Most of the architects claim that they can work as interior designers. Some of the greatest architects have infact created most beautiful interiors. So, if architects can do the works of an interior designer, how important is the existence of this profession? Or can architects really function as designers as well?
It is def harder to go the other way, an interior person doing architecture. But talented people can do either.
I have known some very good interior designers that could design most anything and come up with things I never would have. Interiors people get more training in colors, textiles, and acoustics than I did, but I feel I can do a good job at any of those things and have done some very successful (small) strictly interiors projects. Interiors people can get more into selecting art work, window coverings, knick-knacks etc.
I think it is a taste preference, what do you like to design? Knowing that the boundaries can be blurred often.
How about Ergonomists in the same breath, or Project Management as a separate discipline, or cost consultancy, or any kind of building engineer or surveyor. It is Adam Smith's division of labour as the primary force in the progress of opulence. Specialisation is the future, and unfortunately the necessary ingredient for flourishing capitalism. This is why we have specialist CAD monkeys. Or Excel Junkies, or bricklayers...
psyarch, that's a beautiful world you paint with designers, project managers and the technical guys all working on the assembly line. no doubt, the specialization formula is making a few (read: leaders of big firms) rich, but who went into architecture with the idea of underpinning a flourishing capitalism. Sure, you've got architects who are better at design that code interpretation, but it doesn’t take much reduction to see the problems that arise when these are treated as hermetic specialties.
There is a distinct difference between interior designers and decorators.....those who are decorators and not interior designers should have their swags clipped, there faux painted white, and their
antiques reclassified as hobo junk.
u were the mother of three girls so sweet
who climbed through the turnstiles
and climbed to the street
but after conception your body lay cold
and withered through autumn and you found yourself old
can you tell me why you have been so sad
he took a lover on a faraway beach
while you arranged flowers and picked color schemes
the girls were all there and they traded their vows
the youngest one glared with furrowed brow
they tenderly kissed and then cut the cake
the bride then tripped and broke the vase
the one thought would spend the years
so perfectly placed below the mirror
arriving late you clean the debris
and walked into the angry sea
the ones i have worked with were awful. like trading spaces (or whatever it is called)...the developers picked em, not me. it was truly painful.
i do most of the interior type stuff on my own now. i really think interior and exterior can't be treated as separate entities anyway, but wouldn't mind working with someone like petra blaisse if the chance came up...
in my view, the tendency toward "architectural arrogance" continues to be a bane for our profession ... architects often have a broad knowledge, but that knowledge often is rather thin ... we take courses in structures, but we can't really design a beam or a connection ... we take courses in acoustics, but we still need acoustical consultants ... what we know often helps us to integrate the work of others who are much better equipped to make the final technical or design decision ... what we know doesn't qualify us to make every decision on a project at the level required
our firm employs quite a large number of well trained and highly qualified interior designers ... the architects in our firm respect their contribution to the design process and the talents they bring to the final project design ... we engage them early in the process and we don't just wait until the end so they can "decorate" our design ... it takes a collaborative attitude, but there's no reason whatsoever to look down upon either the abilities or the contributions of these fine professionals
i agree comb. i also see a similar attitude amongst some graphic designers too. they hesitate to have someone else work on "their" project because only they know best. it's a shame. i think if people took a similar collaborative effort with their ciients, they might often get a richer project. i often hear disparaging comments made about clients here and in office settings. i'm not saying that all clients are great or know best. i do find that they often have very valuable thoughts, and if they feel like they are heard and a integral part of the process, they will give you more latitude to create an even richer project. remember, they are the reason we have a job in the first place.
I did find myself caught between and interior designer and a client a number of years ago. It was one of those situations where the grand dame client, really had her act together and caught the interior designer trying to take advantage of her. You know, I can get this
french dining room table at 50% off but when it arrives it is full price plus a designer fee which is equal to the value of the table. The Client
whom I might add, referenced herself as an Industrialist, founded a very profitable corporation sent the interior designer walking with her
head down for her unprofessional antics. The Client has since passed
and I will always remember our very first conversation as I qoute her,
"I'm looking for a dreamer, and the only thing I don't have is time,
can we get this show on the road." We did and she is till this day one of my favorite clients. The interior designer on the other hand, well we have yet to work together on another project.
in my world, designers who receive compensation built into the cost of furniture they select tend to be of the "decorator" sort and mostly work in residential and very small scale commercial
in the mainstream commercial world, interior designers more frequently tend to operate along the same lines as architects -- i.e. they work for professional fees and the ff&e is purchased by the owner directly or through a 3rd party purchasing agent.
yeah, I could see if you were spec'ing an office building it'd not be good to double the cost of every chair, but then again, that's why they are coming to you - you are the professional and only you can get the discount.
Seems like it'd be bad judgement to intentionally refuse profit, especially considering how little arch's make anyway. Client never needs to know what you get them for, that's your business and your negotiations with the furniture manufacturer's.
I dunno, seems like this profession likes to discount itself to the point of being poor.
So, if architects can do the works of an interior designer, how important is the existence of this profession? Or can architects really function as designers as well?
The eternal debate "What is the role of the architect ?"
someone wrote this :--in my view, the tendency toward "architectural arrogance" continues to be a bane for our profession ... architects often have a broad knowledge, but that knowledge often is rather thin ... we take courses in structures, but we can't really design a beam or a connection ... we take courses in acoustics, but we still need acoustical consultants ... what we know often helps us to integrate the work of others who are much better equipped to make the final technical or design decision ... what we know doesn't qualify us to make every decision on a project at the level required
just a small bit of historical trivia....I think it may be a little if not totally related with the topic.
In ancient Egypt ,( and I think it was true also for ancient greece,persia,India and rome )..... the guys who became "architects" finished their education at the apprx age of 50.
well the started off in their teens like all of us generally...but they had to study almost everything on earth unrelated to conventional fields of arch education such as art,sculpture,medicine, psychology,entire laws of their time ,their religious scriptures, all sciences, non-sciences etc.
studying all that , interning etc took up that many years...then after they completed mastering all that..only then they could be termed or commissioned as Architect.
this was done because the architect was supposed to have a holistic knowledge of the "world".
It was something akin to becoming a creator.."If you wanna be a creator..you must know as much as possible about creation"...and also because ancient egypt was very obsessed with architecture (and death ).
Architects in Ancient Egypt worked only for the Royal family and other nobility.(this tradition continued in all civilisations before our present one )..the laity built their own shelters by themselves.
the egyptian archs officially wore only purple or gold ..and they sat next to the king on a high point and merely overlooked/supervised armies of engineers , structural designers,carvers,sculptors,slaves and heck they maybe even commanded armies of interior decorators etc .
well that may have taken the most part of your life to get there but its unnecessary to state what prestige,power and moolah the profession held,......
The mastery of anything and everything should be the sole ground for arrogance ..that and that only.
It was not for chickensh*t that our profession was/is called the Noble profession but of course that was the past and times have "changed".
Well there are alot of chairs out there designed by other modernist which I would classify as equally uncomfortable....and yes I have sat in one of his chairs.
I thought calling them interior designers was out, a big big no no? Or is that just in the uk? & Commonwealth? Interior Architects seem to be the catch phrase now, but it covers a whole manner of sins some new. I think they serve a vital function but they too are being undermined by decorators. I find however whilst architects are more particularly prefering to work in a specific oevre int. architects are more keen to satisfy the "tastes" not necessarily the brief. I worked for an int. architect learned alot but not willing to do tha again.
Heimarmene, I think Chayo has designed a few chairs. Maybe I should ask him if he could post some of his commerical work. I think you might be suprised cause most likely you have encountered it on this side of the pond.
i'm actually encouraged by ASID's decision to allow full membership in their organization only to "registered" interior designers (i.e. NCIDQ) ... while i'm not entirely clear about what it takes to become a registered ID, it would seem that this will begin to provide some meaningful differentiation betweent the truly qualified interior designers and the decorators ... it's an effort at professionalism
architechnophilia ... it's not clear to me that the term "interior architect" has gained much traction in the US yet ... i believe to use that term appropriately, one must pass the licensure qualifications required of architects ... at which point, there seems little value in differentiating one's self any further ... i do believe that if indivduals with ID educations and ID experience start calling themselves "interior architects" you'll see a great deal of teeth-grinding by both the aia and the various state boards of architects.
architects vs. interior designers
Most of the architects claim that they can work as interior designers. Some of the greatest architects have infact created most beautiful interiors. So, if architects can do the works of an interior designer, how important is the existence of this profession? Or can architects really function as designers as well?
It is def harder to go the other way, an interior person doing architecture. But talented people can do either.
I have known some very good interior designers that could design most anything and come up with things I never would have. Interiors people get more training in colors, textiles, and acoustics than I did, but I feel I can do a good job at any of those things and have done some very successful (small) strictly interiors projects. Interiors people can get more into selecting art work, window coverings, knick-knacks etc.
I think it is a taste preference, what do you like to design? Knowing that the boundaries can be blurred often.
How about Ergonomists in the same breath, or Project Management as a separate discipline, or cost consultancy, or any kind of building engineer or surveyor. It is Adam Smith's division of labour as the primary force in the progress of opulence. Specialisation is the future, and unfortunately the necessary ingredient for flourishing capitalism. This is why we have specialist CAD monkeys. Or Excel Junkies, or bricklayers...
in a fight, i pick the architects any day
Momentum, I agree, in bed, I pick the architect any day
I think interiordesigners should be locked up , and brought blindfolded from building to building .
I think interiordesigners should be locked up , and brought blindfolded from building to building .
psyarch, that's a beautiful world you paint with designers, project managers and the technical guys all working on the assembly line. no doubt, the specialization formula is making a few (read: leaders of big firms) rich, but who went into architecture with the idea of underpinning a flourishing capitalism. Sure, you've got architects who are better at design that code interpretation, but it doesn’t take much reduction to see the problems that arise when these are treated as hermetic specialties.
There is a distinct difference between interior designers and decorators.....those who are decorators and not interior designers should have their swags clipped, there faux painted white, and their
antiques reclassified as hobo junk.
u were the mother of three girls so sweet
who climbed through the turnstiles
and climbed to the street
but after conception your body lay cold
and withered through autumn and you found yourself old
can you tell me why you have been so sad
he took a lover on a faraway beach
while you arranged flowers and picked color schemes
the girls were all there and they traded their vows
the youngest one glared with furrowed brow
they tenderly kissed and then cut the cake
the bride then tripped and broke the vase
the one thought would spend the years
so perfectly placed below the mirror
arriving late you clean the debris
and walked into the angry sea
and it felt like falling in love again...
the ones i have worked with were awful. like trading spaces (or whatever it is called)...the developers picked em, not me. it was truly painful.
i do most of the interior type stuff on my own now. i really think interior and exterior can't be treated as separate entities anyway, but wouldn't mind working with someone like petra blaisse if the chance came up...
"the ones i have worked with were awful."
ah yes, but couldn't that be said about people with every profession?
yup.
- from: you know you were or are an arch student when...
in my view, the tendency toward "architectural arrogance" continues to be a bane for our profession ... architects often have a broad knowledge, but that knowledge often is rather thin ... we take courses in structures, but we can't really design a beam or a connection ... we take courses in acoustics, but we still need acoustical consultants ... what we know often helps us to integrate the work of others who are much better equipped to make the final technical or design decision ... what we know doesn't qualify us to make every decision on a project at the level required
our firm employs quite a large number of well trained and highly qualified interior designers ... the architects in our firm respect their contribution to the design process and the talents they bring to the final project design ... we engage them early in the process and we don't just wait until the end so they can "decorate" our design ... it takes a collaborative attitude, but there's no reason whatsoever to look down upon either the abilities or the contributions of these fine professionals
i agree comb. i also see a similar attitude amongst some graphic designers too. they hesitate to have someone else work on "their" project because only they know best. it's a shame. i think if people took a similar collaborative effort with their ciients, they might often get a richer project. i often hear disparaging comments made about clients here and in office settings. i'm not saying that all clients are great or know best. i do find that they often have very valuable thoughts, and if they feel like they are heard and a integral part of the process, they will give you more latitude to create an even richer project. remember, they are the reason we have a job in the first place.
BEGIN: sarcasm
heck ... architecture'd be a great profession, if it weren't for the a) clients, b) consultants, c) contractors, and d) colleagues in our firm
hey ... it'd be just like school, where we get to do all the work and make all the decisions ourselves
course ... we'd never get anything built
END: sarcasm
heh, heh, heh.
heh, heh, heh.
'a lot of architects can design a lot of bad interiors'
i wonder if vado ever said this.
said it? man i've done it...
I did find myself caught between and interior designer and a client a number of years ago. It was one of those situations where the grand dame client, really had her act together and caught the interior designer trying to take advantage of her. You know, I can get this
french dining room table at 50% off but when it arrives it is full price plus a designer fee which is equal to the value of the table. The Client
whom I might add, referenced herself as an Industrialist, founded a very profitable corporation sent the interior designer walking with her
head down for her unprofessional antics. The Client has since passed
and I will always remember our very first conversation as I qoute her,
"I'm looking for a dreamer, and the only thing I don't have is time,
can we get this show on the road." We did and she is till this day one of my favorite clients. The interior designer on the other hand, well we have yet to work together on another project.
charging retail would be expected, I think (the 'designer fee', beyond the hours, is ridiculous - just charge more per hour if you can get it).
From my very limited experience and exposure, interior designers make a decent amount more than architects.
in my world, designers who receive compensation built into the cost of furniture they select tend to be of the "decorator" sort and mostly work in residential and very small scale commercial
in the mainstream commercial world, interior designers more frequently tend to operate along the same lines as architects -- i.e. they work for professional fees and the ff&e is purchased by the owner directly or through a 3rd party purchasing agent.
well its more profitable to be an interior designer...
most of the firms that i've worked with does both. in fact we used to insist that we do the interiors for the buildings we design.
the clients usually agree thinking that its a good deal. So do we ..
while we're on the topic ... what did you think of the interiors that zaha did for monsoon restaurant (i think thats what it was called??)
yeah, I could see if you were spec'ing an office building it'd not be good to double the cost of every chair, but then again, that's why they are coming to you - you are the professional and only you can get the discount.
Seems like it'd be bad judgement to intentionally refuse profit, especially considering how little arch's make anyway. Client never needs to know what you get them for, that's your business and your negotiations with the furniture manufacturer's.
I dunno, seems like this profession likes to discount itself to the point of being poor.
The eternal debate "What is the role of the architect ?"
someone wrote this :--in my view, the tendency toward "architectural arrogance" continues to be a bane for our profession ... architects often have a broad knowledge, but that knowledge often is rather thin ... we take courses in structures, but we can't really design a beam or a connection ... we take courses in acoustics, but we still need acoustical consultants ... what we know often helps us to integrate the work of others who are much better equipped to make the final technical or design decision ... what we know doesn't qualify us to make every decision on a project at the level required
just a small bit of historical trivia....I think it may be a little if not totally related with the topic.
In ancient Egypt ,( and I think it was true also for ancient greece,persia,India and rome )..... the guys who became "architects" finished their education at the apprx age of 50.
well the started off in their teens like all of us generally...but they had to study almost everything on earth unrelated to conventional fields of arch education such as art,sculpture,medicine, psychology,entire laws of their time ,their religious scriptures, all sciences, non-sciences etc.
studying all that , interning etc took up that many years...then after they completed mastering all that..only then they could be termed or commissioned as Architect.
this was done because the architect was supposed to have a holistic knowledge of the "world".
It was something akin to becoming a creator.."If you wanna be a creator..you must know as much as possible about creation"...and also because ancient egypt was very obsessed with architecture (and death ).
Architects in Ancient Egypt worked only for the Royal family and other nobility.(this tradition continued in all civilisations before our present one )..the laity built their own shelters by themselves.
the egyptian archs officially wore only purple or gold ..and they sat next to the king on a high point and merely overlooked/supervised armies of engineers , structural designers,carvers,sculptors,slaves and heck they maybe even commanded armies of interior decorators etc .
well that may have taken the most part of your life to get there but its unnecessary to state what prestige,power and moolah the profession held,......
The mastery of anything and everything should be the sole ground for arrogance ..that and that only.
It was not for chickensh*t that our profession was/is called the Noble profession but of course that was the past and times have "changed".
ah , yes !
The greatest artists are those who use humanity as their material and history as their canvas.
Frank did it so well!...and that isn't the new Frank!
... did you EVER sit in one of his chairs ?
Well there are alot of chairs out there designed by other modernist which I would classify as equally uncomfortable....and yes I have sat in one of his chairs.
I thought calling them interior designers was out, a big big no no? Or is that just in the uk? & Commonwealth? Interior Architects seem to be the catch phrase now, but it covers a whole manner of sins some new. I think they serve a vital function but they too are being undermined by decorators. I find however whilst architects are more particularly prefering to work in a specific oevre int. architects are more keen to satisfy the "tastes" not necessarily the brief. I worked for an int. architect learned alot but not willing to do tha again.
interior designers i've met think architects design structures while they design the "space"... [raised eyebrows and a wtf!!!]
@snooker,
Here's a chair for comfort...
http://www.asinine.org/albums/London/IMG_2566_British_Museum_Chair_of_Guns.jpg
Heimarmene, I think Chayo has designed a few chairs. Maybe I should ask him if he could post some of his commerical work. I think you might be suprised cause most likely you have encountered it on this side of the pond.
i'm actually encouraged by ASID's decision to allow full membership in their organization only to "registered" interior designers (i.e. NCIDQ) ... while i'm not entirely clear about what it takes to become a registered ID, it would seem that this will begin to provide some meaningful differentiation betweent the truly qualified interior designers and the decorators ... it's an effort at professionalism
architechnophilia ... it's not clear to me that the term "interior architect" has gained much traction in the US yet ... i believe to use that term appropriately, one must pass the licensure qualifications required of architects ... at which point, there seems little value in differentiating one's self any further ... i do believe that if indivduals with ID educations and ID experience start calling themselves "interior architects" you'll see a great deal of teeth-grinding by both the aia and the various state boards of architects.
again it seems the uk has won the battle of acceptance and trouble I'm sure.
exterior designer
has a nice ring
exterior designer
has a nice ring
and, i just discovered how to inadvertently double post
and, i just discovered how to inadvertently double post
Sitting on History
- Bill Woodrow
Another British contribution to comfortable chairs ... currently located in the Entrance Hall of The British Library at St. Pancras
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