Now having been a follower of the Archinect boards for a while I do not know how seriously to take these figures. They make architecture actually look like a viable career where as everyone here seems to be going on about how they make 30000 after their Harvard gsd degrees and getting a graduate degree is pointless since you have no hope of paying off M.Arch debt etc.
Is it just only the unlucky ones on the boards or is the AIA full of it?
Honestly, the numbers above are a good bit higher than what I am seeing, but I am in Fort Myers, and I am not running a mega-firm.
I don't make that, and the people working for me don't make that, even though they are worth every bit of that and more. The money is just not there. So I try to make up for it in other ways that may not put a lot of extra money in their pockets, but give them job satisfaction and quality of life. Candidates should keep those things in mind as well when evaluating the compensation they are offered.
- since the biggest numbers of architects are in cities like NY, SF, LA, etc, those salaries are probably tilted toward the higher averages in those cities. I can tell you that the salaries quoted above look high to me for seniority grades below PM (possibly because they include overtime?) and low to me for the titled seniority grades. Note that Arch 3s at many firms also have a titled grade (such as A, SA, AP, SAP or principal). Generally, Arch 3's have at least 10 years of experience. Principals at the large corporate firms make alot more than indicated... Directors of design and managing principals and the like probably make twice or at last 50-80% as much again as what is shown.
- salaries nationwide are decilning for MOST professions. It doesn't matter that inflation was 5.2%. Salaries / average employee have plunged something like 9% nationally over that time period. Architects and designers may be stagnating or making a little less, but strangely, we're actually outperforming the economy as a whole. The bottom has fallen out on industrial process engineers and automotive design engineers, it's been OK for architects and civil engineers, and it's been quite good for computer engineers and programmers. Lawyers still make more money than we do, but their average comp has fallen by the mid-teens (and unemployment is astoundingly high.. top law schools are yielding up to 40%-60% unemployment among new grads). Anyone without a college degree is now in big trouble. Overall, we're hurting but less than many others in America. The country isn't doing that well these days and hasn't (in terms of pay, in real terms, since the mid 1970s). Generally speaking, for those of us born after 1970 or so, for the same jobs, adjusted for inflation, we make less than our parents did at the same age (except for professions like investment banking and private equity).
- Work for architects have shifted to international and publicly linked projects. Those in the larger firms, dependent as they are on Asian and South American growth, have done relatively well. This will continue until those economies get in trouble too, unless the US economy starts to pick up. Publicly linked projects (airports, border crossings, hospitals, prisons, stadia, convention centers, etc) look increasingly like trouble given public budget cut backs, which means firms that specialize in such domestic projects may be facing problems going forward.
- urban planners, urban designers and civil engineers (who have higher representation than architects do in the public sector or at least on public sector projects) have generally done better much than architects in both compensation and employment during the recession. However, post-recession, with more municipalities and government agencies laying off or at least not hiring and major infrastructure projects getting suspending, they've done worse. Quid-pro-quo
- real estate development professionals (and particularly home builders) are mostly now employed in other fields. their bottom fell out and it isn't coming back with any speed. The one exception up until now has been those who develop affordable housing (using government programs); however, with the budget problems in Congress, that's changing too, which means they're in trouble as well.
- building mechanical and electrical engineers and some civil/structural (as opposed to civil/site) engineers have done exceedingly well, but mostly because our schools have an (increasing) structural problem in producing enough of them and because of competition from other fields (namely from sustainablity consultants) for their skills.
- sustainablity, regardless of the profession, has done relatively well, but mostly because of the novelty of it and because of the "learn-on-the-job" nature of the experience required to date. This will change quickly.
- landscape archs aren't doing that well. Many that I know are unemployed and, unfortunately, I've had little in the way of reference I can fairly give them. Landscape design budgets are among the first to be cut and landscape projects are among the first to get suspended in tough times.
Dec 6, 11 11:03 pm ·
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How true is this info?
Architect magazine has posted their figures from the AIA on what the current levels of compensation look like across the US
http://www.architectmagazine.com/compensation/who-makes-what.aspx
Now having been a follower of the Archinect boards for a while I do not know how seriously to take these figures. They make architecture actually look like a viable career where as everyone here seems to be going on about how they make 30000 after their Harvard gsd degrees and getting a graduate degree is pointless since you have no hope of paying off M.Arch debt etc.
Is it just only the unlucky ones on the boards or is the AIA full of it?
interesting.
You are not looking at the numbers carefully. "By the numbers" breakdown is most telling. Here is what you get if you crunch the numbers:
According to DOL, inflation between '08-'11 was 5.2%. This list only represents the gainfully employed. Draw your own conclusions.
Honestly, the numbers above are a good bit higher than what I am seeing, but I am in Fort Myers, and I am not running a mega-firm.
I don't make that, and the people working for me don't make that, even though they are worth every bit of that and more. The money is just not there. So I try to make up for it in other ways that may not put a lot of extra money in their pockets, but give them job satisfaction and quality of life. Candidates should keep those things in mind as well when evaluating the compensation they are offered.
A few impressions that may be of interest:
- since the biggest numbers of architects are in cities like NY, SF, LA, etc, those salaries are probably tilted toward the higher averages in those cities. I can tell you that the salaries quoted above look high to me for seniority grades below PM (possibly because they include overtime?) and low to me for the titled seniority grades. Note that Arch 3s at many firms also have a titled grade (such as A, SA, AP, SAP or principal). Generally, Arch 3's have at least 10 years of experience. Principals at the large corporate firms make alot more than indicated... Directors of design and managing principals and the like probably make twice or at last 50-80% as much again as what is shown.
- salaries nationwide are decilning for MOST professions. It doesn't matter that inflation was 5.2%. Salaries / average employee have plunged something like 9% nationally over that time period. Architects and designers may be stagnating or making a little less, but strangely, we're actually outperforming the economy as a whole. The bottom has fallen out on industrial process engineers and automotive design engineers, it's been OK for architects and civil engineers, and it's been quite good for computer engineers and programmers. Lawyers still make more money than we do, but their average comp has fallen by the mid-teens (and unemployment is astoundingly high.. top law schools are yielding up to 40%-60% unemployment among new grads). Anyone without a college degree is now in big trouble. Overall, we're hurting but less than many others in America. The country isn't doing that well these days and hasn't (in terms of pay, in real terms, since the mid 1970s). Generally speaking, for those of us born after 1970 or so, for the same jobs, adjusted for inflation, we make less than our parents did at the same age (except for professions like investment banking and private equity).
- Work for architects have shifted to international and publicly linked projects. Those in the larger firms, dependent as they are on Asian and South American growth, have done relatively well. This will continue until those economies get in trouble too, unless the US economy starts to pick up. Publicly linked projects (airports, border crossings, hospitals, prisons, stadia, convention centers, etc) look increasingly like trouble given public budget cut backs, which means firms that specialize in such domestic projects may be facing problems going forward.
- urban planners, urban designers and civil engineers (who have higher representation than architects do in the public sector or at least on public sector projects) have generally done better much than architects in both compensation and employment during the recession. However, post-recession, with more municipalities and government agencies laying off or at least not hiring and major infrastructure projects getting suspending, they've done worse. Quid-pro-quo
- real estate development professionals (and particularly home builders) are mostly now employed in other fields. their bottom fell out and it isn't coming back with any speed. The one exception up until now has been those who develop affordable housing (using government programs); however, with the budget problems in Congress, that's changing too, which means they're in trouble as well.
- building mechanical and electrical engineers and some civil/structural (as opposed to civil/site) engineers have done exceedingly well, but mostly because our schools have an (increasing) structural problem in producing enough of them and because of competition from other fields (namely from sustainablity consultants) for their skills.
- sustainablity, regardless of the profession, has done relatively well, but mostly because of the novelty of it and because of the "learn-on-the-job" nature of the experience required to date. This will change quickly.
- landscape archs aren't doing that well. Many that I know are unemployed and, unfortunately, I've had little in the way of reference I can fairly give them. Landscape design budgets are among the first to be cut and landscape projects are among the first to get suspended in tough times.
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