nobody's actually installed a host of the programs architects usually use yet. no word on performance yet either. give it a week and we'll probably know more.
But I suspect all will be well, the fact that they got vga graphics working is no small feat.
supposedly the hack is availible for download, but I can't connect to the site (probably swamped). Doesn't matter, I suppose, I don't have a mactel to try.
Mac video cards are different from PC cards, so another consideration is that the hacked macintels will probably be using hacked drivers, which is not good for stability.
nobody thought it wouldn't be possible...what I am praying for is that this will be endorsed, eventually. It can't hurt Apple, as they'll be getting tons of new customers and will probably still charge for their software.
My bet is on Vista working on it without a hack (but I know nothing about all this stuff, just that I want one!)
I just had a look through the files and instructions....even with detailed instructions, it's not a simple procedure if you're not a computer person, and you need a windows PC with Nero to set up the install disc.
apple will never sanction it.
I just want to see someone compare running heavy openGL applications on an equivalent PC and on XOM (xp on mac)
if they wind up within 5% performance, I might just get a second gen macbook toward the end of the year.
Apple doesn't want people calling with windows questions - they want their hands washed of the whole endevor...so they'll continue to not do or say anything one way or the other about it.
the people who want to do it will still do it, just knowing that anything they mess up is their own damn fault.
also: there's nothing illegal about slipstreaming updates or drivers onto a windows cd image. corporate users do it all the time. microsoft may not like it, but it isn't anything illegal, or even against the EULA, AFAIK.
1
Apple have already said they will not actively prevent people running windows on a mac (although they will defend against people running OSX on a PC).
2
Although slipstreaming drivers into a windows install is not against the EULA, narf's solution includes replacing windows files with hacked versions, and slipstreaming those into the install, which is against the EULA, I think.
3
Lots of people hoped that Vista would run without a hack on a macintel, but this week Microsoft announced that Vista will not include EFI support, only traditional BIOS. Macintels do not have BIOS support, only EFI. Vista will need a hack, too.
In any event I think you'd have to try very very hard to find someone who hasn't broken a EULA...
Even harder might be finding someone who's actually read one...
As I understand it, "normal" slipstreaming (drivers and software) modifies some windows files, so I assume the modified files might not be such a huge deal. I'm not about to read the EULA to find out, though - I think it's around 18 pages now.
I was told that EFI will be supported in the 64 bit edition of vista. This doesn't help the current 32 bit mactels, but the next gen will have 64 bit support. (based on merom/conroe/woodcrest). probably still to early to tell for sure, but it might work.
will definitely be interesting to see how this pans out.
I have been using macs since 3rd grade, and my frist laptop was the Powerbook Titanium 500.
But now, the titanium is deteriorating-cracking and corroding, and many others have the same problem. It costs 600 bucks to fix, but my powerbook can literally crumble apart anyday. It still works illustrator and stuff wonderfully, its just the metal body...
Thats why im skeptical of first-generation(intel) mac laptops- you can end up as a ginea pig...
I would love to be able to buy a mac with a windows environment, for while i cannot stand the OS X interface i still think mac powerbooks are stunnigly beautiful. The design don't come cheap unfortunately and Mac laptops remain rather exclusive machines. it's probably apple's policy to keep it that way, they probably do not want to dumb down their products with microsoft ones but at the same time they remain in a niche market which is not necessarily a good thing for them in the long term, especially considering how cheap PC laptops have become. but i guess the fact that some people have managed to run XP on a powerbook is not a just mere attempt at glory and that apple may have to take that into account at some point and devise ways to make their laptops more accessible.
Personally, I would never buy one without support for the OS, so if Vista can't run on it, I won't be an Apple customer. It's a poor choice for both MS and Apple, if they don't cooperate to make it work. Apple would get my computer money, and MS would still get my cash (I'd even pay more for Vista to run on a Mac).
Won't hold my breath, though. Now if only Dell would buy Sony's screen and webcam, I'd be happy enough.
same here i would never take the risk of running a windows OS on a mac powerbook unless it is officially endorsed by apple. too damn risky, warranties would be void if anything went wrong, not to mention the lack of support if the system crashes etc. But i'm kinda secretly hoping that some people will do it and start a trend that would somehow force apple rethink their exclusive OS policy and make their products a bit more mainstream and affordable without compromising on the quality. probably wishful thinking though, diehard macsters would probably think apple is selling its soul to the devil in doing so. still a shame though, because i would seriously consider buying a mac notebook if the range of software avalaible for PC's was also available for macs. and i'm sure i'm not the only one.
XP installed on a mactel
oh, yeah. can't wait to get the macbook.
Dual-booting is uncool.
Virtualization is where its at.
holy crap.
i guess i'm getting a macbook too. so much for all the laptop research i was doing.
careful now.
nobody's actually installed a host of the programs architects usually use yet. no word on performance yet either. give it a week and we'll probably know more.
But I suspect all will be well, the fact that they got vga graphics working is no small feat.
supposedly the hack is availible for download, but I can't connect to the site (probably swamped). Doesn't matter, I suppose, I don't have a mactel to try.
Mac video cards are different from PC cards, so another consideration is that the hacked macintels will probably be using hacked drivers, which is not good for stability.
nobody thought it wouldn't be possible...what I am praying for is that this will be endorsed, eventually. It can't hurt Apple, as they'll be getting tons of new customers and will probably still charge for their software.
My bet is on Vista working on it without a hack (but I know nothing about all this stuff, just that I want one!)
I just had a look through the files and instructions....even with detailed instructions, it's not a simple procedure if you're not a computer person, and you need a windows PC with Nero to set up the install disc.
apple will never sanction it.
I just want to see someone compare running heavy openGL applications on an equivalent PC and on XOM (xp on mac)
if they wind up within 5% performance, I might just get a second gen macbook toward the end of the year.
why wouldn't apple sanction it? it just opens up their market share
it's microsoft that might not approve as you have to modify and burn a Win XP cd to make it work.
Apple doesn't want people calling with windows questions - they want their hands washed of the whole endevor...so they'll continue to not do or say anything one way or the other about it.
the people who want to do it will still do it, just knowing that anything they mess up is their own damn fault.
also: there's nothing illegal about slipstreaming updates or drivers onto a windows cd image. corporate users do it all the time. microsoft may not like it, but it isn't anything illegal, or even against the EULA, AFAIK.
1
Apple have already said they will not actively prevent people running windows on a mac (although they will defend against people running OSX on a PC).
2
Although slipstreaming drivers into a windows install is not against the EULA, narf's solution includes replacing windows files with hacked versions, and slipstreaming those into the install, which is against the EULA, I think.
3
Lots of people hoped that Vista would run without a hack on a macintel, but this week Microsoft announced that Vista will not include EFI support, only traditional BIOS. Macintels do not have BIOS support, only EFI. Vista will need a hack, too.
In any event I think you'd have to try very very hard to find someone who hasn't broken a EULA...
Even harder might be finding someone who's actually read one...
As I understand it, "normal" slipstreaming (drivers and software) modifies some windows files, so I assume the modified files might not be such a huge deal. I'm not about to read the EULA to find out, though - I think it's around 18 pages now.
I was told that EFI will be supported in the 64 bit edition of vista. This doesn't help the current 32 bit mactels, but the next gen will have 64 bit support. (based on merom/conroe/woodcrest). probably still to early to tell for sure, but it might work.
will definitely be interesting to see how this pans out.
I have been using macs since 3rd grade, and my frist laptop was the Powerbook Titanium 500.
But now, the titanium is deteriorating-cracking and corroding, and many others have the same problem. It costs 600 bucks to fix, but my powerbook can literally crumble apart anyday. It still works illustrator and stuff wonderfully, its just the metal body...
Thats why im skeptical of first-generation(intel) mac laptops- you can end up as a ginea pig...
I would love to be able to buy a mac with a windows environment, for while i cannot stand the OS X interface i still think mac powerbooks are stunnigly beautiful. The design don't come cheap unfortunately and Mac laptops remain rather exclusive machines. it's probably apple's policy to keep it that way, they probably do not want to dumb down their products with microsoft ones but at the same time they remain in a niche market which is not necessarily a good thing for them in the long term, especially considering how cheap PC laptops have become. but i guess the fact that some people have managed to run XP on a powerbook is not a just mere attempt at glory and that apple may have to take that into account at some point and devise ways to make their laptops more accessible.
I am with you doberman. I hate mac's OS X.
Personally, I would never buy one without support for the OS, so if Vista can't run on it, I won't be an Apple customer. It's a poor choice for both MS and Apple, if they don't cooperate to make it work. Apple would get my computer money, and MS would still get my cash (I'd even pay more for Vista to run on a Mac).
Won't hold my breath, though. Now if only Dell would buy Sony's screen and webcam, I'd be happy enough.
same here i would never take the risk of running a windows OS on a mac powerbook unless it is officially endorsed by apple. too damn risky, warranties would be void if anything went wrong, not to mention the lack of support if the system crashes etc. But i'm kinda secretly hoping that some people will do it and start a trend that would somehow force apple rethink their exclusive OS policy and make their products a bit more mainstream and affordable without compromising on the quality. probably wishful thinking though, diehard macsters would probably think apple is selling its soul to the devil in doing so. still a shame though, because i would seriously consider buying a mac notebook if the range of software avalaible for PC's was also available for macs. and i'm sure i'm not the only one.
Voided warranty? It's just software, wipe the drive before you send it in.
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