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Architecture outsource overseas to Architects/Designers that have US experience

Orig.Arch.

Hello there!

I am wondering if you as an architectural firm would outsource jobs to an outsourcing company that its principal architect has worked in the US (California & Ohio)?

 
Jul 11, 19 8:35 pm
Non Sequitur

no.

next question.

Jul 11, 19 8:57 pm
Orig.Arch.

Thank you for your reply. Yes the next question is why?. What are the reasons that make you not to outsource jobs to a professional architect?

Jul 11, 19 9:08 pm
Non Sequitur

Quality and liability control are big. Sense of ownership is another plus response time is much easier (read: client management) when you're producing the work in house.

Orig.Arch.

I got your point, But I mentioned an experienced professional that has been working in the states for multiple firms. That means quality is not an issue. Work in-house will be faster. Outsourcing cheaper with same quality. I honestly can't imagine sending work overseas to an outsourcing firm that know nothing about codes and regulations, specs, contracts, details, imperial system, etc... will be a nightmare. But sending it to an architectural professional who has the same experience in the same country will make things different. Let me know your thoughts.

Jul 11, 19 9:35 pm
Non Sequitur

Quality is always sub-par, at best, when outsourced. There is a reason why it's cheaper and the outsourced staff does not have the same responsibilities as if they were full-time in-house employees.

Orig.Arch.

Thank you for your input. It is cheaper because cost of living is cheaper, thats all. I really thank you for your input. I hope to get input from everyone.

Jul 11, 19 11:07 pm
Orig.Arch.

but I am not following, why quality will be a sub-par from a licensed architect? 

Jul 11, 19 11:10 pm
b3tadine[sutures]

What makes you think that because this person is licensed, quality is a forgone conclusion? A monkey can be trained to do what we do.

midlander

I once worked in a large corporate firm that had an outsourcing center in Manilla. It took a few years (!) to get them up to speed with our company's rather middling standards, and required a few full time principals stationed there overseeing things. They would also fly the Manila staff out to stay in a local office and work with the team after a major project kicked off. I have no idea if this was cost effective; there were other reasons it was being done.


They actually were very helpful for getting revit models built in a rush, but only on projects where we were not AOR and didn't care at all about how the models would grow with the project development. Sometimes it we were just feeding them busy work because managing real work remotely with people unfamiliar to the team was too much overhead to deal with. We had a quota of labor required to assign to them... sometimes that labor was just rename all the sheets.


I would never recommend it for anyone looking for one-off help. There are rather few tasks in architecture that can be neatly separated from the team's labor and developed independently.

Jul 12, 19 8:22 am
Orig.Arch.

Thank you for your explanation

tintt

How much is it?

Jul 12, 19 8:43 am
Orig.Arch.

It depends on the scope of work.

archi_dude

Every comment you’ve made has grammatical and spelling errors. So clearly quality would fall and there would be costly communication errors. 

Jul 12, 19 9:02 am
Orig.Arch.

I am not sure where are the spelling errors, but it's ok. Thank you for your input. I want to ask you about the quality, why would a licensed architect give you bad quality drawings?

kjdt

Is the licensed architect who has worked in the US the one who is going to be doing all of the work? Or is he just going to be assigning it to others, and supposedly supervising them? In my past experiences with outsourcing to foreign companies, it became clear that some of them who claim superior qualifications are actually just middlemen who will then outsource to other companies. How do we ensure that 100% of the work is done by the US-experienced architect and no one else?

Orig.Arch.

Thank you for your comment. He will be assigning work to others and supervise them - make corrections, sketch details, code research, etc... How to ensure the quality? Simply an architect equals reputation. Why would an owner of an outsourcing firm (the US Architect) risk his reputation in the market? he will make sure that everything goes under the firm's standards.

Formerlyunknown

Tell us about the specific experience of the firm's principal who has worked in the US.  For how many years did that person work in the US?  For how many different firms, and for how long at each?  What were the specialties of those firms?  What was that person's role in those firms?

It's possible that we would outsource to an overseas firm, especially in times like these where we can't always fill production positions very quickly with qualified local people.  But we'd need to know all these things in order to evaluate whether this overseas firm would have enough of a base understanding of our needs and US construction norms to be useful. 

Jul 12, 19 10:00 am
Orig.Arch.

The firm's principal worked in the US for 5 years, with a total of 9 years of experience. Currently perusing his license. He has been working for 3 firms.

Role: Job Captain and Architectural Project Manager

Type of projects: Healthcare, Residential, Tenant Improvement (Retail/Hospitality), Commercial

Please feel free to email me at Andrew.Y.Naam@gmail.com

Formerlyunknown

People who already know you will surely be better leads than just trying to advertise for clients on forums like this one (which is clearly what you're doing, by posting your email address in this context.) If you are going to keep trying to do it this way, you need to find someone with a better grasp of English to proofread your posts. They're a poor advertisement for you, because they have a lot of errors, so anybody who reads these posts is going to think that either you don't have good attention to detail, or that you aren't fluent enough to do accurate notes and specifications.

Also I would hesitate because now I know you're not actually licensed yet, your previous experience was all at a level where you would still have had a lot of supervision, and you've bounced around without staying at any one firm for very long. It's not a very reassuring profile. Maybe once you start to get some independent projects through your previous employers they'll be able to serve as good references, and perhaps refer other leads to you.

Non Sequitur

5 years experience in US and no license? Wow... why not bet on such a sure thing?

Orig.Arch.

Thank you. Yes I am not licensed yet, almost there. The main reason for this post is to know more about the market of outsourcing architecture work, I do not have a company yet to make proposals and get projects. I need to know if architectural firms are open to outsource jobs or no.

English is my second language, doing my best improve it. When it comes to advertisement, I will hire someone professional in advertising.

Non Sequitur: I am not sure why you are so sarcastic. I am just asking to know more the market. Yes 5 years f experience in the US and no license yet, I had things more important than to get my license at that time.

Non Sequitur

You had more important things than competing a license? Sure man, whatever, but then don’t complain when we’re suspicious about quality.

Orig.Arch.

Family? Illness? I am not sure why are you trying to judge me. It is very disrespectful
!

Non Sequitur

Cool story bro, we judge based on what info you’ve given us. Still doesn’t give much confidence in quality.

Orig.Arch.

Yea, the thing is that you do not have the right to judge, you just say your opinion and that's it.

Non Sequitur

I absolutely have that right.

Orig.Arch.

Unfortunately, you do not have the right to judge others, you have the right to judge yourself, to be a respectful and better person but not others!.

Non Sequitur

Thank you king Jesus.

archi_dude

Unfortunately when people are deciding whether or not to trust you with work, they will be judging you. It’s their right to choose who to work with. 5 years experience as a junior staff member, not actually licensed yet, bounced around multiple jobs so possibly couldn’t handle the heat when given more responsibilities or made errors so wasn’t given new responsibilities, plus poor grasp of the English. This has confirmed our judgements of outsourcing = low quality, difficult communication and vague idea of who you are actually working with.

Orig.Arch.

Sir, the aim of this thread is to know the opinion of people whether it will workout or not. Some people took it as judging me, I am not sure why you are doing so. When it comes to judge me for professional work, you should see my work first (which I believe it is the most important part). I already knew your opinion. Thank you

Liz_Lf

I believe, although I work with a rendering company and not an architecture firm, outsourcing is a difficult choice for some architecture firms because they want to make sure that the exchange they are doing (Quality assured and stands met in house) will be worth the exchange of (lower prices and possible quicker turn around time for outsourced products or services). 

A lot of time communication can be an issue, time difference, or they just prefer the label of in house work always being done. Like most cases things are not black and white though; some firms may find the exchange worth it if you meet enough of their standards, especially being a licensed Architect and having worked in the US already, but some may find it would not be worth the risk. It is definitely a case by case situation. 

Jul 12, 19 10:55 am
Orig.Arch.

I totally agree with you! As I mentioned in one of my comments, it could be a nightmare to outsource an architectural work, that's why I think they key is to outsource to someone that has the same experience and knows how to put a set of drawings that can be permitted.

midlander

OP: trying to be more helpful, if you've got solid experience in the US, contact some of your old firms and ask them if they have work you could help them with as a freelance employee. Being cheap is much less valuable than being effective and competent - what you need to do is find people who trust you to get work done well even if they aren't able to check in on you every day.

Jul 12, 19 11:24 am
Orig.Arch.

You are correct! the key is not the price that I will be cheaper, the key is that I help this firm to get more projects and get bigger by providing DD and CD which take the most time in a project schedule. Yes I have contacted my previous firms and they are welcoming the idea! that's why I am posting here to collect people's opinion

tintt

Isn't this illegal anyways? 

Jul 12, 19 9:40 pm
Orig.Arch.

Really? Why??

Non Sequitur

It’s illegal in my area. All construction docs must be completed under the direct supervision of the office whose stamp is used. At best, I could see outsourcing custom BIM families but never DD and CD. Why hand off control of the most important parts to some mysterious wanker?

tintt

You would know why if you are actually studying for getting your license.

Orig.Arch.

Guys, whoever will sign and stamp the CDs will revise all the drawings and make corrections as necessary, so it is under his supervision. I am not sure what are you guys trying to say!

Non Sequitur

We’re saying it’s not as simple as you’re claiming it to be. If it was, everyone and their neighbor would do it.

jla-x

We are trying to say that it’s not a good idea. Not an efficient or effective way to work for firms, and probably not too profitable for you.

Orig.Arch.

Thank you guys for your opinions :)

jla-x

so you are just looking to be a freelance independent contractor?  I’m not understanding?  



Jul 12, 19 11:45 pm
Orig.Arch.

Correct, but overseas and make business visits as necessary.

jla-x

The pay would barely cover the plane tickets.

jla-x

Terrible idea

Orig.Arch.

It depends on the flow of projects. Thanks

jla-x

I outsourced a render once because I was in a crunch. I spent more time trying to explain what I needed than I would have spent doing it in my own. Never again. Spent same amount of time + money and 10X the headache.

Orig.Arch.

Yea, totally agree with you. Thats why I thought if you outsource a job to someone that has same experience (US experience) will be easier and more efficient, but looks like I am wrong based on people's opinions.

Orig.Arch.

Thank you all for giving me feedback. It looks like it is not a good idea to outsource overseas even to a US experienced professional. But would you outsource work to a US based company?



Jul 13, 19 11:43 am
midlander

no. the problem is that outsourcing adds a level of management work while reducing the quality of coordination.

Orig.Arch.

Thanks

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