Well, after all that talk about laptops, I think I'm going to build a kickass desktop. Sure laptops have thier advantages, but for less than a good laptop, I can have a killer desktop. We're talking 256 MB ATI FireGL and dual monitors for just over $2200.
That said:
#1 AMD 64 bit 3400+ or dual Xeons (looks to run about the same bling)
#2 Do I need 2 DVD drives (1 burn, 1 read only, basing this off a Dell workstation)
#3 Do I need 2 HDD? Saw a Dell with an 80 and a 120 GB. Is that overkill/add on later if you need it?
#4 Suggestions for monitors. I'm looking 17-19" good one (Dell, Sony?) and then a 15 inch crap one. Main work would be on the good monitor with pallettes and junk on the smaller, cheaper monitor. What brands do you like for the good one (I know there are $1000+ ones, I'm looking in the $550-700 range)
you dont need 2 dvd drives, or 2 hard drives. you can always buy another down the road.
as far as monitors go for what you can spend you can afford a good 21 inch. I bought my sony e540 refurbished from overstock for only a couple hundred bucks. great monitor. after I bought mine my old roomate bought 2. no problems with them.
that said I find it hard to believe that you will be able to build a computer with top of the line components and dual monitors for 2200. can you write out everything you are getting and where?
My experience with monitors:
Currently on a Dell 17" - nice but nothing special
Used to use both Sony and Veiwsonic 19" flat screen CRT's. I liked both but the sony had a bad pixel (unusual for sony I thought), and the Viewsonic was way cheaper.
If it was my money, I'd have a good look at viewsonic 21" and 19" flat screen CRT's.
Ok, I slightly underestimated. But not much. I looked everything up on Newegg.com and rounded everything up to the nearest $50. This is to account for little things I might have forgotten or slight spec changes.
4 fan case $100
DVD burner $100
AMD Athlon 64 3400+ $450
Mobo $150
ATI 256 MB Fire GL $650
200 GB HDD $150
1 GB RAM $200
Sony 19" LCD $600
Total = $2400
So I was a little low. You ask, "where is monitor #2?" The idea was to get a cheap LCD for less important stuff like pallettes and text and have the whole 19 inch just for work. I've seen 14-15 inch LCDs for $150. I bet they are like 3 year old laptop screens, but could be fine. I'm looking into LCD because as we all know, a 19 inch CRT is huge. I have a 17" Samsung flatscreen CRT now that I love, but it's HUGE. And studio desk space is a premium. Although I may run the CRT as the second. So I think it's safe to say you could build a solid machine for about $2600. $1800 for just the CPU.
Just a few suggestions:
Depending on what software you'll be working with (but 3DSMax esp), it's my understanding there is more value in having dual Pentium 4's with hyperthreading.
Also, I've heard the resolution/clarity on LCD's doesn't come close to that of CRT's, which also might pose problems in 3D work (I don't have any personal experience with graphics on LCD's... maybe someone else can offer advise here.
And I think you'd be better off having (2) hardrives with RAID functionality (this came in handy BIG TIME in school, esp. if you're building your own machine).
coincidentally, im building myself a kick-ass dual machine now too
if i understand correctly, are you looking for dual xeons??? - since the equivalent of a xeon then is an AMD opteron - which is 64 bit and is really kick ass. i will post some links here for you to understand their benchmark tests of the Xeon against the Opteron. We here did a lot of research on it and decided for going for the Opteron.
For the Video Card, you might also want to look at the NVidia Quadro FX series....and if you are running maya, then do look at the qualification chart URL i will also post below...Maya seems to love the quadro cards and i think you can get the Quadro FX 500 for about 350$ only.
As for the CD/DVD drives, i am going to go for a DVD RW/CD RW combo and a CDR/DVDR...just for copying disks sometimes (and my office is going to pay for this!!!)
and 2 HDDs is a good bet
you might want to have the master as a 40GB one, and the slave as a 80GB one...the samsung 40 GB ones are much more stable and have a faster seek rate too.
The main reason Im going to AMD is for their 64 bit processing capabilities, and though windows xp pro is just 32 bit now, they are plannign to ship their 64 bit version, and in say 2 years, 64 bit processing is going to be 'the thing'
hope this helps you and please dont mind asking more questions, you will start getting issues with the AMD motherboard (im giong for a MSI motherboard)-but if you do, just ask!!!
hasslehoff - I missed the part about it being for a studio computer... I can understand the LCD(s). damn I didnt realize that dvd burners were that cheap already. huh, might have to check into one.
good luck with your build. have you built before?
maybe want to think about a couple or a few hard drives, maybe a raid setup or use the smaller faster drives -scsi 10000 rpm.. but $$$
good luck.
Yeah, I've been Frankensteining my current PC for about 5 years. It's time for a new one though. I think I'm going to do what sameolddoctor said and get the 40 GB and 80GB combo. I'm warry of RAID as I hear, when it works it's brilliant, but when it fails, it's a nightmare.
Close in price, and a 3 yr warranty with great tech support (I know, I use it). The Dell 19" LCD is really sweet, I've got one in the office. Faster ram here, too, and you can upgrade to 400 if you want. Larger hard drive, also. Obviously, you can lower the cost several ways. I am not sure how this P4 compares, but this about the machine I'll be getting soon, sans LCD (I want the 20"!).
Preliminary Ship Date5
7/9/2004
Need it sooner
Dell Precision Workstation 360
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$2,741
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That is a pretty good deal. But I want the ATI card and it seems as though you have to special order it (custom build your own). The ATI card has twice the RAM and a higher clock speed. As far as I know, the Quadro 500 is the lowest model they make. Plus, the Athlon 64s outperform the P4 in many tests. And when 64 bit Windows comes out, it should be hot.
Once the nForce3 motherboard comes out, the Athlon 64 should totally rule the P4EE. I saw some bench marks and it was pretty amazing and it was running on the board I posted.
ok. Be careful of the tests you read. I've seen some AMD tests that looked great, but were misleading and incorrect (kind of like when the G5 was the 'fastest' machine, but it really wasn't).
I'd stay away from the FireGL cards, but I really don't know too much about them. I've only heard bad stuff, at least related to Max. Also remember that nvidia works with Discreet for specific drivers.
Also, don't forget about the 64 bit deal. Until the software companies write the software for it, it means nothing. So Discreet and co will have to re write Max, and I wouldn't hold my breath about that anytime soon, at least not until Intel offers their new chips.
I thought about AMDs for a while, but all the tests I've seen they did not do better, and prices wise, the ones comparable to the Xeons aren't any cheaper.
It's all what you want, though. I'd just never build my own machine and the 3 years next day onsite is priceless (I had my nvidia graphic card, that had a bad fan, replaced in about 20 hours or so, after a 15 minute call to diagnose it, as I had no idea what the noise was).
Ok, I am done. Eitherway, you'll have a rockin' machine!!
hey hassellhoff,
you might want to look at the maya qualification charts, they say they have absolutely NO ISSUES with the quadro fx 500,1000 etc cards...and the quadro fx500 is just for 250-300$
Sameolddoctor: Can you give me some tips on the dual Opterons? How would dual 244s compare to a Athlon 64 3400+? Do you need to do anything weird with RAM? I.e. if you put in 2x512, will it always access the whole 1GB or only when certain software uses dual processors, or would you need to put in 2GB? Does it always use the dual processors or only certain software? I've never done a multi-processor machine. I saw some bench marks and it showed the dual 244($307 each) being pretty close to a dual 3.0GHz Xeon ($470 each) machine. I'm just wondering how it would compare to the machine that Penn offers through Dell.
guys,
i have a quick question about a graphic card. What's good for my desktop? 64MB DDR NVIDIA® GeForce4 MXTM graphics card. I am looking for dell 2600c. slim computer and it has only that graphic card.
is this enough for 3d max or photoshop?
smthn, check the manufacture website to see if the hardware is approved. I think that card would be fine for Photoshop (in my current PC I'm still using a GeForce 2 MX) and it's fine. When you get into 3D that could be another story. I know Maya doesn't approve GeForce class cards, just Quadro.
Jun 20, 04 12:49 pm ·
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Desktop component thoughts
Well, after all that talk about laptops, I think I'm going to build a kickass desktop. Sure laptops have thier advantages, but for less than a good laptop, I can have a killer desktop. We're talking 256 MB ATI FireGL and dual monitors for just over $2200.
That said:
#1 AMD 64 bit 3400+ or dual Xeons (looks to run about the same bling)
#2 Do I need 2 DVD drives (1 burn, 1 read only, basing this off a Dell workstation)
#3 Do I need 2 HDD? Saw a Dell with an 80 and a 120 GB. Is that overkill/add on later if you need it?
#4 Suggestions for monitors. I'm looking 17-19" good one (Dell, Sony?) and then a 15 inch crap one. Main work would be on the good monitor with pallettes and junk on the smaller, cheaper monitor. What brands do you like for the good one (I know there are $1000+ ones, I'm looking in the $550-700 range)
Thanks!
you dont need 2 dvd drives, or 2 hard drives. you can always buy another down the road.
as far as monitors go for what you can spend you can afford a good 21 inch. I bought my sony e540 refurbished from overstock for only a couple hundred bucks. great monitor. after I bought mine my old roomate bought 2. no problems with them.
that said I find it hard to believe that you will be able to build a computer with top of the line components and dual monitors for 2200. can you write out everything you are getting and where?
My experience with monitors:
Currently on a Dell 17" - nice but nothing special
Used to use both Sony and Veiwsonic 19" flat screen CRT's. I liked both but the sony had a bad pixel (unusual for sony I thought), and the Viewsonic was way cheaper.
If it was my money, I'd have a good look at viewsonic 21" and 19" flat screen CRT's.
yeah my 540 is a flatscreen, besides if you are going to be doing any kind of photoshop, illustrator, autocad, etc the bigger monitor is well worth it
Joe,
Ok, I slightly underestimated. But not much. I looked everything up on Newegg.com and rounded everything up to the nearest $50. This is to account for little things I might have forgotten or slight spec changes.
4 fan case $100
DVD burner $100
AMD Athlon 64 3400+ $450
Mobo $150
ATI 256 MB Fire GL $650
200 GB HDD $150
1 GB RAM $200
Sony 19" LCD $600
Total = $2400
So I was a little low. You ask, "where is monitor #2?" The idea was to get a cheap LCD for less important stuff like pallettes and text and have the whole 19 inch just for work. I've seen 14-15 inch LCDs for $150. I bet they are like 3 year old laptop screens, but could be fine. I'm looking into LCD because as we all know, a 19 inch CRT is huge. I have a 17" Samsung flatscreen CRT now that I love, but it's HUGE. And studio desk space is a premium. Although I may run the CRT as the second. So I think it's safe to say you could build a solid machine for about $2600. $1800 for just the CPU.
Just a few suggestions:
Depending on what software you'll be working with (but 3DSMax esp), it's my understanding there is more value in having dual Pentium 4's with hyperthreading.
Also, I've heard the resolution/clarity on LCD's doesn't come close to that of CRT's, which also might pose problems in 3D work (I don't have any personal experience with graphics on LCD's... maybe someone else can offer advise here.
And I think you'd be better off having (2) hardrives with RAID functionality (this came in handy BIG TIME in school, esp. if you're building your own machine).
hasellhoff,
coincidentally, im building myself a kick-ass dual machine now too
if i understand correctly, are you looking for dual xeons??? - since the equivalent of a xeon then is an AMD opteron - which is 64 bit and is really kick ass. i will post some links here for you to understand their benchmark tests of the Xeon against the Opteron. We here did a lot of research on it and decided for going for the Opteron.
For the Video Card, you might also want to look at the NVidia Quadro FX series....and if you are running maya, then do look at the qualification chart URL i will also post below...Maya seems to love the quadro cards and i think you can get the Quadro FX 500 for about 350$ only.
As for the CD/DVD drives, i am going to go for a DVD RW/CD RW combo and a CDR/DVDR...just for copying disks sometimes (and my office is going to pay for this!!!)
and 2 HDDs is a good bet
you might want to have the master as a 40GB one, and the slave as a 80GB one...the samsung 40 GB ones are much more stable and have a faster seek rate too.
The main reason Im going to AMD is for their 64 bit processing capabilities, and though windows xp pro is just 32 bit now, they are plannign to ship their 64 bit version, and in say 2 years, 64 bit processing is going to be 'the thing'
hope this helps you and please dont mind asking more questions, you will start getting issues with the AMD motherboard (im giong for a MSI motherboard)-but if you do, just ask!!!
links:
amd opteron/xeon comparision tests:
http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=opteron246&page=1
http://www.highend3d.com/boards/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=hardware&Number=177988&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=
for the motherboards:
http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=dualduel&page=1
hasslehoff - I missed the part about it being for a studio computer... I can understand the LCD(s). damn I didnt realize that dvd burners were that cheap already. huh, might have to check into one.
good luck with your build. have you built before?
maybe want to think about a couple or a few hard drives, maybe a raid setup or use the smaller faster drives -scsi 10000 rpm.. but $$$
good luck.
Yeah, I've been Frankensteining my current PC for about 5 years. It's time for a new one though. I think I'm going to do what sameolddoctor said and get the 40 GB and 80GB combo. I'm warry of RAID as I hear, when it works it's brilliant, but when it fails, it's a nightmare.
I just speced out a computer on Newegg.com. I'll probably wait on the 939 pin nForce mobo, but this looks like a hot set up for not too much bling.
Mother Board ASUS "A8V Deluxe Wi-Fi" K8T800 Pro Chipset $171.00
AMD Socket 939 Athlon 64 3500+, 2.2 GHz, 512KB L2 Cache $499.00
Case Lian Li Black Mid-Tower Case, Model "PC-61" $105.00
DVD-Burner NEC 8X Dual Layer DVD+/-RW Drive, $94.99
Master HDD Seagate 80GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive $77.50
Slave HDD Seagate 160GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive $120.25
Keyboard Logitech Elite Keyboard USB/ PS/2 104keys $32.00
Corsair Value Select Dual Channel Kit 184 Pin 1G DDR PC-3200 $178.00
Video Card ATI FGL 9800 Video Card, 256MB DDRII, 256-bit, Dual DVI, 8X AGP $633.00
SONY SDM-S93/B 19" LCD Monitor –RETAIL $599.00
Power Supply ENERMAX Noisetaker Series 470W Power Supply $84.00
Total $2,593.74
if you're building it yourself, try looking on ebay. I got a graphics card through them, ended up saving about 3 times what I paid for it.
I just checked on Ebay for that card and it was $900!
Close in price, and a 3 yr warranty with great tech support (I know, I use it). The Dell 19" LCD is really sweet, I've got one in the office. Faster ram here, too, and you can upgrade to 400 if you want. Larger hard drive, also. Obviously, you can lower the cost several ways. I am not sure how this P4 compares, but this about the machine I'll be getting soon, sans LCD (I want the 20"!).
Cheers.
Dell Precision Workstation 360
Catalog Number / Description Product Code SKU Id
Dell Precision Workstation 360 Minitower:
Intel® Pentium® 4 Processor 3.00GHz, 1MB / 800MHz FSB 3T301 [221-4076] 1
Operating System:
Microsoft® Windows® XP Professional, SP1 with Media and NTFS WXP1 [420-1931] 11
Memory:
1GB,DDR333 SDRAM Memory,NECC (4 DIMMS) 1GN43 [311-2783] 3
Keyboard:
Enhanced Performance, USB (8 Hot Keys) U8 [310-2701] 4
Mouse:
Dell USB 2-Button Optical Mouse with Scroll LOD [310-4165] 12
Monitors:
Dell UltraSharpâ„¢1901FP flat panel(19.0 viewable),HeightAdjustableStand 1901FPH [320-1576] 5
Graphics Card:
nVidia, QuadroFX 500, 128MB, dual monitor VGA or DVI/VGA capable QFX500 [320-0711] 6
Speakers:
Dell A425 Speakers A425 [313-2128] 18
Productivity Software:
Dell Precision Workstation NOMSBE [461-2963] 22
Boot Hard Drive:
250GB SATA, 7200 RPM Hard Drive with DataBurst Cacheâ„¢ 250SAT [340-9742] 8
CD ROM/DVD ROM:
8X DVD+RW/+R with Roxio® Easy CD Creator plus DVD decode DVRWR8 [313-2147] 16
Floppy Drive:
No Floppy Drive NFD [340-7635] 10
Energy Star:
Energy Starâ„¢ ES [310-4821] 50
Purchase Intent:
Purchase is not intended for resale. NOT4SEL [462-4506] 138
Hardware Support Services:
3Yr Parts + Onsite Labor (Next Business Day) W3YOS [980-7000][980-7002] 29
Installation Services:
No Installation NOINSTL [900-9987] 32
Oh, the price.... $2,741
http://configure.us.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx?c=us&cs=04&kc=6W300&l=en&oc=ws360t&s=bsd
Preliminary Ship Date5
7/9/2004
Need it sooner
Dell Precision Workstation 360
From $2,791
Now from
$2,741
Discount Details
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No payments for 60 days
As QUICK and EASY to use as your credit card | Apply and Buy
Lease for 30 months at 0%
Low monthly payments. Low-cost financing | Apply and Buy
Update Price & Ship Date
That is a pretty good deal. But I want the ATI card and it seems as though you have to special order it (custom build your own). The ATI card has twice the RAM and a higher clock speed. As far as I know, the Quadro 500 is the lowest model they make. Plus, the Athlon 64s outperform the P4 in many tests. And when 64 bit Windows comes out, it should be hot.
Once the nForce3 motherboard comes out, the Athlon 64 should totally rule the P4EE. I saw some bench marks and it was pretty amazing and it was running on the board I posted.
ok. Be careful of the tests you read. I've seen some AMD tests that looked great, but were misleading and incorrect (kind of like when the G5 was the 'fastest' machine, but it really wasn't).
I'd stay away from the FireGL cards, but I really don't know too much about them. I've only heard bad stuff, at least related to Max. Also remember that nvidia works with Discreet for specific drivers.
Also, don't forget about the 64 bit deal. Until the software companies write the software for it, it means nothing. So Discreet and co will have to re write Max, and I wouldn't hold my breath about that anytime soon, at least not until Intel offers their new chips.
I thought about AMDs for a while, but all the tests I've seen they did not do better, and prices wise, the ones comparable to the Xeons aren't any cheaper.
It's all what you want, though. I'd just never build my own machine and the 3 years next day onsite is priceless (I had my nvidia graphic card, that had a bad fan, replaced in about 20 hours or so, after a 15 minute call to diagnose it, as I had no idea what the noise was).
Ok, I am done. Eitherway, you'll have a rockin' machine!!
hey hassellhoff,
you might want to look at the maya qualification charts, they say they have absolutely NO ISSUES
hey hassellhoff,
you might want to look at the maya qualification charts, they say they have absolutely NO ISSUES with the quadro fx 500,1000 etc cards...and the quadro fx500 is just for 250-300$
just a thought
I hate computers
Sameolddoctor: Can you give me some tips on the dual Opterons? How would dual 244s compare to a Athlon 64 3400+? Do you need to do anything weird with RAM? I.e. if you put in 2x512, will it always access the whole 1GB or only when certain software uses dual processors, or would you need to put in 2GB? Does it always use the dual processors or only certain software? I've never done a multi-processor machine. I saw some bench marks and it showed the dual 244($307 each) being pretty close to a dual 3.0GHz Xeon ($470 each) machine. I'm just wondering how it would compare to the machine that Penn offers through Dell.
Processor: Dual Pentium Xeons @ 2.8GHz each; 1MB L3 cache per processor
Graphics: NVIDIA Quadro FX 1000 with 128MB DDR SDRAM
Sound: Built-in stereo sound capability; mono speaker built-in
RAM (Memory): 1.0GB DDR SDRAM
Hard Disk Drive: 80GB hard drive and 40GB hard drive (two separate drives)
Optical Drive: CD-RW/DVD+RW multiburner drive & CD-ROM drive (2 separate drives)
guys,
i have a quick question about a graphic card. What's good for my desktop? 64MB DDR NVIDIA® GeForce4 MXTM graphics card. I am looking for dell 2600c. slim computer and it has only that graphic card.
is this enough for 3d max or photoshop?
smthn, check the manufacture website to see if the hardware is approved. I think that card would be fine for Photoshop (in my current PC I'm still using a GeForce 2 MX) and it's fine. When you get into 3D that could be another story. I know Maya doesn't approve GeForce class cards, just Quadro.
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