I kinda wish that was possible and I thought about it at one point. But until Autodesk supports Macs (and they come down in price) then it's not practical for most architecture firms.
I agree - I was sorely tempted by a 20 inch powerbook, but its never going to happen. I think in NZ that Autodesk/PC based software would have approximately 99% of the market. I am destined to be a PC user, and I'm not too unhappy. Macs are just so seductive...
diabase -
Good Luck with the HP. That'll probably work well for you.
Maybe slightly off topic, but -
I was just reading the 'War Of The Worlds' article on wired.com.
They mentioned how the arrival of AMD64 based
workstations at the ILM previs dept. had a huge impact on their
ability to handle the job (hell, it's probably some evil promotional
corporate tie in that the journalist didn't get or didn't want to get, but
anyway...).
It then mentions that the previs guy on set would use an AMD64 based
Acer Ferrari laptop as part of his setup (Acer does the hardware for the Ferrari F1 team - another promotional corporate tie in!)
The Ferrari seems pretty cheap, and there are other vendors/models too. For some reason nobody seems to offer one with a 256mb graphics card.
Got my laptop today, with a docking station, keyboard, mouse etc. Also got Autocad 2006 lt, Autodesk Viz 2006, Adobe Creative Suite 2.0, and a trial version of Revit 8. And a very nice Belkin bag...
ok...so i iam reading all this shit and i am still kinda confused. it seems to me the key is to got to whatever notebooks website put in the top of the line configuration and check the price....and hope for some rebate? Reading this stuff and reading the content of the computer websites in dumbfounding and not very enjoyable for me.
I beleive i will be doing some heavy modeling and rendering while in graduate school coming up soon. I have heard from so many people to go with the dell's just becasue of their service. but i was told today was the last day of AlienWare's 500 dollar system rebate.. SHould i take advantage of this over a Dell?
The Alien systems seem to be way more stacked than dell's. Not sure about their support.
So can someone type out a list of steps (as if you were talking to a moron) for me to do or what to look for in getting a laptop. Rebates and all. I am looking to spend up to probably 2400 but would really feel alot better for myslef if i didnt spend that much.
1. Go to the Alienware site
2. Spec the machine out how you want it
3. They should have a 'printable version', select, and print
4. Go to www.techbargains.com and on the right side, scroll down to you find the Dell deals - find the applicable deal (I go for Laptops above $1999 - $750 off)
5. If there isn't that deal, post on here and ask if anyone know's of anywhere else (it's the best site I've found), or wait, it'll be back in a day or two
6. On the Dell site, spec out the machine similar to the Alienware (or another competitor, if you'd like)
7. Once done, hit 'Add to Cart'
8. Keep going until you get to the checkout (DON"T enter credit card info!! - Not yet!!)
9. There will be a COUPON field where you can enter the #
10. Go to the www.techbargain.com site (this is keeping two IE windows open), SELECT and COPY the discount code
11. Back at the Dell site, PASTE the code into the COUPON field
12. Hit the recalculate
13. Bingo! It'll take at least $750 off the price
Then you can truly compare the prices. Make sure you look close for things like the screen res (Dell should have two options), processor, memoery and memory speed, the MODEL of graphic card and the ram (the graphic card MODEL will have a bigger impact) - those are the major things that you need to look closely at the names and numbers.
It's really pretty easy once you do it. From there, you can compare anyone's models. Computer Arts just ranked the Alienware tops, but they compared it to Dell's workstation model (which is old and has a small screen), not the 9300 or XGen2, both of which would have done better (imho).
Post the specs on here or on www.cgarchitect.com and any questions you might have. Lots of us are looking for laptops (and ahve been for ages), so sharing advice and findings can only help everyone.
I am accustomed to working on my DT, comfortably, on a good chair, good music, etc.
This takes place either in my office or in my house where I have generic PC, built with the best parts I can find here, and I think it’s pretty much the same parts as everywhere except for the PRO graphic cards, which cost a fortune anyway.
Say 8 to 10 hour working periods where the DT.PC will perform normally doing renderings, photo editing ACADing etc.
So I got a Toshiba LT Dynabook G3, which by now is a bit old, anyway I use it for presentations with clients. ( it has great Harman kardon speakers by the way )
I’ve read this topic with interest and it seems that many of you work mobile, meaning outdoors or on transportation systems, or I don’t understand very well, because elsewhere you’ll be plugged into a power outlet, almost everywhere that is indoors has a power outlet, so the battery life-power-capacity issue is an issue of how long the battery will run for me during a presentation and that is also relative, depends on where the presentation is.
The other issue is that the lap tops described are really power full, like workstations but somehow they’re not that good, they are packed with power but consume a lot of battery and are really expensive and I would consider how much of that I really need, is it that you do hours long 3D renderings and modeling at the park? Do you do ACAD drawings in the METRO? Can you? Don’t you need a comfortable position and a good mouse?
What is the end for these really complicated, really EXPENSIVE and really power full mobile stations?
Maybe it’s just the different ways of working we all have, but I’m thinking that if I ever get to save aside enough money for a new lap top I’ll get something that looks really good to carry along to presentations, and has decent performance. Like a MAC
‘cause I hope I do all the heavy working hours on my work station at home on the PC.
Or maybe I am missing out the point that the idea is to replace the desktop PC for a LT ?
hoy shit. techbargains had a coupon for 35% off inspiron computers.. I just priced out a fully stacked xps gen 2 for $4208. with the online rebate and 35% off coupon it came to $2700!!!! holly shit!
Intel® Pentium® M Processor 760 (2 GHz/2MB Cache/533MHz FSB), Microsoft Windows XP Professional - For networking with work or school Unit Price $4,208.00
Dell Home Customers: 35% off select Inspirons over $999!
LIMITED TIME OFFER! View Details Remove Coupon
- $1,472.80
Catalog Number: 29
Module Description Show Details
Inspiron XPS Gen 2 Intel® Pentium® M Processor 760 (2 GHz/2MB Cache/533MHz FSB)
Operating System Microsoft Windows XP Professional - For networking with work or school
LCD Panel 17 inch UltraSharpâ„¢ Wide Screen UXGA Display with TrueLifeâ„¢
Memory 2GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 533MHz 2 Dimm
Video Card 256MB NVIDIA® GeForce™ Go 6800 Ultra
Hard Drive 60GB 7200rpm Hard Drive
Network Card Integrated 1 Gigabit Network Card and Modem
Adobe Software Adobe® Acrobat® Reader 6.0
CD ROM/DVD ROM 8x CD/DVD burner (DVD+/-RW) with double-layer write capability
Wireless Networking Card Save $20 Intel® PRO 2915 and Dell 350 Bluetooth Internal Wireless Card
Office Productivity Software (Pre-Installed) No productivity suite - Corel WordPerfect word processor only
Security Software No Security Subscription
Primary Battery 9-cell Lithium Ion Primary Battery (80 WHr)
Limited Warranty, Services and Support 3Yr Ltd Warr,At-Home Service,and Tech Support plus Nights and Weekends
XPS Specialized Support Inspiron XPS, Specialized Support
Dial-Up Internet Access 6 Months America Online Internet Access Included
Digital Imaging Photo Albumâ„¢ SE Basic
Enhanced Software for CD/DVD burner DigitalMedia Plus:Burn,Copy CD Music/Data,Backup,Label(CD-RW/DVD+RW only)
Miscellaneous Award Winning Service, Support
Financial Software No QuickBooks package selected- Includes limited use trial
the new acer ferrari's are out as well mmmm, carbon fiber
they've got me foaming at the mouth. they're one of the first laptops with a mobile 64-bit chip.
as far as dell goes, i've always hated their laptops, and their service. i had an old (pII 233 Mhz) laptop which was constructed so poorly that the pressure in the case would cause the keys to activate, locking the computer because it was continuously recieving an "N" signal. ugh. then later the computer stopped booting, so we sent it to dell again, to be told that the motherboard had fried and needed replacing. we didn't find that solution to be worth it, so we had them send it back. later one of my friends who knew more than i did, recognized the symptoms of a virus, reinstalled the operating system, and the machine has run just fine ever since.
since then, every time i've dealt with dell has been a rehash of that. every time i called them about our server at work, i got jerked around by someone who barely understood english, and read off the screen what the supposed answer to my problem was. every time they gave me a solution that made them money which i didn't take, because inevitably i knew more than they did, and i was able to sort out the problem eventually, before my boss authorized the purchase.
note that every poster on this board who likes dell's support likes it because they've had a hardware failure and had to send their machine back. DO NOT PUT UP WITH THEIR CRAP.
as far as doing autoCAD on a train:
i've done it on commuter rail lines, but not on light rail (chicago's 'L', similar to the metro, BART, whatever) (which is partly because i wouldn't pull out something that's worth that much on the 'L'). it's definately possible, but definately a pain in the ass. but you're only doing it breifly, so it's not a big deal.
Well, you can not like Dell, but they've saved my ass more than once.
As a matter of fact, a graphic card in one of the my older workstations just went bad, couldn't even boot, and tomorrow a tech guy will be out to replace it. Took at 20 minute phone call. The workstation is 3 years old and hasn't been off for more than a few days at a time. Great deal if you ask me.
monkeyboy - that's a SUPERB deal!! They rarely give discounts on the XGen, and given that it's got the better graphic card (the ULTRA), I'd buy it if you can. Damn, I am hoping to get one in the next month or two, but can't justify it right now. I'd love that machine (have to turn those lights off, though).
actually i just priced it out with just the regular limited warranty and it came to 2800 with tax. i really like it but goddam thats alot of money. if it was 300 cheaper i would buy it in a heartbeat
i guess i only have till 5;00 am to decide
oops.. i bought it.. 2800.. and got the 1 year service w/in home service plan. maybe i'll upgrade. i heard they contact you to see if you wanna upgrade. and i heard some people actually bargain with them.
SO i checked out the ALias website last night and they said they didnt recommend the GeForce card but supported the Quadro. I got the GeFOrce 2800 ultra. Has anyone had problems with it?
thanks for all your help and support. especially you trace. i may need some more WHEN i tell my wife. She moved tyo NYC already and i couldnt get a hold of her.
Dell is the shittiest company - disposible parts, crappy wiring. The first day I had mine, my exhaust fan blew [I guess the 12 year olds in 3rd world countries can't wrap the copper wiring tight enough].
You plug more than 2 gigs of ram into it and you end up having to upgrade your fans, motors, ect.
I have a Dell XPS - running maya, doing animations, simulations - it performs like a champ - it has enough fans (both in the rear and in the bottom) to prevent overheating - if you can deal with the heft (not a laptop to casually take anywhere, too big for working on an aeroplane, to heavy to take to the cafe) its a good buy. Dell support is good, despite what you might hear. the fans are not as quiet as some laptops, given the amount of cooling req'd - but they do not "scream"
again, this laptop is more stable than most desktops, it is able to render what my desktop at school cannot
monkeyboy - don't worry about it, really, esp from people telling you to get Apples. Personally, I trust magazine reviews far more than people's opinions on boards like this (I'd trust somewhere like cgarchitect or extremetech.com, but not here). The XGen and 9300 have stellar reviews, besting everything out there for value/performance.
Not sure what the Maya deal is or what they 'support'. I do know I own Quadros and a Geforce and have worked on just about everything out there, save the Wildcats. Personally, and you'l find many that agree, the Quadros are just too expensive. IF youare going character animation, maybe it's better, but I didn't notice a difference between a Geforce 5900 and a Quadro 1300. I only bought one because they discounted it so it was essentially free.
FYI, anyone looking to buy workstations from Dell, they can negotiate, so it's worth the call, I got about $1200+ off my price.
My wife needed a machine. I ended up getting the HP zv6000. My main reason was the processor. The AMD Athlon 64 4000+. The graphics card I am not crazy about, but then again, she will not be doing too much heavy graphics stuff. Some people have had issues with this machine because the hardware can support dual channel memory, but for some reason it is disabled. HP never advertized it as dual channel capable, but when you put in a dual capable chip and chipset, people begin to wonder why they cannot.
This machine comes with PC2700 ram, but can take PC3200. It seems like the machine might have a bit more future to it than some others, so I got it for her. Again, she does not need anything crazy, just something that works for her, and I think this machine will suit her well.
Looking forward to her not having to use that shitty red nub IBM used as an excude for a pointing device on older trackpads. I think they still use it, but give people a trackpad as well.
Personally, I will be getting another PowerBook 15", and saving up for when the AMD Athlon 64 x2 (Dual Core Athlon) becomes MORE available (I believe only Alienware uses it in their workstations right now). Have you guys seen the 3D Studio benchmarks for this thing? It blows everything out of the water! Would love to have a desktop with two of these in it, but it might be a few more months before that can be a reality.
Tried out the Dell coupon thing? Is this for real??? Do I go ahead and buy it online or do I have to print it out and take it to store? How do I check the validity of this coupon?
YOu pay for it online. Dell doesn't have any retail stores.
It's just like buying one online, but you enter the coupon and save. Simple aas that. If it works (they do have some problems with coupons expire, limited usage, etc.), you'll see the amount saved in your checkout. Just pay from there.
Good luck. I am sure you can call if you still don't feel comfortable.
talking about laptops, I got myself the Asus z70v... its awesome. GREAT screen and color reproduction which in the end is what matters to those superficially inclinded. (plus the carbon fiber chassis is great)
Does anyone know if there is anythring wrong with running XP home instead of XP pro with the typical programs we use and networking. Or should i upgrade?
This is killing me - I've been following this thread and searching everywhere for a nice looking, affordably priced P4 notebook. BOXX makes a beautiful system, but $4,000 is out of the question, and the Alienware / Dell XPS Gen2 systems might be ok for the terminally virginal, but I'm looking for something a little less "saturday night network party".
I love the stuff on Sonystyle.com, but they've dropped P4's from their line, and Apples are out of the question (i'm a rhino user). Where does the self-conscious architect find a fully-loaded system he can shamelessly pose with at a coffee shop?
why do you want a P4???? yes, if do not want to use it as a laptop, i.e. desktop replacement then they are fine, but nowdays the centrinos are so badass, its not even funny. no wonder they got dropped out of sonystyle.com
toshiba also has some p4 laptops, but they are real heavy... also try acer and fujitsu
Some Pentium M models by Toshiba Sony and even IBM look pretty damn nice (not Apple nice, but nice), and the 1.86 or 2.0 Gig Pentium M/Centrinos should be plenty fast enough if RAM is maxed out.
I've had better rendering benchmark times with AMD 64's. I personally use a Centrino, and it can handle almost anything.
I don't know why people are even mentioning macs. It's out of the question. It would be a complete waste of money to purchase hardware that cannot run CAD or 3d applications. Only for photoshop? macs are for graphic designers, not architects.
im no mac fan, but they are used by architects. maybe not as much as pcs. but there lots of companies/firms that use both. they use vectorworks. and they have a program to convert windows cad to mac. macs are known for its graphic stuff, 3d too.
yes. But, the real issue between mac and pc maybe only for those still in school. It's a known fact, that as a student, one cannot afford the tools needed to produce the work required. "Finding" software for a mac seems like it would be much more problematic than for PC. which makes it, highly incovenient. Unless you have $5,000 laying around.
I've seen the claim made twice in this thread that a 2.0ghz centrino is as effective as a 3.8ghz P4. Is this really the case (and has anyone read any articles backing this up?)??
I don't care if the thing is kind of heavy and runs hot. I want a powerful decent looking system (not impressed with toshiba's current offering). So that's the question - will a power user be happy with a 2ghz centrino instead of a 3.8ghz p4?
I read that a 1.6 Centrino roughly equaled a 2.8 P4....haven't read anything new about that comparison in a while.
I'd doubt that the top Centrino would equal the top P4, though. Could be close, but one is made to perform in a laptop with limited heat sinks/fans and limited battery, the other doesn't take those into the factor.
Question becomes about heat, as in how hot it'll get with the P4 and how quickly it shuts down to compensate. Battery life, if you care about it, is a big difference, too.
I suppose I had to register just to clear some things up for you guys....
First... Pentium-M (centrino vs P4):
currently being sold, there are three variants of PM and two of the mobile p4. they are:
"banias" core PM w/ 400 Mhz bus
"dothan" core PM w/400 Mhz bus
"dothan" core PM w/533 Mhz bus
P4m w/o hyperthreading
p4m w/ hyperthreading
both P4M chips use an 800Mhz bus
comparing PM to P4M in single application performance isnt cut and dry. it depends on the application, mainly how much data and how fast the app needs to move between the processer and RAM (this is what bus speed affects)
However, in general, a 400 Mhz bus "banias" PM can be translated to P4M by multiplying by 1.4 (1.6~2.26)
moving to the 400Mhz bus dothan gets you another 5-10% improvement over banias in almost all cases. Moving to 533 bus dothans gets varying performance benefits, again depending on how much the application taxes the memory bus. In general, 3d renderers tax that bus in porportion to how complicated the scene is. tons of polygons and high res textures = lots of data going back and forth between the processor and memory, and the more a higher speed bus will be noticable in improving render times.
However (AND THIS IS IMPORTANT!!!), all I've been talking about here is running a single application. I don't know about you guys, but I've never, ever done that while I was in school. I pretty much always had Photoshop, indesign, illustrator, and either rhino or Acad open all at the same time, constantly bouncing from one to the other. That kind of thing is hell on a computer that can only process one thing at a time (which is everything except the p4m w/hyperthreading)
basically, if you only have one computer, a processor with hyperthreading will allow you to work much more efficiently if you use more than one program at once. However, as noted, the P4M notebooks are huge, heavy, usually made of cheaper parts, have worse battery life, and often run into heat issues.
I would not buy a non-hyperthreaded P4M. that really is the worst of both worlds.
Personally, I think the best solution is to buy a decent PM notebook, and get a cheap ($3-500) desktop from dell. The desktop will likely be as good or better than the PM (or most P4Ms) at rendering, so you can model/texture/whatever on the laptop, then just go home and let the desktop crunch numbers. frees up your laptop to work on other things while you're rendering. it's a better solution, and will likely wind up costing less than a totally tricked out behemoth of a notebook from alienware or dell.
Graphics cards:
workstation class cards (quadro or firegl) are nice, if you can afford them, but not entirely because they perform better (though they do in many cases). The big reason, to me, to get a quadro/firegl is the ability to enable hardware Antialiased lines in autocad. it's a feature that basically lets the card "smooth out" (antialias) lines, so they're not so jagged. This is something you can't live without once you've used it, it makes complicated drawings ALOT easier to read on screen. Workstation class cards have this feature, their gamer class equivalents don't.
Ram:
ram upgrades are dirt simple to do yourself. dell/ ibm/alienware will take you for many hundreds of dollars for what you can get from crucial.com for much, much less. if you have options when configuring, get the smallest amount of ram possible, and then go to crucial to get what you want. A full 2GB of laptop DDR400 from crucial is currently $280. dell will want over $1000 for the exact same thing.
Phew! ok, I'm taking a break, next up is dell vs ibm vs alienware vs...
Everyone just missed a SUPERB deal from DELL. Really, it was sweet.
40% off their laptops, and that includes the 9300 and XGen 2. Damn, that's the best I've seen. All gone now, though.
Also, yesterday, Dell had a 9100 P4 3.0 with a free 20" LCD for $830. Not the highest grade parts (good parts, though), but that's still a great deal.
That's over, too.
No point to that, just that if you are looking, be ready and keep an eye on one of the discount sites....really early, 'cause they go in seconds.
Quick question if you don't mind on the ram note. Totally agree with you re: Dell, HP, etc screwing you for Ram prices, however so do Kingston and Crucial to a sense.
I am looking to upgrade a new Dell Inspiron 9300, and options are as follows for 1G modules
Which is preferred? I usually just bought ram based on correct pin count, bus speed, etc. Crucial doesn't offer different grades of same thing like Kingston. Aren't DDR2 PC2-4200 SODIMM modules generally the same despite manufacturer?
i have heard that its best to get EXACTLY the same type of RAM in your computer, be it desktop or laptop..that is the same company, the same specs (ECC, non-ECC etc)....see what exactly you have in your laptop and go for the same...
you might spend 30-40$ more now, but will thankful later!
Being a hater of all things MAC (they do have nice mp3 players tho.)
I had to weigh in on this. I am on my 5th Dell workstation. Its a 2004 Dell Dimension XPS P4 with 2 Gigs of Ram and a 128 K graphics card. It (as well as all of the other Dells in my family) have worked flawlessly for the time that I've used them and seem to handle multi-tasking well. It renders pretty fast and seems to be able to clock most 3d model apps. Their only problem is that the fans are loud and the laptops in the Dell family are heavy as shit. I am with some of the folks above. If you are planning to to a ton of rendering, high-res output, etc... do yourself a favor- get a workstation and put the extra dough into tricking it out with a dual processor and super huge flatpanel.
Laptop Face Off
my thoughts exactly.
I kinda wish that was possible and I thought about it at one point. But until Autodesk supports Macs (and they come down in price) then it's not practical for most architecture firms.
I agree - I was sorely tempted by a 20 inch powerbook, but its never going to happen. I think in NZ that Autodesk/PC based software would have approximately 99% of the market. I am destined to be a PC user, and I'm not too unhappy. Macs are just so seductive...
wow 20" PB! Where did you hear that rumor? That would be huge and sweet.
diabase -
Good Luck with the HP. That'll probably work well for you.
Maybe slightly off topic, but -
I was just reading the 'War Of The Worlds' article on wired.com.
They mentioned how the arrival of AMD64 based
workstations at the ILM previs dept. had a huge impact on their
ability to handle the job (hell, it's probably some evil promotional
corporate tie in that the journalist didn't get or didn't want to get, but
anyway...).
It then mentions that the previs guy on set would use an AMD64 based
Acer Ferrari laptop as part of his setup (Acer does the hardware for the Ferrari F1 team - another promotional corporate tie in!)
The Ferrari seems pretty cheap, and there are other vendors/models too. For some reason nobody seems to offer one with a 256mb graphics card.
here's the wired story
here's the Acer lappie. Not my cup of tea though, looks wise...
diabase, that machine looks nice with that Fire card. Also, seems fairly light at 5.8 lbs. nice choice!
So,
Got my laptop today, with a docking station, keyboard, mouse etc. Also got Autocad 2006 lt, Autodesk Viz 2006, Adobe Creative Suite 2.0, and a trial version of Revit 8. And a very nice Belkin bag...
The resolution on this thing can go to 1900x1200.
Aaahh......
ok...so i iam reading all this shit and i am still kinda confused. it seems to me the key is to got to whatever notebooks website put in the top of the line configuration and check the price....and hope for some rebate? Reading this stuff and reading the content of the computer websites in dumbfounding and not very enjoyable for me.
I beleive i will be doing some heavy modeling and rendering while in graduate school coming up soon. I have heard from so many people to go with the dell's just becasue of their service. but i was told today was the last day of AlienWare's 500 dollar system rebate.. SHould i take advantage of this over a Dell?
The Alien systems seem to be way more stacked than dell's. Not sure about their support.
So can someone type out a list of steps (as if you were talking to a moron) for me to do or what to look for in getting a laptop. Rebates and all. I am looking to spend up to probably 2400 but would really feel alot better for myslef if i didnt spend that much.
1. Go to the Alienware site
2. Spec the machine out how you want it
3. They should have a 'printable version', select, and print
4. Go to www.techbargains.com and on the right side, scroll down to you find the Dell deals - find the applicable deal (I go for Laptops above $1999 - $750 off)
5. If there isn't that deal, post on here and ask if anyone know's of anywhere else (it's the best site I've found), or wait, it'll be back in a day or two
6. On the Dell site, spec out the machine similar to the Alienware (or another competitor, if you'd like)
7. Once done, hit 'Add to Cart'
8. Keep going until you get to the checkout (DON"T enter credit card info!! - Not yet!!)
9. There will be a COUPON field where you can enter the #
10. Go to the www.techbargain.com site (this is keeping two IE windows open), SELECT and COPY the discount code
11. Back at the Dell site, PASTE the code into the COUPON field
12. Hit the recalculate
13. Bingo! It'll take at least $750 off the price
Then you can truly compare the prices. Make sure you look close for things like the screen res (Dell should have two options), processor, memoery and memory speed, the MODEL of graphic card and the ram (the graphic card MODEL will have a bigger impact) - those are the major things that you need to look closely at the names and numbers.
It's really pretty easy once you do it. From there, you can compare anyone's models. Computer Arts just ranked the Alienware tops, but they compared it to Dell's workstation model (which is old and has a small screen), not the 9300 or XGen2, both of which would have done better (imho).
Post the specs on here or on www.cgarchitect.com and any questions you might have. Lots of us are looking for laptops (and ahve been for ages), so sharing advice and findings can only help everyone.
Cheers
thanks trace! this will be very helpful.
i just found this info for anyone that cares.
link
a little bitty off topic....
I am accustomed to working on my DT, comfortably, on a good chair, good music, etc.
This takes place either in my office or in my house where I have generic PC, built with the best parts I can find here, and I think it’s pretty much the same parts as everywhere except for the PRO graphic cards, which cost a fortune anyway.
Say 8 to 10 hour working periods where the DT.PC will perform normally doing renderings, photo editing ACADing etc.
So I got a Toshiba LT Dynabook G3, which by now is a bit old, anyway I use it for presentations with clients. ( it has great Harman kardon speakers by the way )
I’ve read this topic with interest and it seems that many of you work mobile, meaning outdoors or on transportation systems, or I don’t understand very well, because elsewhere you’ll be plugged into a power outlet, almost everywhere that is indoors has a power outlet, so the battery life-power-capacity issue is an issue of how long the battery will run for me during a presentation and that is also relative, depends on where the presentation is.
The other issue is that the lap tops described are really power full, like workstations but somehow they’re not that good, they are packed with power but consume a lot of battery and are really expensive and I would consider how much of that I really need, is it that you do hours long 3D renderings and modeling at the park? Do you do ACAD drawings in the METRO? Can you? Don’t you need a comfortable position and a good mouse?
What is the end for these really complicated, really EXPENSIVE and really power full mobile stations?
Maybe it’s just the different ways of working we all have, but I’m thinking that if I ever get to save aside enough money for a new lap top I’ll get something that looks really good to carry along to presentations, and has decent performance. Like a MAC
‘cause I hope I do all the heavy working hours on my work station at home on the PC.
Or maybe I am missing out the point that the idea is to replace the desktop PC for a LT ?
This idea-posting ended up longer than I expected
cheers
hoy shit. techbargains had a coupon for 35% off inspiron computers.. I just priced out a fully stacked xps gen 2 for $4208. with the online rebate and 35% off coupon it came to $2700!!!! holly shit!
Inspiron XPS Gen 2
SYSTEM COMPONENTS
Inspiron XPS Gen 2 Qty 1
Intel® Pentium® M Processor 760 (2 GHz/2MB Cache/533MHz FSB), Microsoft Windows XP Professional - For networking with work or school Unit Price $4,208.00
Dell Home Customers: 35% off select Inspirons over $999!
LIMITED TIME OFFER! View Details Remove Coupon
- $1,472.80
Catalog Number: 29
Module Description Show Details
Inspiron XPS Gen 2 Intel® Pentium® M Processor 760 (2 GHz/2MB Cache/533MHz FSB)
Operating System Microsoft Windows XP Professional - For networking with work or school
LCD Panel 17 inch UltraSharpâ„¢ Wide Screen UXGA Display with TrueLifeâ„¢
Memory 2GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 533MHz 2 Dimm
Video Card 256MB NVIDIA® GeForce™ Go 6800 Ultra
Hard Drive 60GB 7200rpm Hard Drive
Network Card Integrated 1 Gigabit Network Card and Modem
Adobe Software Adobe® Acrobat® Reader 6.0
CD ROM/DVD ROM 8x CD/DVD burner (DVD+/-RW) with double-layer write capability
Wireless Networking Card Save $20 Intel® PRO 2915 and Dell 350 Bluetooth Internal Wireless Card
Office Productivity Software (Pre-Installed) No productivity suite - Corel WordPerfect word processor only
Security Software No Security Subscription
Primary Battery 9-cell Lithium Ion Primary Battery (80 WHr)
Limited Warranty, Services and Support 3Yr Ltd Warr,At-Home Service,and Tech Support plus Nights and Weekends
XPS Specialized Support Inspiron XPS, Specialized Support
Dial-Up Internet Access 6 Months America Online Internet Access Included
Digital Imaging Photo Albumâ„¢ SE Basic
Enhanced Software for CD/DVD burner DigitalMedia Plus:Burn,Copy CD Music/Data,Backup,Label(CD-RW/DVD+RW only)
Miscellaneous Award Winning Service, Support
Financial Software No QuickBooks package selected- Includes limited use trial
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dell 720 Color Printer Qty 1
Free Dell Color Printer 720 Unit Price $0.00
Catalog Number: 29
Module Description Show Details
Dell Color Printer 720 Free Dell Color Printer 720
Hardware Support Services 1Yr Ltd. Warranty- Advance Exchange
TOTAL:$2,735.20
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
the new acer ferrari's are out as well
mmmm, carbon fiber
they've got me foaming at the mouth. they're one of the first laptops with a mobile 64-bit chip.
as far as dell goes, i've always hated their laptops, and their service. i had an old (pII 233 Mhz) laptop which was constructed so poorly that the pressure in the case would cause the keys to activate, locking the computer because it was continuously recieving an "N" signal. ugh. then later the computer stopped booting, so we sent it to dell again, to be told that the motherboard had fried and needed replacing. we didn't find that solution to be worth it, so we had them send it back. later one of my friends who knew more than i did, recognized the symptoms of a virus, reinstalled the operating system, and the machine has run just fine ever since.
since then, every time i've dealt with dell has been a rehash of that. every time i called them about our server at work, i got jerked around by someone who barely understood english, and read off the screen what the supposed answer to my problem was. every time they gave me a solution that made them money which i didn't take, because inevitably i knew more than they did, and i was able to sort out the problem eventually, before my boss authorized the purchase.
note that every poster on this board who likes dell's support likes it because they've had a hardware failure and had to send their machine back. DO NOT PUT UP WITH THEIR CRAP.
as far as doing autoCAD on a train:
i've done it on commuter rail lines, but not on light rail (chicago's 'L', similar to the metro, BART, whatever) (which is partly because i wouldn't pull out something that's worth that much on the 'L'). it's definately possible, but definately a pain in the ass. but you're only doing it breifly, so it's not a big deal.
Well, you can not like Dell, but they've saved my ass more than once.
As a matter of fact, a graphic card in one of the my older workstations just went bad, couldn't even boot, and tomorrow a tech guy will be out to replace it. Took at 20 minute phone call. The workstation is 3 years old and hasn't been off for more than a few days at a time. Great deal if you ask me.
monkeyboy - that's a SUPERB deal!! They rarely give discounts on the XGen, and given that it's got the better graphic card (the ULTRA), I'd buy it if you can. Damn, I am hoping to get one in the next month or two, but can't justify it right now. I'd love that machine (have to turn those lights off, though).
actually i just priced it out with just the regular limited warranty and it came to 2800 with tax. i really like it but goddam thats alot of money. if it was 300 cheaper i would buy it in a heartbeat
i guess i only have till 5;00 am to decide
300 is nothing to keep you from saving over a grand, imho. 2 gigs in a laptop is really pretty nice. Get the 3 year all included.
oops.. i bought it.. 2800.. and got the 1 year service w/in home service plan. maybe i'll upgrade. i heard they contact you to see if you wanna upgrade. and i heard some people actually bargain with them.
SO i checked out the ALias website last night and they said they didnt recommend the GeForce card but supported the Quadro. I got the GeFOrce 2800 ultra. Has anyone had problems with it?
thanks for all your help and support. especially you trace. i may need some more WHEN i tell my wife. She moved tyo NYC already and i couldnt get a hold of her.
Or buy a mac.
Smalldog.com <- great deals on Macs.
Dell is the shittiest company - disposible parts, crappy wiring. The first day I had mine, my exhaust fan blew [I guess the 12 year olds in 3rd world countries can't wrap the copper wiring tight enough].
You plug more than 2 gigs of ram into it and you end up having to upgrade your fans, motors, ect.
And if you are going to be using any 3d modeling software with high quality rendering engines, you're gonna hate hearing your Dell laptop screaming.
thats not what i wanted to hear.
I have a Dell XPS - running maya, doing animations, simulations - it performs like a champ - it has enough fans (both in the rear and in the bottom) to prevent overheating - if you can deal with the heft (not a laptop to casually take anywhere, too big for working on an aeroplane, to heavy to take to the cafe) its a good buy. Dell support is good, despite what you might hear. the fans are not as quiet as some laptops, given the amount of cooling req'd - but they do not "scream"
again, this laptop is more stable than most desktops, it is able to render what my desktop at school cannot
p.s. i have had the laptop for one year
monkeyboy - don't worry about it, really, esp from people telling you to get Apples. Personally, I trust magazine reviews far more than people's opinions on boards like this (I'd trust somewhere like cgarchitect or extremetech.com, but not here). The XGen and 9300 have stellar reviews, besting everything out there for value/performance.
Not sure what the Maya deal is or what they 'support'. I do know I own Quadros and a Geforce and have worked on just about everything out there, save the Wildcats. Personally, and you'l find many that agree, the Quadros are just too expensive. IF youare going character animation, maybe it's better, but I didn't notice a difference between a Geforce 5900 and a Quadro 1300. I only bought one because they discounted it so it was essentially free.
FYI, anyone looking to buy workstations from Dell, they can negotiate, so it's worth the call, I got about $1200+ off my price.
My wife needed a machine. I ended up getting the HP zv6000. My main reason was the processor. The AMD Athlon 64 4000+. The graphics card I am not crazy about, but then again, she will not be doing too much heavy graphics stuff. Some people have had issues with this machine because the hardware can support dual channel memory, but for some reason it is disabled. HP never advertized it as dual channel capable, but when you put in a dual capable chip and chipset, people begin to wonder why they cannot.
This machine comes with PC2700 ram, but can take PC3200. It seems like the machine might have a bit more future to it than some others, so I got it for her. Again, she does not need anything crazy, just something that works for her, and I think this machine will suit her well.
Looking forward to her not having to use that shitty red nub IBM used as an excude for a pointing device on older trackpads. I think they still use it, but give people a trackpad as well.
Personally, I will be getting another PowerBook 15", and saving up for when the AMD Athlon 64 x2 (Dual Core Athlon) becomes MORE available (I believe only Alienware uses it in their workstations right now). Have you guys seen the 3D Studio benchmarks for this thing? It blows everything out of the water! Would love to have a desktop with two of these in it, but it might be a few more months before that can be a reality.
Hi Trace,
Tried out the Dell coupon thing? Is this for real??? Do I go ahead and buy it online or do I have to print it out and take it to store? How do I check the validity of this coupon?
I mean, I tried it out.
Cheers
YOu pay for it online. Dell doesn't have any retail stores.
It's just like buying one online, but you enter the coupon and save. Simple aas that. If it works (they do have some problems with coupons expire, limited usage, etc.), you'll see the amount saved in your checkout. Just pay from there.
Good luck. I am sure you can call if you still don't feel comfortable.
talking about laptops, I got myself the Asus z70v... its awesome. GREAT screen and color reproduction which in the end is what matters to those superficially inclinded. (plus the carbon fiber chassis is great)
what about Fujitsu?
Does anyone know if there is anythring wrong with running XP home instead of XP pro with the typical programs we use and networking. Or should i upgrade?
wow ur not paying? thats great... parents? gift?
go with the faster processor. same cost. battery isn't an issue. same memory and both graphic cards are good! :) good luck
as far i as know you have restrictions for networking in xp home
hello again trace,
this coupon expires on the 14th of this month. Do these coupons come out regularly or do i just grab it now?
Cheers
This is killing me - I've been following this thread and searching everywhere for a nice looking, affordably priced P4 notebook. BOXX makes a beautiful system, but $4,000 is out of the question, and the Alienware / Dell XPS Gen2 systems might be ok for the terminally virginal, but I'm looking for something a little less "saturday night network party".
I love the stuff on Sonystyle.com, but they've dropped P4's from their line, and Apples are out of the question (i'm a rhino user). Where does the self-conscious architect find a fully-loaded system he can shamelessly pose with at a coffee shop?
What gives?
why do you want a P4???? yes, if do not want to use it as a laptop, i.e. desktop replacement then they are fine, but nowdays the centrinos are so badass, its not even funny. no wonder they got dropped out of sonystyle.com
toshiba also has some p4 laptops, but they are real heavy... also try acer and fujitsu
Some Pentium M models by Toshiba Sony and even IBM look pretty damn nice (not Apple nice, but nice), and the 1.86 or 2.0 Gig Pentium M/Centrinos should be plenty fast enough if RAM is maxed out.
I've had better rendering benchmark times with AMD 64's. I personally use a Centrino, and it can handle almost anything.
I don't know why people are even mentioning macs. It's out of the question. It would be a complete waste of money to purchase hardware that cannot run CAD or 3d applications. Only for photoshop? macs are for graphic designers, not architects.
im no mac fan, but they are used by architects. maybe not as much as pcs. but there lots of companies/firms that use both. they use vectorworks. and they have a program to convert windows cad to mac. macs are known for its graphic stuff, 3d too.
yes. But, the real issue between mac and pc maybe only for those still in school. It's a known fact, that as a student, one cannot afford the tools needed to produce the work required. "Finding" software for a mac seems like it would be much more problematic than for PC. which makes it, highly incovenient. Unless you have $5,000 laying around.
They look nice though.
monkeyboy,
for single processor machines, win XP home should be just fine, this goes even for the new pentium hyperthreaded chips.
But for dual processor machines, you need xp pro, since the xp home does not even recognize the second processor
"Finding" software for a mac is not problematic at all ;-)
I've seen the claim made twice in this thread that a 2.0ghz centrino is as effective as a 3.8ghz P4. Is this really the case (and has anyone read any articles backing this up?)??
I don't care if the thing is kind of heavy and runs hot. I want a powerful decent looking system (not impressed with toshiba's current offering). So that's the question - will a power user be happy with a 2ghz centrino instead of a 3.8ghz p4?
I read that a 1.6 Centrino roughly equaled a 2.8 P4....haven't read anything new about that comparison in a while.
I'd doubt that the top Centrino would equal the top P4, though. Could be close, but one is made to perform in a laptop with limited heat sinks/fans and limited battery, the other doesn't take those into the factor.
Question becomes about heat, as in how hot it'll get with the P4 and how quickly it shuts down to compensate. Battery life, if you care about it, is a big difference, too.
I suppose I had to register just to clear some things up for you guys....
First... Pentium-M (centrino vs P4):
currently being sold, there are three variants of PM and two of the mobile p4. they are:
"banias" core PM w/ 400 Mhz bus
"dothan" core PM w/400 Mhz bus
"dothan" core PM w/533 Mhz bus
P4m w/o hyperthreading
p4m w/ hyperthreading
both P4M chips use an 800Mhz bus
comparing PM to P4M in single application performance isnt cut and dry. it depends on the application, mainly how much data and how fast the app needs to move between the processer and RAM (this is what bus speed affects)
However, in general, a 400 Mhz bus "banias" PM can be translated to P4M by multiplying by 1.4 (1.6~2.26)
moving to the 400Mhz bus dothan gets you another 5-10% improvement over banias in almost all cases. Moving to 533 bus dothans gets varying performance benefits, again depending on how much the application taxes the memory bus. In general, 3d renderers tax that bus in porportion to how complicated the scene is. tons of polygons and high res textures = lots of data going back and forth between the processor and memory, and the more a higher speed bus will be noticable in improving render times.
However (AND THIS IS IMPORTANT!!!), all I've been talking about here is running a single application. I don't know about you guys, but I've never, ever done that while I was in school. I pretty much always had Photoshop, indesign, illustrator, and either rhino or Acad open all at the same time, constantly bouncing from one to the other. That kind of thing is hell on a computer that can only process one thing at a time (which is everything except the p4m w/hyperthreading)
basically, if you only have one computer, a processor with hyperthreading will allow you to work much more efficiently if you use more than one program at once. However, as noted, the P4M notebooks are huge, heavy, usually made of cheaper parts, have worse battery life, and often run into heat issues.
I would not buy a non-hyperthreaded P4M. that really is the worst of both worlds.
Personally, I think the best solution is to buy a decent PM notebook, and get a cheap ($3-500) desktop from dell. The desktop will likely be as good or better than the PM (or most P4Ms) at rendering, so you can model/texture/whatever on the laptop, then just go home and let the desktop crunch numbers. frees up your laptop to work on other things while you're rendering. it's a better solution, and will likely wind up costing less than a totally tricked out behemoth of a notebook from alienware or dell.
Graphics cards:
workstation class cards (quadro or firegl) are nice, if you can afford them, but not entirely because they perform better (though they do in many cases). The big reason, to me, to get a quadro/firegl is the ability to enable hardware Antialiased lines in autocad. it's a feature that basically lets the card "smooth out" (antialias) lines, so they're not so jagged. This is something you can't live without once you've used it, it makes complicated drawings ALOT easier to read on screen. Workstation class cards have this feature, their gamer class equivalents don't.
Ram:
ram upgrades are dirt simple to do yourself. dell/ ibm/alienware will take you for many hundreds of dollars for what you can get from crucial.com for much, much less. if you have options when configuring, get the smallest amount of ram possible, and then go to crucial to get what you want. A full 2GB of laptop DDR400 from crucial is currently $280. dell will want over $1000 for the exact same thing.
Phew! ok, I'm taking a break, next up is dell vs ibm vs alienware vs...
nice post manamana
Everyone just missed a SUPERB deal from DELL. Really, it was sweet.
40% off their laptops, and that includes the 9300 and XGen 2. Damn, that's the best I've seen. All gone now, though.
Also, yesterday, Dell had a 9100 P4 3.0 with a free 20" LCD for $830. Not the highest grade parts (good parts, though), but that's still a great deal.
That's over, too.
No point to that, just that if you are looking, be ready and keep an eye on one of the discount sites....really early, 'cause they go in seconds.
great info, manamana
Quick question if you don't mind on the ram note. Totally agree with you re: Dell, HP, etc screwing you for Ram prices, however so do Kingston and Crucial to a sense.
I am looking to upgrade a new Dell Inspiron 9300, and options are as follows for 1G modules
Dell an additional $500
<br />
Kingston value ram at New Egg for $101
<br />
Kingston officially approved Dell ram for $193 a module
<br />
Crucial module for $140
Which is preferred? I usually just bought ram based on correct pin count, bus speed, etc. Crucial doesn't offer different grades of same thing like Kingston. Aren't DDR2 PC2-4200 SODIMM modules generally the same despite manufacturer?
i have heard that its best to get EXACTLY the same type of RAM in your computer, be it desktop or laptop..that is the same company, the same specs (ECC, non-ECC etc)....see what exactly you have in your laptop and go for the same...
you might spend 30-40$ more now, but will thankful later!
Being a hater of all things MAC (they do have nice mp3 players tho.)
I had to weigh in on this. I am on my 5th Dell workstation. Its a 2004 Dell Dimension XPS P4 with 2 Gigs of Ram and a 128 K graphics card. It (as well as all of the other Dells in my family) have worked flawlessly for the time that I've used them and seem to handle multi-tasking well. It renders pretty fast and seems to be able to clock most 3d model apps. Their only problem is that the fans are loud and the laptops in the Dell family are heavy as shit. I am with some of the folks above. If you are planning to to a ton of rendering, high-res output, etc... do yourself a favor- get a workstation and put the extra dough into tricking it out with a dual processor and super huge flatpanel.
"a 128 K graphics card"
damn, how do you render on that? Sorry, since you are a hater I had to take a stab at ya . . . no offense!
Block this user
Are you sure you want to block this user and hide all related comments throughout the site?
Archinect
This is your first comment on Archinect. Your comment will be visible once approved.