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How do I build this?

Larchinect

I got invited to design and build a custom dog house for a fundraiser. I came up with this design which I originally thought should be built out of steel, but cant find a fabricator to team with, so I'm looking for ideas on alternative materials (inexpensive!) which keeps the concept intact.

 

Thoughts??

 
May 11, 12 11:29 pm
x-jla

plastic

May 12, 12 3:12 am  · 
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archigeniss

I would recommended wood! steel could get too cool and since you mention you have some budget constrains wood could be cheap and easier to manage. Try to get 1/8" wood something that looks nice and you could paint it with some natural color tint it will look great!!!

May 12, 12 4:01 am  · 
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Foamcore, yo!

May 12, 12 9:36 am  · 
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Oh dear.  This is what's wrong with architecture education.  How can any physical thing be "designed" if one doesn't know what it's made of?

 

So first, is that a green roof or is it fake turf? If it's real grass you're going to need more depth  for soil, and it will drain right onto the dog inhabitant, unless you allow for water collection to channel down the ceiling and out which means most likely more depth too.  Unless you do an interior gutter along one edge.

Do you think a dog will enjoy sleeping on steel?  What surface do you think a dog would like to sleep on?  Or is it a hard surface with fake turf or a blanket on the inside that can be removed so the whole thing can be cleaned?  Does it sit directly on the ground, or does it need to be raised up so it doesn't sink down into the surrounding grass as the dog's weight pushes it down over time?  Do those holes in the back allow ventilation, or do they allow a frigid wind to blow across the dog's shivering form as s/he cowers on an icy steel plate flat on the wet ground?!

 

I'm sorry to be harsh but I don't think this is very well thought out, which means it doesn't look cool at all, even if the general idea of it looks kinda like it could be cool.  But seriously: figure out the basics of a dog's habitation requirements.  Figure out what materials and shop facilities are available to you inexpensively.  THEN design it.

May 12, 12 11:17 am  · 
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as usual, donna speaks the truth!

May 12, 12 12:04 pm  · 
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Wilma Buttfit

Repurposed truck topper?

May 12, 12 1:15 pm  · 
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archinect is new education tool ?  why not?  better than the hit and miss education of learning at the office...

 

i would add to what donna said about turf and other good questions by saying steel is bloody heavy. 

it is perfectly cool to not know how to build what you design...as long as you work it out at some point (earlier is better).  you will need to modify the design a bit to suit the construction, most likely.

 

plywood is possible, but will take some thinking to get it working and is maybe a bit heavy if not clever.  probably i would use FRP.  Make shape, sand, then paint.  Not as easy to use as plywood but waterproofing is built in and it is not hard to make curves.

 

if you take it on without someone who has done this kind of work before it is good idea to add time to the schedule for getting it wrong.  maybe best to do a few tests first.

May 12, 12 3:47 pm  · 
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won and done williams

Clay.

May 12, 12 5:12 pm  · 
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Actually what Will says is true: it's perfectly cool to design w/o knowing how to build, but to me the beauty of most design is in how well its material expression is part of the concept.  

Larchitect, you said you want to figure out how to build it in a way that will "keep the concept intact".  What is your concept?

May 12, 12 6:39 pm  · 
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Larchinect

hey donna, you make a lot of assumptions. I'd love to see some of your boring ass work. Take your snotty ass attitude somewhere where pople might care. Its steel, the concept is steel, did i SAY ITS STEEL? Do you own a dog? Ever boarded a dog? They sleep on concrete in most cases, we have two dogs, so we kind of know. Maybe theres a dog bed or pad inside? who knows. I'd explain the concept to you further, but I dont think its worth my time. thanks for nothing. 4 inches for some grasses and succulents is adequate, thanks for making yourself look ignorant.

 

wow, totally useless responses. I'll just take my ass back over the landscape architecture boards where we at least get straight discussion, snobs.

 

May 12, 12 6:59 pm  · 
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Janosh

Jeez, Larchinect.  You asked for input, and received criticism that was constructive.  What's the problem?

May 12, 12 7:26 pm  · 
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wow dude, that was totally uncalled for.

 

your design is unfinished and preliminary at best.  steel makes not so much sense as construction material to me to begin with, but if you wanna go ahead then you need to work it out a wee bit more.  the construction will change the design so donna is wondering which bits are important to you.  whats the problem?

 

if the concept is the shape then coolio, go with that.  if you want a step by step manual for how to detail and build that shape then you probably are looking in the wrong place.  this isn't really a DIY hangout.  but getting back to your original question...wood or frp make sense to me.  wouldn't be too hard to do, but you will need to do the legwork yourself.  google is a good start if you have no experience.  i assume the green is fake, in which case i recommend the super real fake stuff with long blades of grass to pull off effect.  otherwise it will just look cheap.

 

hope it ain't too snobbish to point out that donna is not anonymous in here and you can indeed see her work on the inter-web.  she isn't commenting frivolously.  you on the under hand....

May 12, 12 7:53 pm  · 
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Larchinect

I asked for alternative materials and got a critique...fine, just reminded me why I stopped checking this forum. I looked at donna's 'bus shelter' ...not really one to throw stones.

May 12, 12 9:42 pm  · 
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<sarcasm> Ooh, I'm hurt.</sarcasm>  ;-)

May 12, 12 10:32 pm  · 
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b3tadine[sutures]

whatever dick head. go back to landscaping my yard, and shut your pie hole. it does suck, no actually sucking would be a vast improvement. build it out of cardboard.

May 12, 12 10:37 pm  · 
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Thecyclist

I don't know how well wood would hold up. That grass will hold a good amount of moisture and I think the wood would start to decay faster than expected. On the other hand I cannot think of another material besides wood - maybe plastic but if you cannot find a metal fabricator, plastic may be a problem too. If you go with wood, consider hitting it with a heavy layer of waterproofing finish.

To hold the grass onto the roof I would most likely use some sort of wire grid system that the dirt and roots can be intertwined into underneath so it would not be seen. You should also put some sort of drainage mat underneath so water drains easily.

May 12, 12 10:40 pm  · 
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Seriously, Larchitect, sorry I hurt your feelings and was treating you like I would talk to a student.  Your original post seemed very flippant and hit a nerve with where my design sentiments live.  I don't like the design, but that really shouldn't matter to you if YOU do.  It's always hard to put something out in the world, and thick skin is necessary, as is knowledge, since not everyone will ever like what you do.  It's nice you're doing it for a charity.

And yeah, I've always had dogs, so I do know what they like.  A hard surface is something mine only seek when they're just back from a walk and hot - they head for the tile floor in the bathroom.  

May 12, 12 11:06 pm  · 
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Oh, and as usual there is no there nailed it.  A truck topper would be perfect.

May 12, 12 11:08 pm  · 
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Wilma Buttfit

Thanks, D. I AM an expert, having won a dog house design competition before. But I won't post a picture, because all of you would have too much fun ripping it apart!

May 13, 12 9:21 am  · 
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chatter of clouds

is there really a need to be nasty to Larchinect?

 her or his original post did not come across as being flippant - whatever anyone thinks of the design. the person was just asking for help not a talking down to or lecture on the current state of architectural education.  the following does sound indeed sound self-righteous and needless :

"Oh dear.  This is what's wrong with architecture education.  How can any physical thing be "designed" if one doesn't know what it's made of?"

perhaps because you feel comfortable nesting in archinect with your archinect hommies,  makes you feel elevated enough to have a go at someone outside your circle  like Larchinect.

i sort of agree with Larchinect. and i would add that there are few, very few, interesting individual minds or characters haunting this place.

and there is no reason that the design cannot be realized using non metals or , in a friendly manner, encouraging Larchinect to develop it in a canine-friendly manner.

May 13, 12 11:42 am  · 
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i r giv up

larchitect, if you're asking how to build that thing, you have some serious learning issues that are going to become really obvious in the next couple of years....

i suggest you start reading. a lot.

a first year student could fabricate that thing.

if you can't find a fabricator for that, you must be living in the middle of nowhere or not looking hard enough.

in fact, i bet that if i google'd hard enough (3 minutes of my time), i'd be able to find someone to do it, and ship it, but i'm not here to hold your hand.

that form is simple.

the curves are not complex.

putting astoturf on top of it is not hard.

seriously.

are you trolling?

May 13, 12 12:13 pm  · 
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backbay

while i think what donna said is right, people here do have a problem when it comes to giving constructive criticism.  the same thing happened to me when i asked for help finding a specific type of firm, mentioned my thesis, and somebody decided to tell me i shouldn't even be in architecture and harassed me throughout the rest of the thread.  i think like two people addressed my question.

a lot of egos bouncing around.  he didn't want a design critique, he just wanted to know how he should go about building it.

May 13, 12 12:20 pm  · 
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tammuz, I already aplogized for being overly harsh to Larchitect.  I also asked him/her to explain his/her concept, because I honestly would like to know toward what goal this idea is based.

In a broader sense of our field: in my opinion, which is definitely not shared by all my "hommies" (sp?) here on Archinect, not having an understanding of the materials of which our work is made is a moral failing of architecture and of current architecture education (and one reason why I've decided not to teach any more).  

Every time an architect goes to a fabricator with a pretty rendering and says "What can I make this out of?", it's one more craftsmen who sneers every time they see an architect coming.  It's one more person who thinks architects only exist to fulfill our own "vision" of an idea with no regard for how something is made or used.  It's one more person who thinks an architect is just an unnecessary expense because we don't know how to do anything but make pretty pictures that cost too much.

I'm 45 and have spent 25 years in this field trying to prove to people who know how to build that I do too. But in my professional life I still see, every day, contractors who won't respect anything I and my peers say, not because we don't, actually, know almost as much about building as they do, but because with the label "architect" we're already being judged as dilettantes.  

The bulk of current architecture education is only making this divide worse.  Every swoopy, material-less form that someone says is their "concept" but has no idea how to make it into an object  makes our jobs, ALL of ours, harder.  It's embarrassing and frustrating, and I see it constantly, not only from students but from architects who really don't have any understanding of fabrication.

(And as for no one if interest hanging out here? tammuz, go right ahead and do what Larchitect and others and everyone who is not anonymous here has done and show us some of your work.  I know there is a lot of cool work happening by people here who are afraid to show it, perhaps in part because they're afraid of harsh criticism like I, perhaps mistakenly, laid down on Larchitect.  But again: thick skin is necessary in our profession.  If I hadn't had harsh criticism from professors in school I'd probably still think doing neon hoops around faux-Corinthian Fypon columns was whimsical because when I was in school, that was the trendy thing, not unlike swoopy turf roofs today!)

May 13, 12 12:40 pm  · 
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chatter of clouds

 

to  clarify, by few interesting minds i meant few interesting critical/articulate minds who can push Larchinect forward - so thats related to the purpose of this post. yes, i concur there are good and interesting architects around here. but they're usually the ones who perform better with their hands more than their (figurative) mouths. but there are a few, very few...

your apology is not really sincere Donna. you're just paying lip service. you're justifying your stance not apologizing.  my work is besides the point; its not a penis contest dear so stop pretending to have one.  thats all i really have to say to you Donna. 

May 13, 12 12:53 pm  · 
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chatter of clouds

post repeated

May 13, 12 12:53 pm  · 
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Thecyclist

D Sink...keep preaching. I currently am a student and see the issues that you state almost all of my classmates

May 13, 12 12:57 pm  · 
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poop876

I say poured concrete haha what a tool!

May 13, 12 2:29 pm  · 
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i don't agree with donna's view...quite. but didn't find the comments all that harsh either.  still not sure what the fuss is about.

 

@Donna, that is a good point about respect from the builders. I get that alot too, but don't mind.  Actually i don't care at all, as long as they build what i want.  In some projects lately I have been in odd position of knowing more about fabrication than the old hand builder who is shocked to learn that complex stuff can be done cheaply after all.  CNC has changed things in an interesting direction that way.  And a lot of it is about swoopy stuff.

 

none of which is about doggie houses of course.  do carry on with the rabble-rousing...

 

 

May 13, 12 3:13 pm  · 
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CNC has definitely changed things, though not to the extent I had hoped by now.  It's still mostly being used decoratively.

The cool thing, Will, is you and I approach it so differently but no big deal which way we attack it because IMO your work is completely wonderful with a great material sensibility.  

Oops, tammuz will accuse us of being homies if I compliment you, so maybe I better not. ;-)

Larchitect I still wish you'd come back and explain your concept so you could get some helpful advice here.  I promise I'll be nice.  Or rather, I promise I won't be mean.

May 13, 12 3:51 pm  · 
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x-jla

 

 wow larchitect your an angry little fucker. 

May 13, 12 5:48 pm  · 
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Rusty!

what eventually got built...

May 13, 12 6:56 pm  · 
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calculator

repurposed dryer front for entrance, recycled tarp, that wood is all recycled, HVAC is 100% natural...

 

I bet that thing qualifies for LEED Silver at least...

May 13, 12 7:46 pm  · 
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snook_dude

lol....I started to read the comments....and I do have the most respect for Mrs Liberty. She rarely miss fires.  So Laarch a what ever.  Take her issues and deal with them, as it will result in a  stronger design... Now my thoughts.  You might be able to do it out of wacky plywood but you would have to have a frame work of some sort. Which you could do out of framing lumber looking at the size of the thing.  You might just be able to take one of those plastic rubber carpet protectors for chairs and flip it upside down with the pokie...things sticking out to grab ahold of some geo-tec fabric interlays which would inturn hold some sorta hydro ponic fed peat moss kinda   grid.  I would suggest elevating the whole item on some rad ass Italian looking legs just so it isn't sitting in the grass. My experience is dogs like to be up in the air a bit so they can observe what is in their enviorins.  Anyhow...as some one told me a long time ago, there are no bad ideas, just ones which need to be developed....so have at it SARGE!

May 13, 12 9:09 pm  · 
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job job

Larchinect, I remember your first post which was an angry one about a classmate who was accepted to Harvard - unfairly, in your estimation. She was an undeserving, jaywalking loser, if I remember. But that was years ago, and everyone grows up, and out of it - I know I have.

The responses you received were, in fact, mocking and pedantic but it's to be expected. There's a group of self-appointed moderators who consider themselves arbiters elegantiae. This phenomenon happens everywhere. In real life, it's middle-everything soccer-parents; in social sites, they are what Prensky calls the digital immigrants. They spend a lot of time here for a sense of community and worth, which is totally fine, but they don't know what they're doing - especially in terms of what archinect is becoming. It doesn't matter

About that dog shed - FLW designed one, and so did Work AC. This is a fun design exercise that you're not prototyping for mass-production by the SPCA, yes? Without a builder, you can switch the rolled form from steel to polypropylene. Thermoforming is not difficult, and the strips can be heat-welded to make the loop. Stability will come from the side panel, and the representation of Nature can change from grass or astroturf to flocking, which would be a really nice, low-profile finish. Or use old dryers, but really well.

May 13, 12 11:30 pm  · 
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chatter of clouds

job job, i sometimes frequent a string instrument forum/site and the conceptart and deviantart forums. what you say is not really correct; its not normal on all sites to be mocking and pedantic. true , there are people who are regulars but they, overwhelmingly, are not as bitchy as  many archinectors. then again, musicians and artists are less inclined to waste time on feeling needlessly defensive, offended, self righteous, ego manic...etc. architects are well into S&M, its inculcated into them at the get go during their university years.

May 13, 12 11:54 pm  · 
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mdler

what up LB?

 

 

May 14, 12 12:49 am  · 
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mdler

fiber reinforced concrete. Its waterproof.

 

You could also look at expanded polystyrene foam with some type of waterproof shell on it

May 14, 12 12:52 am  · 
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curtkram

I would think you could do fiberglass.  They have some really lightweight concrete along with that mesh reinforcement now too don't they?  That could be viable.  Also 3dH.

So I'm interested in hearing the concept of why a dog would like this.  It does not look adequate for winter shelter, though would provide some shade in the summer.  You could fill it with hay for dog warming purposes, but most of it would spill out or get kicked out.  It sort of looks like maybe the grass is insulation to keep it cool, even though it's open on 2 sides?  My dog lays on the grass when she can, unless it's hot.  Then if the concrete is cooler/in the shade she might go that route.  If you had a metal pan for the bottom and put water or something under it to keep it cool it could be good for cold weather dogs in hot environments.  I've never seen a real dog house that doesn't have a small opening for the dog to get in and out.  I think there's a reason for that.

Also, to simplify the above statements: "I designed stuff that can't be built/I don't know how to build" -- "don't do that."  I concur.  Maybe things were worded harshly or whatever, but if an architect doesn't have that sort of foresight, we really do become worthless as part of the building process.  Perhaps that does not apply to landscape architects.

May 14, 12 8:02 am  · 
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toasteroven

concrete might be too heavy  and difficult to work with (although it would be cheap) - I'd go with fiberglass - talk to some people who make small boats or kayaks.  it might end up looking less crisp and maybe a little thicker, and it would have to be secured to the ground - but with the sandwiching process it opens up other possibilities for effects and finish...

 

and to the OP - I don't think you'd have gotten "criticism" here if you had proposed (and included pros and cons of ) some alternative materials in your original post.  This is what frustrates people who work with students and recent grads - you came up with one idea, it didn't work, now you're stuck.  IMO, you'd get more traction if it seems like we're helping you though a problem rather than asking us to do your thinking for you.

May 14, 12 10:09 am  · 
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x-jla

sausage

May 15, 12 12:08 am  · 
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Did nobody notice that curtkram suggested 3dh?

Yo!

May 15, 12 12:11 pm  · 
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did indeed.  somewhere out there a fancy graphics lover just got his wings. 

May 15, 12 10:29 pm  · 
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