here is the diagram.

Conventionally:

fascism = left
communism = right

ergo, China is communist, not fascist.

Ironically enough, the end results of the two political extremes appear remarkably similar on the streets.

hmm I never pictured communism being right (I thought tha was capitalism)

And I'm not sure China is of either socio-political system. They are instead a country tired of Western criticism and willing to do what it takes to shake all of that.

Sorry, was half asleep when I posted.

Conventionally:

fascism = right
communism = left.

Still, China is communist, not fascist. Although, like LiG says, the end result may not be that different.

Not so long time ago there was a link in the news section to an article about Koolhaas and China. If I remember correctly, the point was that China's political system is the rawest form of capitalism (no worker's rights etc.) but with a communistic facade.

Coincidentially I just found this report:

The Olympics Countdown

i thought fascist is that any form of government which has 0 tolerance of oppositional voices and to ensure certain groups in the society to stay in power.

there are large numbers of architects (mostly starchitect) who preach about liberation, nomadic space, against the hierarchy, free bodily movement...etc. I wouldn't have assume they recognised the fact that china is a fascist state and would have an impact on their urbanistic studies?

or may be afterall, money talks, preaching stop.

'Fascism' has a more specific definition than that.

But it's a good question.

I'd have to check, but Eisenmann talks about Terragni's relationship to fascism, at the other end of the political spectrum.

China is half-assed communism at best. Many of the basic communist principles have been replaced with capitalist ideals. It isn't the classless and shared-ownership nation it once was. One of the few communist teachings it has going for it is its tight-laced censorship.

Other than that, feel free to enjoy the private land, the wide spectrum of their class structure, and Gucci.

those facists paid their respects to the wrong university, it was VT.

Under the ruse of communism, China is a actually a really, really bad form of Capitalism. The government reaps all the benefits and profit of the free market while the masses are reduced to slave labor simply existing to make the government more money.

The free market goes both ways, those workers don't have to work in those environs for that pay, but they do because they're desperate and there are assholes who tend over-exploit that. That said, it is a tragedy and stuff like that happens all the time in the developing world, and we in the developed world hardly ever hear word of it. Thanks for posting aspect.

so really what you are all saying is that China is a unique model, neither left nor right, in some nebulous section in the middle. Sounds familiar US = China?

I'm going to China with my school in less than one month. I'd like to continue my school blog when I am there, but will I be subject to censorship?

That said, Apurimac, I don't believe you can count on the powers-that-be at each level to accomodate for the working class in a kind and gentle fashion. Capitalism leverages the most pronounced and strong tendency we have as humans - greed. Now, this greed can take the form of self preservation, but it can also manifest itself as labor exploitation, human rights violations, or generally exclusionary practices, so long as one party benefits.

If China is some ultra-pure form of Capitalism, then there is a strict divide between economic models and political models (which I also firmly believe in). The US is a modified form of capitalism, probably realized in the most public of manners when certain monopolies were disbanded (anti-trust legislation). I've heard many times that the end goal of Capitalism is the destruction of Capitalism itself; successful entities in a Capitalist system eventually destroy free competition by becoming the most successful of the lot.

I don't think China is a hybrid - even though chinese Capitalism is indeed pure and raw (unforgiving). While their form of government accomodates for this raw Capitalism, their terms of censorship smack of far-right politics (limited personal freedoms).

I think you'll be fine with your blog - just keep it architecture related. Many of their censorship firewalls look for key words and phrases that may speak negatively upon the motherland (i.e. Tibet, Tibetan buddhism, Dalai Lama, death penalty, human rights, Cultural Revolution, etc.).

hey L8r, i'll be sittin' right on that slow plane to china with you. ;)

Also, the thing is, you can never count on the powers-that-be to accomdate for anything. Great changes typically come from movements of people which is then later reflected in government. That said, it may be time for Chinese laborers to consider demanding better working conditions/compensation, if they haven't already. The free market, like I said, goes both ways. When the price of labor is set, and when workers are forced into labor, is a good indication you are no longer in a "free market".

i've always been under the assumption that communism is a way to organize a society economically, and fascism is a political idealogy ... in any case, there seem to be a lot of fascist tendancies left there, without the so called benefits of communism.

l8rpeace> the key word is Falun Gong, june 4 Massacre. if u are at china and search google for the above words, it won't show any link. another money talks "do no evil" stop.
from a friend's personal experiences: when u go to tiananmen square, any form of a hint/gesture/signs to demonstrate, there will be lots of polices disguises as civilians come and take u away within 5 secs.


when i read articles about beijing/tiananmen urban structure, no word about june 4 Massacre nor mentioning open spaces under extreme surveillance... to me that's like someone talk about architecture of concentration camp pretending no knowing the Massacre of the Jews.

agreed, the media in china is hardly open. there's alot of talk in america about how the media is "lefty" or "righty" but in china, it's to a completely different level in china, in china its propagandistic. it's not until foreign journalism gets involved that issues like the tiananmen protests are openly addressed.

but i think the large majority of chinese know this. when so much of the media is controlled, i think people aren't dumb to it, they don't believe a word they read in the media.

there is an aspect of information that is about appearances. this being said, china has made big leaps to open up and the country's growth is accelerating, pressures to cater to foreign investment means that the chinese are much more interested in appearances to the foreign markets and political forces... which is much more critical and so policy in china will increasingly be more sensitive to foreign pressures for human rights, environment, etc.

I used to work in Shanghai and I would occassionally receive text messages sent out by The Party about anti-Japanese rallies in People's Square. I thought that was a little wacky.

Its another glorious day in the bright, shiny, happy, glorious People's Republic...



That said, i still can't wait to go.

Apurimac - If you are interested in propoganda art, I highly recommend going to the Propoganda Poster Art Center in Shanghai while you are there. [Please note: 'Art Center' is generous nomenclature. It's in the basement of an old man's apartment.] All the posters are original, illustrate the People's Republic at its finest, graphic splendors, and, best of all, led by an old man who takes you from room to room.

Awesome! I'll be sure to try and see if i can check it!