I've been out of my undergraduate program for 2+ years now. I never really 'connected' with any professors and haven't kept in touch with any of them. I'm pretty sure I could evince a recommendation from one or two if I asked them, but after looking at the actual recommendation forms that graduate schools desire, I'm reluctant to.
Basically, the people I work with could provide way more compelling (and accurate) judgments of my potential, then a professor who probably hardly remembers me.
Will submitting recommendations from 3 colleagues/bosses be a red flag to people reviewing my app? Just curious.
I'm on the same boat as you. Never really connected with most of my profs. The one's I did, taught studios early on during my undergrad. They probably don't even remember my work anymore.
I don't think it would matter a whole big deal if you submit recommendations from bosses only, as long as they aren't peers at a similar level but principals or someone higher up. Fact is, most, if not a lot of them, are involved in academia and mentoring one way or the other.
Like you say, people at work could provide way more compelling and accurate judgments of your potential. Let's face it, many of us aren't proud or entirely pleased with some of the work we've done during school. It is not after the deadline is over or years after, that we truly learn or understand how we'd have done the project differently and why. Often times, during school, it felt like I was doing many things just because a crit recommended it or just to please one of the profs, without actually understanding why or how to arrive at it.
A mix of recommenders / referees is usually desirable: instructors, employers, and the Pritzker winner who went to high school with your parents.
If I was on an admissions committee, I'd look for good letters from whichever source. (Key criteria = how long they've known you, in what capacity, and how much of your work and ethos they personally have knowledge of.)
That said, I'd be skeptical of an applicant only two years out of school who couldn't cough up a decent letter from a single instructor. For me, it's a bit of a red flag that wouldn't concern me if you'd been out for 5 years or more. Now, this doesn't mean you're not good or qualified; but it may suggest something (true or not) about personality or level of engagement when compared to other applicants with a range of recommenders.
The lesson here, if you want strong letters, is to sort of latch on to the one or two instructors you do connect with, and stay in touch with them even after their class is done. Drop in at their office, talk about your work, ask about theirs, email them an interesting article and say "I thought of your class when I read this. What do you think?" Ask them for advice; they'll offer it.
The rec letters I write for students who've stayed in touch over the last 1-3 years are far stronger and more enthusiastic than the short, perfunctory ones I have to write describing fair or even good work by someone I knew briefly back then but haven't heard from since. I don't know them; the one's who stay in touch, I do know. It's that simple.
Don't forget part 2 of the lesson: stay involved with at least a couple of your favorite faculty once you get in. Not only for the camaraderie and networking, but you never know when you'll need a good recommendation.
they should let every undergrad know during their first undergrad semester that recommendation letters will be required for grad school applications ><
I agree with citizen - while I wouldn't look askance at an applicant with no faculty references who'd graduated 5+ years ago, it does send up a teeny little red flag in the case of someone who finished undergrad fairly recently. While getting stellar (and highly personalized, current) letters from your employers and supervisors is great, they may not be able to speak to your academic potential and strengths the way that a former professor could since that just isn't the relationship they've had with you.
I wasn't quite in your situation when I was applying to grad school - I could pretty easily think of one or two faculty who I thought I'd connected with in undergrad - however, I certainly had NOT kept in touch with any of them in the intervening two years and felt like a tool emailing them out of the blue and saying, 'hey, long time no see, do me a favor??' However, when I swallowed that embarrassment and just did it, I was surprised at how well they still remembered my work (and not because it was so incredibly exceptional) and how willing they were to help. One professor, who I'd only taken one seminar with and was nervous to contact, actually asked me to send him my in-process portfolio and essays so that he could better tailor his recommendation to my application.
You certainly know your experiences with faculty best, but if you can, I recommend soliciting one of your letters from a former professor you liked (and who seemed to like you). Send them a note telling them what you've been up to for the last few years, what you're working on, why you want to go to grad school, and throw in a few pieces of recent work they haven't seen, and you might be surprised how interested they are in helping and how impressed they are at your progress.
(And all the above advice about staying in touch is spot-on, even after you've gotten every letter you think you're going to need. Say thank you, send an email every so often - every time you complete a project, show them, get published, send a link, etc. - and drop by their office just to say hi anytime you're in the neighborhood. These are the people who put together short lists, jury competitions, and hire faculty.)
I'm in the same boat. It really surprises me when people casually mention that you need a letter from the Dean or head of your undergrad department. Let's be honest, how many of us REALLY were on a first-name "buddy" basis with our teachers? Especially with the size of most of my undergraduate classes, even though I went to office hours, participated in class, and sent "thank you" emails to professors at the end of the semester, I was still just another student in a sea of hundreds. Most of us were. I can't exactly pop up into their lives again and ask for a recommendation 5 years later. It just isn't realistic.
That's what I think too, accesskb. It is only one portion of your application, it's the larger picture that counts. If the other areas of your application are solid, then not having letters from professors isn't going to make you look like some kind of slacker slob.
Oct 14, 12 5:12 pm ·
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Red flag if recommendations don't come from profs?
I've been out of my undergraduate program for 2+ years now. I never really 'connected' with any professors and haven't kept in touch with any of them. I'm pretty sure I could evince a recommendation from one or two if I asked them, but after looking at the actual recommendation forms that graduate schools desire, I'm reluctant to.
Basically, the people I work with could provide way more compelling (and accurate) judgments of my potential, then a professor who probably hardly remembers me.
Will submitting recommendations from 3 colleagues/bosses be a red flag to people reviewing my app? Just curious.
I'm on the same boat as you. Never really connected with most of my profs. The one's I did, taught studios early on during my undergrad. They probably don't even remember my work anymore.
I don't think it would matter a whole big deal if you submit recommendations from bosses only, as long as they aren't peers at a similar level but principals or someone higher up. Fact is, most, if not a lot of them, are involved in academia and mentoring one way or the other.
Like you say, people at work could provide way more compelling and accurate judgments of your potential. Let's face it, many of us aren't proud or entirely pleased with some of the work we've done during school. It is not after the deadline is over or years after, that we truly learn or understand how we'd have done the project differently and why. Often times, during school, it felt like I was doing many things just because a crit recommended it or just to please one of the profs, without actually understanding why or how to arrive at it.
good luck.
A mix of recommenders / referees is usually desirable: instructors, employers, and the Pritzker winner who went to high school with your parents.
If I was on an admissions committee, I'd look for good letters from whichever source. (Key criteria = how long they've known you, in what capacity, and how much of your work and ethos they personally have knowledge of.)
That said, I'd be skeptical of an applicant only two years out of school who couldn't cough up a decent letter from a single instructor. For me, it's a bit of a red flag that wouldn't concern me if you'd been out for 5 years or more. Now, this doesn't mean you're not good or qualified; but it may suggest something (true or not) about personality or level of engagement when compared to other applicants with a range of recommenders.
Addendum to my post above:
The lesson here, if you want strong letters, is to sort of latch on to the one or two instructors you do connect with, and stay in touch with them even after their class is done. Drop in at their office, talk about your work, ask about theirs, email them an interesting article and say "I thought of your class when I read this. What do you think?" Ask them for advice; they'll offer it.
The rec letters I write for students who've stayed in touch over the last 1-3 years are far stronger and more enthusiastic than the short, perfunctory ones I have to write describing fair or even good work by someone I knew briefly back then but haven't heard from since. I don't know them; the one's who stay in touch, I do know. It's that simple.
Yea, I hear you, citizen. My choice is between the genuine professional letter or the perfunctory academic one. Probably going to choose the former.
Don't forget part 2 of the lesson: stay involved with at least a couple of your favorite faculty once you get in. Not only for the camaraderie and networking, but you never know when you'll need a good recommendation.
Check the university's application website. Some schools specifically ask for 1 or 2 academic professors
they should let every undergrad know during their first undergrad semester that recommendation letters will be required for grad school applications ><
I agree with citizen - while I wouldn't look askance at an applicant with no faculty references who'd graduated 5+ years ago, it does send up a teeny little red flag in the case of someone who finished undergrad fairly recently. While getting stellar (and highly personalized, current) letters from your employers and supervisors is great, they may not be able to speak to your academic potential and strengths the way that a former professor could since that just isn't the relationship they've had with you.
I wasn't quite in your situation when I was applying to grad school - I could pretty easily think of one or two faculty who I thought I'd connected with in undergrad - however, I certainly had NOT kept in touch with any of them in the intervening two years and felt like a tool emailing them out of the blue and saying, 'hey, long time no see, do me a favor??' However, when I swallowed that embarrassment and just did it, I was surprised at how well they still remembered my work (and not because it was so incredibly exceptional) and how willing they were to help. One professor, who I'd only taken one seminar with and was nervous to contact, actually asked me to send him my in-process portfolio and essays so that he could better tailor his recommendation to my application.
You certainly know your experiences with faculty best, but if you can, I recommend soliciting one of your letters from a former professor you liked (and who seemed to like you). Send them a note telling them what you've been up to for the last few years, what you're working on, why you want to go to grad school, and throw in a few pieces of recent work they haven't seen, and you might be surprised how interested they are in helping and how impressed they are at your progress.
(And all the above advice about staying in touch is spot-on, even after you've gotten every letter you think you're going to need. Say thank you, send an email every so often - every time you complete a project, show them, get published, send a link, etc. - and drop by their office just to say hi anytime you're in the neighborhood. These are the people who put together short lists, jury competitions, and hire faculty.)
I'm in the same boat. It really surprises me when people casually mention that you need a letter from the Dean or head of your undergrad department. Let's be honest, how many of us REALLY were on a first-name "buddy" basis with our teachers? Especially with the size of most of my undergraduate classes, even though I went to office hours, participated in class, and sent "thank you" emails to professors at the end of the semester, I was still just another student in a sea of hundreds. Most of us were. I can't exactly pop up into their lives again and ask for a recommendation 5 years later. It just isn't realistic.
i totally agree with paintitblack... heck, I don't really connect with some of my classmates either
I think it the end you shouldn't worry too much if your portfolio is kickass and other requirements are too
That's what I think too, accesskb. It is only one portion of your application, it's the larger picture that counts. If the other areas of your application are solid, then not having letters from professors isn't going to make you look like some kind of slacker slob.
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