A 4 year B.S. Arch and 5 year B. Arch are actually quite different. The school rankings don't matter. >

Check to see if the B. Arch is accredited, meaning you can be a liscensed architect without a masters degree. A B.S. Arch, you will need a masters. Most Arch Masters programs, after a B.S. Arch, are 2 additional years (4+2). You have to apply into a Masters program, but with a solid portfolio and decent grades/ gre scores, you should have your choice with grad schools.

That could be a deciding factor- the number of years to become accredited or the importance of having a masters. Ball State, the school I went to, converted from a 5 year B.Arch to 4 year B.S. Arch program. I was actually glad they did this so I could have another school on my resume and have more options to dual major.

Deciding for undergrad, or all design schools for that matter, rankings don't really matter. Both UVA and VTech are top teir schools.

The 'feel' for the school does matter. Since you spend so much time in studio as an architecture student, that environment is very important.


Coming from family members who went to these schools, there is a lot of school pride and a both places have great college spirit.

Here is another post on this website concerning this topic.


I would recommend UVA it is a much better architecture school.

i am assuming you have visited both universities.

caveat: architecture school is rough- no matter which program your son enters. it wont be a walk in the park. all-nighters, bad critiques, high stress levels... there's a reason they call it a "profession" (or so they say)


my two pennies...
if you have visited UVA i would hope you would have met John Quale. john quale's ecomod projects have just won numerous awards from the national (and maybe international level) for sustainable homes and rebuilding katrina-ravaged communities. he is the next "mcdonough" which may or may not mean much to you, but aside from UVA having a stellar reputation for education, William McDonough was an architecture professor at UVA and is renowned throughout the world for his ideas in sustainable architecture.
aside from the amazing faculty (look at some of their C.V.'s on the UVA website), they have very nice facilities and they have a good mix of grad with undergrad which is a great learning experience. additionally, i found the faculty to be EXTREMELY encouraging to the student- whatever they wanted to do.

VT has amazing resources as well. and if you have visited VT you will know that they have not only undergrad + grad architecture but also PhD programs. which UVA has as well but only in architectural history. VT's programs extends into the environmental design sector as well. personally if i were to choose VT i would want to be at the Washington-Alexandria Campus.

the major difference between the two programs for an undergrad is the ability to graduate in 5 years and start IDP and get licensed- which is what will happen at VT. at UVA your son will have to go through the grad school application process- and if he decides to work first he will not be able to begin IDP and get licensed until he finishes that additional 2-3 years in grad school. if he decides to do the 5yr program at VT he can always go back for grad school later if he wants, but he wont be hindered from becoming licensed.

i graduated with a B.Architecture from Hampton University. i will be attending UVA in the fall to pursue my post-professional M.Architecture so i can continue research in sustainble post-disaster reconstruction.

Design Intelligence only ranks professional degrees so that's why Virginia Tech shows up and not UVa.

If your son has a lot of interest in returning to school for an MArch then UVa is a good option, otherwise not really.

By the way have you heard about the construction at these architecture schools? UVa's additions should be done in a year or so, then I hear VT will also be undergoing some construction.

The path I took was an non-architecture undergrad degree (fine arts/art history/philosphy) at the ...AHEM... rival school, but I went to VT afterwards because I thought it was the perfect fit for me in terms of the location, the faculty I would be working with, the facilities, the technology, and the entire campus atmosphere. And sure enough I have had an absolutely amazing experience there. It's a very theory-based program that will be quite heavy handed with the phillosophy, but it's also a very technology-savy program. They don't necessarily beat you to death with it, they just expect it from the students. VT's arch program is also known for its production of strongly graphic oriented students. From the day you start, the faculty will beat graphic sensibility into your head. That becomes very helpful when getting a job. I wouldn't change my mind for the world. I'm almost finished with my degree, got about eight different job offers and recently accepted a job in DC. It worked out very well but UVA would too.

VT is in the process of doing a complete renovation of Cowgill Hall, the main architecture building. From what I understand, it is one of the biggest schools of architecture in the country -- currently housed in four buildings. Burchard and Cowgill are the main architecture and Industrial design buildings, and the Interior Design, Landscape Architecture, and Urban Studies programs are housed in Burruss Hall and the Architecture Annex. And they are all within close proximity -- allowing access to a wide range of student and faculty resources.


The 1998 addition to the architecture school is Burchard Hall designed by SOM. It's pretty decent and Cowgill is pretty decent overall -- very similar in appearance to Campell Hall at UVA -- minus the brick.


As for the decisions. It's a good one because both schools are solid. I mean both are top tier schools with a panoply of resources. If you want your kid to go to grad school, I would go to UVA, otherwise go to VT if you want him to get a professional B.Arch. Rankings are pretty arbitrary because they don't talk about the quality of education and faculty. They instead rank them based on job placement. UVA is more known for its grad program in architecture.



Oh and many of my colleagues in the grad program did UVA undergrad and VT grad. They're pretty solid. That could be another option for your son.

Hope this all helps. congrats to you for his admissions. You should be very proud.

i have several friends that went to both schools.
the ones that went to UVA got into slightly better grad schools.

the ones that went to vatech got better jobs straight out of school.

as for me, i'm glad i chose VT over UVA.

my closest friends and i (from VT) definitely have been able to contribute more at the firms we've jumped into than my cohorts that ended up as wahoos. tech's affiliations with switzerland are also stronger than uva's in copenhagen or vicenza.

Thank you all very much for sharing your experience and opinions. It definitely helps make the differences clearer. My son has to ultimately make the decision, of course. Yes, we have visited both schools, and know the campus differences. I don't think we ever met John Quale, however.

My son has an interest in Industrial Design, which VA Tech has, but not UVA. This could be a factor, but I'm not sure how significant it is overall.

j is right. UVA ranks right up under Harvard, etc.

maybe your son should be the one posting on here?

i don't have too much to add as i don't know a whole lot about the programs, but i think that UVA has a much better national reputation...

I think he should go by his reaction to the school and to the program - i have a b.s. arch from UVA and I have the same responsibilities at my firm as interns with b.archs - and i know quite a few people with b.archs who are going to grad school anyway to get their m.arch II (an abbreviated version of an m.arch I, which is required for uva grads, though typically with some advanced standing).

If he is interested in grad school - no idea if this is important to him or not, but several of my UVA classmates are going to grad school this fall - at Harvard, Yale, UVA, Rice, UT Austin, RISD, Penn, etc. - all excellent grad programs.

Anyway - UVA is terrific for undergrad - can't say enough good things about the school of architecture and the professors and students!

I don't know anyone from the VT program but the UVA graduates I have worked with have all be very competant designers

I graduated from Virginia Tech several years ago. I'm not too familiar with UVA's program, and I'm sure that some things at VT have changed since I was there, so I won't try to compare the two schools. Needless to say, both are good.

Regarding though the assertion that a degree from Virginia Tech is a disadvantage -- FWIW, here in NYC I have found that other architects are complimentary of the VT program, and speak highly of VT grads they have employed.

Your son's future job and/or grad school prospects will depend not so much on attending one school over another, but on the work & effort he puts in to school for these next 4-5-6 years. And making that commitment to studio will be that much easier if he is able to choose the program/school/university/town which best suits him.

J, you are way off on VT's academic standing. I don't think you know enough about acedemic rankings to really make the type of claims that you just made. No one is arguing VT is better than UVA -- not very many schools are.

But to say Virginia Tech does not have a good academic profile just doesn't add up in anyway. US News and World Report ranks it 70th (34th among public schools) overall. Any school ranked in the top 125 is categorized as 'national university doctoral, first tier) -- and consequenly gives them a high academic reputation. In addition, VT is designated as a Research One institution (Research extensive with a very high level of research activity) by the Carneggie Foundation. Only about 56 schools (including UVA of course) have this designation. And Just about every college within Virginia Tech is nationally ranked including its Engineering, Business, Agriculture, Vet Med, and Architecture programs.

And the other claim you made about "VT alums only able to find work within the state" is also a big bucket of wrong. Of all 35 of my graduating m.arch thesis class, only about five or six people are working in the state at pretty decent offices such as HKS, DMJM, McDunnough, etc. The rest have found work all over -- from San Fransisco to New York City, from Miami to Boston, from Houston to Mineapolis, etc, etc. I just accepted a job in D.C. Previous classmates of mine have found jobs in NYC, Philly, Tampa, Atlanta, Dallas, and Cleveland, just to name a few. So your claim again was unrelieved rubbish -- but I won't really hold that against you since you simply don't know enough about this.

The undergrads have it way better. Their program is even higher in status than the grad program. I've seen peopel get jobs with Machado and Silvetti, Herzhog and DeMuron, Ceasar Peli, KPF (in which the head is a VT alum), Murphy Jaan, etc.

Giving people false information will not help you.

i agree with archmed

yeah right +i, why is the father doing it...

Some people told that DI ranking is not that serious because that reflects preferences in practical works.

And some other people told that VT's graduates get their jobs in areas just around the school like VA, DC, and MD.

Then,
would they think that DI surveyed just in those 3-states for making the ranking?
Would they think that the reason for VT's high ranking is because DI survayed just in those 3-states?

so what did you decide???? we are all anxiously awaiting...

Sorry for keeping you hanging, but I've had a family emergency to deal with.

After careful consideration of all your thoughful responses above, which we sincerely appreciate....the decision is......UVA.

My son likes the campus at UVA better, believes that he will get just as good an education there, and believes it's a more prestegious school to have on his resume. If he really decides he doesn't want to pursue architecture at some point in the program, he can always transfer of course.

Thanks again for all you responses!

thnksnow-
fantastic!

i'll see him there in the fall-
tell him to sign up on archinect himself

there's other Wahoos on here that can help him out too :)

J, I think you also missed a major point of my post. I clearly stated that not very many schools in the country are better than UVA. I also clearly said that I don't think by any means that VT is a better school. And who said anything about bias? I actually think VT is the third best school in the state after UVA and William and Mary. How is that biased?

You initial post (and to some extent your follow-up post) made it sound like VT was some two-bit community college with a football program and I was simply stating that it obviously wasn't the case. And few outside of Blacksburg heard to VT? What part of 'national university' are you having a particularly difficult time trying to understand? Students from all 50 states, and about 120 countries go to school there. I'm not sure if you know, but Blacksburg is a tiny little hamlet that doesn't have more than 20,000 people in the imediate area. I really doubt that Blacksburg has the resources to supply a 28,000 student body.

I actually like UVA. I go there very often and I have many friends who go there or work in the Charlottesville area. One of my good friends who I went to undergrad with will be starting their M.Arch program in the fall so I have a good excuse to go there more often.

just an fyi, virginia tech has a much higher standing overseas than UVA, especially in germany.

wahoowa

I know the decision was already made, but, as a hokie, I would like to say something.

As most people know, uva is better than vpi in overall academic reputations.
Probably, that is truth.
But, in architectural field, I would postpone to say “yes”.
Of course, I know some talented people who went to uva, but I still cannot confirm uva’s architecture program is better than vt’s, especially in undergraduate programs.

In past, uva was inclined to “history”, and vt was inclined to “craft”.
However, now uva is also pursuing similar tendency to vt, namely, vt has much influenced on uva’s architecture program.
Although uva might also have influenced on vt, that has not been much than vt’s influence on uva.

There has been the Virginia community competition in which most students of universities in Virginia and DC area have participated. Of course, UVA and VT are major universities, which have participated in that competition.
In reality, VT has usually won that competition, differently from most people’s anticipation that uva would have won. Although most people are thinking VT is “practical” and UVA is “academic”, even in student competition, vt has been better.

In this posting, I don’t deny uva has better overall reputation, but I would say “facts” could be sometimes different from such “reputations” which some people, who just know about those schools’ “name”, have made.

Anyway, both schools are good enough not to regret the choice.
Good luck

i wouldnt say winning the Virginia Prize competition is a substance of proof that VT is or is not better than UVA. ive seen shitty entries win from all THREE of the schools who enter that competition.

"i wouldnt say winning the Virginia Prize competition is a substance of proof that VT is or is not better than UVA. ive seen shitty entries win from all THREE of the schools who enter that competition."

Agree 100%. We're talking about the Virginia Society Competition. Winning that really doesn't mean anything about the respective schools. As it happens, faculty from all three universities do rotations each year in writing the program. for it. This past year, it was a UVA professor and the year before it was VT's chair that wrote it.

and do not forget HU also participates- so some years it has an HU professor writing the charrette.
being that HU has a naab accredited undergrad program--- unlike UVA.

i think this discussion has gotten more than a little close-minded about what VT and UVA are all about. for all the similarities there is a world of difference. and contrary to people at either of these schools, neither exists in isolation and both are subject to influence from all over the world.

VT and UVA are very different schools- for many reasons.


and with that i will make an arrogant statement that UVA is better than VT ;) hehe


no harm, Archmed :)

hit up a fellow arch-i-nectar when you visit UVA :)

+i, are you starting the m.arch program at Campbell Hall? If so, you'll be in there with a good friend of mine who starts there at that same time in the 2 year m.arch program. He's been living there for the past year to establish residency in the state of Virginia. Not sure if he's an archinector, but very cool dude.

He and I were roomates up in WV while we were working up there.

Oh and I didn't forget about HU either. And I know that they participate as well. As a matter of fact, it's open to all who wish to participate. I've seen entries from W&M, JMU, and V-State.

i will be there- 3rd floor, campbell hall, in a dark corner where they keep the other Path C students... all three of us.

What's path C?

I know at VT, the M.Arch I is for students who already have a professional 5-year degree but want a masters. M.Arch II are for students who have a 4-year bachelor of arts in architecture (many people from UVA's 4-year program end up doing grad school at VT for that), and the M.Arch III is the first professional degree for people without any background in architecure.

What's Path C equivalent to?

I didn't say winning in the competition means VT is better than UVA, but I just said VT has gotten 'better results' in the competition which seems to have most common conditions to compare two different schools' programs.

It is just one of your interpretations that "competition winning means better school", because you could also have interpreted as "better reputation or name means better school".

Archmed, UVA Path C= Post-professsional degree (1year)




syp, then tell me, what exactly do you mean by "results" when referring to competitions?

(merriam-webster):
RESULT: to proceed or arise as a consequence, effect, or conclusion

i would suppose "result" when referring to competition is it's conclusion. the conclusion is the summation of work.

so did you see ALL THE WORK from ALL THREE (or more) schools in order to give you credibility to state "VT has gotten 'better results' in the competition which seems to have most common conditions to compare two different schools' programs"?

or did you just see the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and honorable mentions?

i don't know much about VT, but i do want to say this; if i had a kid and they wanted to go to college, VT would be one of the ones i would recommend quite highly. reading about those that were murdered in april, i found their goals to be quite remarkable, and inspiring. double majors, phd candidates, and every single one seemed dedicated to something more than just being some rich, corporate climbing whore. they were quite a group of promising, young and terribly bright youth.

Of course, yes I saw because I had studied at VT, and I also got one.

And did you see any one?

you saw what? the placed entries? the entire work submitted from all three schools?

ugh this is pointless. forget it.

Yeah the argument is pointless. It's just a competition that supposedly brings all the state's architecture students together. It's not to judge who has the best archtecture school. And +i got it right -- there are some downright bad entries and there are great entries from all three schools.

This would be my last posting.

My point was not to decide which school is better.
I am not interested in such a general, conclusive reputation ignoring individual person's diverse conditions.

The point of my argue is 'some people pretend to know something which he did not experience'.
In addition, he did not tell anything about "facts" but POINTLESS "reputations" or "guesses" which would become kinds of illusions.

Thus, I did never say "vt is better than uva."
Such a judgement about which school is better was always found in your posting, namely, that is just your "interpretation" and "interest" about my posting not mine.

UVA, UVA,UVA.


also, uva is comprehensively superior to vtech.

also, attending the university of virginia will be better for him down the road if he decides to do something other than architecture. UVA has a reputation as an ivy-league calibre institution.

In the past...

UVA= Beaux Arts

VPI= Bauhaus

now? who knows...

yeah, research the profs. that isnt the case anymore. at least not at UVA.

ugh...