping an eye on Apple. With MS f'in' up and Apple doing everythign right, it could be very soon that things start shifting (even the editor of PC Mag said he'd switch to Linux if MS didn't get Vista running well).
vista will get there, it'll just take another year or two. XP was terrible until a little after SP1 came out.
What I'm worried about is that driver compatibility will force me to switch before it's fully ready (new hardware that'll only work, or work better, on vista, while there are still big problems in other areas)
1. dell inspiron. for all everyone may say about dell laptops this is (at least has been) the most for your money. you can save about $1000 on a comparably equipped macbook pro (identical video card, same amount of memory, etc.. .)
2. the macbook pro is not the top of line notebook for 3d modelling/cad applications. people who love mac - value the stability of the operating system, interface, stylishness etc.. , over it's ability to crunch serious modeling polygons. the best vido card the macbook pro offers is identical to what is offered w/ the dell inspiron. the best notebook ideal for modeling and cad will come in the form of a mobile workstation like the dell m90 or similar. these systems are bulky, heavy, and not pretty - but if it's the work power that you're after...that's the way to go.
the debate about mac vs pc could go either way depending on personal preference until you get into the capacity of a workstation class pc. video card options, and hard drive capacity alone put those units at a higher level than a macbook pro. of course there are other things that one might value such as style, weight, ect.. , but a macbook pro could never keep pace (talking specifically about 3d/cad) w/ a fully loaded dell m90.
Yea, a lot of decisions.
btw,
what is everyone set up?
do you guys have a preferable mouse when designing?
such as comfortability, button functions, etc.?
i want a new mouse, preferable wired mouse. I dont like using batteries.
and continue with notebook talk as well.
Right now its between a mac, or a mac mini?, shuttle pc, dell, and hp
I wouldn't use a Mac Mini for anything architecture-related. It's fine for basic household stuff like email and web-surfing, but I doubt it could handle anything remotely as intensive as most architectural applications.
macbook pros overheat and they are over priced, but if you value asthetics over everything else they are worth the buy.
on mice -
I was really hesitant to get a cordless mouse...until i used a Mx1000. The battery is annoying and I wish it was corded but it's a very comfortable and highly precise mouse. I've actually been looking to pick up a second one on the cheap to take into work. The ability to switch between click-scroll and smooth scroll is great for zoom functions in some 3D work, and when marking up long PDFs.
there is another company that makes high speed computers that fit into the size of mac minis (however they are pc based). Stunning and green, I always thought that would be a good little device to have sitting on my desk
FYI, Intel should be rolling out a new line of mobile chips in January that are much faster and cooler-running than the Core 2 Duos currently used in the MacBook Pros. There's a lot of speculation that Apple may update the MacBook Pro line at the same time. If you're considering a MacBook Pro, it might be worth waiting to see what they come out with in a couple months.
hey lig, thanks for your 2cents. found it v. helpful ^^
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